A38 headsail size recommendations

[Palin]

I recently acquired hull #53, Lucia, and I’m in the process of freshening systems to get her offshore again. She came to me with only a 140% genoa for the forestay furler. (Full-batt main and staysail are in good condition) I find the genoa almost useless. I’m in the process of getting quotes for a new yankee and a drifter from various sailmakers. The first two have come back recommending 100% jibs of approximately 46 sq meters - which seems kinda big to me. Lacking experience with the boat I have little to go on except for my gut feeling. So I’d like to hear from some A38 owners about what size headsail works best for them before I make any decisions. 

Thanks and I’m eager to join your community and get sailing again.

Patrick 

[Carl Gaines]

Being a full-time, calm latitudes cruiser for 11 years on hull 61, I will give you my impression. We bought Diva with the sails pictured here. I THINK they were “original” in cut. Beautiful!

[Greg Campbell]

Hi Patrick,

The stats for the A38 give a foresail area of 43.8 sq metres so your sailmaker advice is probably right about the area.  If running a single jib/genoa instead of the staysail/yankee combinaton then a foresail area slightly larger than the specified 43.8 sq metres will be needed to overcome the loss of venturi effect in dropping from two slots to one.   A staysail with yankee was the designed foresail setup, as was the case for many cutters of the era.  With modern sail furling systems though, many people have gone for a genoa, with a heavier staysail used mostly in higher winds, say above 25 knots - heavy enough to also heave to, partly furled at 40 knots.  A 140% genoa is very big, and no doubt difficult to tack/gybe around the inner forestay.  Something around 120% is more common.  In my case, on the A33 with a much smaller bowsprit, I like my 120% genoa.  It gives good power upwind in 12-20 knots, and with a pole, gives reasonable sailing broad downwind in anything above 8-10 knots.  Slightly difficult to tack, but easy to deploy/furl from the cockpit and never subject to wraps.  Much of your choice will depend on the sailing you will do.  My sail combination is pretty ineffective below 10 knots, but being coastal cruisers where fuel is readily available, we generally turn the engine on at that point.  If you plan to cross oceans however, there may be many quiet days and in addition to your jib you will need a light airs foresail, of which modern sailmakers have a range for you to choose from.  Trevor Robertson, who bought Diva (Carl's image above) has vast experience and has now put another 15-20,000 miles on Diva, now named Ironbark III, having crossed both the Atlantic and the Pacific.  If Trevor notices your query and responds, his observations would be enlightening.  He's presently sailing between Tonga and New Zealand.

Cheers

Greg

[p linton]

Thanks for the responses. I appreciate all feedback. Even though I have an furler on the forestay my intention is to sail as a cutter with a Yankee and staysail. I’m having a drifter made for lighter winds. I’m counting on the yankee being reefable by about 15%, so if I had the new sail made to 85% of lp it could be effectively reefed to 70%. As I said before I’m just making these numbers up on my gut feeling. Any advice that helps me optimize the size of this new yankee is appreciated

Patrick 

Sent from my iPhone

On Nov 2, 2023, at 10:51 PM, 'Greg Campbell' via Alajuelaboats <alajue...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Hi Patrick,

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[James Samiljan]

On the San Pícaro, my son and I have used a high-cut yankee and staysail for years.  We find the two small jibs  much easier to work with than a single genoa.  It’s also nice to be able to see where you’re going.  

Jim Samiljan 

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[Trevor Robertson]

Hello all

The headsail size is of course going to depend on your usage and where you are. A sail suitable for a drifting match on a Saturday afternoon on the Chesapeake is going to be different to one used for longer voyages.

I found the jib that Carl had made too big for my usage and cut it down. It was originality about 46m2 or a little more. We laid it out on the beach in Carriacou, I marked the new clew position along the mitre and Andy the sailmaker cut it to that size, thereby reducing its area to about 31.8m2 - which is about 72% of the fore triangle.  The resizing was done by eye and I don't think we bothered with a tape measure.

 The sail performed well and was a lot easier to handle than the old large one so I had Tasker in Thailand make another jib of similar dimensions (I got the tape measure out before ordering the new sail). 

I am happy with the new jib and would not want it to be any larger. Its specs are

Luff 14.00m

Leach 11.22m

Foot 5.88m

LP 4.47m

Area 31.77m2

Cloth 7 oz Challenge Fastnet

The mainsail had only two reefs so I  had another set put in, which allows me to reef down to abt 14m2. That figure is pretty rough - again I marked its position without by eye using a tape measure.

The Alajuela 38 is an easily driven vessel and does not need heroic amounts of sail to achieve respectable speeds. Don't let the sail maker bully you into oversized sails that may suit the sail maker's Viking image but are inappropriate for sensible passage making.

Greg, Carl and anyone else who may be interested- I got to New Zealand yesterday after an unexpectedly difficult passage from Tonga. I copped a hiding from Cyclone Lola along the way.  I thought I was early enough in the season to be safe from that sort of silliness but that damned cyclone was the earliest ever recorded. Amongst other damage, I  lost the self steering which made the last week of the trip more tedious than it needed to be.

Best

Trev 

Trevor Robertson. 
Iron Bark III

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/alajuelaboats/CAMW%2Be29dmnvV94hPj-OCqq03r8dhaRmcZkwbXWB6Pfk%2B_Bsf-w%40mail.gmail.com.

[p linton]

Thanks everyone for sharing your experiences. Sounds like Trevor has been down the path that I’m on with this new boat and has had enough time and miles under his keel to zero in on an ideal-to-him jib size. I feel confident now continuing the conversation with my sailmaker. 

Patrick

Sent from my iPad

On Nov 8, 2023, at 10:54 PM, Trevor Robertson <trevir...@gmail.com> wrote:



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