Concerning Aedict ultimate

[Norbert Preining]

Dear Martin,

I have purchased Aedict and all is extensions, i have been long term supporter on Patreon.

What will change for me with this new update that I got now hold of from installing?

Does that mean that the paid extensions are now useless?

Please let us know a bit about the details

Thanks a lot

Norbert

--
PREINING Norbert http://www.preining.info
Accelia Inc. + JAIST + TeX Live + Debian Developer
GPG: 0x860CDC13 fp: F7D8 A928 26E3 16A1 9FA0 ACF0 6CAC A448 860C DC13

[Timothy Connor]

Similar issue for me.  I purchased Aedict and all its extensions.  It would now appear that they are no longer usable.

[Martin Vysny]

Dear Norbert, Timothy,
  thank you for your mails, and for your awesome support. I apparently did a poor job explaining about the recent events. Let's go through those.

1. What

The "Aedict Ultimate" change consists of the following:
1. Copying of the KanjiDraw Practice extension functionality into the Aedict itself. The functionality will be activated only when the "Aedict Ultimate" subscription is active. The KanjiDraw Practice standalone app will not be removed and you can continue using it. However, Aedict will not attempt to launch it (it will launch the embedded Practice). Maybe I should change it in a way that if you have Practice installed, it would use that instead. Yet there is the fear of piracy, please read below.
2. Copying of the KanjiPad Extension into the Aedict itself. The functionality is activated when the "Aedict Ultimate" subscription is active. The old Extension is unfortunately not used anymore and you can uninstall it safely.
3. Hiding a couple of Aedict functionality behind the Ultimate, to encourage users to actually do the purchase.

The "Aedict Ultimate" change should not affect the Aedict Reader in any way. The Reader will now work with the (now free) Aedict (Basic), without any Ultimate subscription. Also, the Aedict OCR is not altered in any way (or should not be - if it is, please let me know and I will try to fix it immediately).


2. Why

Money, unfortunately. Commercially, Aedict has been a failure. It never generated enough money to pay for the time invested. One-time payments really works only on BIG apps - tens of thousands of downloads. The model of selling extensions (such as KanjiDraw Practice and KanjiPad Extension) only generated small additional revenue; the Patreon opt-in support model only generated small additional revenue. Also Aedict has been pirated on other APK stores, simply because it had no protection mechanisms built-in and it was extremely easy to pirate.

The important part here is that Aedict has no other way of generating money but from sales. I can't do consulting - hardly can I teach Japanese. I can't add commercials - the revenue from commercials for an app with 5000 installs is laughable. I'm not backed by a government nor a company. To put it bluntly, in order for me to have money for the development, is to take the money from Aedict users such as you. There is no other way.

So, what I'm trying now is a single subscription enforced for everyone (so that everyone contributes, not just the Patreon guys; I have canceled the Patreon page since Aedict Ultimate has been designed as a replacement for Patreon). With recurring subscriptions, even an app with low number of users may (or may not) generate enough income. Remember that it's not easy to play nice here: you pay 1,5 eur per month, of that ~20% is charged as VAT, 30% as a Google "tax", then I need to tax the rest with the tax authorities in my country so I receive 0,6 eur tops. You can read more about my frustration here: http://mavi.logdown.com/posts/5400674

Ideally there would be just a single subscription which would enable all of Aedict functionality (even including Reader and OCR). Of course there is history and guys like you who made the purchase beforehand and now feel their investment gone. That is bad and I hate myself for doing that to you guys. I also hate myself for spending time on coding Aedict instead of playing with my kids. Now, pick your poison.


3. The Rest

I'm definitely not a marketing/sales guy. I learn as I go, making tons of stupid mistakes in the process. For me, Aedict is a valuable lesson in software engineering and a hobby. I know it's no fun anymore since there are your money involved. Yet, Aedict is a hobby and I am not free to spend time on hobbies anymore. The hobby has to pay off, and to be able to work on a hobby I need to take unpaid leave from my job. Anyways, enough about me. My future plan is to see whether the subscription thing will work. So far it had generated lot of anger and no income, so it looks like yet another failure. I'll give it some time and then if Aedict Ultimate fails, I'll stop developing Aedict and throw the whole offering under the train. This decision is probably long overdue anyway.

ps: Actually multiple versions of Aedict3 are now published on Google Play (I think it's 3.49 or something like that). You can try to install that one instead of 3.50.2, yet I have no idea how to do that via Google Play.

Best regards,
Martin

--
Please support the Aedict development, either by subscribing at https://aedict-online.eu or by supporting us at https://www.patreon.com/aedict
---
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "aedict-users" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to aedict-users...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.

[Norbert Preining]

Dear Martin

Thanks for the clear answer, I understand your pain. Having seen that the Patreon support has died off, I thought I jump into and get a subscription to Aedict Ultimate, since I guess it will be another the same or less then I pledged on Patreon.

But after installing I have to say, maybe I'm too stupid, but I didn't find a button to subscribe ... Could you help me?

Best

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Norbert,

  thank you for your kind words, and I once again apologize for this
move. If there was another way to raise money, I'd go for it. It's not
pleasant for me to be accused of being a greedy bastard by some of the
users :-D It's just not worth it.

If there is a Japanese-teaching university willing to sponsor the
development by paying me a monthly wage, I'd be honored to remove the
Aedict Ultimate subscription and make all the apps (including the
Reader, OCR, everything) for free and open-source, with the logo of the
university of course.

  To subscribe, just activate the Please Subscribe notification dialog,
e.g. by starting a quiz for JLPT N3. Then, just click OK and then Google
Play should take over and should allow you to subscribe.

Best regards,
Martin

[Martin Vysny]

Hi, please allow me to post additional info to clear up things.

Thank you Norbert for the suggestion - I'll add the "Subscribe" item
into the Settings as you suggest. Not sure about the kanjipad - it's
tight on UI space already

If you subscribed to Aedict Ultimate, you can safely uninstall both
Aedict KanjiDraw Practice and the KanjiPad Extension. They are now
included in Aedict itself.

Please keep the Aedict Reader Popup installed. It will continue to work
as-is, without any additional payments. It will not be affected by the
"Ultimate" subscription move in any way. There will not be another
subscription for Popup or anything like that. Please, if the Reader
Popup asks you to install KanjiDraw Practice or KanjiPad Extension or
suggests the "Aedict Ultimate" subscription then it is a bug and please
let me know - I will fix it.

Reader Popup will not be included in Aedict. It uses a special
permission which allows it to draw over other apps. That is generally
considered dangerous (because of potential security issues); and I don't
want to bring this "special" "dangerous" permission into Aedict itself.

Thank you and all the best,
Martin

[Norbert Preining]

Hi Martin

(adding ML back into Cc as we are back on technical issues)

> Thanks for the suggestion - I'll add the "Subscribe" item into the Settings

> as you suggest. Not sure about the kanjipad - it's tight on UI space already

You could do something like with the JLPT3 test and above to pop up a
temp, but don't waste your time too much ;-)

> If you subscribed to Aedict Ultimate, you can safely uninstall both Aedict
> KanjiDraw Practice and the KanjiPad Extension.

Thanks for confirmation.

> Please keep the Aedict Reader Popup installed. It will continue to work
> as-is, without any additional payments. It will not be affected by the
> "Ultimate" subscription move in any way. There will not be another
> subscription for Popup or anything like that. Please, if the Reader Popup
> asks you to install KanjiDraw Practice or KanjiPad Extension or suggests the
> "Aedict Ultimate" subscription then it is a bug and please let me know - I
> will fix it.

Actually, it doesn't work on my Huawei P10pro with EMUI 8.0, copying
text does not popup anything. BUT (!) I have checked that Aedict Reader
has popup permissions (Phone Manager -> Dropzone).

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Norbert
  regarding Popup not working on P10pro, can you please raise an issue
at https://github.com/mvysny/aedict/issues ? I'm not sure whether I will
be able to help, but there may be others with the same phone and may
know a workaround.

Best,
Martin

[Stuart LeVine]

I've been listening from the side and would like to add in my suggestion.  There's no reason why you shouldn't earn a descent return on your efforts and I suspect you won't with the premium package.   I suggest you consider subscriptions for the dictionaries (encrypting them if you have to) with a clear explanation to the user community of the need and a clear f-u to the whiners.

Stuart

[Timothy Connor]

I don't expect Martin to support or develop this application in perpetuity.

However, I  paid for functionality that have been removed and now I'm being charged monthly to get that functionality back.  I don't think it unreasonable to be unhappy about that.

If i were in Martin's place I would freeze development of Aedcit including dictionary updates and launch a version 4 with support and the subscription model.  This doesn't punish those of us who supported and purchased his applications.

I, however, hate subscription models.  I choose those  services that I subscribe to very carefully and will frequently choose inferior products that I can buy outright.  But other people, especially those of different generations who can give a "clear f-u" to polite strangers they disagree with may feel differently.

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Stuart,
  thank you for your encouraging words, it's nice to hear a positive feedback in the outrage cry :-) I have considered that option, yet I don't feel it's right, since those dictionaries have not been created by me. So it would probably be dishonest to charge for them...
Best,
Martin

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Timothy,

  thank you for your mail. Freezing Aedict 3 and launching Aedict 4 was my initial plan. That would allow me to start afresh and get rid of old crust and old features that were causing crashes. However, technically-wise having two dictionaries offering the same API would not work - Google Play would probably reject to install such apps. Also, Aedict 3 users could also point fingers and say I paid for Aedict 3, I want Aedict 4 for free. Also, I would have to develop a way to migrate the user data from Aedict 3 to Aedict 4. That's a lot of work, with unclear financial outcome. It was far easier to simply bolt subscription on top of Aedict 3 and simply continue with the development.

Let me rephrase. Aedict 3 is economical disaster. It does not pay off. Maintaining two separate Aedicts with a migration path would not pay off and it would be a huge time eater. I understand that you like to pay for an app once and then receive lifetime updates. I like that too. And it works, if the app has 50,000+ users (Takoboto). However, Aedict has 5,000 users. I have no other choice but to go subscription. And even that is uncertain. I'm investing my energy and free time on an uncertain project.

Let me try again. If Aedict would provide enough earnings for a decent life, I would create Aedict 4 and invest time to maintain them side-by-side and all that I've mentioned above. Actually, I would never HAVE to create Aedict 4: If Aedict would provide decent money I'd simply keep Aedict 3 with one-time payments. I enjoy developing Aedict and solving issues for the community, but after 6 years of "voluntary work" (since that's what this is. It doesn't pay off) I had enough. Either Aedict starts delivering money, or it's gone.

I believe in options. I had an option to do voluntary work, and I chose not to. I understand it's unpopular because customers want things to be for free. But that doesn't work for me, I want my work to pay off. So I activated the subscriptions as the last resort. Now you have the option to pay, to not to pay, or to go elsewhere. I'm sorry but that's how it is. I've tried everything else, people just don't want to pay for apps (well they do, one-time, but that's just not enough for Aedict). I've heard that Takoboto is awesome. And it's free! And it has impressive ratings.

Aedict, too, will be free one day. When the subscription model fails to deliver the money I need, I will unlock all features and give away everything for free. On that day, the development of Aedict will cease, the dictionary updates will stop flowing and the whole thing will be killed. Luckily it will continue to work because it works offline. Until Google decides to not to support old apps.

It boils down to this question. What would you like me to do? Stop the development, or go the subscription model? Having both in the way of having Aedict 3 and 4 would not work - nobody would activate a subscription to pay for what they already have in Aedict 3. Or rather, only the kind folks that supported me on Patreon would activate the subscription. And that's not enough and we're back at square one. So would you prefer to stop the development or not? Let's vote with money.

Sorry for the tone of this mail. But I'm just really tired and angered of hearing that people want my highly-specialized work for free (or for peanuts. Because that's what 100 eur per month is. Peanuts. I can't live off that).
Best,
Martin

[Stuart LeVine]

Martin

It's very simple: 3 is dead.  No more updates.

New product 4 is subscription including dictionaries and minor upgrades.  Major version upgrades pay upgrade fee.

[Timothy Connor]

Hi Martin,

Thanks for the reply.  I completely understanding abandoning a business model that won't work for you.  I also agree this program has been a bargain and I feel like I've gotten my money's worth from it.  I've no issues with you going to a subscription model.  I'm just not a generally a purchaser of subscriptions.

I like to think I've been civil in my objections to the changes you've made, but I understand that not everyone may be polite.  So I also wish you well in dealing with the feedback some of which may be less than polite.  I hope you reconsider or can create some kind of lifetime subscription model.  I'd have no issue with "buying" the application again with some kind of modest improvement made to it.

All the best.  Tim

[Martin Vysny]

Hi, can't do that anymore - can't switch Aedict 3 to pay-once, Google Play disallows me :-/
I guess I have to go with the subscription and we shall see. Anyways, thanks so much for listening to my rumblings ;)

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Norbert,
  I'm very sorry, I just have discovered that Aedict Reader still
requires KanjiPad Extension. I have moved the necessary functionality
into Aedict and made Reader no longer depend on KanjiPad Extension, but
it's not yet ready to be released.

So, for now please keep the KanjiPad Extension installed until both new
Aedict and Reader are released.

Best,
Martin

On 02.08.2018 09:48, Norbert Preining wrote:

[Norbert Preining]

>   I'm very sorry, I just have discovered that Aedict Reader still requires
> KanjiPad Extension. I have moved the necessary functionality into Aedict and

Really? At least on my Android phone it is working without the KanjiPad
extension installed.

Maybe some different functionality I don't use?

[Martin Vysny]

On 03.08.2018 09:31, Norbert Preining wrote:
>>   I'm very sorry, I just have discovered that Aedict Reader still requires
>> KanjiPad Extension. I have moved the necessary functionality into Aedict and
> Really? At least on my Android phone it is working without the KanjiPad
> extension installed.
>
> Maybe some different functionality I don't use?

You're right - Popup only starts asking for KanjiPadExt when you
activate the kanji draw mode. To do that, just open the Reader window,
then click the three-dot menu, then the drawing icon.

Best,
Martin

[Ugo Poifol]

Hi Martin,

For what it's worth, I think the subscription model is very reasonable given the the price currently charged. I hope it succeeds in bringing you some steady income.

However, the current iteration is very confusing. I know how to activate it, but having no subscription option in settings is weird ; besides, there is no way to know exactly what gets unlocked. For example, the new Kanjipad detection algorithm is stellar - yet there is no way of knowing it was included. I understand you want it to be a subscription bonus, a reward for the faithful, but you're hurting your business model by keeping most features a secret.

Even know I'm not entirely sure what features I have unlocked. There are a lot of Aedict features I don't use, but maybe I'd use them if they were upgraded, and I don't feel like trying everything again to see if something was unlocked.

One last thing - the "About" section and your explnation posts often link to the aedict.eu page, but it doesn't seem to be working. I'm concerned some potential users get scared away by the lack of information and dead links, and it seems like you can only make sense of the current state of Aedict if you're a long-time user who enjoys digging around Google groups and Github.

Cheers

Ps: I don't know if it was the trigger, but an update fixing the crash at boot on my Oreo device was pushed within an hour of me submitting a crash report. Many thanks for that.

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Ugo,

  thank you very much for your kind words, and I apologize for the late
reply - I wanted to fix the documentation as you suggested prior
replying :-) . I'm happy to know that there are users who consider the
new pricing system reasonable.

You're right - we need more information. I have explained the Aedict
Ultimate in the blog post here:
https://mvysny.github.io/aedict-blog/Aedict-Ultimate/
Please feel free to let me know if there is anything to be added.

Also I will add the "Aedict Ultimate" menu item into the Settings, which
will show you the state of the subscription, and will offer to obtain
one if needed. You can also check the subscription state in Google Play
- there is a menu "Subscriptions" which lists all subscriptions from all
apps.

Regarding the aedict.eu - you're right. It's served by Tomcat along with
Aedict-online.eu, and apparently aedict-online causes Tomcat to die
after couple of weeks. I need to investigate; for now I have set up a
site watchdog to let me know when Tomcat dies.

Best,
Martin
ps: the Oreo-related crash was an unfortunate aftereffect after I
migrated Aedict to target newest SDKs as required by Google Play. I
don't have Oreo phone myself; I tried to test on the Emulator but I
missed the case where it would crash. Hopefully Aedict works good for
you without any crash.

[Ugo Poifol]

Hi Martin,

Excellent. Within 24 hours of my message, all websites were running again and you made a list of Ultimate features. It's the kind of reactivity that (among other things) make me stick with Aedict.

One more thing: when I subscribed, Google Play offered me 4 months (!) of free subscription. I effectively won't be paying anything until December. Do you still get paid by Google in the meantime?

No further remarks, Aedict has been smooth sailing for me since you fixed the Oreo crash. Let's hope for a long future for Aedict!

Regards

[Martin Vysny]

Hi Ugo,

  happy to hear that everything is okay :)

Nope, I will not be paid in the meantime. Not to worry: this is my investment for the future to come, and an apology to the users who already paid for the app.

Best regards and have a nice weekend,

Martin