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drag n drop ai->id

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Gerald Singelmann

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May 15, 2002, 9:26:06 AM5/15/02
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hi all,

i just tried something i deemed simple: i created a simple circle in ai and applied the feet-brush so that it looked like someone was walking in circles. this had some 25 feet with 6 paths each resulting in some 550 points.

when dragging this into indesign I get the message "the result would be too complicated, so it was converted into an EPS" (or similar: i am running a german indesign)

so I think: ah, there is a limit. and to find out more I build a test: a star made of a line which is copied/rotated in 1 degree steps, resulting in an object being made of 180 paths and 360 points. dragging two of these into indesign poses no problem.

and now I am confused. I thought 100 paths or 512 points would be the limit to be dragged. Does anybody KNOW what indesign thinks to be too complicated?

thank you

BTW: macOS 9.22, G4, 65MB each

Steve Werner

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May 15, 2002, 11:25:15 AM5/15/02
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In Illustrator 9 or 10 preferences, change the Clipboard preference to be AICB--not PDF.

John Slate

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May 15, 2002, 4:13:17 PM5/15/02
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Steve:

As this preference is not either/or, what happens if you have both AICB and PDF selected?

Jon Bessant

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May 15, 2002, 5:00:50 PM5/15/02
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AICB--not PDF<

AICB

Jon

Thurgood

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May 15, 2002, 5:02:10 PM5/15/02
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You can have both.

Thurgood

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May 15, 2002, 6:38:01 PM5/15/02
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Well maybe she's right, youshould always listen to your mother厃ou sound like a fine son indeed.

Jon Bessant

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May 15, 2002, 6:32:26 PM5/15/02
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My mother told me that was greedy!

;-)

Jon

Gerald Singelmann

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May 16, 2002, 3:05:55 AM5/16/02
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when you select both AICB and PDF in AI the result depends on what you choose in ID: "prefer PDF when pasting" or not. if not, you get the AICB-data

when you copy PDF in AI and paste PDF in ID you get something like a placed image. but not paths that can be worked on.

steve, thanks for the try, but the question is still open: when I want some complicated path from AI in ID -- where is the limit? how complicated may it get?

Sandee Cohen

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May 16, 2002, 7:37:24 AM5/16/02
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Gerald,

I think you're wrong about the "prefer PDF when pasting" preference for ID.

The best that I can understand is that preferences is for what happens when ID pastes OUT to other applications.

When I set that preference to be on, I was able to paste OUT from InDesign INTO Adobe Illustrator 10. The artwork came in with a rectangular mask, which I had to delete. But otherwise it was pure paths! (TCole didn't think it could be done.)

But I don't think there is (or there shouldn't be) any limit. The only thing I can think is that you didn't have the preference set in AI.

I don't think the problem with the feet walking in circles was the number of points. It probably was the brush objects.

Were the feet brushes expanded? Try expanding them if not.

JasonSmith

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May 16, 2002, 2:40:21 PM5/16/02
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I have AICB data enabled, and sometimes i get the "data will be placed as eps" box on more complex AI art.

Mik

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May 18, 2002, 12:30:35 AM5/18/02
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Me too (same error message). I'm trying to bring some 300/400K diagrams into ID2 from (AICB enabled) Illustrator. I also tried to find some size or complexity limit.

They open as editable paths in ID1.5.2 but not ID2.

Incidentally, this error message only has an OK button, which is infuriating if EPS is not OK, i.e. not what I want; please add a CANCEL option.

Mik

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May 20, 2002, 4:15:54 PM5/20/02
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I'll add more detail to my previous post, in the hope that some Adobe person can explain why ID2 can't do something that ID1.5 can.

I open a 216K drawing in Illustrator, select all > copy.

Open new doc in ID2, paste . . and receive the message:

"This command would create a large number of page items and would severely degrade performance. Data will be placed as embedded EPS" OK? Grrrrr . . .

I then quit ID2, open ID1.5, create new doc, paste . . .

. . and my drawing arrives complete and editable. I can then open the 1.5 doc in 2 and continue.

Can anyone else duplicate this behaviour?

Any ideas?

P.S. G4, OS9.1

P.P.S. InDesign is (apart from this) fantastic software and I'd like to thank the people who made it.

JasonSmith

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May 28, 2002, 11:03:54 AM5/28/02
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Mik, I cant exactly duplicate the problems because i dont have ID 1.5, but i can say for a fact that there are some simple ai graphics that ID 2.0.1 wont let me copy/paste into, I get the same 'imported as eps' message that you get.

OS 9.2.2.

Eliot Harper

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May 29, 2002, 12:16:05 PM5/29/02
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Hello Gerald,

You ask an interesting question. I just spoke with the Engineer who developed this functionality. Here is an explanation why this message is displayed:

In InDesign 2.0, 'too complicated' is taken to mean that more than 100 objects (i.e., paths with a stroke or fill applied, images, etc.) would be created.

The problem being worked around is that Illustrator inexplicably flattens patterns in its AICB so that a simple pattern fill potentially results in hundreds, even thousands, of small objects. InDesign turns each of these into a separate page item. Unfortunately, InDesign's performance sharply degrades with such a large number of page items.

On a related note, if the AICB data uses non-native "paint servers" (anything other than solid color or an 'Adobe Graphics Manager'-style gradient), InDesign also resorts to placing as EPS.

Hope this helps,

Eliot

Mik

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May 30, 2002, 11:56:10 PM5/30/02
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Eliot,

Thanks for looking for an explanation.

Can I make a "feature request" that the previous functionality (of ID 1.5) be restored in a future version?

Or perhaps we could be warned about the number of objects, then allowed to paste the clipboard and:

1) see if the degraded performance is acceptable,

2) edit the excess objects ourselves?

Perhaps we could be given a "preference" choice of 100, 500, or 1000 objects?

Any of these would be preferable to the hassle of bringing a drawing over from Illustrator in little pieces and then putting them back together again. After I've done this the performance is still just fine.

Again, thanks for a great product. I think your engineer is underestimating the number of objects we can handle.

Mik

Mik

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May 30, 2002, 11:58:22 PM5/30/02
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pako

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Jun 5, 2002, 9:29:22 AM6/5/02
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I already asked this question in another thread but since Sandee has been in this thread I ’ll ask it again. Most of all I think this adds up to the subject.

I am copy-pasting from Freehand 9.0.1 and have to ‘put Photoshop 4/5’ in the convert colors-preferences in Freehand. The problem is that PMS-spot-colors are pasted as rgb-colors in InDesign 1.5 AND 2.0.

Second: the colors aren’t in the right cmyk-values when converted to cmyk so I have to check the values in FH and reenter them in the swatchespallette in InDesign...

Is there a work-around for this?

Sandee Cohen

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Jun 5, 2002, 12:09:45 PM6/5/02
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pako,

I have a feeling that spot colors will NEVER transfer correctly from FH to ID.

And you probably will always have to adjust colors.

Pasting from FH or AI into ID is really for the path shapes. If colors are important, then I'd use File> Place.

pako

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Jun 7, 2002, 4:44:10 AM6/7/02
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Off course, I know how to place a file, but the ability to past Freehand vectorshapes is just one of the great advantages of working in InDesign!

Why is the colorpaste correctly NEVER possible, is the colorengine of Adobe so different?

Sandee Cohen

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Jun 7, 2002, 8:06:58 AM6/7/02
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pako,

I don't know what is happening. But if you paste from FreeHand to Illustrator and then into ID your colors will come in correctly.

JasonSmith

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Jun 7, 2002, 8:30:06 AM6/7/02
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Yet, if you go to the pantone swatches in ID, it says: "Reading Illustrator Library".
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