Sorting simultaneous 5K/10K races in chute

[Dave Fleishman]

Hello—I searched through the past conversations on this forum and I didn’t find something like what I have, so I’m hoping people might have dealt with this before.

I have two races, a 5K and 10K, with a simultaneous start.  In years past, when we hand-timed, we had two chutes at the end, one for each race, because we pulled the bib tags to get the finish order.  With the chip timing, I don’t feel a need for that any longer, since the chips are assigned to a specific race.

The problem is that people have difficulty following directions, which we reiterate multiple times before and at the race, that they cannot change races in the middle of the race.  We had a woman a couple years ago, registered as a 10K runner, who swore she ran the 10K but it was clear she had run only the 5K.  I simply disqualified her, but I wish I had a better way of differentiating runners with a single finish line chute.  

I plan on putting a camera on the 10K route as a failsafe, but I would like to be able to figure it out better at the finish line without having to go to the cam.  

Any thoughts/ideas/suggestions?  Thanks.

[Patrick W]

Don't worry about chutes, just have a finish.  People don't follow directions at the best of times, but when they're sugar depleted from a race they're even worse lol.  Don't make more work for yourself, look for ways to gather the information automatically as they move through things. No thinking.  If you want to know if they did the full 10k, have a middle split - you don't want something at the finish that causes confusion just becasue it has always been done that way.  

Add cameras or colour code the bib if you want to keep track of what race people registered in.  If it's a standard bib for the event, it is easy to add a neon pink / yellow / green / blue sticker to differentiate the distances.  You can simplify even more if you mark the direction signs with the same colour marks so they just have to follow their colour.

[Brian Agee]

One thing the software can do that might help is to enter something like "34" minutes into the "early detection warning" in the "Scoring" tab for the 10K race. This will highlight anyone that finishes faster than that time.

Also, just to clarify, when you said "since the chips are assigned to a specific race". If you meant using the "Assign to this specific race" when programming tags. I personally wouldn't recommend doing that simply because if you swap someone's race you would also have to give them a new bib #. This also means that you are forced to re-program the unused tags if you want to use them for an upcoming race. No big deal, just a waste of time.

In case someone isn't aware: If you see that someone needs to be swapped to a different race. You can simply right click on the finisher in the results, or on their name in the "Athlete" list on the right, and you'll see an option to quickly swap their race. That's faster and easier than minimizing the timing screen and doing it in the Open race screen.

As Patrick said, the only real way to know is to set up a read point or a camera at the 5k point of the 10k. It's a headache to setup, so you'd probably want to charge extra for a "cheater" read point. The different color bibs is also a big help.

[Dave Fleishman]

Thanks, all.  I tried different color bibs one year, and it made no difference.  5K people in the 10K chute and vice versa.  I have numbers assigned to each race, so I know a 5K entrant, because their number is above 200.  All the others are 10K.  The issue, as Brian notes, is race day swapping.  I’m not worried about them, too much, though, as they at least followed directions.  I just switch them to the other race, and it works fine.  It’s the people who don’t come to me before the race.  

I think the camera will have to be the option.  This is a rural course with no power at the 10K turnaround.  But I can get a cam in at a part of the 10K course that will capture those runners at least.  

I appreciate all your help, everyone.  

[Jennifer Austin]

Hi Dave,

I completely understand your frustration.  I have gotten to the point where we now have on our event websites, registration pages; waiver verbiage and on our rider/runner communications(emails) "If you are registered for xyz event and wish to change your race mileage after receiving confirmation, you must email us with notification of your change before race day. Failure to notify prior to competing will result in disqualification from the event. Email: x...@xyz.com Subject line: SWAP".  

On race day,  you have those few that just aren't up to the 10k or those that are feeling ambitious and want to do the 10k instead of the 5k, they realize they will be disqualified if they do not communicate. And for good measure, we announce it with our before race announcements.  Overkill?  Maybe, but it has made our participants aware and we have had only a handful that played they "I didn't know" card. 

I still do number differences and or color differences on bibs for mileages.  That is just my preference and it seems our participants like that too. 

We do this for both cycling events and running events and it works well for us.