Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[Paul Oranika]

Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform

Perhaps the debate over Benjamin Adekunle and the differing opinions on the man is one more indication that some people would still be blinded by their bigotry and hatred to the point that it is inconceivable for these folks to reason or embrace objectivity in any way, shape or form. Such dubious mentality which prevents some people from calling a spade what it is, may be responsible for their positions over war crimes committed by Adekunle and others during the Nigerian Civil war. Unfortunately for Nigerian war criminals their records and war crimes would remain indelible in the minds of many not only for this generation of Nigerians but also for posterity.

There are two sides to this debate; one side is the praise singers for Adekunle a man who is more appropriately regarded as “the Adolf Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform”, by so many Nigerians.

 The other side is mainly comprised of individuals who are objective enough to call a spade what it is.  Let us quote some excerpts from Benjamin Adekunle on his merits, from the interview he gave to the German reporter Randolph Baumann, of STERN Magazine. The interview took place on August 18, 1968 at Port Harcourt after the city was captured by the federal soldiers during the civil war.

Here are some excerpts and exchange between Adekunle and the German reporter, and you be the judge.

Randolf Baumann: What is happening to the European Humanitarian Assistance programs which were authorized through your government?

 

Adekunle: In the section of the front that I rule—and that is the whole south front from Lagos to the border of Kamerun—I do not want to see the Red Cross, Caritas Aid, World Church delegation, Pope, Missionary, or UN delegation.

 

Randolf Baumann: Does that mean that the many thousands of tons of food that are stored in Lagos will never get to the refugee camps in your section of the country?

 

Adekunle: You are a sharp one, my friend. That’s exactly what I am saying.

 

Randolf Baumann: But you said yourself that most of the refugees in the part you captured are not Ibos.

 

Adekunle: But there could be Ibos among them. I want to avoid feeding a single Ibo as long as this whole people have not given up yet.

Randolf Baumann: What are your troops doing when they march into a town around Port Harcourt, an area where most of the farmers are not Ibos?

 

Adekunle: We aim at everything that moves.

 

Randolf Baumann: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland that is, to the place populated by Ibos only?

 

Adekunle: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.

 

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

 

Adekunle: You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria.

 

Randolf Baumann: Do you sometimes feel sympathy for the Ibos?

 

Adekunle: I have learned a word from the British, which is “sorry”! That’s how I want to respond to your question. I did not want this war but I want to win this war. Therefore I have to kill the Ibos. Sorry!

 

There you have it folks the true words of the man Benjamin Adekunle. Let us carefully analyze  Adekunle’s testimony. Mind you the issue was on allowing relief agencies and international Association of the Red Cross, Caritas, World Council of Churches and other relief agencies to deliver food relief to millions of Biafran Children and older men and women but particularly to the Biafran Children suffering and dying from Kwashiorkor and malnutrition during the Civil war.

During the Second World War Hitler and the Nazis did the same thing when they forced Jews into concentration camps where they deliberately starved them to death, and some were sent to their early graves through the Gas Chambers.

Although Adekunle did not operate in the same method used by Nazi Germany his chosen strategy of denying food relief to the dying Biafrans led to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Biafran children. But let us go further in dissecting Adekunle’s hidden agenda and hatred of the Biafran people.

When Adekunle said, “We shoot at everything that moves and when our troops march into the center of Igbo territory, we shoot at everything even at things that don’t move.”

This statement reveals a lot more about this man’s wickedness and vindictiveness particularly towards the Igbo people. When he made that statement the war had not entered the Igbo heartland. But this evil man through his statement is reserving his harshest and most devilish actions for that period when he enters Igbo heartland. Do you see and were you able to decipher this man’s anger, bigotry and hatred for the Igbos, such obsession was driving his devilish and evil actions during the war.

At the end of the war he got what he deserved and was forced into early retirement from the Nigerian army in 1974, during his prime, illustrating the fact that authorities in the Nigerian army may have been embarrassed to see this man continuing his career in the Nigerian army and for all intents and purposes his life was over then and was submerged into nothingness, and utter neglect. But he was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy, but that is a topic for another day. We congratulate those brave Nigerian House members that boycotted any efforts to honor this man, the evil that men do indeed lives after them!

Those are my views, yours always welcome

Paul Okechukwu Oranika

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

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Subject: [africanworldforum] Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

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[Vin Otuonye]

Ayo:

Why do you always see issues with ethnic lenses? Our criticism of Adekunle is not because of his race/ethnicity. Note how ignorant Adekunle was when Randolf Bauman asked him the question in the email posted below. He was asked, are you a racist? Apparently, Adekunle did not understand the question.

What Randolf Bauman meant is are you a tribalist? Adekunle should have understood the question and his response "You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria" only show how ignorant and low his comprehension of English language is. Sadly, he was even then an officer with the Nigerian army.

Listen Ayo, when Ndigbo criticize people like Adekunle or Awolowo, it is not a criticism of Yoruba race. There are some Yoruba that fought the war like Adekunle but they fought professionally and adhered to the rules of war. These Yoruba soldiers did not kill innocent Igbo babies and children. Do you read us castigating them? There maybe some Yorubas that even risked their lives to save some Biafra kids. Do you read us castigating them? Our fight against people like Adekunle and Awolowo is not a fight against the Yoruba race. It is a fight against injustice. How many times do we have to remind people like you that?  Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere says Martin Luther King, Jr.

Chief Adeniran Ogunsanya was good to Ndigbo and we love him dearly for it.

Why do you act like a juvenile at times? To you it's if they criticize one of our own, they are criticizing my tribe. That is utter rubbish and juvenile way of reasoning.

But let's turn the table. If the Nigerian civil war is between the Yorubas and the rest of Nigeria and a Nigerian officer acted the way of Benjamin Adekunle, be honest, what would be your take? We are not saying people are not killed in war but when every rules of engagement is sacrificed and someone of Adekunle mold go about exterminating innocent lives and you are here defending him (simply because he's your tribesman), honestly, you need to have your mind examined.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 20:48:47 +0000
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Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

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[rotimi fashakin]

I have read some of the inelegant and utterly uncomplimentary things written about the late Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle. For me, he was a courageous soldier with very deep and patriotic love for Nigeria. As a growing lad in Lagos Island in the late sixties, I remembered that able-bodied Men often hid themselves to prevent forced conscription anytime the Black Scorpion came to Town. He was not just feared on the war front, but the civil populace also held him in awesome mysticism. 

Perhaps, the greatest memory of Benjamin Adekunle firmly etched on my mind was the narrative of exemplary leadership as told me by a retired three star general who served under him in the 3rd marine commando. In the weeks, days preceding the massive amphibious landing in Bonny, some of the officers became petrified as to the slim prospect of the mission being successful. The reasoning was that, in contemporary military history, it was only General Douglas MacArthur who did such a large landing at Inchon in the Korean War, code-named 'Operation Chromite' in 1950. So, one of the officers - who later rose to become a two-star general- prodded the rest to move against their commander "before he succeeded in killing all of them."  When asked how he hoped to eliminate the commander, he suggested his being drowned in the Lagos lagoon with a huge milestone around his neck. One of the officers present then suggested that they bounced the idea off the second-in-command (Major Gibson Jallo). It was Jalo who, in a fit of rage, threatened to Court-martial all of them. In parting, he called all of them by name and told them that: "if anything should happen to him, i know all of you." That intervention from Gibson Jalo was what effectively aborted that sinister plot. On the day of the operation, it was Benjamin Adekunle's boat that was ahead of all the other boats on the march towards Bonny. Gibson Jalo then turned to some of the officers: "That was the man you wanted to kill!" It was a demonstrable show of exemplary leadership!

I have read with anguish some of the utterly denigrating things said in memory of a man who hazarded his life for the unity of the Country. Said he in an interview in 1968: "I did not want this war but I want to win this war. Therefore I have to kill the Ibos. Sorry!" Unfortunately, some of our friends (of Igbo extraction) have pilloried him severely for this statement and believe that he deserved no honour in death. How utterly mistaken! Some have even openly applauded the two South Eastern Federal Legislators who refused to accord the traditional one-minute silence in memory of this remarkable Nigerian, as directed by the Speaker of the House of Representatives in the legislative hallowed chambers. Again, this behaviour was couched on a defective herd mentality! As the Yoruba assert: collectively, we must show wisdom and not asininity. What these folks fail to realise is that what is uppermost in the mind of a Military commander is how to win a war and in the quickest time. The more a war lingers, the more the fatalities figure soars and the more the susceptibility loss of Troops' morale. Let us draw a parallel in contemporary history. During the second world war, the Japanese showed stubbornness with their kamikaze attacks and surprise forays into American territory like the Pearl Harbour Attack. As a means of bringing the war to an end quickly, the Americans dropped the Atomic bomb on two Japanese cities (first on Hiroshima on August 6, 1945 and three days later, on Nagasaki). It worked! The Japanese saw the devastating effect of the war and surrendered! Of course, the devastating effect of the Atomic bomb is still felt in those two Japanese cities  more than fifty years later, aside the tens of thousands that were killed immediately. The Americans knew that an invasion of Japan would have cost in excess of one million casualties, hence the decision to drop the bombs. Today, the two Nations (Japan and US) have fostered greater friendship after the cessation of hostilities on August 15, 1945. For me, the continual reference to the role played by Benjamin Adekunle, in this style of prosecuting the war, as to why he must be excoriated is akin to what the late MKO Abiola poetically captured as: "running and looking back at the same time." A philosopher once captured it properly that "if God wanted us to dwell so much on our past, he would have made another pair of eyes at the back of our heads." Like Lot's wife, any one that indulges in looking back when it is imperative in moving forward, there is clearly one destination for that loss of purpose: DESTRUCTION. Unfortunately, someone may read this and label me "an Igbo hater." Undoubtedly, there are various dispensations in the mutation from a geographic space to Nationhood. The Civil war, which ended more than forty four years ago, was one phase that, as Nigerians, must be consigned to history if we must foster amity and genuine reconciliation for the badly needed progress.

God bless Nigeria, the land of our Nativity.

Rotimi Fashakin

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[Ayo Ojutalayo]

 
Vin, my response in color:

Why do you always see issues with ethnic lenses? Our criticism of Adekunle is not because of his race/ethnicity. Note how ignorant Adekunle was when Randolf Bauman asked him the question in the email posted below. He was asked, are you a racist? Apparently, Adekunle did not understand the question.

I am surprised you cannot see Adekunle indirectly telling the journalist to use the proper word instead of "race".

What Randolf Bauman meant is are you a tribalist? Adekunle should have understood the question and his response "You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria" only show how ignorant and low his comprehension of English language is. Sadly, he was even then an officer with the Nigerian army.

Adekunle knew the difference between "racist" and "tribalist" hence he told the journalist that he (journalist) should know racists are in South Africa, and not in Nigeria. You still don't get what Adekunle was doinfg to the journalist? Adekunle was a Sandhurst Royal  Military Academy graduate. I don't know if you know that Sandhurst in the military world is what Oxford and Cambridge Universities are in the academic world. Your saying Adekunle was ignorant and low in English language only exposed your ignorance and your bigotry.

Listen Ayo, when Ndigbo criticize people like Adekunle or Awolowo, it is not a criticism of Yoruba race. There are some Yoruba that fought the war like Adekunle but they fought professionally and adhered to the rules of war. These Yoruba soldiers did not kill innocent Igbo babies and children. Do you read us castigating them? There maybe some Yorubas that even risked their lives to save some Biafra kids. Do you read us castigating them? Our fight against people like Adekunle and Awolowo is not a fight against the Yoruba race. It is a fight against injustice. How many times do we have to remind people like you that?  Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere says Martin Luther King, Jr.

Vin, I am yet to see any one that witnessed Adekunle or his men kill innocent Igbo babies and children. The nearest to it was Pastor Emeka Okala who said Nigerian "foot soldiers" killed his uncle, and he did not respond when I asked him pointedly who were the "foot soldiers" that killed his uncle. As I indicated, I would believe him if he says Adekunle or his men killed his uncle.

Your fight is not against injustice. Your fight is against every body that contributed to the fall of biafra; and the more the contribution to biafra's death, the more voracious you are against the person.

Chief Adeniran Ogunsanya was good to Ndigbo and we love him dearly for it.

If Chief Ogunsanya was given a responsibility by the federal government in pursuit of keeping Nigeria one in 1967-1970, he would have had no choice but to discharge the responsibility to the best of his ability.

Why do you act like a juvenile at times? To you it's if they criticize one of our own, they are criticizing my tribe. That is utter rubbish and juvenile way of reasoning.

You are the one that act like a juvenile. I have made it very clear on these forums many times that the federal troops fought on my behalf as a Nigerian. I will therefore not keep quiet when people like you abuse and insult those who kept Nigeria from disintegration including Generals Gowon and Ike Nwachukwu who are not Yorubas. Only people that are new on the forums will allege that I defend only Yorubas that fought or worked to keep Nigeria one.

But let's turn the table. If the Nigerian civil war is between the Yorubas and the rest of Nigeria and a Nigerian officer acted the way of Benjamin Adekunle, be honest, what would be your take? We are not saying people are not killed in war but when every rules of engagement is sacrificed and someone of Adekunle mold go about exterminating innocent lives and you are here defending him (simply because he's your tribesman), honestly, you need to have your mind examined.

Vin, your question is irrelevant because my position is very clear: all sides commited atrocities before and during the civil war, we should move on. If you refuse to move on, because to you, only non-Igbos commited atrocities, I will defend those who fought on my behalf to keep Nigeria one. If you know what "rules of engagement" are, you should know that they are not given by the enemy. You don't know the rules of engagement given to Nigerian Commanders. You can therefore not claim that "every rules of engagement" was sacrificed. If war crimes were committed (and would have been committed by both sides), this should have been handled at the appropriate venue all these years. You guys should get over it. You cannot re-fight the war: move on, 99% of Ndigbo have moved on!

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Ayo Ojutalayo

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[Vin Otuonye]

Ayo:

I am surprised that you (like Adekunle) don't know that the words race and tribe are used interchangeably. The journalist is not ignorant. The journalist knows that Nigeria is 100% black. So, he used the right word when he used "race". Tribe and ethnicity is what we Nigerians use.

 

I know that Adekunle went to Sandhurst Royal Military Academy. That he went to Sandhurst means nothing. It doesn't speak of his intelligence. A lot of people go Ivy league schools and honestly don't impress me. I practice with some of them so I know what am talking about.

 

The Federal government did not ask Adekunle to kill innocent babies and children. Listen, the leader of MASSOB, Chief Ralph Uwazurike formed that association because he watched his 8 year-old sister die because of the way people like Adekunle prosecuted that war. That image is forever in his memory.

 

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 00:22:34 +0000
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Subject: [africanworldforum] Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

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[Otitigbe Obadiah Oghoerore Alegbe Ph.D (The Okatakyie Otitigbe of Africa)]

Adekunle did not say "shoot anything that moves". It was Mohammed Shuwa in Awka the only place that I believe there were war crimes based on a friend of mine who was in the Awka as a Couple.

Awka was where all the Engineering of Biafra was done where they manufactured weapons because they were all black smiths. For that reason, Shuwa ordered to shoot anything that moved.

Otitigbe.

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[peter opara]

Otitigbe, you are worse than a GOAT. What is wrong with you?! You are going to defend Adekunle and pair him with Shuwa, a man who did his bit to stop senseless murder of Igbo in the north! Do you read? If you do, do you comprehend? You never read the words of Adekunle or you go blind when you come across his words or words attributed to him. Ogogoro head. You wish Adekunle on your folks, he is a fine man by you that you must defend. So let his kind chance on your folks in time conflagration. How about that cow head.

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[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Vin,

Only illiterates will use race and tribe interchangeably. It is not done in in Social Sciences, and not in Law. A journalist who does, must be English-challenged. After all, the journalist who interviewed Adekunle was not British, not Canadian or not American. He can therefore be forgiven for using race instead of tribe. Adekunle was not obliged to help him out, more so since the journalist's question conveyed some bias already. Tribe and ethnicity may be use interchangeably, not race and tribe.

I don't know Chief Ralph Uwazurike, so I won't know how credible he or his story is. There are Igbos and minority Eastern Nigerians on these forums that I will believe whatever they say happened to them or their relations during the civil war. I am waiting for such people to tell us their stories if they have any. I will not be surprised hearing stories of atrocities in any war. It will be a miracle to hear of a war with no atrocities. That is why those who deny atrocities on the biafran side sound ridiculous to me.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
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Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 8:42 PM
Subject: RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

What is Peter Opara saying here? That Shuwa "did his bit to stop senseless murder of Igbo in the north" does not mean he would be happy when he got to Igbo/Biafra ammunition factories.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

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Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 11:24 PM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

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[Chika Onyeani]

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[Vin Otuonye]

Ayo:

You are simply talking rubbish in your attempt to defend Adekunle. Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably. Only an illiterate, as you stated think otherwise. Beside, you conveniently dodged the point that Nigeria is 100% black so when the journalist used race, his meaning is clear. He cannot be talking about whites or Asians.  Only olodo and English or mentally challenged person will fail to understand him. By the way that he is not British means nothing. British are not supposed to be expert in English language especially if he is Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 04:22:03 +0000
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Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

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[emmanuel ileka]

Vin,

I am not sure if you passed GS 101 in school to canvass the fact that race, ethnicity and tribe can be used interchangeably.

You may need to google the meaning of the words to continue in this discourse.

Chris.

---

From: vincent...@msn.com
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CC: ayooju...@yahoo.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 11:21:53 +0000

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[Otitigbe Obadiah Oghoerore Alegbe Ph.D (The Okatakyie Otitigbe of Africa)]

Peter.

Are you stupid? You must be a dog. No wonder your support for Buhari who participated in killing Igbos.

Mohamed Shuwa committed the atrocities in Awka. My friend was in the Division. Shuwa was the one to be accused of genocide.

Continue to live in bitterness until you die. You are nor redeemable.

Otitigbe

From: 'peter opara' via AfricanWorldForum

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[Otitigbe Obadiah Oghoerore Alegbe Ph.D (The Okatakyie Otitigbe of Africa)]

In fact Mohammed Shuwa in obedience Hassan Katsina started the war. Gowon never said the word go. It was Mohammed Shuwa who was in command of the Fist division who said "All we are waiting for is the word Go". Do nto be stupid. You were not born. I was around.

The first commander to move troops against Biafra was Mohammed Shuwa. In fact the war started as North versus Biafra until Biafra invaded Mid-West and move to Lagos then Adekunle was asked to block him in Ore. Mid West was supposed not to be a battle field as requested be Ejoor but Ojukwu betrayed him and it was then another front was opened. Adekunle did not start the war.

Policemen were sent to arrest Ojukwu and Biafrans slaughter all of then, it was the Hassan in rebellion against Gowon order Shuwa to move on and capture Ojukwu by force.

Otitigbe.

From: 'peter opara' via AfricanWorldForum

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 12:24 AM

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[Otitigbe Obadiah Oghoerore Alegbe Ph.D (The Okatakyie Otitigbe of Africa)]

If you do not identify your enemies, you cannot defeat them.

Otitigbe.

From: 'peter opara' via AfricanWorldForum

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 12:24 AM

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[Otitigbe Obadiah Oghoerore Alegbe Ph.D (The Okatakyie Otitigbe of Africa)]

Ayo.

It shows that Peter is just anti-Yoruba or someon embittered Yorubaphobia. Can you imagine an Igbo  man ferverently supporting and Hausa-Fulani candidate against an Niger Delta while at the same time crying genocide?

Otitigbe.

From: 'Ayo Ojutalayo' via AfricanWorldForum

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 1:46 AM

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[Stevek]

Chris,

Clearly, this man is struggling to get a round peg to fit a square hole to fit his questionable purpose.

He has this very annoying habit of finding 'facts' or defining terms to fit his logical absurdities to feed his tribal bias, even though this man is just a Lagos boy whose parents were Igbo. He is highly prevaricate. And then when you point this out to him, he reverts to atavistic uncivility and foul language about having sex with one's wife, mother, and sister.

That kind of behavior may be acceptable to a Stone Mountain, Georgia, cabbie but not here on these forums of, mostly, professionals.

On the real substance of this discussion, both Ayo and this character were trying to fit the words of the Briton to their tribalist agenda.

A Briton knows the difference between 'tribe' and 'race'; it is his language. The Britons knew it long before we knew the word after they have used it to label us, based on the observation of our characteristics.

They had among themselves: Welsh, Irish, Scots, and English. But they never called themselves tribes because they didn't (and still don't) band on the basis of whether they are Welsh, Irish, Scots, or English. So, when they came to Africa and saw how the Africans, atavistically, banded together against each other on the basis of distinct differences in language (and sometimes, very little differences) - a social quality that is comparable to monkeys and apes, they went back to their language to find a word for it. And among the various phrases at their disposal (a flight of birds, a school of fish, a tribe of monkeys), they concluded that the word 'tribe' fitted what they observed of Africans. So, we became tribes. And the word 'tribalism' became an African word. They even put it as an item of identity in our passports (check out an expired Nigerian passport issued up to the 1970s and you'd see what I mean).

And we are that way till this day, even after we obtain Ph.Ds or teach conjured Ph.Ds.

The Briton spoke his native language. He asked Lt. Col. Adekunle if he was racist, i.e., hated white people. That he was a tribalist was already in evidence. After all, it was that which necessitated the interview!

This reminds me of the relationship that born again evangelical Nigerians (and other Africans) have with Christianity. They take the religion brought to them, largely, by the Anglican Church, modify, replace their pagan sacrifice requiring ancestral worship with it, and exaggerate their beliefs in it so much that they would murder others or go to an open war with those who don't believe exactly as they do.

But the Archbishop of Canterbury, the head of the Anglican Church that brought them the origin genuine religion before the ignorant Africans corrupted it, easily admits that sometimes he wonders about the existence of God.

If you hang around these forum long enough, you will read a certain local broken English-speaking acountant in Ajegunle, Lagos, tell you that he has a better English language comprehension than a scientist that has lived in the US for over 40 years.

That is our nature.

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: emmanuel ileka <emma_...@hotmail.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>

Cc: "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 8:04 AM
Subject: RE: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin,

I am not sure if you passed GS 101 in school to canvass the fact that race, ethnicity and tribe can be used interchangeably.

You may need to google the meaning of the words to continue in this discourse.

Chris.

From: vincent...@msn.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: ayooju...@yahoo.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay
Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 11:21:53 +0000

Ayo:

You are simply talking rubbish in your attempt to defend Adekunle. Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably. Only an illiterate, as you stated think otherwise. Beside, you conveniently dodged the point that Nigeria is 100% black so when the journalist used race, his meaning is clear. He cannot be talking about whites or Asians.  Only olodo and English or mentally challenged person will fail to understand him. By the way that he is not British means nothing. British are not supposed to be expert in English language especially if he is Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 04:22:03 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: vincent...@msn.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin,

Only illiterates will use race and tribe interchangeably. It is not done in in Social Sciences, and not in Law. A journalist who does, must be English-challenged. After all, the journalist who interviewed Adekunle was not British, not Canadian or not American. He can therefore be forgiven for using race instead of tribe. Adekunle was not obliged to help him out, more so since the journalist's question conveyed some bias already. Tribe and ethnicity may be use interchangeably, not race and tribe.

I don't know Chief Ralph Uwazurike, so I won't know how credible he or his story is. There are Igbos and minority Eastern Nigerians on these forums that I will believe whatever they say happened to them or their relations during the civil war. I am waiting for such people to tell us their stories if they have any. I will not be surprised hearing stories of atrocities in any war. It will be a miracle to hear of a war with no atrocities. That is why those who deny atrocities on the biafran side sound ridiculous to me.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Cc: NigerianWomanForum <nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 8:42 PM
Subject: RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Ayo:

I am surprised that you (like Adekunle) don't know that the words race and tribe are used interchangeably. The journalist is not ignorant. The journalist knows that Nigeria is 100% black. So, he used the right word when he used "race". Tribe and ethnicity is what we Nigerians use.

 

I know that Adekunle went to Sandhurst Royal Military Academy. That he went to Sandhurst means nothing. It doesn't speak of his intelligence. A lot of people go Ivy league schools and honestly don't impress me. I practice with some of them so I know what am talking about.

 

The Federal government did not ask Adekunle to kill innocent babies and children. Listen, the leader of MASSOB, Chief Ralph Uwazurike formed that association because he watched his 8 year-old sister die because of the way people like Adekunle prosecuted that war. That image is forever in his memory.

 

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 00:22:34 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; omo...@yahoogroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com; naijao...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

 
Vin, my response in color:

Why do you always see issues with ethnic lenses? Our criticism of Adekunle is not because of his race/ethnicity. Note how ignorant Adekunle was when Randolf Bauman asked him the question in the email posted below. He was asked, are you a racist? Apparently, Adekunle did not understand the question.

I am surprised you cannot see Adekunle indirectly telling the journalist to use the proper word instead of "race".

What Randolf Bauman meant is are you a tribalist? Adekunle should have understood the question and his response "You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria" only show how ignorant and low his comprehension of English language is. Sadly, he was even then an officer with the Nigerian army.

Adekunle knew the difference between "racist" and "tribalist" hence he told the journalist that he (journalist) should know racists are in South Africa, and not in Nigeria. You still don't get what Adekunle was doinfg to the journalist? Adekunle was a Sandhurst Royal  Military Academy graduate. I don't know if you know that Sandhurst in the military world is what Oxford and Cambridge Universities are in the academic world. Your saying Adekunle was ignorant and low in English language only exposed your ignorance and your bigotry.

Listen Ayo, when Ndigbo criticize people like Adekunle or Awolowo, it is not a criticism of Yoruba race. There are some Yoruba that fought the war like Adekunle but they fought professionally and adhered to the rules of war. These Yoruba soldiers did not kill innocent Igbo babies and children. Do you read us castigating them? There maybe some Yorubas that even risked their lives to save some Biafra kids. Do you read us castigating them? Our fight against people like Adekunle and Awolowo is not a fight against the Yoruba race. It is a fight against injustice. How many times do we have to remind people like you that?  Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere says Martin Luther King, Jr.

Vin, I am yet to see any one that witnessed Adekunle or his men kill innocent Igbo babies and children. The nearest to it was Pastor Emeka Okala who said Nigerian "foot soldiers" killed his uncle, and he did not respond when I asked him pointedly who were the "foot soldiers" that killed his uncle. As I indicated, I would believe him if he says Adekunle or his men killed his uncle.

Your fight is not against injustice. Your fight is against every body that contributed to the fall of biafra; and the more the contribution to biafra's death, the more voracious you are against the person.

Chief Adeniran Ogunsanya was good to Ndigbo and we love him dearly for it.

If Chief Ogunsanya was given a responsibility by the federal government in pursuit of keeping Nigeria one in 1967-1970, he would have had no choice but to discharge the responsibility to the best of his ability.

Why do you act like a juvenile at times? To you it's if they criticize one of our own, they are criticizing my tribe. That is utter rubbish and juvenile way of reasoning.

You are the one that act like a juvenile. I have made it very clear on these forums many times that the federal troops fought on my behalf as a Nigerian. I will therefore not keep quiet when people like you abuse and insult those who kept Nigeria from disintegration including Generals Gowon and Ike Nwachukwu who are not Yorubas. Only people that are new on the forums will allege that I defend only Yorubas that fought or worked to keep Nigeria one.

But let's turn the table. If the Nigerian civil war is between the Yorubas and the rest of Nigeria and a Nigerian officer acted the way of Benjamin Adekunle, be honest, what would be your take? We are not saying people are not killed in war but when every rules of engagement is sacrificed and someone of Adekunle mold go about exterminating innocent lives and you are here defending him (simply because he's your tribesman), honestly, you need to have your mind examined.

Vin, your question is irrelevant because my position is very clear: all sides commited atrocities before and during the civil war, we should move on. If you refuse to move on, because to you, only non-Igbos commited atrocities, I will defend those who fought on my behalf to keep Nigeria one. If you know what "rules of engagement" are, you should know that they are not given by the enemy. You don't know the rules of engagement given to Nigerian Commanders. You can therefore not claim that "every rules of engagement" was sacrificed. If war crimes were committed (and would have been committed by both sides), this should have been handled at the appropriate venue all these years. You guys should get over it. You cannot re-fight the war: move on, 99% of Ndigbo have moved on!

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Ayo Ojutalayo

Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 20:48:47 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W43982E54A2CAD7FF0339C9E7B40%40phx.gbl.

[emmanuel ileka]

Vin,

Please find below for your information.

Chris

"The traditional definition of race and ethnicity is related to biological and sociological factors respectively.

Race refers to a person's physical appearance, such as skin color, eye color, hair color, bone/jaw structure etc.

Ethnicity, on the other hand, relates to cultural factors such as nationality, culture, ancestry, language and beliefs."

For example, take the Caucasian race. The physical characteristics of Caucasians were described by M. A. MacConaill, as being "light skin and eyes, narrow noses, and thin lips. Their hair is usually straight or wavy". Caucasoids are said to have the lowest degree of projection of the alveolar bones which contain the teeth, a notable size prominence of the cranium and forehead region, and a projection of the mid facial region. A person whose appearance matches these characteristics is said to be a Caucasian. 

Comparison chart

	Ethnicity	Race
Definition	An ethnic group or ethnicity is a population of human beings whose members identify with each other, on the basis of a real or a presumed common genealogy or ancestry.	The term race refers to the concept of dividing people into populations or groups on the basis of various sets of physical characteristics (which usually result from genetic ancestry).
Significance	Ethnicity connotes shared cultural traits and a shared group history. Some ethnic groups also share linguistic or religious traits, while others share a common group history but not a common language or religion.	Race presumes shared biological or genetic traits, whether actual or asserted. In the early 19th century, racial differences were ascribed significance in areas of intelligence, health, and personality. There is no evidence validating these ideas.
Genealogy	Ethnicity is defined in terms of shared genealogy, whether actual or presumed. Typically, if people believe they descend from a particular group, and they want to be associated with that group, then they are in fact members of that group.	Racial categories result from a shared genealogy due to geographical isolation. In the modern world this isolation has been broken down and racial groups have mixed.
Distinguishing Factors	Ethnic groups distinguish themselves differently from one time period to another. They typically seek to define themselves but also are defined by the stereotypes of dominant groups.	Races are assumed to be distinguished by skin color, facial type, etc. However, the scientific basis of racial distinctions is very weak. Scientific studies show that racial genetic differences are weak except in skin color.
Nationalism	In 19th century, there was development of the political ideology of ethnic nationalism -- creating nations based on a presumed shared ethnic origins (e.g. Germany, Italy, Sweden...)	In 19th century, the concept of nationalism was often used to justify the domination of one race over another within a specific nation.
Legal System	In the last decades of the 20th century, in the U.S. and in most nations, the legal system as well as the official ideology prohibited ethnic-based discrimination.	In the last decades of the 20th century, the legal system as well as the official ideology emphasized racial equality.
Conflicts	Often brutal conflicts between ethnic groups have existed throughout history and across the world. But most ethnic groups in fact get along peacefully within one another in most nations most of the time.	Racial prejudice remains a continuing problem throughout the world. However, there are fewer race-based conflicts in the 21st century than in the past.
Examples of conflict	Conflict between Tamil and Sinhalese populations in Sri Lanka.	Conflict between white and African-American people in the U.S., especially during the civil rights movement.

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 06:10:43 -0700
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/1411132243.11686.YahooMailNeo%40web125101.mail.ne1.yahoo.com.

[Stevek]

"You are simply talking rubbish in your attempt to defend Adekunle. Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably. Only an illiterate, as you stated think otherwise." _ Vin the Cabbie

Vintage Vin. And what is the 'rubbish' that Ayo was talking? "Only illiterates will use race and tribe interchangeably. It is not done in in Social Sciences, and not in Law. A journalist who does, must be English-challenged." - Ayo

He acts idiotically and stupidly then preempts to call his opponent the very things that ONLY he is guilty of. Then he flavors his chutzpah with foul guttersnipe about having sex with people's wives, mothers, and sisters.

That is what gave me the first clue that the cabbie was just a pretend lawyer on the Internet. After all, lawyers are professionals who are more knowledgeable and disciplined.

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>

Cc: "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 7:21 AM
Subject: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Ayo:

You are simply talking rubbish in your attempt to defend Adekunle. Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably. Only an illiterate, as you stated think otherwise. Beside, you conveniently dodged the point that Nigeria is 100% black so when the journalist used race, his meaning is clear. He cannot be talking about whites or Asians.  Only olodo and English or mentally challenged person will fail to understand him. By the way that he is not British means nothing. British are not supposed to be expert in English language especially if he is Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 04:22:03 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: vincent...@msn.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin,

Only illiterates will use race and tribe interchangeably. It is not done in in Social Sciences, and not in Law. A journalist who does, must be English-challenged. After all, the journalist who interviewed Adekunle was not British, not Canadian or not American. He can therefore be forgiven for using race instead of tribe. Adekunle was not obliged to help him out, more so since the journalist's question conveyed some bias already. Tribe and ethnicity may be use interchangeably, not race and tribe.

I don't know Chief Ralph Uwazurike, so I won't know how credible he or his story is. There are Igbos and minority Eastern Nigerians on these forums that I will believe whatever they say happened to them or their relations during the civil war. I am waiting for such people to tell us their stories if they have any. I will not be surprised hearing stories of atrocities in any war. It will be a miracle to hear of a war with no atrocities. That is why those who deny atrocities on the biafran side sound ridiculous to me.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Cc: NigerianWomanForum <nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 8:42 PM
Subject: RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Ayo:

I am surprised that you (like Adekunle) don't know that the words race and tribe are used interchangeably. The journalist is not ignorant. The journalist knows that Nigeria is 100% black. So, he used the right word when he used "race". Tribe and ethnicity is what we Nigerians use.

 

I know that Adekunle went to Sandhurst Royal Military Academy. That he went to Sandhurst means nothing. It doesn't speak of his intelligence. A lot of people go Ivy league schools and honestly don't impress me. I practice with some of them so I know what am talking about.

 

The Federal government did not ask Adekunle to kill innocent babies and children. Listen, the leader of MASSOB, Chief Ralph Uwazurike formed that association because he watched his 8 year-old sister die because of the way people like Adekunle prosecuted that war. That image is forever in his memory.

 

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 00:22:34 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; omo...@yahoogroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com; naijao...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

 
Vin, my response in color:

Why do you always see issues with ethnic lenses? Our criticism of Adekunle is not because of his race/ethnicity. Note how ignorant Adekunle was when Randolf Bauman asked him the question in the email posted below. He was asked, are you a racist? Apparently, Adekunle did not understand the question.

I am surprised you cannot see Adekunle indirectly telling the journalist to use the proper word instead of "race".

What Randolf Bauman meant is are you a tribalist? Adekunle should have understood the question and his response "You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria" only show how ignorant and low his comprehension of English language is. Sadly, he was even then an officer with the Nigerian army.

Adekunle knew the difference between "racist" and "tribalist" hence he told the journalist that he (journalist) should know racists are in South Africa, and not in Nigeria. You still don't get what Adekunle was doinfg to the journalist? Adekunle was a Sandhurst Royal  Military Academy graduate. I don't know if you know that Sandhurst in the military world is what Oxford and Cambridge Universities are in the academic world. Your saying Adekunle was ignorant and low in English language only exposed your ignorance and your bigotry.

Listen Ayo, when Ndigbo criticize people like Adekunle or Awolowo, it is not a criticism of Yoruba race. There are some Yoruba that fought the war like Adekunle but they fought professionally and adhered to the rules of war. These Yoruba soldiers did not kill innocent Igbo babies and children. Do you read us castigating them? There maybe some Yorubas that even risked their lives to save some Biafra kids. Do you read us castigating them? Our fight against people like Adekunle and Awolowo is not a fight against the Yoruba race. It is a fight against injustice. How many times do we have to remind people like you that?  Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere says Martin Luther King, Jr.

Vin, I am yet to see any one that witnessed Adekunle or his men kill innocent Igbo babies and children. The nearest to it was Pastor Emeka Okala who said Nigerian "foot soldiers" killed his uncle, and he did not respond when I asked him pointedly who were the "foot soldiers" that killed his uncle. As I indicated, I would believe him if he says Adekunle or his men killed his uncle.

Your fight is not against injustice. Your fight is against every body that contributed to the fall of biafra; and the more the contribution to biafra's death, the more voracious you are against the person.

Chief Adeniran Ogunsanya was good to Ndigbo and we love him dearly for it.

If Chief Ogunsanya was given a responsibility by the federal government in pursuit of keeping Nigeria one in 1967-1970, he would have had no choice but to discharge the responsibility to the best of his ability.

Why do you act like a juvenile at times? To you it's if they criticize one of our own, they are criticizing my tribe. That is utter rubbish and juvenile way of reasoning.

You are the one that act like a juvenile. I have made it very clear on these forums many times that the federal troops fought on my behalf as a Nigerian. I will therefore not keep quiet when people like you abuse and insult those who kept Nigeria from disintegration including Generals Gowon and Ike Nwachukwu who are not Yorubas. Only people that are new on the forums will allege that I defend only Yorubas that fought or worked to keep Nigeria one.

But let's turn the table. If the Nigerian civil war is between the Yorubas and the rest of Nigeria and a Nigerian officer acted the way of Benjamin Adekunle, be honest, what would be your take? We are not saying people are not killed in war but when every rules of engagement is sacrificed and someone of Adekunle mold go about exterminating innocent lives and you are here defending him (simply because he's your tribesman), honestly, you need to have your mind examined.

Vin, your question is irrelevant because my position is very clear: all sides commited atrocities before and during the civil war, we should move on. If you refuse to move on, because to you, only non-Igbos commited atrocities, I will defend those who fought on my behalf to keep Nigeria one. If you know what "rules of engagement" are, you should know that they are not given by the enemy. You don't know the rules of engagement given to Nigerian Commanders. You can therefore not claim that "every rules of engagement" was sacrificed. If war crimes were committed (and would have been committed by both sides), this should have been handled at the appropriate venue all these years. You guys should get over it. You cannot re-fight the war: move on, 99% of Ndigbo have moved on!

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Ayo Ojutalayo

Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 20:48:47 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W413B22614B38DF75CB9810DBB40%40phx.gbl.

[Wilson Iguade]

Vin ,

You are making yourself look bad by saying or repeating falsehood "... race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably".

This is all am gonna sey, because do not want to get into y'all fight. Please stop misleading the gullible amongst us by saying "Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably."

Seriously! Una wire mi sef! "I"

Sent from my iPhone

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W413B22614B38DF75CB9810DBB40%40phx.gbl.

[okoiad...@gmail.com]

It is even wrong sociologically, anthropologically and literally to refer to an ethnic nationality as massive as the Igbo as a "tribe"! 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/COL403-EAS239110F4BE523FF94B44A81D4B40%40phx.gbl.

[Vin Otuonye]

Chris:

I want to thank you for your insult. Please note how you jumped into the fray without following the thread. You see how you have given the old grumpy cranky imbecille jail house lawyer, Stevek, opportunity to insult me? While at it, what is GS 101?

It's rather unfortunate that you have to seek outside source to know the meaning of race and ethnicity. It is evident what the meanings are and you really need not go to outside source if indeed you passed your GS 101. When that interview was conducted between Adekunle and the journalist in the late 60s, ethnicity or tribe is not a common word used. Race is. And race and ethnicity are used interchangeably then, as it is even today. But paying close attention to the question asked, only a fool will not understand what the question is. This is what transpired between Adekunle and the journalist:

Randolf Baumann: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland that is, to the place populated by Ibos only?

 

Adekunle: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.

 

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

 

Adekunle: You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria.

Now, with above in mind, why can't Adekunle  (and some of you here) realize that the Randolf Baumann is talking about tribe and ethnicity? Isn't Nigeria 100% black? Do we have white/caucasian Nigerians? Do we have Asian Nigerians? So, why is the question: are you a racist difficult for you guys? That Randolf Baumann used the word "racist", he meant tribe/ethnicity. Race and ethnicity are used interchangeably then and now. Why is that difficult for you to understand? And you are here insulting me. You owe me an apology.

Now, the imbecille jail house lawyer, Stevek said the Briton spoke his native language when he asked  are you a racist "hated white people". But what has being a racist and hating white people got to do with this interview. The immediate question preceding that question laid the groundwork for us to understand. The preceding question was;

Randolf Baumann: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland that is, to the place populated by Ibos only? to which Adekunle replied:

Adekunle: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.

As you can see from above question, the journalist did not mean to ask Adekunle are you a racist in the sense of do you hate white people. The race he meant is tribe/ethnicity.

So keep your comparison chart of what race and ethnicity mean to yourself. No thank you.

Finally, I want to throw a challenge to the imbecille, jail house lawyer Stevek: Since you don't know how to do research, I'll help you out: Check the Georgia Bar Organization. If you don't see my name Vincent Otuonye as attorney in good standing with the state bar of Georgia, forever keep your stinky mouth shut.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

From: emma_...@hotmail.com

To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: ayooju...@yahoo.com

Subject: RE: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 09:25:21 -0400 

Vin,

Please find below for your information.

Chris

"The traditional definition of race and ethnicity is related to biological and sociological factors respectively.

Race refers to a person's physical appearance, such as skin color, eye color, hair color, bone/jaw structure etc..Ethnicity, on the other hand, relates to cultural factors such as nationality, culture, ancestry, language and beliefs."

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W23E3F78F0476DC1EC0B8D4E7B40%40phx.gbl.

[Vin Otuonye]

Wilson:

The word tribe/ethnicity is not in vogue (prevaliling style at a particular time) in the late 60s. Race is.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 15:09:44 +0100

Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

From: okoiad...@gmail.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/20140919140944.4866189.98619.44546%40gmail.com.

[ASKTJ]

All this adekunle/Hitler debate is just a distraction from the issue of the moment $9.3m Cashgate for arms -a wanton display of incompetence and corruption.

Adekunle is dead and he is now continuing the journey of life and facing reality of life after death with his deeds while on mother earth

Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com> wrote:

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

From: africanw...@googlegroups.com</a

[Tijani Asuku]

All this adekunle/Hitler debate is just a distraction from the issue of the moment $9.3m Cashgate for arms -a wanton display of incompetence and corruption.

Adekunle is dead and he is now continuing the journey of life and facing reality of life after death with his deeds while on mother earth.

[Tijani Asuku]

All this adekunle/Hitler debate is just a distraction from the issue of the moment $9.3m Cashgate for arms -a wanton display of incompetence and corruption.

Adekunle is dead and he is now continuing the journey of life and facing reality of life after death with his deeds while on mother earth

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/1298530464.2441.1411086154826.JavaMail.yahoo%40jws10645.mail.bf1.yahoo.com.

[Stevek]

"The word tribe/ethnicity is not in vogue (prevaliling style at a particular time) in the late 60s. Race is." - Vin the Cabbie

Vin,

You are so full of bullcrap it ain't even funny anymore. How do you know that what you wrote above is true? Your Igbo parents, probably, haven't been married and moved to Lagos yet!

Yes, tribe was so much 'in vogue' that Nigerian passports issued in the 70' (and, I suspect, in the 60's) had a category of 'Tribe' for identity purposes. I know this because I still have my old cancelled Nigerian passport.

You just open your damned mouth and say any Godforsaken thing that comes to your mind to win an argument as if you are in a beer parlor among your fellow cabbies just because we are on the Internet.

Pari paso, it is impossible for me to insult the likes of you. Anything I say to you, no matter how bad you feel about it, should be considered friendly advice, seeing that I merely say what is true about you; unlike you about me and others.

At 10:19 am, shouldn't you be sitting in a courthouse, instead of spewing untruth to the Internet on the computer?

Hope your pickups are good today.

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "igu...@hotmail.com" <igu...@hotmail.com>; "okoiad...@gmail.com" <okoiad...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 10:19 AM
Subject: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Wilson:

The word tribe/ethnicity is not in vogue (prevaliling style at a particular time) in the late 60s. Race is.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 15:09:44 +0100
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay
From: okoiad...@gmail.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com

It is even wrong sociologically, anthropologically and literally to refer to an ethnic nationality as massive as the Igbo as a "tribe"! 

From: Wilson Iguade Sent: Friday, 19 September 2014 14:58 To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Reply To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Cc: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin ,

You are making yourself look bad by saying or repeating falsehood "... race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably".

This is all am gonna sey, because do not want to get into y'all fight. Please stop misleading the gullible amongst us by saying "Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably."

Seriously! Una wire mi sef! "I"

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 19, 2014, at 6:21 AM, "Vin Otuonye" <vincent...@msn.com> wrote:

Ayo:

You are simply talking rubbish in your attempt to defend Adekunle. Get this: race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably. Only an illiterate, as you stated think otherwise. Beside, you conveniently dodged the point that Nigeria is 100% black so when the journalist used race, his meaning is clear. He cannot be talking about whites or Asians.  Only olodo and English or mentally challenged person will fail to understand him. By the way that he is not British means nothing. British are not supposed to be expert in English language especially if he is Welsh, Scottish or Northern Irish.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 04:22:03 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: vincent...@msn.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin,

Only illiterates will use race and tribe interchangeably. It is not done in in Social Sciences, and not in Law. A journalist who does, must be English-challenged. After all, the journalist who interviewed Adekunle was not British, not Canadian or not American. He can therefore be forgiven for using race instead of tribe. Adekunle was not obliged to help him out, more so since the journalist's question conveyed some bias already. Tribe and ethnicity may be use interchangeably, not race and tribe.

I don't know Chief Ralph Uwazurike, so I won't know how credible he or his story is. There are Igbos and minority Eastern Nigerians on these forums that I will believe whatever they say happened to them or their relations during the civil war. I am waiting for such people to tell us their stories if they have any. I will not be surprised hearing stories of atrocities in any war. It will be a miracle to hear of a war with no atrocities. That is why those who deny atrocities on the biafran side sound ridiculous to me.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Cc: NigerianWomanForum <nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, September 18, 2014 8:42 PM
Subject: RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Ayo:

I am surprised that you (like Adekunle) don't know that the words race and tribe are used interchangeably. The journalist is not ignorant. The journalist knows that Nigeria is 100% black. So, he used the right word when he used "race". Tribe and ethnicity is what we Nigerians use.

 

I know that Adekunle went to Sandhurst Royal Military Academy. That he went to Sandhurst means nothing. It doesn't speak of his intelligence. A lot of people go Ivy league schools and honestly don't impress me. I practice with some of them so I know what am talking about.

 

The Federal government did not ask Adekunle to kill innocent babies and children. Listen, the leader of MASSOB, Chief Ralph Uwazurike formed that association because he watched his 8 year-old sister die because of the way people like Adekunle prosecuted that war. That image is forever in his memory.

 

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 00:22:34 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; omo...@yahoogroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com; naijao...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

 
Vin, my response in color:

Why do you always see issues with ethnic lenses? Our criticism of Adekunle is not because of his race/ethnicity. Note how ignorant Adekunle was when Randolf Bauman asked him the question in the email posted below. He was asked, are you a racist? Apparently, Adekunle did not understand the question.

I am surprised you cannot see Adekunle indirectly telling the journalist to use the proper word instead of "race".

What Randolf Bauman meant is are you a tribalist? Adekunle should have understood the question and his response "You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria" only show how ignorant and low his comprehension of English language is. Sadly, he was even then an officer with the Nigerian army.

Adekunle knew the difference between "racist" and "tribalist" hence he told the journalist that he (journalist) should know racists are in South Africa, and not in Nigeria. You still don't get what Adekunle was doinfg to the journalist? Adekunle was a Sandhurst Royal  Military Academy graduate. I don't know if you know that Sandhurst in the military world is what Oxford and Cambridge Universities are in the academic world. Your saying Adekunle was ignorant and low in English language only exposed your ignorance and your bigotry.

Listen Ayo, when Ndigbo criticize people like Adekunle or Awolowo, it is not a criticism of Yoruba race. There are some Yoruba that fought the war like Adekunle but they fought professionally and adhered to the rules of war. These Yoruba soldiers did not kill innocent Igbo babies and children. Do you read us castigating them? There maybe some Yorubas that even risked their lives to save some Biafra kids. Do you read us castigating them? Our fight against people like Adekunle and Awolowo is not a fight against the Yoruba race. It is a fight against injustice. How many times do we have to remind people like you that?  Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere says Martin Luther King, Jr.

Vin, I am yet to see any one that witnessed Adekunle or his men kill innocent Igbo babies and children. The nearest to it was Pastor Emeka Okala who said Nigerian "foot soldiers" killed his uncle, and he did not respond when I asked him pointedly who were the "foot soldiers" that killed his uncle. As I indicated, I would believe him if he says Adekunle or his men killed his uncle.

Your fight is not against injustice. Your fight is against every body that contributed to the fall of biafra; and the more the contribution to biafra's death, the more voracious you are against the person.

Chief Adeniran Ogunsanya was good to Ndigbo and we love him dearly for it.

If Chief Ogunsanya was given a responsibility by the federal government in pursuit of keeping Nigeria one in 1967-1970, he would have had no choice but to discharge the responsibility to the best of his ability.

Why do you act like a juvenile at times? To you it's if they criticize one of our own, they are criticizing my tribe. That is utter rubbish and juvenile way of reasoning.

You are the one that act like a juvenile. I have made it very clear on these forums many times that the federal troops fought on my behalf as a Nigerian. I will therefore not keep quiet when people like you abuse and insult those who kept Nigeria from disintegration including Generals Gowon and Ike Nwachukwu who are not Yorubas. Only people that are new on the forums will allege that I defend only Yorubas that fought or worked to keep Nigeria one.

But let's turn the table. If the Nigerian civil war is between the Yorubas and the rest of Nigeria and a Nigerian officer acted the way of Benjamin Adekunle, be honest, what would be your take? We are not saying people are not killed in war but when every rules of engagement is sacrificed and someone of Adekunle mold go about exterminating innocent lives and you are here defending him (simply because he's your tribesman), honestly, you need to have your mind examined.

Vin, your question is irrelevant because my position is very clear: all sides commited atrocities before and during the civil war, we should move on. If you refuse to move on, because to you, only non-Igbos commited atrocities, I will defend those who fought on my behalf to keep Nigeria one. If you know what "rules of engagement" are, you should know that they are not given by the enemy. You don't know the rules of engagement given to Nigerian Commanders. You can therefore not claim that "every rules of engagement" was sacrificed. If war crimes were committed (and would have been committed by both sides), this should have been handled at the appropriate venue all these years. You guys should get over it. You cannot re-fight the war: move on, 99% of Ndigbo have moved on!

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Ayo Ojutalayo

Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 20:48:47 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W2730717B66259C55CD0E8CDBB40%40phx.gbl.

[emmanuel ileka]

I have signed out. Good luck to you all.

Sent from my Windows Phone

---

From: Vin Otuonye
Sent: 19/09/2014 15:14
To: africanworldforum@google; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
Cc: ayooju...@yahoo.com; emma_...@hotmail.com; avatar...@yahoo.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Chris:

I want to thank you for your insult. Please note how you jumped into the fray without following the thread. You see how you have given the old grumpy cranky imbecille jail house lawyer, Stevek, opportunity to insult me? While at it, what is GS 101?

It's rather unfortunate that you have to seek outside source to know the meaning of race and ethnicity. It is evident what the meanings are and you really need not go to outside source if indeed you passed your GS 101. When that interview was conducted between Adekunle and the journalist in the late 60s, ethnicity or tribe is not a common word used. Race is. And race and ethnicity are used interchangeably then, as it is even today. But paying close attention to the question asked, only a fool will not understand what the question is. This is what transpired between Adekunle and the journalist:

Randolf Baumann: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland that is, to the place populated by Ibos only?

 

Adekunle: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.

 

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

 

Adekunle: You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria.

Now, with above in mind, why can't Adekunle  (and some of you here) realize that the Randolf Baumann is talking about tribe and ethnicity? Isn't Nigeria 100% black? Do we have white/caucasian Nigerians? Do we have Asian Nigerians? So, why is the question: are you a racist difficult for you guys? That Randolf Baumann used the word "racist", he meant tribe/ethnicity. Race and ethnicity are used interchangeably then and now. Why is that difficult for you to understand? And you are here insulting me. You owe me an apology.

Now, the imbecille jail house lawyer, Stevek said the Briton spoke his native language when he asked  are you a racist "hated white people". But what has being a racist and hating white people got to do with this interview. The immediate question preceding that question laid the groundwork for us to understand. The preceding question was;

Randolf Baumann: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland that is, to the place populated by Ibos only? to which Adekunle replied:

Adekunle: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.

As you can see from above question, the journalist did not mean to ask Adekunle are you a racist in the sense of do you hate white people. The race he meant is tribe/ethnicity.

So keep your comparison chart of what race and ethnicity mean to yourself. No thank you.

Finally, I want to throw a challenge to the imbecille, jail house lawyer Stevek: Since you don't know how to do research, I'll help you out: Check the Georgia Bar Organization. If you don't see my name Vincent Otuonye as attorney in good standing with the state bar of Georgia, forever keep your stinky mouth shut.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: ayooju...@yahoo.com

Chris,

Clearly, this man is struggling to get a round peg to fit a square hole to fit his questionable purpose.

He has this very annoying habit of finding 'facts' or defining terms to fit his logical absurdities to feed his tribal bias, even though this man is just a Lagos boy whose parents were Igbo. He is highly prevaricate. And then when you point this out to him, he reverts to atavistic uncivility and foul language about having sex with one's wife, mother, and sister.

That kind of behavior may be acceptable to a Stone Mountain, Georgia, cabbie but not here on these forums of, mostly, professionals.

On the real substance of this discussion, both Ayo and this character were trying to fit the words of the Briton to their tribalist agenda.

A Briton knows the difference between 'tribe' and 'race'; it is his language. The Britons knew it long before we knew the word after they have used it to label us, based on the observation of our characteristics.

They had among themselves: Welsh, Irish, Scots, and English. But they never called themselves tribes because they didn't (and still don't) band on the basis of whether they are Welsh, Irish, Scots, or English. So, when they came to Africa and saw how the Africans, atavistically, banded together against each other on the basis of distinct differences in language (and sometimes, very little differences) - a social quality that is comparable to monkeys and apes, they went back to their language to find a word for it. And among the various phrases at their disposal (a flight of birds, a school of fish, a tribe of monkeys), they concluded that the word 'tribe' fitted what they observed of Africans. So, we became tribes. And the word 'tribalism' became an African word. They even put it as an item of identity in our passports (check out an expired Nigerian passport issued up to the 1970s and you'd see what I mean).

And we are that way till this day, even after we obtain Ph.Ds or teach conjured Ph.Ds.

The Briton spoke his native language. He asked Lt. Col. Adekunle if he was racist, i.e., hated white people. That he was a tribalist was already in evidence. After all, it was that which necessitated the interview!

This reminds me of the relationship that born again evangelical Nigerians (and other Africans) have with Christianity. They take the religion brought to them, largely, by the Anglican Church, modify, replace their pagan sacrifice requiring ancestral worship with it, and exaggerate their beliefs in it so much that they would murder others or go to an open war with those who don't believe exactly as they do.

But the Archbishop of Canterbury, the head of the Anglican Church that brought them the origin genuine religion before the ignorant Africans corrupted it, easily admits that sometimes he wonders about the existence of God.

If you hang around these forum long enough, you will read a certain local broken English-speaking acountant in Ajegunle, Lagos, tell you that he has a better English language comprehension than a scientist that has lived in the US for over 40 years.

That is our nature.

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: emmanuel ileka <emma_...@hotmail.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 8:04 AM
Subject: RE: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin,

I am not sure if you passed GS 101 in school to canvass the fact that race, ethnicity and tribe can be used interchangeably.

You may need to google the meaning of the words to continue in this discourse.

Chris.

From: vincent...@msn.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
CC: ayooju...@yahoo.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W43982E54A2CAD7FF0339C9E7B40%40phx.gbl.

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[Ayo Ojutalayo]

"On the real substance of this discussion, both Ayo and this character were trying to fit the words of the Briton to their tribalist agenda.

A Briton knows the difference between 'tribe' and 'race'; it is his language. The Britons knew it long before we knew the word after they have used it to label us, based on the observation of our characteristics." . . . Stevek

Stevek,

So you are not aware that I defend General Gowon, General Ike Nwachukwu and others that fought on the Federal side of the civil war? The same I do for any civilian that helped to keep Nigeria from disintegration when being abused or insulted by our Igbo compatriots. My defending players that kept Nigeria from disintegration has no "tribalist agenda" even though I am proud of being Yoruba. By the way, are you aware that I am not in support of an Oduduwa Republic, meaning Yoruba leaving Nigeria?

The journalist that interviewed General Adekunle was German (German reporter Randolph Baumann, of STERN Magazine) and not a Briton. That was why he used racist when he meant tribalist, and the Black Scorpion took advantage of the journalist. That is what your friend, Vin Otuonye, has trying to do word-abracadabra about, thereby ridiculing himself in public by saying race and tribe are used interchangeably!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>

To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 9:10 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Vin wire me too with his "... race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably"!!!

Ayo Ojutalayo 
 

---

From: Wilson Iguade <igu...@hotmail.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 9:58 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[Vin Otuonye]

Ayo:
 
There is nothing like "wire" here. What Wilson Iguade meant to write is "tire" as in "una tire me sef". This was similar to what the journalist Randolf Bauman asked Adekunle. However, he used race instead of tribe or ethnic. Despite that, his message is clear and I repeat Adekunle was just ignorant not to understand his question. And I repeat race, ethnicity and tribe are used interchangeably then despite what you guys are writing here. "Race' is in vogue then.
 
And you came up with Sandhurst this, Sandhurst thatt. May I remind you that Gowon also attended Sandhurst yet he messed up in Aburi. So much for Sandhurst!
 
Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye
 

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 15:36:21 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: igu...@hotmail.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/1730807227.6337.1411140981978.JavaMail.yahoo%40jws10683.mail.bf1.yahoo.com.

[Stevek]

Ayo,

Ich sprechen Deutsh auch. I speak German, too.

A German knows the difference between 'race' and 'tribe' if he has learned to speak English because, in his language, there are two disparate words not likely to be interchanged. On one hand, the German word for 'tribe'  volk is identical with people. Hence, the vehicle they built for common people was named Volkswagen (pronounced Folksvagen) or 'Car for the people'.

On the other hand, the German word for 'race' is 'rennsport'. It has a very different connotation and implies the very beginning of Mankind whereas 'tribe' implies local custom.

A German is not likely to misue 'tribe' for 'race'.

Ayo, you know me. I hit fakes hard. I have disagreed with you on just about everything but I have never called you a bad name. I have some respect for what you represent but the respect is for a different reason than what you take your stand for.

I believe you are a tribalist, albeit, a noble one for your people. I have the same regard for Agwunobi and others like him. But I consider tribalism atavistic. I consider it unreasonable and uncivilized. Therefore, it is impossible for me to respect a tribalist. Tribalism gets in the way universal action for the good of all the people because it is the universal rising of the tide that raises all boats. That's what the rest of the world is doing. We have only one true nation in Nigeria but the US, China, and the former Soviet Union had several. And they can send probes to the far reaches of space while we have no electricity and Jonathan for president.

That you don't want the Yoruba to be in a separate country from Nigeria only means that you have the best of Yoruba's interest at heart; it doesn't mean you  take that position because you love Nigeria. It doesn't mean you don't either. But I respect that. That is why I give the same advice to dumb Igbo irredentists like Joe Attueyi and Vin Otounye (both really just confused Lagos boys).

I, too, stand for One Nigeria but I can stand with you only if your arguments are based on the truth, and not contrived.

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
To: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>; "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 11:23 AM
Subject: RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"On the real substance of this discussion, both Ayo and this character were trying to fit the words of the Briton to their tribalist agenda.

A Briton knows the difference between 'tribe' and 'race'; it is his language. The Britons knew it long before we knew the word after they have used it to label us, based on the observation of our characteristics." . . . Stevek

Stevek,

So you are not aware that I defend General Gowon, General Ike Nwachukwu and others that fought on the Federal side of the civil war? The same I do for any civilian that helped to keep Nigeria from disintegration when being abused or insulted by our Igbo compatriots. My defending players that kept Nigeria from disintegration has no "tribalist agenda" even though I am proud of being Yoruba. By the way, are you aware that I am not in support of an Oduduwa Republic, meaning Yoruba leaving Nigeria?

The journalist that interviewed General Adekunle was German (German reporter Randolph Baumann, of STERN Magazine) and not a Briton. That was why he used racist when he meant tribalist, and the Black Scorpion took advantage of the journalist. That is what your friend, Vin Otuonye, has trying to do word-abracadabra about, thereby ridiculing himself in public by saying race and tribe are used interchangeably!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Vin,

Thank you; my pigin English is not as good as Wilson's in view of our different "states of origin". That was why I trusted him and quoted him.

How can you compare messing up in Aburi with not knowing the meaning of "Are you a racist?" You said Adekunle's comprehension of English was low. That was why I told you he was a Sandhurst graduate. A Sandhurst graduate could not be guilty of low English comprehension . . . . not for him not to understand "Are you a racist?"

It's up to you if you want to continue to ridicule yourself publicly with your "race is interchangeable with ethnicity and tribe".

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; Wilson Iguade <igu...@hotmail.com>

Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 11:52 AM

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

"So, why is the question: are you a racist difficult for you guys? That Randolf Baumann used the word "racist", he meant tribe/ethnicity. Race and ethnicity are used interchangeably then and now. Why is that difficult for you to understand? And you are here insulting me. You owe me an apology." . . . Vin Otuonye

Vin,

You still cannot understand that Adekunle's response to the journalist that he should know where to find racists was deliberate? That racists are in Apartheid South Africa? And you still don't know that Adekunle saw an opportunity to give-it-back to the biased journalist and he used the opportunity by telling the journalist he was not a "racist"? You are smarter than you are presenting yourself on this issue. The same with your "race and tribe being used interchangeably in the 60's and now"! And if sincerely you didn't know, you have been given more than enough materials that you have no excuse to continue to ridicule yourself.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: emmanuel ileka <emma_...@hotmail.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 10:48 AM

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/COL402-EAS203F7C42430D65E3D85A468E7B40%40phx.gbl.

[Vin Otuonye]

Stevek:
 
You know the reason I have not cursed you out is because of the respect I have for people like Dr. Adeniran Adeboye. You are too fake and academic in your approach to issues that you don't know when you make a Jack-Ass of yourself. In our discussion below, context is king. We are not talking about who knows and understand German or not. And we are not talking about whether a German knows the difference between race and tribe or whether they have two different words for race and tribe. We are talking about the context in which the word "racists" is used. Even you and Ayo don't agree on this. Context is king and we have to go back to the interview in which that word was used. Preceding the question on are you a racist,  the question the journalist Randolf Baumann asked Adekunle is this:

 
Randolf Baumann: What are your troops doing when they march into a town around Port Harcourt, an area where most of the farmers are not Ibos?

 

Adekunle: We aim at everything that moves.

 

Randolf Baumann: What will your troops do when you get to the Ibo heartland that is, to the place populated by Ibos only?

 

Adekunle: There we will aim at everything even if it is not moving.

 

With above background/context as king, Randolf Bauman asked the million dollar question:

 

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

 
 

So Mr Stevek, where did you get it on your convulted brain that "A German is not likely to misue 'tribe' for 'race'" Why would Randolph Baumann ask Adekunle whether the later is a racist if not to continue on the line of the previous questions he asked him? Is Adekunle fighting white people? Is Adekunle fighting Randolph Baumann? Are Ndigbo white people?
 
Do you see why I said you are a jail house lawyer? You don't think logically. You always bring extraneous things to confuse yourself and try to confuse the readers. You throw in some red herrings to make stupid cheap point. This was exactly the same mistake you made on the issue Okoi raised about the CAN president's jet with your assumptions and your stupid innuendos. On this issue I give you a straight "F".
 
Lord have mercy on you.
 
Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

 

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 09:19:05 -0700
From: avatar...@yahoo.com
Subject: Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay
To: ayooju...@yahoo.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; vincent...@msn.com

[Vin Otuonye]

Ayo:
 
Do you think by saying it's up to me to continue ridiculing myself, that, that will scare me? Listen, I am right and you, Stevek and that fry by night fool who posted definition of race and ethnicity (you see how less important he is that I don't even remember his name), all you three are wrong. You can take that to the bank.
 
Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye
 

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 16:24:08 +0000
From: ayooju...@yahoo.com
To: vincent...@msn.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com; igu...@hotmail.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[ikeagbor]

Vin ask Ayo, to type "Yoruba race" in Google and see if he can learn something. Ike

Sent from my MetroPCS 4G Android Device

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W66F57033925F49602FBC0DBB40%40phx.gbl.

[daniel Akusobi]

Ayo.
Cool a bit because your tactics of forcing words out of  some of us here is becoming obvious, and you are not doing so respectfully. Your tuition keeps pilling up the more you continue to force out some teaching about the war on you.
Jerome Yakubu has, in his usual comic rants , stated he castrated Ojukwu before he was buried. It looks he gave you the balls to preserve and you decided to fry them for a brunch. You ate them too.
Be mindful my friend,  because a Biafran  ball, the type Ojukwu had, germinates like a bean. It could be the reason for your abrupt eruption of  intelligence you are misusing here.

Your failure to understand that Ojukwu was one of the reasons Nzeogwu / Ifeajuna coup did not become an immediate , a massive blood shade in the North that  day.

That Tafawa Belewa had planned to raid Yoruba with his army ( so his class enemy,  Awolowo, would rot in jail)  was prevented by Nzeogwu's  coup.
That the nature of hate filled politics in the West during Awolowo and Akintola  rained rancor and raided the confidence Nigeria had in their New country,to the extent the head of government of the federation then could no more handle.
That the coup by Nzeogwu was done on behalf of Yoruba, to stop them from  Bokoharamizing themselves.

That Nzeogwu and Ifeajuna had planned to release Awo from jail and install him as president or prime minister of Nigeria after eliminating some major players in the deterioration of Nigeria, under Tafawa Belewa .

That no leader in the position of Ojukwu during the 1966 pogroms would not do what he did, bring his people back to their home, a safe haven, so they can more tactfully face off with their enemies.

That it was Gowon that took the war to the Igbos, when the Igbos had already surrendered to them and went back to their home, on realizing that the Hawusas could not stop killing the people of Eastern Region they laid some eyes on.  
That leaving or declaring intention to leave a non working marriage is the best way to prevent a fatal domestic violence.

That war is bad , and occasionally inevitable and can clean up an entire country or tribe, that's why one of the rules of war is to spare women, children, the handicapped and unarmed civilians out of blood shade.
This rule is in place to ensure that some people would still be alive to replenish some human loses due to war.
You sound like you can reason but have failed to think about the issues surrounding the war from a more critical view point. There are real human and emotional faces applicable to issues prior, during and after the war we do not have to trivialize or tribalize.

Would you be praising Jah if the war was between Igbos and Yoruba and a mad Igbo soldier did what your hero, Adekunle,  said he did?
What he did, killing women and children, would have guaranteed your not being born or alive to say that there cannot be a crime in a war.
Dan

On Sep 18, 2014 5:15 PM, "Vin Otuonye" <vincent...@msn.com> wrote:

Ayo:

Why do you always see issues with ethnic lenses? Our criticism of Adekunle is not because of his race/ethnicity. Note how ignorant Adekunle was when Randolf Bauman asked him the question in the email posted below. He was asked, are you a racist? Apparently, Adekunle did not understand the question.

What Randolf Bauman meant is are you a tribalist? Adekunle should have understood the question and his response "You should know exactly where racists are. There is no such thing as racism in Nigeria" only show how ignorant and low his comprehension of English language is. Sadly, he was even then an officer with the Nigerian army.

Listen Ayo, when Ndigbo criticize people like Adekunle or Awolowo, it is not a criticism of Yoruba race. There are some Yoruba that fought the war like Adekunle but they fought professionally and adhered to the rules of war. These Yoruba soldiers did not kill innocent Igbo babies and children. Do you read us castigating them? There maybe some Yorubas that even risked their lives to save some Biafra kids. Do you read us castigating them? Our fight against people like Adekunle and Awolowo is not a fight against the Yoruba race. It is a fight against injustice. How many times do we have to remind people like you that?  Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere says Martin Luther King, Jr.

Chief Adeniran Ogunsanya was good to Ndigbo and we love him dearly for it.

Why do you act like a juvenile at times? To you it's if they criticize one of our own, they are criticizing my tribe. That is utter rubbish and juvenile way of reasoning.

But let's turn the table. If the Nigerian civil war is between the Yorubas and the rest of Nigeria and a Nigerian officer acted the way of Benjamin Adekunle, be honest, what would be your take? We are not saying people are not killed in war but when every rules of engagement is sacrificed and someone of Adekunle mold go about exterminating innocent lives and you are here defending him (simply because he's your tribesman), honestly, you need to have your mind examined.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

[Stevek]

Dan,

You have done a good job here of truthfully and simply summarizing the events that led to the Civil War.

I hope Ayo ponders on what you wrote here and proves to all that his interest in the whole affair is no more than keeping Nigeria One, which most people would prefer.

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Thu, 18 Sep 2014 20:48:47 +0000
From: africanw...@googlegroups.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; naijap...@yahoogroups.com
CC: nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

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[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Vin,

So you and me are of different races, right?

 

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; Wilson Iguade <igu...@hotmail.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 3:18 PM

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Ikeagbor,

That is why it will be grammatically correct to say "Ayo is a racist"?

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

 

---

From: 'ikeagbor' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
To: "africanworldforum@googlegroups com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; Wilson Iguade <igu...@hotmail.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 3:29 PM
Subject: RE: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/errmnnu7vxh3q75ck7gsdgp5.1411154861957%40email.android.com.

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Stevek,

What is new in what Dan wrote that makes it "a good job"? He expects me to agree with his biafran stories because the January 1966 Igbo coup was to help Yoruba? And you want me to agree with him? Both of you should sell that story to those born after the civil war, not me.

 

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: 'Stevek' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
To: daniel Akusobi <daku...@gmail.com>; "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "naijaintellects@googlegroups com" <naijain...@googlegroups.com>; paul elemuo <pel...@epractice.com>; "publ...@elombah.com" <publ...@elombah.com>; "OKONKWO...@googlegroups.com" <OKONKWO...@googlegroups.com>; Nebukadineze Adiele <nebuka...@aol.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 5:44 PM

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[Vin Otuonye]

Ayo:

In the context Randolf Baumann asked the question, yes. He meant tribe but race was in vogue at the time he conducted the interview. 

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 22:10:44 +0000

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Vin,

Vin,

You were not born then, how do you know "race was in vogue then"? Did you read Stevek telling you Nigerian Passport at that time indicate holder's TRIBE and NOT Race?

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
To: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "africanworldforum@google" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; Wilson Iguade <igu...@hotmail.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>

Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 7:12 PM

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

"I have some respect for what you represent but the respect is for a different reason than what you take your stand for. I believe you are a tribalist, albeit, a noble one for your people." . . . Stevek

Since Papa Awo was and is still called a tribalist, I am happy to share the label with him. I only wish you Stevek, and not one of the biafrans, will tell me how I deserve this honor.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>
To: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 12:19 PM
Subject: Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[EKE EKE]

Some people do not get in this forum. Tribe is a pejorative  classificatory word which you will never hear a white man use to describe any white ethnic group. You will never hear about European tribes, but frequently hear of African and Amazonian tribes. There is a way to understand a language which is not possible, until one has lived among the owners of the language and study how they use it amongst themselves. 

It is insulting to describe the nations that make up  Nigeria as tribes. Have you ever heard any body describing the French, Germans, Irish,Welsh, Scots, English etc., as tribes the way the Igbos, Yorubas, Ijaws, Ibibios, Ishekiris, etc., are described as tribes? 

With kind regards

Eke

  

   

Sent from my iPhone

On 19 Sep 2014, at 14:25, emmanuel ileka <emma_...@hotmail.com> wrote:

Vin,

Please find below for your information.

Chris

"The traditional definition of race and ethnicity is related to biological and sociological factors respectively.

Race refers to a person's physical appearance, such as skin color, eye color, hair color, bone/jaw structure etc.

Ethnicity, on the other hand, relates to cultural factors such as nationality, culture, ancestry, language and beliefs."

Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

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[okoiad...@gmail.com]

Eke Eke, you are totally right! Tribe is a derogatory word used by racist white academic to show that Africans are "uncivilised". So it is wrong sociologically, anthropologically and literally to describe  massive Nationalities such as Igbo or Yoruba or Hausa " tribe"!     

From: 'EKE EKE' via AfricanWorldForum Sent: Saturday, 20 September 2014 07:13 To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Reply To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Cc: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com

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[Vin Otuonye]

Okoi & Eke:

You see how you guy are now proving me right? Okoi, you are proving me right without even knowing it. When the German journalist Randolf Baumann asked Benjamin Adekunle the question:

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

I know exactly what he meant and what he had in mind. And with racist, he meant, are you a tribalist? However because Adekunle did not understand the question, he went off tangent. And please note it was Ayo Ojutalayo that brought whites in South Africa in this discussion. Race as in racist is the word in vogue then not tribe or tribalist.

Do you see how Ayo Ojutalaya, Stevek and the fly-by-night fool Emmanuel Ileka made a fool of themselves with the latter copying and posting below the difference between race and ethnicity?

 A Nigerian journalist would have asked: Are you a tribalist?

Now, Ayo, again who is right. I knew all along that I am right you, Stevek and the fly-by-night compound fool Emmanuel Ileka are wrong.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2014 09:14:45 +0100
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerrian Army Uniform-An Essay
From: okoiad...@gmail.comlis

To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/20140920081445.4870286.9062.44789%40gmail.com.

[Vin Otuonye]

Okoi & Eke:

Do you see how you guys are proving my point? Okoi, do you notice how you're proving my point without even knowing so? When the German Journalist, Randolf Baumann asked Benjamin Adekunle the question:

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

I knew exactly what the journalist had in mind but Benjamin Adekunle doesn't understand it and he went off tangent in answering the question. Now, it is Ayo Ojutalayo that brought in whites in South Africa to this discussion. Then race as in racist is in vogue. That is what a foreign journalist will ask: are you a racist? Even though what he meant was are you a tribalist? If the question had been asked by a Nigerian journalist, the Nigerian journalist would have asked are you a tribalist?

Now, this is what Ayo Ojutalayo, Stevek and the fly-by-night fool Emmanuel Ileka failed to understand and the compound fool Emmanuel Ileka, who jumped on the fray without following the thread started insulting me and copied the difference between race and ethnicity as if it matters. However, it not stop there. The demented Stevek went on to publish how German has two words for race and tribe/ethnicity, and why if Baumann meant tribe, he would have used the right word.

Ayo, didn't I say I am right and you, Stevek and the compound fool Emmanuel Ileka are wrong? Well, I've just been proved right.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

---

Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2014 09:14:45 +0100

Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

From: okoiad...@gmail.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.comt

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/20140920081445.4870286.9062.44789%40gmail.com.

[EKE EKE]

Vin, 

I have no doubt that you are right. What I did was to buttress the context. In that conversation , if I may go further , the journalist was trying to make Adekunle see that he is discriminating against a people because of who they are and not what they have done. Whether you call it race, tribe or ethnicity, whenever any of  these is the basis of a person decision, discretion or consideration, the individual is unfair and prejudiced. 

With kind regards 

Eke

Sent from my iPhone

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[Vin Otuonye]

Eke:

You are 100% right.

Vin

---

Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay
From: eo...@aol.com
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2014 13:43:48 +0100
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com; emma_...@hotmail.com; avatar...@yahoo.com; vincent...@msn.com; okoiad...@gmail.com
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com

[Stevek]

Bar. Okoi,

Eke-Eke was right on the money. One cannot claim to have full comprehension and use of a language until that person has lived among the owners of the language for a considerable time. The reasons are obvious but suffice it to say that among the reasons, sound and spelling of the words of a language is not all of it. A whole half of the meaning of the words in the language depends on expressions and gesticulation. In addition, the owners of the language speak it a lot differently when speaking among themselves. That is why I laughed hard when that broken English-speaking Ajegunle account, Joe Attueyi, claimed that he has a better English comprehension that one that can be counted among the owners of the English language by virtue of advanced education, street and corporate experience among the owners of the language for over 40 years.

After I arrived here and made friends with Americans, my friends would as, 'Do you miss your tribe?" I would say no. And then they would say that they were sure my tribe missed me. Later, two of them Judy and Eric (one white one black) explained to me that their concept of tribe is a group of barely-clad humans moving along the forest floors incessantly in search for food and protection, keeping all other groups of humans in the vicinity at bay and separate. Of course, I explained that wasn't the case and showed them pictures of myself in Lagos and other city pictures. But, because of the word 'tribe', it was clear that their initial concept stayed. Later, I noticed that when I went anywhere with my school friends who were non-Africans, I was asked what 'tribe' I came from after the initial introduction but the non-African foreigners were not asked for their tribes. Nobody knew the names of the ethnicities in India, China, and other non-African places but almost everyone has heard of Hausa, Ibo (Igbo), and Yoruba.

When it was time to renew my first Nigerian passport in 1979, 5 years after I have lived among the Americans, I really read the contents of my passport. In the biometrics page at the beginning of the passport, I saw an entry for, guess what?, 'TRIBE'. I picked up the dictionary at that time and looked for the definition of 'tribe'. Among the entry for Collective Nouns I found something like the following (culled from the Internet);

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Glossary_of_collective_nouns_by_collective_term

Notice who are also collectively called 'tribes' besides, unwashed low-brow 'natives'? Scroll down and see. It was very humbling and I remembered that for a long time.

I was determined to change this, whatever it took, as soon as I could. To me, that was the real value of Western education. It allowed you to share in human progress since the days of Homo habilis, instead of being closed in and isolated - limiting you to only the things you have been able to invent and think of - like living on the Galapagos Archipelago. That is one of the main reasons I have continuing battles with those who have seen the light and yet revert to the uninformed and primitive practices of our ancestral past which kept us on a Dark Continent. just because they have some sense of misplaced loyalties to the ignorant past. That is why I didn't get along very well with Valentine Ojo (whom I dubbed Ogboju Ode Ninu Igbo Irumale) and don't get along very well with Otitigbe, who wants to use Ifa to compute the terminal velocity of the photon! It is the same reason I don't get along too well with Prof. Adeniran Adeboye (who is really good people).

I don't get along with such people because, to me, the ultimate value of exposure and education is to put one on the rarified top of the mountain so one can see more clearly, understand much better, and take the message back to the less privileged of one's kind; not to revert and rejoin them in ignorance!

Then in about 20 years ago, I had the opportunity to do something about it when I joined the Old Naijanet list serve. It was during this time that I began a crusade against the word 'tribe'. I re-introduced the words 'ethnic', 'ethnicity', 'ethnocentrism', 'ethno phobic', 'ethnophobic', to replace 'native', 'tribe', 'tribalism', and 'tribal hatred'. I, later, re-introduced the words 'Yorubaist', 'Yorubacentric, "Igbophobic', 'Igbocentic', and 'Igbophilic' to represent 'a proud member knee-jerk defender of the Yoruba tribe', 'one that thinks the world revolves around the Yoruba and everyone and everything else exists for the greater glory of the Yoruba', 'unreasoned hate of the Igbo', 'one that thinks the world revolves around the Igbo and everyone and everything else exists for the greater glory of the Igbo', and 'any lover of the Igbo who is not an Igbo'.

I am glad to see that 20 years later, the culture of the use of the word 'tribe' by Nigerians is changing to the preferred 'ethnic'. And I hope it continues.

What Nigerians, nay all Africans' need more than anything is for those among them who has had the opportunity of education and exposure to have integrity, practice and propagate what they have learned, and be humble. Not wave degrees they hardly understand what it stands for as a badge of superiority and become troglodytes in their specialties, oftentimes, misleading the unfortunate because they, themselves, were so busy showing that thy are so important and have completely forgotten the essentials of what they learned.

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

May God free Nigeria from the grip of its demons.

From: "okoiad...@gmail.com" <okoiad...@gmail.com>
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[Stevek]

Ayo,

You have asked a fair question. I just posted something in response to Bar. Okoi. Read it.

After that, if you still require me to answer your question, I promise to answer it thoroughly and dispassionately, to the best of my ability.

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
To: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>; "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>
Sent: Friday, September 19, 2014 10:55 PM
Subject: Stevek: Re: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"I have some respect for what you represent but the respect is for a different reason than what you take your stand for. I believe you are a tribalist, albeit, a noble one for your people." . . . Stevek

Since Papa Awo was and is still called a tribalist, I am happy to share the label with him. I only wish you Stevek, and not one of the biafrans, will tell me how I deserve this honor.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

[Stevek]

Eke-Eke,

Are you seriously suggesting that a German, who speaks American English as a second language, doesn't know the difference in the use of the word 'tribe' and race' by virtue of the massive American presence in Germany since the second world war? Isn't this almost saying that an Englishman can call an oak tree a chestnut tree or even a cat a leopard?

How can you say this after your long treatise about the owners of the language being more able in the use of the language than the foreigners that learned it?

For those who live among these people, like you do, it is quite clear that the German interviewer has finished that portion about Biafran natives. After all the evidence that precipitated that interview does not leave that question about Lt. Col. Adekunle's tribalism in doubt.

Having established that Lt. Col. Adekunle was a tribalist, he was moving on to the larger racism, for the benefit of his European audience, because being a tribalist is just one step behind racism, especially, going by Lt.Col. Adekunle's well publicized attitude towards the staff of the Red Cross and other European charity organizations involved in the 3MCDO sector, as well as international observers, whop were all white.

Just wondering.

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: EKE EKE <eo...@aol.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>

Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "emma_...@hotmail.com" <emma_...@hotmail.com>; "avatar...@yahoo.com" <avatar...@yahoo.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>; "okoiad...@gmail.com" <okoiad...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin, 

I have no doubt that you are right. What I did was to buttress the context. In that conversation , if I may go further , the journalist was trying to make Adekunle see that he is discriminating against a people because of who they are and not what they have done. Whether you call it race, tribe or ethnicity, whenever any of  these is the basis of a person decision, discretion or consideration, the individual is unfair and prejudiced. 

With kind regards 

Eke

Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Sep 2014, at 13:23, Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com> wrote:

Okoi & Eke:

You see how you guy are now proving me right? Okoi, you are proving me right without even knowing it. When the German journalist Randolf Baumann asked Benjamin Adekunle the question:

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

I know exactly what he meant and what he had in mind. And with racist, he meant, are you a tribalist? However because Adekunle did not understand the question, he went off tangent. And please note it was Ayo Ojutalayo that brought whites in South Africa in this discussion. Race as in racist is the word in vogue then not tribe or tribalist.

Do you see how Ayo Ojutalaya, Stevek and the fly-by-night fool Emmanuel Ileka made a fool of themselves with the latter copying and posting below the difference between race and ethnicity?

 A Nigerian journalist would have asked: Are you a tribalist?

Now, Ayo, again who is right. I knew all along that I am right you, Stevek and the fly-by-night compound fool Emmanuel Ileka are wrong.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

[EKE EKE]

My dear Stevek, 

I am not suggesting anything. What I mean is what I said in plane English. 

You may have your own reason to attempt to introduce supposition in something that is plane. 

If your understanding if linguistics and semantic is the same as mine, you would understand that the reference to living among those who speak a language does not refer to the German, but actually an indirect attempt to draw attention to Adekunle's understanding of the question. 

We can have a civil debate on understanding and usage of language, which may help you gain more insight into why you have chosen to understand my comment in the way you have demonstrated. 

Philosophers are still debating the best way to understand a statement. Some believe we should allow what we already know and believe about a word to inform our understanding, others believe that statements are expression of the thoughts of the speaker and that to objectively  understand  statements we should take into consideration, the meaning of the words used, the context in which the words were spoken and what the speaker was doing when the words were spoken. 

This is how understood the interview. 

Do have a nice weekend 

With kind regards 

Eke 

Sent from my iPhone

[Stevek]

Yours is well understood and accepted. I was, merely, offering my own understanding of the German's inquiry.

In any case, it is really irrelevant if he actually meant 'race' or 'tribe' since the people consider that irrelevant to what the discussion was about. It is the power of diversion for those who don't have facts on their side.

And, clearly, the claim that 'race' was used interchangeably with 'tribe' , which you posting seem to support is false. No one used race for tribe. The word 'Tribe' was in every Nigerian passport. It is only very recently that expressions like 'The Yoruba race' has emerged from the great discussion of American Indian tribes, like the Sioux, Cheyenne, Apache, who lately are referred to as 'nations'.

On the question of the German's control of the English language, you need to find out. These Germans - and I have worked with some that came straight out of Germany - speak American English flawlessly, if you discount their annoying substitution of V for W and vice versa. They, at least, understand English much better than the Hausa-speaking Lt. Col. Adekunle!

Have a nice day Eke. (are you from Warri?)

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

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[EKE EKE]

Stevek , 

I concur, my problem in this forum is that people often discountenance evidence to argue belief. I am from Nigeria. 

Do have a great weekend 

Eke 

Sent from my iPhone

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[Wilson Iguade]

Wow! Vin, na wa for you. You are back on this your hang up on racist or tribalist? God helps us? Humans in our bid for RATIONALIZATION which as caused death and massacre in human history.

Folks, my point here is very very very narrow - the justification or more appropriately the rationalization of our behavior. Lord have mercy on us. 

Sent from my iPhone

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/BAY176-W4571B0FA91F7334FA887FDBB50%40phx.gbl.

[Vin Otuonye]

Wilson:

Have a nice weekend. Enjoy your weekend.

Vin

---

Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay
From: igu...@hotmail.com
Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2014 10:49:30 -0500
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com; avatar...@yahoo.com; okoiad...@gmail.com; emma_...@hotmail.com; vincent...@msn.com

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[Stevek]

Eke,

Thanks. I like both your answers!

Have a good one, too.

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[Odudu Abasi]

"I have read some of the inelegant and utterly uncomplimentary things written about the late Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle. For me, he was a courageous soldier with very deep and patriotic love for Nigeria." - Rotimi Fashakin

Rotimi Fashakin,

You are correct - one Yoruba man to another!

Protective shields and/umbrellas are always extended over some of the most despicable and odious public characters which our nation has bred, according to where the ignominious character happen to have been born and according to where the person  holding the umbrella or protective,  shield over him/her, was born.  You are not alone - a mere glance,  at the names of those who today are holding out Goodluck Jonathan as the best Nigerian presidential product,  attests to this fact of domiciliary "patriotism" over what is good for the nation.

You probably never knew or you are feigning ignorance of the fact that Benjamin Adekunle was patriotic only to Benjamin Adekunle;  but you feel duty-bound to protect his legacy, as a fellow Yoruba. Those who suffered under Benjamin Adekunle's command disagree vehemently, Yoruba soldiers included. For them Adekunle was the most odious thug in  army uniform; Did he live to pay a price (from God!!!)  for the sins and crimes he committed against humanity? Closet Nigerian "men and women of god" continuously refuse to learn lessons from the lives of men like Benjamin Adekunle; or of men like Sanni Abacha, and others of that ilk.  Such prices as these men paid for the way they lived  will continue to be paid by those who live similarly. Some of us may be under the erroneous impression that corrupting  and unpatriotic characters to our nation, like Ibrahim Babangida and Olusegun Obasonjo and others of that ilk, from LGA chairpersons to governors to the presidency,  still live large today without repercussions from God or man for the things they did to put our nation under the cover of corruption, insecurity and despotic rule. That may be so, but do we know what these corrupt men are going through in their private lives; or what they will go through, publicly, by tomorrow?

It is the same attitude - our own thieves are saints; it is the other guy's thieves who are the criminals -  which is responsible for our national decay.  Looters  of Nigerian treasuries and their supporters have painted the name corruption on the nation's face, chest, back and bottom; and they are the ones who shout "patriotism" the most!!!!

OduduAbasi

DFW

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[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Stevek,

For your information, my first degree was in Political Science, and this was at the time of liberation of Angola and Mozambique. This was when international crusade against apartheid South Africa was at its peak. In actual fact, I and others started a Black Consciousness Movement at the University of Ife that we gave a Swahili name: Wantu Wazuri (beautiful people). I therefore knew as early as early 70's that tribe and tribalism were derogatory words. In actual fact, we discouraged the use of words like blackmail, black book etc. We instead used white mail and explain to whoever was listening why whitemail and not blackmail. The same with black book. Because Black is Beautiful. I have indicated on these forums before that I am a Pan Africanist. I see all Blacks as my brothers and sisters. That is not to say that some of my brothers and sisters cannot do no wrong or that I cannot disagree with them. But it will never be because of their country or their ethnic group(s).

One thing I have learned on these forums is not to waste my time educating adults that are already formed in their ways and thinking. I make my position known and leave it to my readers to agree or disagree. I also don't waste my time defending myself because there is no way I can change the mind of someone who believes I am a tribalist that I am not from a tribe talk less of being a tribalist. Above all, I doubt if there is any Nigerian that has been called a tribalist more than Papa Awolowo. Why then should I bother if I am called a tribalist? The same with being called an Igbo hater. I have made myself so clear on many occasions on the forums that whoever still believes I am an Igbo hater cannot change his mind. To me, there is nothing about any ethnic group in Nigeria that can make me hate it. Individuals that led Nigeria poorly (Babangida, Abacha, Obasanjo, Jonathan) or impressively (Murtala, Buhari, Idiagbon) did NOT do so on behalf of their ethnic groups.

I have always agreed that Ojukwu did what he had to do when he attempted to take Eastern Nigeria out of Nigeria. Details of what followed shows that it was obvious Biafra could not withstand Nigeria, Africa and the international community's resolute to keep Nigeria from disintegration. That must have explained Zik's position which would have been a better route to end the war rather than 'fight to finish' that wasted more lives on both sides especially on the Biafra's side. To read people tell the civil war story or analyze it as if the Nigerian side (civilians and military) was composed of devils while the Biafran side (civilians and military) was composed of angels/saints that committed no atrocities and made no mistakes is unintelligible, and unacceptable to me even if I continue to be called Igbo hater or tribalist. It does not make sense to me for a side to be complaining that the other side did not allow food and medicine to come to it during a WAR, or to complain about the reception/treatment given to it (twenty pounds policy) after losing a war. That was why a negotiated settlement to end the war would have made better sense. Now, nobody is complaining that Biafran leadership should have agreed to end the war in return for some concessions (which would have ensured nothing like twenty pounds policy), when it was clear Biafra could not win the war. As I have said many times, Gowon, Awolowo, Enahoro, Ike Nwachukwu, Asika etc etc helped to keep Nigeria from disintegration. And they did it on my behalf as a Nigerian. I will therefore always defend them when they come under attack by Biafran supporters.

Ragards!

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 9:18 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Vin,

This is the last contribution I am making on this issue. Whether you agree or not, I know this more than you. There are other things you may know more than me but not this.

- There was no time that RACE was in vogue, and used instead of TRIBE.

- Major Nzeogwu accused politicians of tribalism in his January 16 1966 address, therefore the word was in use and was not seen then as a derogatory word.

- Race, Tribe and Ethnicity should not be used interchangeably and I have never seen them used interchangeably. Whoever does is making a mistake. If the journalist used race because he believed it could be used interchangeably with tribe, he made a mistake and that was why Adekunle told him (the journalist) he should know where to look for racists (apartheid South Africa).

Ayo Ojutalayo

[Wharfery Snake]

Rotimi Fashakin the imbecile:

But why wouldn't you hold Adekunle in high esteem? He represent everything that you value. Paint it as you may Rotimi you identify with Adekunle because he was killing people of the East and that gives you a hard-on.

WS - A revered prince of Mushin.

Sent from my iPad

On Sep 18, 2014, at 8:11 PM, rotimi fashakin rot...@yahoo.com [NIgerianWorldForum] <NIgerianW...@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

I have read some of the inelegant and utterly uncomplimentary things written about the late Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle. For me, he was a courageous soldier with very deep and patriotic love for Nigeria. As a growing lad in Lagos Island in the late sixties, I remembered that able-bodied Men often hid themselves to prevent forced conscription anytime the Black Scorpion came to Town. He was not just feared on the war front, but the civil populace also held him in awesome mysticism. 

Perhaps, the greatest memory of Benjamin Adekunle firmly etched on my mind was the narrative of exemplary leadership as told me by a retired three star general who served under him in the 3rd marine commando. In the weeks, days preceding the massive amphibious landing in Bonny, some of the officers became petrified as to the slim prospect of the mission being successful. The reasoning was that, in contemporary military history, it was only General Douglas MacArthur who did such a large landing at Inchon in the Korean War, code-named 'Operation Chromite' in 1950. So, one of the officers - who later rose to become a two-star general- prodded the rest to move against their commander "before he succeeded in killing all of them."  When asked how he hoped to eliminate the commander, he suggested his being drowned in the Lagos lagoon with a huge milestone around his neck. One of the officers present then suggested that they bounced the idea off the second-in-command (Major Gibson Jallo). It was Jalo who, in a fit of rage, threatened to Court-martial all of them. In parting, he called all of them by name and told them that: "if anything should happen to him, i know all of you." That intervention from Gibson Jalo was what effectively aborted that sinister plot. On the day of the operation, it was Benjamin Adekunle's boat that was ahead of all the other boats on the march towards Bonny. Gibson Jalo then turned to some of the officers: "That was the man you wanted to kill!" It was a demonstrable show of exemplary leadership!

I have read with anguish some of the utterly denigrating things said in memory of a man who hazarded his life for the unity of the Country. Said he in an interview in 1968: "I did not want this war but I want to win this war. Therefore I have to kill the Ibos. Sorry!" Unfortunately, some of our friends (of Igbo extraction) have pilloried him severely for this statement and believe that he deserved no honour in death. How utterly mistaken! Some have even openly applauded the two South Eastern Federal Legislators who refused to accord the traditional one-minute silence in memory of this remarkable Nigerian, as directed by the Speaker of the House of Representatives in the legislative hallowed chambers. Again, this behaviour was couched on a defective herd mentality! As the Yoruba assert: collectively, we must show wisdom and not asininity. What these folks fail to realise is that what is uppermost in the mind of a Military commander is how to win a war and in the quickest time. The more a war lingers, the more the fatalities figure soars and the more the susceptibility loss of Troops' morale. Let us draw a parallel in contemporary history. During the second world war, the Japanese showed stubbornness with their kamikaze attacks and surprise forays into American territory like the Pearl Harbour Attack. As a means of bringing the war to an end quickly, the Americans dropped the Atomic bomb on two Japanese cities (first on Hiroshima on August 6, 1945 and three days later, on Nagasaki). It worked! The Japanese saw the devastating effect of the war and surrendered! Of course, the devastating effect of the Atomic bomb is still felt in those two Japanese cities  more than fifty years later, aside the tens of thousands that were killed immediately. The Americans knew that an invasion of Japan would have cost in excess of one million casualties, hence the decision to drop the bombs. Today, the two Nations (Japan and US) have fostered greater friendship after the cessation of hostilities on August 15, 1945. For me, the continual reference to the role played by Benjamin Adekunle, in this style of prosecuting the war, as to why he must be excoriated is akin to what the late MKO Abiola poetically captured as: "running and looking back at the same time." A philosopher once captured it properly that "if God wanted us to dwell so much on our past, he would have made another pair of eyes at the back of our heads." Like Lot's wife, any one that indulges in looking back when it is imperative in moving forward, there is clearly one destination for that loss of purpose: DESTRUCTION. Unfortunately, someone may read this and label me "an Igbo hater." Undoubtedly, there are various dispensations in the mutation from a geographic space to Nationhood. The Civil war, which ended more than forty four years ago, was one phase that, as Nigerians, must be consigned to history if we must foster amity and genuine reconciliation for the badly needed progress.

God bless Nigeria, the land of our Nativity.

Rotimi Fashakin

On Thursday, September 18, 2014 9:49 PM, 'Ayo Ojutalayo' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

__._,_.___

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Posted by: rotimi fashakin <rot...@yahoo.com>

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[rotfash]

OduduAbasi,
You may not agree with Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle's prosecution of the civil war in the area he commanded; your divergent view is your right and I am sure you should allow me to exercise mine without the pejorative insinuation of nihilistic colouration.
It is alright to engage me polemically but it is quite infernal to impute extraneous motives into my position. Thank you.
Rotimi Fashakin.
Maranatha! The King is coming.

'Odudu Abasi' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

"I have read some of the inelegant and utterly uncomplimentary things written about the late Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle. For me, he was a courageous soldier with very deep and patriotic love for Nigeria." - Rotimi Fashakin

Rotimi Fashakin,

You are correct - one Yoruba man to another!

Protective shields and/umbrellas are always extended over some of the most despicable and odious public characters which our nation has bred, according to where the ignominious character happen to have been born and according to where the person  holding the umbrella or protective,  shield over him/her, was born.  You are not alone - a mere glance,  at the names of those who today are holding out Goodluck Jonathan as the best Nigerian presidential product,  attests to this fact of domiciliary "patriotism" over what is good for the nation.

You probably never knew or you are feigning ignorance of the fact that Benjamin Adekunle was patriotic only to Benjamin Adekunle;  but you feel duty-bound to protect his legacy, as a fellow Yoruba. Those who suffered under Benjamin Adekunle's command disagree vehemently, Yoruba soldiers included. For them Adekunle was the most odious thug in  army uniform; Did he live to pay a price (from God!!!)  for the sins and crimes he committed against humanity? Closet Nigerian "men and women of god" continuously refuse to learn lessons from the lives of men like Benjamin Adekunle; or of men like Sanni Abacha, and others of that ilk.  Such prices as these men paid for the way they lived  will continue to be paid by those who live similarly. Some of us may be under the erroneous impression that corrupting  and unpatriotic characters to our nation, like Ibrahim Babangida and Olusegun Obasonjo and others of that ilk, from LGA chairpersons to governors to the presidency,  still live large today without repercussions from God or man for the things they did to put our nation under the cover of corruption, insecurity and despotic rule. That may be so, but do we know what these corrupt men are going through in their private lives; or what they will go through, publicly, by tomorrow?

It is the same attitude - our own thieves are saints; it is the other guy's thieves who are the criminals -  which is responsible for our national decay.  Looters  of Nigerian treasuries and their supporters have painted the name corruption on the nation's face, chest, back and bottom; and they are the ones who shout "patriotism" the most!!!!

OduduAbasi

DFW

On Saturday, September 20, 2014 11:24 AM, 'Stevek' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Eke,

Thanks. I like both your answers!

Have a good one, too.

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: 'EKE EKE' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com>

To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "emma_...@hotmail.com" <emma_...@hotmail.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>; "okoiad...@gmail.com" <okoiad...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 10:31 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Stevek , 

I concur, my problem in this forum is that people often discountenance evidence to argue belief. I am from Nigeria. 

Do have a great weekend 

Eke 

Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Sep 2014, at 15:12, "'Stevek' via AfricanWorldForum" <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Yours is well understood and accepted. I was, merely, offering my own understanding of the German's inquiry.

In any case, it is really irrelevant if he actually meant 'race' or 'tribe' since the people consider that irrelevant to what the discussion was about. It is the power of diversion for those who don't have facts on their side.

And, clearly, the claim that 'race' was used interchangeably with 'tribe' , which you posting seem to support is false. No one used race for tribe. The word 'Tribe' was in every Nigerian passport. It is only very recently that expressions like 'The Yoruba race' has emerged from the great discussion of American Indian tribes, like the Sioux, Cheyenne, Apache, who lately are referred to as 'nations'.

On the question of the German's control of the English language, you need to find out. These Germans - and I have worked with some that came straight out of Germany - speak American English flawlessly, if you discount their annoying substitution of V for W and vice versa. They, at least, understand English much better than the Hausa-speaking Lt. Col. Adekunle!

Have a nice day Eke. (are you from Warri?)

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: 'EKE EKE' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
To: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>
Cc: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "emma_...@hotmail.com" <emma_...@hotmail.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>; "okoiad...@gmail.com" <okoiad...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 9:56 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

My dear Stevek, 

I am not suggesting anything. What I mean is what I said in plane English. 

You may have your own reason to attempt to introduce supposition in something that is plane. 

If your understanding if linguistics and semantic is the same as mine, you would understand that the reference to living among those who speak a language does not refer to the German, but actually an indirect attempt to draw attention to Adekunle's understanding of the question. 

We can have a civil debate on understanding and usage of language, which may help you gain more insight into why you have chosen to understand my comment in the way you have demonstrated. 

Philosophers are still debating the best way to understand a statement. Some believe we should allow what we already know and believe about a word to inform our understanding, others believe that statements are expression of the thoughts of the speaker and that to objectively  understand  statements we should take into consideration, the meaning of the words used, the context in which the words were spoken and what the speaker was doing when the words were spoken. 

This is how understood the interview. 

Do have a nice weekend 

With kind regards 

Eke 

Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Sep 2014, at 14:36, Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com> wrote:

Eke-Eke,

Are you seriously suggesting that a German, who speaks American English as a second language, doesn't know the difference in the use of the word 'tribe' and race' by virtue of the massive American presence in Germany since the second world war? Isn't this almost saying that an Englishman can call an oak tree a chestnut tree or even a cat a leopard?

How can you say this after your long treatise about the owners of the language being more able in the use of the language than the foreigners that learned it?

For those who live among these people, like you do, it is quite clear that the German interviewer has finished that portion about Biafran natives. After all the evidence that precipitated that interview does not leave that question about Lt. Col. Adekunle's tribalism in doubt.

Having established that Lt. Col. Adekunle was a tribalist, he was moving on to the larger racism, for the benefit of his European audience, because being a tribalist is just one step behind racism, especially, going by Lt.Col. Adekunle's well publicized attitude towards the staff of the Red Cross and other European charity organizations involved in the 3MCDO sector, as well as international observers, whop were all white.

Just wondering.

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: EKE EKE <eo...@aol.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>

Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>; "ayooju...@yahoo.com" <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "emma_...@hotmail.com" <emma_...@hotmail.com>; "avatar...@yahoo.com" <avatar...@yahoo.com>; Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com>; "okoiad...@gmail.com" <okoiad...@gmail.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Vin, 

I have no doubt that you are right. What I did was to buttress the context. In that conversation , if I may go further , the journalist was trying to make Adekunle see that he is discriminating against a people because of who they are and not what they have done. Whether you call it race, tribe or ethnicity, whenever any of  these is the basis of a person decision, discretion or consideration, the individual is unfair and prejudiced. 

With kind regards 

Eke

Sent from my iPhone

On 20 Sep 2014, at 13:23, Vin Otuonye <vincent...@msn.com> wrote:

Okoi & Eke:

You see how you guy are now proving me right? Okoi, you are proving me right without even knowing it. When the German journalist Randolf Baumann asked Benjamin Adekunle the question:

Randolf Baumann: Are you racist?

I know exactly what he meant and what he had in mind. And with racist, he meant, are you a tribalist? However because Adekunle did not understand the question, he went off tangent. And please note it was Ayo Ojutalayo that brought whites in South Africa in this discussion. Race as in racist is the word in vogue then not tribe or tribalist.

Do you see how Ayo Ojutalaya, Stevek and the fly-by-night fool Emmanuel Ileka made a fool of themselves with the latter copying and posting below the difference between race and ethnicity?

 A Nigerian journalist would have asked: Are you a tribalist?

Now, Ayo, again who is right. I knew all along that I am right you, Stevek and the fly-by-night compound fool Emmanuel Ileka are wrong.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Date: Sat, 20 Sep 2014 09:14:45 +0100
Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerrian Army Uniform-An Essay
From: okoiad...@gmail.comlis
To: africanw...@googlegroups.com; africanw...@googlegroups.com
CC: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com

Eke Eke, you are totally right! Tribe is a derogatory word used by racist white academic to show that Africans are "uncivilised". So it is wrong sociologically, anthropologically and literally to describe  massive Nationalities such as Igbo or Yoruba or Hausa " tribe"!     

From: 'EKE EKE' via AfricanWorldForum Sent: Saturday, 20 September 2014 07:13 To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Reply To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Cc: nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com

Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Vin Otuonye: RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Chris.

Vin Cool Breeze Otuonye

Subject: [africanworldforum] Re: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

"But he (The Black Scorpion) was not the only Nigerian that enforced the Hunger as a weapon of war” policy . . . "

 . . . . . . Paul Okechukwu Oranika

I knew all along that Adekunle's role in the defeat of the rebels is why he is hated, not his "shooting any thing that moves" statement. The Black Scorpion was expected to feed his enemies at the war front!

 

Ayo Ojutalayo

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[Chika Onyeani]

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[Joe Attueyi]

Roteh, I don't believe you have a moral right to assert what you just did. Anyone who disagrees with your view point is on the payroll of PDP. And you talk about someone imputing extraneous motives into your view points. 

Na wao for Naija people

Joe

Sent from my Iphone

[rotfash]

Joe , ore mi:
You have never hidden your intense anti Buhari/pro Jonathan sentiments on these fora. What's more? Without prickling effect of your conscience, you asserted that Jonathan has been the best manager of the economy since 1979. The open-ended, leadership centered corruption in the regime is not important to you! The essential industrial concerns closed shop and reopened in neighboring Ghana! As these took flight , so did the employment opportunities for the youths. The insecurity in the land has ensured uncertainty in the ambience for businesses. President Jonathan does not give a damn about declaration of assets. So why should the Dezani in the regime not spend 10billion naira for the maintenance of aircraft for self and family? Despite all these oddities, you shamelessly asserted that the best leadership so far (since 1979) is the Jonathan regime. It is OK to deceive people but when a man begins to deceive himself, there is a huge problem.

Rotimi Fashakin.
Maranatha! The King is coming.

'Joe Attueyi' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

Roteh, I don't believe you have a moral right to assert what you just did. Anyone who disagrees with your view point is on the payroll of PDP. And you talk about someone imputing extraneous motives into your view points. 

Na wao for Naija people

Joe

Sent from my Iphone

On Sep 20, 2014, at 8:49 PM, "'rotfash' via AfricanWorldForum" <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

OduduAbasi,
You may not agree with Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle's prosecution of the civil war in the area he commanded; your divergent view is your right and I am sure you should allow me to exercise mine without the pejorative insinuation of nihilistic colouration.
It is alright to engage me polemically but it is quite infernal to impute extraneous motives into my position. Thank you.
Rotimi Fashakin.
Maranatha! The King is coming.

'Odudu Abasi' via AfricanWorldForum <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

"I have read some of the inelegant and utterly uncomplimentary things written about the late Brigadier Benjamin Adekunle. For me, he was a courageous soldier with very deep and patriotic love for Nigeria." - Rotimi Fashakin

Rotimi Fashakin,

You are correct - one Yoruba man to another!

Protective shields and/umbrellas are always extended over some of the most despicable and odious public characters which our nation has bred, according to where the ignominious character happen to have been born and according to where the person  holding the umbrella or protective,  shield over him/her, was born.  You are not alone - a mere glance,  at the names of those who today are holding out Goodluck Jonathan as the best Nigerian presidential product,  attests to this fact of domiciliary "patriotism" over what is good for the nation.

You probably never knew or you are feigning ignorance of the fact that Benjamin Adekunle was patriotic only to Benjamin Adekunle;  but you feel duty-bound to protect his legacy, as a fellow Yoruba. Those who suffered under Benjamin Adekunle's command disagree vehemently, Yoruba soldiers included. For them Adekunle was the most odious thug in  army uniform; Did he live to pay a price (from God!!!)  for the sins and crimes he committed against humanity? Closet Nigerian "men and women of god" continuously refuse to learn lessons from the lives of men like Benjamin Adekunle; or of men like Sanni Abacha, and others of that ilk.  Such prices as these men paid for the way they lived  will continue to be paid by those who live similarly. Some of us may be under the erroneous impression that corrupting  and unpatriotic characters to our nation, like Ibrahim Babangida and Olusegun Obasonjo and others of that ilk, from LGA chairpersons to governors to the presidency,  still live large today without repercussions from God or man for the things they did to put our nation under the cover of corruption, insecurity and despotic rule. That may be so, but do we know what these corrupt men are going through in their private lives; or what they will go through, publicly, by tomorrow?</d

[EKE EKE]

Anybody who says Jonathan has been good for Nigeria is dishonest. 

Sent from my iPhone

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[Joe Attueyi]

Roteh

That is the basis of an objective debate. I have given specific reasons why I believe Jonathan's management of the economy is the best I have seen since 1979. You don't agree give specifics and what you would do differently. Boko Haram insecurity is political rather than economic. 

Having said that the issue is that if you have the right to assign extraneous motives to others for their views then it is hypocrisy to call out someone else for assigning extraneous motives to your own views. 

Why do you find that too difficult to comprehend?

BTW how Jagabandit dey? Hehehehe. Una dey cause go slow for those of us passing through Bourdillon on our daily business o!

Joe 

Sent from my Iphone

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[Stevek]

Ayo,

 

Thanks for your accommodation. I really appreciate it.

 

I just reconciled with a younger brother of mine, IBK. You might be familiar with him. I bring him into this conversation as a prelude to my response because I 'knew' this man for over 20 years and had a very terrible but unjustified opinion about him. But when I opened my mind and listened to him and him, me, we both found out that we have been saying the same things and without causa belli. The irrelevancies of argumentation erected a lot of barriers in mutual understanding.

 

In my other response, I called you a tribal person and, by your own admission you allow that is true because you said that you are a proud Yoruba. That is why I classified you as a Yorubaist (I have defined that below). Yinka Odumakin is another person I respect greatly that I classify the same way.

 

 And there is nothing wrong with being that. It is just that tribe means nothing to some people, like me. I see only Nigerians. I, only, ask for where a person is from when I first meet them and they tell me that they are from Nigeria only for curiosity. Nothing more. For example, I feel no special affinity to Otitigbe, who may be from Ilue Logbo - my mother's home town in Isoko - just because he is from there. For me the only things that define my people is 'Nigerian'.

 

For me, it the same 'what neighborhood' curiosity reason that makes you ask anyone's whereabouts in the US when you meet in Nigeria when visiting Nigeria, when they reveal to you that they from the States.

 

But tribes has meaning to you. And I respect that.

 

It becomes a problem to me when it becomes the most important screen that one sees Nigerians and Nigerian problems. When a person no longer want to dwell on the facts of the case but makes up ridiculous arguments - arguments I call logical absurdities - then that person becomes a pernicious and atavistic tribalist in my eye.

 

An example is the discussion here in the past about Emeka Ogwuonye and his garnishment of the tax return due the Nigerian embassy. Bolaji Aluko, who knows very well that the IRS will not send a check of refund to another person if they have not demonstrated entitlement, simply, argued boldly and falsely that Emeka Ogwuonye 'stole' the money. You, too, have lived here long enough to know that what Bolaji claimed was not true. But you supported him. And all the vocal Yoruba lined up on one side against all the Igbo on the other side. The only thing that saved him is Emeka's own errors in the court case because he let his anger blind him. Unfortunately, that incident might have caused an untimely death.

 

Another example is the discussions on the Civil War. Your views that Ojukwu caused the Civil War and, therefore, should be responsible for all the million Igbo dead are completely contrary to facts and reason; it was a logical absurdity. You ought to know netter because you were there in the middle to late 60s when these events occurred. And, again, all the same vocal Yoruba lined up on one side against all the Igbo on the other side.

Shakespeare wrote "When these prodigies so conjointly meet, Let no man say 'These are their reasons, they are natural...'" In our modern day colloquialism, we say "If it looks like a duck, walks like a ducks and quacks like a duck, it is a duck".

 

When I see a person perform the way you performed in the two examples provided above, I don't see that person you described in your first paragraph below. I see an atavistic and pernicious tribalist. Please, look up the meanings of the words pernicious' and 'atavistic' lest you think that I am being rude to you. I am only being linguistically accurate. We all grow for the better. If that was you in your first paragraph below, something has happened to you between then and now, in my opinion.

 

Granted that you were only responding to provocation, nevertheless, one who murders his neighbor's child because the neighbor murdered his own child is, himself, a murderer.

 

And you and your kind on the Yoruba side are not alone. There are equal numbers on the Igbo on this forum on the Igbo side doing to the Yoruba what you are doing to the Igbo. And that cannot be good for Nigeria. And I love Nigeria.

 

You cannot love One Nigeria if you are a pernicious and atavistic tribalist. Any declaration to that effect is got to be a declaration in vain!

 

I am just a neutral observer that has been called a Yoruba hater and an Igbo hater in equal times because I dare to speak the truth.

 

Res ipso est (A thing is what it is).

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

From: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>
To: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>; "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 2:13 PM
Subject: Stevek: Concerning TRIBE, TRIBALISM, Nigeria, and Nigerian civil warRe: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

Stevek,

For your information, my first degree was in Political Science, and this was at the time of liberation of Angola and Mozambique. This was when international crusade against apartheid South Africa was at its peak. In actual fact, I and others started a Black Consciousness Movement at the University of Ife that we gave a Swahili name: Wantu Wazuri (beautiful people). I therefore knew as early as early 70's that tribe and tribalism were derogatory words. In actual fact, we discouraged the use of words like blackmail, black book etc. We instead used white mail and explain to whoever was listening why whitemail and not blackmail. The same with black book. Because Black is Beautiful. I have indicated on these forums before that I am a Pan Africanist. I see all Blacks as my brothers and sisters. That is not to say that some of my brothers and sisters cannot do no wrong or that I cannot disagree with them. But it will never be because of their country or their ethnic group(s).

One thing I have learned on these forums is not to waste my time educating adults that are already formed in their ways and thinking. I make my position known and leave it to my readers to agree or disagree. I also don't waste my time defending myself because there is no way I can change the mind of someone who believes I am a tribalist that I am not from a tribe talk less of being a tribalist. Above all, I doubt if there is any Nigerian that has been called a tribalist more than Papa Awolowo. Why then should I bother if I am called a tribalist? The same with being called an Igbo hater. I have made myself so clear on many occasions on the forums that whoever still believes I am an Igbo hater cannot change his mind. To me, there is nothing about any ethnic group in Nigeria that can make me hate it. Individuals that led Nigeria poorly (Babangida, Abacha, Obasanjo, Jonathan) or impressively (Murtala, Buhari, Idiagbon) did NOT do so on behalf of their ethnic groups.

I have always agreed that Ojukwu did what he had to do when he attempted to take Eastern Nigeria out of Nigeria. Details of what followed shows that it was obvious Biafra could not withstand Nigeria, Africa and the international community's resolute to keep Nigeria from disintegration. That must have explained Zik's position which would have been a better route to end the war rather than 'fight to finish' that wasted more lives on both sides especially on the Biafra's side. To read people tell the civil war story or analyze it as if the Nigerian side (civilians and military) was composed of devils while the Biafran side (civilians and military) was composed of angels/saints that committed no atrocities and made no mistakes is unintelligible, and unacceptable to me even if I continue to be called Igbo hater or tribalist. It does not make sense to me for a side to be complaining that the other side did not allow food and medicine to come to it during a WAR, or to complain about the reception/treatment given to it (twenty pounds policy) after losing a war. That was why a negotiated settlement to end the war would have made better sense. Now, nobody is complaining that Biafran leadership should have agreed to end the war in return for some concessions (which would have ensured nothing like twenty pounds policy), when it was clear Biafra could not win the war. As I have said many times, Gowon, Awolowo, Enahoro, Ike Nwachukwu, Asika etc etc helped to keep Nigeria from disintegration. And they did it on my behalf as a Nigerian. I will therefore always defend them when they come under attack by Biafran supporters.

Ragards!

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

[Joe Attueyi]

I say BOLDLY and without FEAR OF CONTRADICTION that Jonathan and hos evonomic policies has been GOOD for Nigeria. And that is an HONEST ASSERTION. 

And I have detailed the reasons why I boldly make that assertion. 

Anyone who asserts otherwise is dishonest. 

Joe

Sent from my Iphone

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/FD04FB2A-6D3C-43A6-9EEA-B4843A78AD63%40aol.com.

[Joe Attueyi]

Eke Eke

Here are Simon's views collaborating most of mine. I guess those of us holding these views are ' dishonest' from your perspective.  So share you own specific proof why your own view is the 'honest ' one 

Joe

My Grouse with President Jonathan

14 Sep 2014

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SimonKolawoleLive By Simon Kolawole; simon.k...@thisdaylive.com, sms: 0805 500 1961 

You know the general election is around the corner when you see all sorts of groups springing up here and there, endorsing candidates here and there, and generally disturbing the public peace everywhere. Oh no, it is that time again. Yes, 2015 is here. The general election is a stone’s throw away. President Goodluck Jonathan obviously wants to remain in Aso Rock for four more years. Major-Gen. Muhammadu Buhari and Alhaji Atiku Abubakar want to return to the State House. It’s a long and impressive list, with Kano Governor Rabiu Musa Kwankwaso, Hon. Aminu Tambuwal and Senator Bukola Saraki also featuring. Jonathan is the man they have to beat. I have never met him one on one.

I met him twice as a member of a group of editors in 2010 but I could not form a fairly realistic opinion about his personality. However, I am quite close to some of his aides and anytime we get arguing about the president’s actions, methods and tactics, it is not always pretty. I always come away thinking it is not the same person we are arguing about. Maybe I have a wrong impression about him. Many of those who have met or worked with the president normally describe him as humble, broadminded, calculative, well-meaning and sincere.

Those of us outside government are more cynical. There are certain things I do not dispute when I criticise Jonathan. I try to be fair-minded. I try to work with the facts. I will never dispute, for instance, that he has done tremendously well in the area of agriculture and I am not relying on his fans for my statistics. His policy of eliminating middlemen in the provision of subsidised fertilisers and seeds to farmers has increased food production significantly, in some instances tripling the income of farmers. When phones were to be given to about 6.2 million farmers some years ago, it was widely criticised and ridiculed. But it has become a potent instrument of eradicating decades of fertiliser subsidy fraud in Nigeria.

This holds massive implications for the economy. Food import bill, according to the official figures, has reduced from N1.4 trillion annually to about half of that figure. That should have a positive impact on forex demand, all things being equal. That also means a lot to the economy of farmers, who now spend less to produce more. They used to procure fertilisers and seeds at exorbitant prices and they would only do what they could afford in any case. Yield has consequently increased in rice, cotton and cassava farming, and I expect that in the years ahead we should enjoy the benefits in form of cheaper food. I expect farmers to start making sizeable forex from exports.

I also will not dispute many other facts. The railway system is being revived and modernised (I would prefer private sector management, though) and the rail now carries 5 million passengers annually, compared to one million some years ago.  Nigerians are getting a better deal in the oil sector through the local content policy, which has seen them own about 400 crude transportation tankers, compared to just 10 per cent of that a few years ago. The creation of the Sovereign Wealth Fund is also a good development that tallies with my own idea of how petrodollars should be managed. I support the ongoing modernisation of our airports, especially if you remember that for nearly 30 years, no serious attempts were made to improve the infrastructure. Having said this, however, I am ready to publicly engage Jonathan’s supporters on a number of issues. I call these issues my “grouse” with Jonathan. They are nothing personal.

My biggest grouse against Jonathan is in the area of the antigraft war. Those who described President Olusegun Obasanjo’s government as very corrupt are now beating a retreat. They have handed the dubious trophy over to the Jonathan government. Somehow, I hear some people say Jonathan is not corrupt that it is his ministers that are corrupt but that he has failed to call them to order. Well, may I tell them that he appointed those ministers and if he can’t fire them and hand them to the police, neither can I. Whatever our criticism of Obasanjo is, he fought corruption at least symbolically. I know that there were many severe corrupt practices under him. I will not deny that.

The subsidy fraud did not end in his time. The waiver fraud went virtually unnoticed. NNPC was not a symbol of transparency. But, even if as a token, Obasanjo fired many ministers, including his bosom friend, Chief SM Afolabi, for corruption. He nullified the sale of government houses when he discovered that his wife had abused the process, in the process firing the Minister of Housing, Mrs Mobolaji Osomo, also his “bosom friend”. He fired his Inspector General of Police, Alhaji Tafa Baolgun, for corruption. Whether or not Obasanjo was sincere, these actions meant a lot to the anti-graft war.

If Jonathan can do half of that, I will not be here criticising him. My second grouse against Jonathan is the way he has handled Boko Haram. For a very long time, he kept saying terror was a new challenge to Nigeria. I agreed with him. He said we needed to develop a security architecture to fight the menace. I did not dispute that. But how long will it take us to prepare for the war that is virtually consuming Borno, Yobe and Adamawa? Will developing security architecture take a life time? I am baffled that the president does not seem to accept that something is not going well in the war against terror.

These guys are pushing back our soldiers all the time. It got so embarrassing some weeks ago that our soldiers had to embark on a “tactical manoeuvre” to Cameroon when they couldn’t handle the situation anymore. Like I said, I do not dispute Jonathan’s achievements. I know his administration has virtually eliminated polio, and guinea worm is now history. Almajiri and girlspecific schools are being built to tackle age-long socio-cultural issues. More universities have been established to address the lack of spaces for a growing youth population. We will look back in 10 years’ time and say thank God more universities were established. There is nothing bad I have to say about the commencement of work on the second Niger Bridge and the Lagos-Ibadan expressway.

I like what I am seeing on the Benin-Ore road, which cried for attention for over 10 years. I would say the power sector reform is progressing well, even if the results are still too dark to the naked eye. Elections are now more peaceful and credible. I can testify. But, Mr. President, without brutally tackling corruption and caging Boko Haram with everything at your disposal, the job is not yet done. We need to free our resources for development, and we need peace and security to attain that goal.

Sent from my Iphone

On Sep 20, 2014, at 9:47 PM, "'EKE EKE' via AfricanWorldForum" <africanw...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/FD04FB2A-6D3C-43A6-9EEA-B4843A78AD63%40aol.com.

[Stevek]

What economic policy? Could you describe it, including how it was implemented?

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/3kk71kib67act41ubu1fihh3.1411244162771%40email.android.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer.

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[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Odudu,

I have read a couple of Adekunle's immediate officers' disagreement with him at the battle front. Also, during the war, there was the story that Adekunle deliberately did not make the final push to end the war because he did not want the war to end. What other information do you have to say "Benjamin Adekunle was patriotic only to Benjamin Adekunle"? And what were "the sins and crimes he committed against humanity" that other Commanders on the two sides of the war did not commit? I am open to learn, but no one has been able to specifically tell us what Adekunle did that was out of place during the war. His braggado while being interviewed showed lack of discretion but it was not the same as killing innocent women and children as people are alleging. Not allowing food and medicine to pass through his area of command to the enemies was not sin or crime.

That Adekunle did not become a Minister, a Governor or a millionaire after the war did not mean that "he paid for the way he lived". It is not everybody that wanted to be part of the corrupt military governments we had after the civil war. If Adekunle wanted to, I am sure he would have warmed himself back to the government that toppled Gowon and subsequent military governments. But Adekunle was not a typical Nigerian. Our problem as Nigerians is that we don't appreciate people that are principled. We complain about people that made and people that are making money dubiously from our commonwealth, yet we don't respect those that could have done the same but refused to (Balarabe Musa, Tam David-West and Buhari easily come to mind). Many of us don't even believe there were/are Nigerians that are not corrupt! In the same vein, we don't believe a Yoruba man can defend another Yoruba man on principle. Nobody pays attention when I blast Obasanjo or Tinubu on the forums. But when I defend Awolowo or Adekunle, I am called names even though I defend Gowon, Enahoro, Ukpabi Asika and Ike Nwachukwu for the same reasons that I defend Awolowo and Adekunle!

It must be mental laziness that make us take the position of least mental resistance . . . every body is corrupt, people defend others because they are of the same ethnic group etc. etc.

  

Ayo Ojutalayo

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

 Odudu,

I have read a couple of Adekunle's immediate officers' disagreement with him at the battle front. Also, during the war, there was the story that Adekunle deliberately did not make the final push to end the war because he did not want the war to end. What other information do you have to say " Benjamin Adekunle was patriotic only to Benjamin Adekunle"? And what were "the sins and crimes he committed against humanity" that others on the two sides of the war did not commit? I am open to learn, and no one has been able to specifically tell us what Adekunle did that was out of place during the war.

That Adekunle did not become a Minister, a Governor or a millionaire after the war did not mean that "he paid for the way he lived". It is not everybody that wanted to be part of the corrupt military governments we had after the civil war. If Adekunle wanted to, I am sure he would have warmed himself back to the government that toppled Gowon and subsequent governments. Our problem as Nigerians is that we don't appreciate people that are principled. We complain about people that made and people that continue to make their money dubiously from our commonwealth, and we don't respect those that could have done the same but refused to. 

  

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

From: Odudu Abasi <odudu...@yahoo.com>
To: "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>; Ibibio Nation <ibibio...@yahoogroups.com>; Ibom Forum <ibom_...@yahoogroups.com>; Nigerian World Forum <nigerianw...@yahoogroups.com>; Naija Observer <naijao...@yahoogroups.com>

[rotfash]

Joe Attuenyi,
Please educate us on the tangibles of this economic policy o jare. We are all ears, Pastor!

Rotimi Fashakin.
Maranatha! The King is coming.

[Joe Attueyi]

Roteh

It seems you have joined those that respond to stuff they have not read. Beneath your question is Simon Kolawole educating you far better than I can. 

Bro don't let your friend the lab rat infest you with this knee jerk reactions without reading and digesting what you are reacting to. It belittles your intelligence. 

Ngwanu read Simon and rebut with facts not emotions. 

Joe

Sent from my Iphone

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[Joe Attueyi]

My Grouse with President Jonathan

14 Sep 2014

Font Size: a / A

SimonKolawoleLive By Simon Kolawole; simon.k...@thisdaylive.com, sms: 0805 500 1961 

You know the general election is around the corner when you see all sorts of groups springing up here and there, endorsing candidates here and there, and generally disturbing the public peace everywhere. Oh no, it is that time again. Yes, 2015 is here. The general election is a stone’s throw away. President Goodluck Jonathan obviously wants to remain in Aso Rock for four more years. Major-Gen. Muhammadu Buhari and Alhaji Atiku Abubakar want to return to the State House. It’s a long and impressive list, with Kano Governor Rabiu Musa Kwankwaso, Hon. Aminu Tambuwal and Senator Bukola Saraki also featuring. Jonathan is the man they have to beat. I have never met him one on one.

I met him twice as a member of a group of editors in 2010 but I could not form a fairly realistic opinion about his personality. However, I am quite close to some of his aides and anytime we get arguing about the president’s actions, methods and tactics, it is not always pretty. I always come away thinking it is not the same person we are arguing about. Maybe I have a wrong impression about him. Many of those who have met or worked with the president normally describe him as humble, broadminded, calculative, well-meaning and sincere.

Those of us outside government are more cynical. There are certain things I do not dispute when I criticise Jonathan. I try to be fair-minded. I try to work with the facts. I will never dispute, for instance, that he has done tremendously well in the area of agriculture and I am not relying on his fans for my statistics. His policy of eliminating middlemen in the provision of subsidised fertilisers and seeds to farmers has increased food production significantly, in some instances tripling the income of farmers. When phones were to be given to about 6.2 million farmers some years ago, it was widely criticised and ridiculed. But it has become a potent instrument of eradicating decades of fertiliser subsidy fraud in Nigeria.

This holds massive implications for the economy. Food import bill, according to the official figures, has reduced from N1.4 trillion annually to about half of that figure. That should have a positive impact on forex demand, all things being equal. That also means a lot to the economy of farmers, who now spend less to produce more. They used to procure fertilisers and seeds at exorbitant prices and they would only do what they could afford in any case. Yield has consequently increased in rice, cotton and cassava farming, and I expect that in the years ahead we should enjoy the benefits in form of cheaper food. I expect farmers to start making sizeable forex from exports.

I also will not dispute many other facts. The railway system is being revived and modernised (I would prefer private sector management, though) and the rail now carries 5 million passengers annually, compared to one million some years ago.  Nigerians are getting a better deal in the oil sector through the local content policy, which has seen them own about 400 crude transportation tankers, compared to just 10 per cent of that a few years ago. The creation of the Sovereign Wealth Fund is also a good development that tallies with my own idea of how petrodollars should be managed. I support the ongoing modernisation of our airports, especially if you remember that for nearly 30 years, no serious attempts were made to improve the infrastructure. Having said this, however, I am ready to publicly engage Jonathan’s supporters on a number of issues. I call these issues my “grouse” with Jonathan. They are nothing personal.

My biggest grouse against Jonathan is in the area of the antigraft war. Those who described President Olusegun Obasanjo’s government as very corrupt are now beating a retreat. They have handed the dubious trophy over to the Jonathan government. Somehow, I hear some people say Jonathan is not corrupt that it is his ministers that are corrupt but that he has failed to call them to order. Well, may I tell them that he appointed those ministers and if he can’t fire them and hand them to the police, neither can I. Whatever our criticism of Obasanjo is, he fought corruption at least symbolically. I know that there were many severe corrupt practices under him. I will not deny that.

The subsidy fraud did not end in his time. The waiver fraud went virtually unnoticed. NNPC was not a symbol of transparency. But, even if as a token, Obasanjo fired many ministers, including his bosom friend, Chief SM Afolabi, for corruption. He nullified the sale of government houses when he discovered that his wife had abused the process, in the process firing the Minister of Housing, Mrs Mobolaji Osomo, also his “bosom friend”. He fired his Inspector General of Police, Alhaji Tafa Baolgun, for corruption. Whether or not Obasanjo was sincere, these actions meant a lot to the anti-graft war.

If Jonathan can do half of that, I will not be here criticising him. My second grouse against Jonathan is the way he has handled Boko Haram. For a very long time, he kept saying terror was a new challenge to Nigeria. I agreed with him. He said we needed to develop a security architecture to fight the menace. I did not dispute that. But how long will it take us to prepare for the war that is virtually consuming Borno, Yobe and Adamawa? Will developing security architecture take a life time? I am baffled that the president does not seem to accept that something is not going well in the war against terror.

These guys are pushing back our soldiers all the time. It got so embarrassing some weeks ago that our soldiers had to embark on a “tactical manoeuvre” to Cameroon when they couldn’t handle the situation anymore. Like I said, I do not dispute Jonathan’s achievements. I know his administration has virtually eliminated polio, and guinea worm is now history. Almajiri and girlspecific schools are being built to tackle age-long socio-cultural issues. More universities have been established to address the lack of spaces for a growing youth population. We will look back in 10 years’ time and say thank God more universities were established. There is nothing bad I have to say about the commencement of work on the second Niger Bridge and the Lagos-Ibadan expressway.

I like what I am seeing on the Benin-Ore road, which cried for attention for over 10 years. I would say the power sector reform is progressing well, even if the results are still too dark to the naked eye. Elections are now more peaceful and credible. I can testify. But, Mr. President, without brutally tackling corruption and caging Boko Haram with everything at your disposal, the job is not yet done. We need to free our resources for development, and we need peace and security to attain that goal.

Sent from my Iphone

On Sep 20, 2014, at 10:54 PM, "'rotfash' via OkonkwoNetworks" <okonkwo...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

--

[EKE EKE]

He has improved food production, when no one is farming in North East because of Boko a Haram and in many parts of middle belt because of Fulani herdsmem. 

Billions were earmarked for mobile phone for farmers and no one accounted for the money and no phone distributed to none existent farmers. 

When he cannot explain how the Nigerian defence budget has been spent for the last four years and the army under equipped to the point where done Soldiers mutinied. 

Bungled fuel subsidy removal and done nothing about the scam of fuel subsidy. 

Has done nothing about the cost of government in Nigeria. 

Nothing about unemployment 

Acquisitive crimes have rocketed in his watch with armed robbery and kidnapping on the increase. 

I cannot understand how a president who refused to declare his asserts as the laws requires him to do, does nothing about endemic and institutionalised corruption and  surrounds himself with convicted criminals and gives national honours to governors who looted their states, can be good for a country because he does less tha 20% of what a more competent president would have done under the same circumstance. 

When you measure Nigeria on the indexes if good governance, education. Healthcare, infant and maternal mortality rate, rate of road traffic accident, unemployment rate, life expectancy, number of internally displaced people etc., there is no evidence that Nigeria has made any true progress in the last 4 years.

In the last three years, I have written more than 200 articles on various aspects of Nigeria including a six part article if over 12,000 words on Nigeria as a failed state. I am yet yo see any evidence that Jonathan has been good for Nigeria. 

What is the use of more universities which is nothing but glorified secondary schools, when not a single university in a Nigeria meets world standard?  

What is Jonathan's vision for Nigeria? 

If you send me the evidence and they stand up to scrutiny, I will change my mind. 

Sent from my iPhone

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/africanworldforum/D3F77EFF-F363-4AA2-8137-DD61B7388F9D%40yahoo.com.

[Ayo Ojutalayo]

Stevek,

You might not have been aware that it took me a long time before I joined in discussing the Emeka issue. I was asking questions, questions and questions. That Emeka was given authority to collect Tax returns on behalf of the Embassy was fishy. And that Emeka sat on the check confirmed the fishiness. His excuse that another client of his, FGN, was owing him is dubious. One does not need to be a Lawyer to know this. I would have taken the same position if it was Bolaji Aluko that did what Emeka did. People that know me will tell you that is me. I will not keep quiet for fear of being called names because the offender is Igbo. And thank God, there are Igbos on these forums that take the same stand as me concerning Emeka's case. What is bad is bad, it does not matter who did it. Have you not been reading what I and some other Yorubas write about Tinubu and how he milked and is still milking Lagos State? Is Tinubu not Yoruba? What of Obasanjo?

Yes, there are things I say about Ojukwu and the civil war out of provocation. This is because I was mocked by Joe Attueyi and his co-travelers when I was pleading that we don't discuss the civil war in a way that will provoke other Nigerians. Joe Attueyi said it was guilty conscience that made me not to want the civil war discussed. I then promised him that I would always be here to explain and defend the other side. As you are aware, I have been able to do it to the best of my ability. And is it only Yoruba participants on the Nigerian side that I defend, no. You should hold those who continue to fight the civil war almost 50 years later responsible. Tell them it is not good for Nigeria. I don't want them to succeed in brain washing the young Nigerians that will read only their side of the story if we ignore them as they repeat their lies and half truths on the forums.

And if Joe Attueyi & Co were brain washed, as many of them were not even born during the war, reading the other side's story may liberate them.

Ayo Ojutalayo
 

---

From: Stevek <avatar...@yahoo.com>
To: Ayo Ojutalayo <ayooju...@yahoo.com>; "africanw...@googlegroups.com" <africanw...@googlegroups.com>
Cc: "nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com" <nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, September 20, 2014 5:09 PM
Subject: Re: Stevek: Concerning TRIBE, TRIBALISM, Nigeria, and Nigerian civil warRe: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[Wilson Iguade]

Quote

Looters  of Nigerian treasuries and their supporters have painted the name corruption on the nation's face, chest, back and bottom; and they are the ones who shout "patriotism" the most!!!!

Unquote by OduduAbasi

Interesting point! Tatto "corruption" on their asses, very funny! Hehehe!

Peace! "I"

Sent from my iPhone

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[Joe Attueyi]

Thanks Eke for your response. You seem to be someone who has done his research with facts and figures ( and one may say with 200 articles). 

From your research Could you kindly share with us the comparative analysis of Nigeria's 'indexes if good governance, education. Healthcare, infant and maternal mortality rate, rate of road traffic accident, unemployment rate, life expectancy, number of internally displaced people ' PRE and POST 2011

Lets start the comparison of Jonathan's economic management vis-a-vis his predecessors from your own objective research results

Joe

Sent from my Iphone

[Stevek]

I have now read in full what Simon wrote and didn't find anything new.

Jonathan's so-called agricultural policy is, simply, the Ministry of Agriculture's continuation of Yar'Ardua's 7-Point Agenda on agriculture.

http://eujournal.org/index.php/esj/article/viewFile/2040/1952

It, probably, has gone this far because he was unaware of its going on. Otherwise, he probably would have stopped it and stolen the funds.

The railway improvent story is also a continuation of Yar'Adua's 7-Point Agenda on Transportation. It just got publicity in Jonathan's time.

So, why would you think that Simon Kolawole of Thisday should bring this link up when the only person who can do something for him is not the dead Yar'Adua but the living Jonathan? Ditto yourself!

If even I, who works for the US government and lives in the US, know this, how can you convince anyone that you - who lives in Nigeria na dclaim to have your finger on the political pulse of the country doesn't know this.

And how come you completely missed Simon Kolawale comments on Jonathan's stupendous corruption?

Those who described President Olusegun Obasanjo’s government as very corrupt are now beating a retreat. They have handed the dubious trophy over to the Jonathan government. Somehow, I hear some people say Jonathan is not corrupt that it is his ministers that are corrupt but that he has failed to call them to order. Well, may I tell them that he appointed those ministers and if he can’t fire them and hand them to the police, neither can I. Whatever our criticism of Obasanjo is, he fought corruption at least symbolically. I know that there were many severe corrupt practices under him. I will not deny that.

I keep telling you that you are not dealing with your ignorant Ajegunle types. Your days of deceiving anyone here is long gone, buddy.

May the rewards for which you are doing this forever elude you!

 

Stevek.

Washington, DC, USA

A society of supine lambs breeds erect wolves. - Stevek

A wise man proportions his beliefs to the evidence - David Hume

[Wilson Iguade]

Folks,

I don't care whether a "tribalist" is a bad or good word. To be prove it, pleeeaaaasssseee am begging y'all call me - EDO TRIBALIST. 

Wow! This would be the day, I grow up. Lololo!

For example, Iguade, the Edo tribalist! 

Hmmmmmm! Very sweet! Here is another example. Iguade, you are such an Edo tribalist I hate you. Ehn! Mak my fucking day, I go die o! Hehehehe! 

God bless. "I"

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[Wilson Iguade]

Ayo well put. I agree with your presentation below, especially as it concerns race and tribal discrimination. Thanks. "I"

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[Stevek]

Thanks for your response. I am not going to be Emeka's advocate here. I am merely going by the fact that no one can cash a check addressed to another without the other'signed consent. Nevertheless, if you claim that you gad reason to stand where you did, I will respect that right for you. On the issue of the Civil War, I draw the line. Pain is what the sufferer say it is. And it is the Easterners that suffered the pain. The rest of us inflicted it on them. They have every right under the Sun to complain. Have a nice weekend. Stevek. Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

[Odudu Abasi]

" - - - that others on the two sides of the war did not commit?"

Ayo,

Your argument bears the same "intelligent" reasoning with that of  someone  who decides to steal only because another thief had stolen from him/her!

OduduAbasi

DFW

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[EKE EKE]

Comparing Nigeria today and 2011, is Nigeria a better country in the indexes of development from internally displaced people, through security to access to healthcare services? Just tell me one thing that is better in Nigeria than three or four years ago. How many corrupt politicians have been brought to book and how many millions has Patience Jonathan, permanent Secretary in Bayelsa starched away, 

In my view, Nigeria is in grips of a criminal fraternity and those of you who see something good in evil because it is less evil good luck. 

Sent from my iPhone

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[Stevek]

Mr. Eke, It appears you don't know who Joe Attueyi is that's why you are taking him seriously. He is not reading any of your responses. He will just lie low for a couple of weeks and start the same crap all over again. Ignore him.

Stevek. Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

[Odudu Abasi]

Rotimi,

Thank you for confirming that the truth hurts!

OduduAbasi

DFW

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Posted by: Joe Attueyi <topc...@yahoo.com>

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[Chika Onyeani]

ALERT:  TWO MORE DAYS TO HISTORIC MEETING WITH DR. NKOSAZANA DLAMINI-ZUMA, AUC CHAIRPERSON

Yes, all arrangements are a go for the African Union Commission Chairperson, Her Excellency Dr. Nkosazana Dlamini-Zuma, to take the center stage and address the African world community, from U.S., Europe, Africa, Caribbean, South America, Canada. She is going to be taking questions from Africans from all over the world.

FEATURED SPEAKER:  Her Excellency Dr. Nkosazana Dlamini Zuma

MODERATOR:  Former U.S. Ambassador to the Republic of Botswana and former Executive Director for African Affairs, at the State Department, Ambassador Joseph Huggins.

DATE:   5 pm Eastern Time, 4 pm Central Time, 3 pm Mountain Time and 2 pm Pacific Time.

CONFERENCE CALL NO.:  1-424-203-8405, and access code is 771294#.

EMAIL YOUR QUESTIONS TO: africana...@yahoo.com or cony...@africansuntimes.com

This program is made possible by Celebrate African Foundation,  a 501(c) 3 non-profit organization, creator the "BEST AFRICAN COUNTRY OF THE YEAR AWARDS"; and the African Sun Times (www.africansuntimes.com), Africa's No.1 newspaper in America.

For more information
on the 2nd Global Teleconference on Vision 2063, contact:

Dr. Chika A. Onyeani
Publisher/Editor-in-Chief
African Sun Times: www.africansuntimes.com
Email: cony...@africansuntimes.com

Tel: 973-675-9919
Cell: 917-279-4038

African Local Call-in Numbers: 


KENYA:  254(0)205231000; NIGERIA: 234(0)14405220; SOUTH AFRICA: 27(0)878250150

The numbers will connect directly to the U.S. call-in number, then put in 771294#.
Other countries, check the numbers below.

AGENDA 2063



Date: 24 January 2063

To: Kw...@iamafrican.com

From: Nkos...@confedafrica.gov

 
Subject: African Unity

 My dear friend Kwame,

 Greetings to the family and friends, and good health and best wishes for 2063.

 I write to you from the beautiful Ethiopian city of Bahir Dar, located on Lake Tana, as we finalize preparations for the Centenary celebrations of the Organisation of African Unity, which evolved to the African Union in 2002 and laid the foundations for what is now our Confederation of African States (CAS).

Yes, who would have thought that the dream of Kwame Nkrumah and his generations, when they called in 1963 on Africans to unite or perish, would one day become a reality. And what a grand reality.

At the beginning of the twenty first century, we used to get irritated with foreigners when they treated Africa as one country: as if we were not a continent of over a billion people and 55 sovereign states! But, the advancing global trend towards regional blocks, reminded us that integration and unity is the only way for Africa to leverage its competitive advantage.

In fact, if Africa was one country in 2006, we would have been the 10th largest economy in the world! However, instead of acting as one, with virtually every resource in the world (land, oceans, minerals, energy, forests) and over a billion people, we acted as fifty-five small and fragmented individual countries.

The bigger countries that should have been the locomotives of African integration, failed to play their role at that time, and that is part of the reasons it took us so long. We did not realize our power, but instead relied on donors, that we euphemistically called partners.

That was the case in 2013, but reality finally dawned and we had long debates about the form that our unity should take: confederation, a united states, a federation or a union.

As you can see, my friend, those debates are over and the Confederation of African States is now twelve years old, launched in 2051.

The role played by successive generations of African youth contributed to our success. Already in 2013 during the Golden Jubilee celebrations, it was the youth that loudly questioned the slow progress towards integration.

They formed African Union Clubs in schools and universities across the continent, and linked with each other on social media. Thus we saw the grand push for integration, for the free movement of people, for harmonization of education and professional qualifications, with the Pan African University and indeed the university sector and intelligentsia playing an instrumental role.

We were a youthful continent at the start of the 21st century, but as our youth bulge grew, young men and women became even more active, creative, impatient and assertive, often telling us oldies that they are the future, and that they (together with women) form the largest part of the electorates in all our countries!

Of course this was but one of the drivers towards unity. The accelerated implementation of the Abuja Treaty and the creation of the African Economic Community by 2034 saw economic integration moved to unexpected levels.

Economic integration, coupled with infrastructure development, saw intra-Africa trade mushrooming, from less than 12% in 2013 to approaching 50% by 2045. This integration was further consolidated with the growth of commodity exchanges and continental commercial giants.

Starting with the African pharmaceutical company, Pan African companies now not only dominate our domestic market of over two billion people, but they have overtaken multi-nationals from the rest of the world in their own markets.

Even more significant than this, was the growth of regional manufacturing hubs, around the beneficiation of our minerals and natural resources, such as in the Eastern Congo, north-eastern Angola and Zambia’s copper belt and at major Silicon valleys in Kigali, Alexandria, Brazzaville, Maseru, Lagos and Mombasa, to mention but a few such hubs.

My friend, Africa has indeed transformed herself from an exporter of raw materials with a declining manufacturing sector in 2013, to become a major food exporter, a global manufacturing hub, a knowledge centre, beneficiating our natural resources and agricultural products as drivers to industrialization.

Pan African companies, from mining to finance, food and beverages, hospitality and tourism, pharmaceuticals, fashion, fisheries and ICT are driving integration, and are amongst the global leaders in their sectors.

Africa is now the third largest economy in the world. As the Foreign Minister’s retreat in Bahir Dar in January 2014 emphasized, we did this by finding the balance between market forces and strong and accountable developmental states and RECS to drive infrastructure, the provision of social services, industrialization and economic integration.

Let me recall what our mutual friend recently wrote:

“The (African) agrarian revolution had small beginnings. Successful business persons (and local governments) with roots in the rural areas started massive irrigation schemes to harness the waters of the continent’s huge river systems.

The pan-African river projects – on the Congo, the Nile, Niger, Gambia, Zambezi, Kunene, Limpopo and many others – financed by PPPs that involved African and BRIC investors, as well as the African Diaspora, released the continent’s untapped agricultural potential.

By the intelligent application of centuries-old indigenous knowledge, acquired and conserved by African women who have tended crops in all seasons, within the first few years bumper harvests were being reported. Agronomists consulted women about the qualities of various grains – which ones survived low rainfalls and which thrived in wet weather; what pests threatened crops and how could they be combated without undermining delicate ecological systems.

The social impact of the agrarian revolution was perhaps the most enduring change it brought about. The status of women, the tillers of the soil by tradition, rose exponentially. The girl child, condemned to a future in the kitchen or the fields in our not too distant past, now has an equal chance of acquiring a modern education (and owning a farm or an agribusiness). African mothers today have access to tractors and irrigation systems that can be easily assembled.

The producers’ cooperatives, (agribusinesses) and marketing boards these women established help move their produce and became the giant food companies we see today.’

We refused to bear the brunt of climate change and aggressively moved to promote the Green economy and to claim the Blue economy as ours. We lit up Africa, the formerly dark continent, using hydro, solar, wind, geo-thermal energy, in addition to fossil fuels.

And, whilst I’m on the Blue economy, the decision to form Africa-wide shipping companies, and encourage mining houses to ship their goods in vessels flying under African flags, meant a major growth spurt. Of course the decision taken in Dakar to form an African Naval Command to provide for the collective security of our long coastlines, certainly also helped.

Let me quote from our mutual friend again:

‘Africa’s river system, lakes and coast-lines abound with tons of fish. With funding from the different states and the Diaspora, young entrepreneurs discovered… that the mouths of virtually all the rivers along the east coast are rich in a species of eel considered a delicacy across the continent and the world.

Clever marketing also created a growing market for Nile perch, a species whose uncontrolled proliferation had at one time threatened the survival of others in Lake Victoria and the Nile.

Today Namibia and Angola exploit the Benguela current, teaming with marine life, through the joint ventures funded by sovereign funds and the African Development Bank.”

On the east coast, former island states of Seychelles, Comoros, Madagascar and Mauritius are leading lights of the Blue economy and their universities and research institutes attract marine scientists and students from all over the world.

My dear friend, you reminded me in your last e-mail how some magazine once called us ‘the hopeless continent’, citing conflicts, hunger and malnutrition, disease and poverty as if it was a permanent African condition.

Few believed that our pledge in the 50th Anniversary Declaration to silence the guns by 2020 was possible. Because of our firsthand experience of the devastation of conflicts, we tackled the root causes, including diversity, inclusion and the management of our resources.

If I have to single out one issue that made peace happened, it was our commitment to invest in our people, especially the empowerment of young people and women. By 2013 we said Africa needed a skills revolution and that we must change our educationsystems to produce young people that are innovative and entrepreneurial and with strong Pan African values.

From early childhood education, to primary, secondary, technical, vocational and higher education – we experienced a true renaissance, through the investments we made, as governments and the private sector in education and in technology, science, research and innovation.

Coupled with our concerted campaigns to eradicate the major diseases, to provide access to health services, good nutrition, water and sanitation, energy and shelter, our people indeed became and are our most important resource. Can you believe it my friend, even the dreaded malaria is a thing of the past.

Of course this shift could not happen without Africa taking charge of its transformation, including the financing of our development. As one esteemed Foreign minister said in 2014: Africa is rich, but Africans are poor.

With concerted political determination and solidarity, and sometimes one step back and two steps forward, we made financing our development and taking charge of our resources a priority, starting with financing the African Union, our democratic elections and our peacekeeping missions.

The Golden Jubilee celebrations were the start of a major paradigm shift, about taking charge of our narrative.

Agenda 2063, its implementation and the milestones it set, was part of what brought about this shift. We developed Agenda 2063 to galvanize and unite in action all Africans and the Diaspora around the common vision of a peaceful, integrated and prosperous Africa. As an overarching framework, Agenda 2063 provided internal coherence to our various sectoral frameworks and plans adopted under the OAU and AU.

It linked and coordinated our many national and regional frameworks into a common continental transformation drive.

Planning fifty years ahead, allowed us to dream, think creatively, and sometimes crazy, to see us leapfrog beyond the immediate challenges.

Anchored in Pan Africanism and the African renaissance, Agenda 2063 promoted the values of solidarity, self-belief, non-sexism, self-reliance and celebration of our diversity.

As our societies developed, as our working and middle classes grew, as women took their rightful place in our societies, our recreational, heritage and leisure industries grew: arts and culture, literature, media, languages, music and film. WEB du Bois grand project of Encyclopedia Africana finally saw the light and Kinshasha is now the fashion capital of the world.

From the onset, the Diaspora in the traditions of Pan Africanism, played its part, through investments, returning to the continent with their skills and contributing not only to their place of origin, but where the opportunities and needs were found.

Let me conclude this e-mail, with some family news. The twins, after completing their space studies at Bahir Dar University, decided to take the month off before they start work at the African Space Agency, to travel the continent. My old friend, in our days, trying to do that in one month would have been impossible!

But, the African Express Rail now connects all the capitals of our former states, and indeed they will be able to crisscross and see the beauty, culture and diversity of this cradle of humankind.

The marvel of the African Express Rail is that it is not only a high speed-train, with adjacent highways, but also contains pipelines for gas, oil and water, as well as ICT broadband cables: African ownership, integrated planning and execution at its best!

The continental rail and road network that now crisscross Africa, along with our vibrant airlines, our spectacular landscapes and seductive sunsets, the cultural vibes of our cities, makes tourism one of our largest economic sectors.

Our eldest daughter, the linguist, still lectures in Kiswahili in Cabo Verde, at the headquarters of the Pan African Virtual University. Kiswahili is now a major African working language, and a global language taught at most faculties across the world.

Our grand children find it very funny how we used to struggle at AU meetings with English, French and Portuguese interpretations, how we used to fight that the English version is not in line with the French or Arabic text!

Now we have a lingua franca, and multi-lingualism is the order of the day.

Remember how we used to complain about our voice not being heard in trade negotiations and the Security Council, how disorganized, sometimes divided and nationalistic we used to be in those forums, how we used to be summoned by various countries to their capitals to discuss their policies on Africa?

How things have changed. The Confederation last year celebrated twenty years since we took our seat as a permanent member of the UN Security Council, and we are a major force for global stability, peace, human rights, progress, tolerance and justice.

My dear friend, I hope to see you next month in Haiti, for the second round of unity talks between the Confederation of African States and the Caribbean states.

This is a logical step, since Pan Africanism had its roots amongst those early generations, as a movement of Africans from the mother continent and the Diaspora for liberation, self-determination and our common progress.

I end this e-mail, and look forward to seeing you in February. I will bring along some of the chocolates from Accra that you so love, which our children can now afford.

Till we meet again, Nkosazana

[N. H. Ibanga]

"Some people do not get in this forum. Tribe is a pejorative  classificatory word which you will never hear a white man use to describe any white ethnic group."

What about the twelve tribes of Israel?

Publius

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Posted by: Odudu Abasi <odudu...@yahoo.com>

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[Ezeana Igirigi Achusim]

Oga Odudu:

No one says that GEJ is an excellent president. What I heard people say is that after surveying what is out there prancing the landscape as potential presidential candidates, the people are, by acclamation, declaring that GEJ tops them all. In the land of the blind, they say, one eyed man is king o. 

Btw, do you have any body in mind you want to sell to us that we have not already rejected? 

And I am

Ezeana Igirigi Achusim

Odi-Isaa

Nwa Dim Orioha 

Sent from my iPhone

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[okoiad...@gmail.com]

Eke Eke, you have ably said it all. I therefore align wholeheartedly with your reasoning and conclusion. No objective and honest analyst of Nigeria under Jonathan can postulate that he has been a good manager of the economy except the voodoo/agbero economists in these forums and the army of sycophants /couriers hired by PDP! 

From: EKE EKE Sent: Saturday, 20 September 2014 23:15 To: africanw...@googlegroups.com Cc: Nigerian World Forum; Naija Observer; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com; emma_...@hotmail.com; Vin Otuonye; okoiad...@gmail.com; okonkwo...@googlegroups.com; Raay...@yahoogroups.com; yana...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] Has Jonathan being a good economic manager?

[okoiad...@gmail.com]

Rotimi, what is there in the article of Simon Kolewole! Absolutely nothing! 

[okoiad...@gmail.com]

By their fruits we shall know them. The chicken has come home to roost! The spin doctors are now un masking themselves! Voodoo statistical figures of economic growth calculated to deceive Nigerians! 

From: Joe Attueyi Sent: Saturday, 20 September 2014 22:29 To: africanw...@googlegroups.com

Cc: Nigerian World Forum; Naija Observer; nigeriawo...@yahoogroups.com; ayooju...@yahoo.com; emma_...@hotmail.com; Vin Otuonye; okoiad...@gmail.com; NaijaP...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [africanworldforum] RE: Adekunle: The Hitler in Nigerian Army Uniform-An Essay

[okoiad...@gmail.com]

Eke Eke, absolutely! I will add fraudulent!