Cause-effect non-difference - Srimad Bhagavatam

[V Subrahmanian]

A eulogy by Paramashiva in the episode of Srihari's Mohini Avatara:

श्रीमद्भागवतपुराणम्/स्कन्धः ८/अध्यायः १२

https://sa.wikisource.org/s/zh7

एकस्त्वमेव सदसद् द्वयमद्वयं च

स्वर्णं कृताकृतमिवेह न वस्तुभेदः ।

अज्ञानतस्त्वयि जनैर्विहितो विकल्पो ।

यस्माद् गुणव्यतिकरो निरुपाधिकस्य ॥ ८ ॥

Although You are the only principle and the supreme cause of the world, You, who are the cause, are not different from the world which is the effect. But seeing the world as different from yourself is due to ignorance. It is because you are devoid of attributes that you do not have this cause-effect difference in reality.

Here is an example: Gold is seen as a cause, jewelry as the effect. But there is no real difference between the cause, gold, and its effects. The Chandogya Upanishad gives this example to convey this very doctrine.

The Brahma sutra 2.1.14 states this very doctrine of 'kArya-kAraNa ananyatva (non-difference of cause and effect)

This Vedantic premise is accepted only in Advaita. In other schools this doctrine does not apply with the accuracy of the gold analogy.

See Sridhara Swami's commentary image for this verse below.

Om

[Bhaskar YR]

praNAms

Hare Krishna

 

A eulogy by Paramashiva in the episode of Srihari's Mohini Avatara:

 

Ø     This is not only mere eulogy but it is the vedantic premise accepted in Advaita.  And those who are saying and arguing in favor of kArya-kAraNa ananyatvam saying so just to drive home the point that brahman is evam eva adviteeyam. 

 

Although You are the only principle and the supreme cause of the world, You, who are the cause, are not different from the world which is the effect.

 

• Cause is always different from effect but effect never exists independently apart from its cause.  Hence there is sentence jagat is brahman but brahma is not jagat ( just like ornaments are gold but gold is not ornament).

 

But seeing the world as different from yourself is due to ignorance.

 

• Yes seeing the jagat with parichinna drushti is avidyA jagat is neither abrahman nor asarvaM.  In its kAraNa svarUpa it is only brahman and nothing but brahman. 

 

It is because you are devoid of attributes that you do not have this cause-effect difference in reality.

 

Ø     Yes, kArya-kAraNa ananyatvaM should ultimately lead us to adviteeyatvaM of brahman. 

 

Here is an example: Gold is seen as a cause, jewelry as the effect. But there is no real difference between the cause, gold, and its effects.

 

• It has to be noted in Advaita though we speak a lot about the  ananyatvaM  of the kAraNa and the kArya, we should always never forget the fact  that the effect is only a form of the cause whereas its opposite does not apply, that is, the cause is not a form of the effect.  bhAshyakAra is quite clear here in sUtra bhAshya : ananyatvepi kAryakAraNayOH kAryastu kAraNAtmatvaM ‘ na tu kAraNasya kAryAtmatvaM’…..This has been said  to teach us two different siddhAnta prakriya in Advaita i.e. jagat is nothing but brahman but in brahman there is not even an iota of duality. 

 

The Chandogya Upanishad gives this example to convey this very doctrine.

The Brahma sutra 2.1.14 states this very doctrine of 'kArya-kAraNa ananyatva (non-difference of cause and effect)

 

Ø     Yes,

 

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

[H S Chandramouli]

Namaste.

This topic of Brahman being kArya-kAraNa ananya has been discussed a number of times earlier. And mostly with the same participants, including myself. Hence I am not posting this with a view to initiate a fresh discussion amongst the same participants. But I felt compelled to present an alternate understanding mainly addressed to others who may be led to believe that this is indeed Advaita Sidhanata in full.

(Shuddha) Brahman is कार्यकारण विलक्षण (kAryakAraNa vilakShaNa). Neither kArya nor kAraNa. I am presenting only two references although there are any number available in the Shrutis.

BU 2-5-19 

// …………अयं वै हरयोऽयं वै दश च सहस्राणि बहूनि चानन्तानि च तदेतद्ब्रह्मापूर्वमनपरमनन्तरमबाह्यमयमात्मा ब्रह्म सर्वानुभूरित्यनुशासनम् ॥ १९ ॥ //

//…………ayaM vai harayo.ayaM vai dasha cha sahasrANi bahUni chAnantAni cha tadetadbrahmApUrvamanaparamanantaramabAhyamayamAtmA brahma sarvAnubhUrityanushAsanam || 19 || //

Bhashya there on  BUB 2-5-19

//  …….तदेतद्ब्रह्म य आत्मा, अपूर्वम् नास्य कारणं पूर्वं विद्यत इत्यपूर्वम् , नास्यापरं कार्यं विद्यत इत्यनपरम्……..//

//……….tadetadbrahma ya AtmA, apUrvam nAsya kAraNaM pUrvaM vidyata ityapUrvam , nAsyAparaM kAryaM vidyata ityanaparam //

Translation  (Swami Madhavananda)  // ……………In short, that Brahman which is the Self is without prior, ie cause, or posterior, i.e. effect,…..// .

MandUkya kArikA  1-11

1.     //  कार्यकारणबद्धौ ताविष्येते विश्वतैजसौ । प्राज्ञः कारणबद्धस्तु द्वौ तौ तुर्ये न सिध्यतः ॥ ११ ॥ //

//  kAryakAraNabaddhau tAviShyete vishvataijasau | prAj~naH kAraNabaddhastu dvau tau turye na sidhyataH || 11 || //

Translation (Swami Gambhirananda)  //  Those two, namely Viswa and Taijasa, are held to be conditioned by cause and effect. PrAjna is conditioned by cause. But both these do not exist in Turiya //.

Regards

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "advaitin" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to advaitin+u...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/AM7PR06MB658115083E8288044DECBE4F8426A%40AM7PR06MB6581.eurprd06.prod.outlook.com.

[putran M]

Namaskaram,

Can someone mention where this Brahma Sutra 2.1.14 is in Swami Gambhirananda's translation? I see only Chapter II Section 1 with 13 topics (sutras) under it, not 14.

thollmelukaalkizhu

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "advaitin" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to advaitin+u...@googlegroups.com.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/CAKk0Te1edgSaiwH5DnMmsJ2f1Cm1PYu9sxNxWTtvfd9cbCW0Mw%40mail.gmail.com.

[H S Chandramouli]

PP 326 to 335

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/CAKqm3-qecdQ40mMXnsPbXZsuZqKnFdkq4BY3Tsd7iACm0PrFjw%40mail.gmail.com.

[putran M]

Namaskaram,

Thanks. I searched the contents and got confused by "Topics".

thollmelukaalkizhu

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/advaitin/CAEs%2B%2BdMyA6oXRD4iBGD5Mv_ehE%2BoF%3DvwkiSvSbdA8scmH7_Q7g%40mail.gmail.com.