Font families display incorrectly in font menu, missing

[eran_...@adobeforums.com]

After in installing the latest CS apps under OSX 10.3 I am constantly presented with the "Missing Fonts" dialog for fonts that are clearly installed and active (Suitcase X). I have traced the problem to the way InDesign (and other CS apps) wrongly interpret some font families. The "regular" variant of the font is separated from the rest of the family, making the rest of the family "unavailable" when a file opens and requires the Bold or Italic version of the font. The font menu looks like this:

Scala Sans
ScalaSans
--Bold (submenu)
--Italic (submenu)
--Bold Italic (submenu)
--etc (submenu)

(notice the missing space in the second listing of the font, so far this has only affected two word named fonts)

Anyone else seen this behavior in ID or any other CS app?? Solutions?

[Kenny...@adobeforums.com]

Interesting. We have Adobe Type tech-support looking into an issue we are having with InDesign CS.

We have an older PS version of Adobe Bodoni. It has a Roman as well as Book version (along with 8 other faces).

In InDesign CS we cannot select the Roman version. It simply reverts back to the Book version. It works OK in all other programs (including other CS programs).

I checked out the font with FontDoctor and no conflicts came up. But I did notice that the Roman version was the only one with a Postscript name that was only one word (Bodoni). Everything else had 2 words (ie Bodoni Book, Bodoni Bold, etc.). Not sure if that is the problem or not.

And it seems to me that we may have had problems with our Scala Sans as well. Not sure if it's the same issue (2 listings). Are you using an Open Type version, or PS?

But it seems you could be onto something regarding 'regular' variants. In our case, the Roman is sometimes considered a 'regular' variant, which may be why it's simply called 'Bodoni'.

I'll let you know if Adobe can come up with anything. Upgrading to the Open Type version may fix it, but we shouldn't have to fork out all that money just to keep working. Anyone else having problems with any other fonts?

[Carole...@adobeforums.com]

Yes, I'm having problems with Gill Sans. I have the Adobe family plus Book and Book Italic from Agfa. They all load into the Gill Sans submenu. In InDesign CS (and only InDesign) I can't use Regular. I defaults back to Book. I've tried everything. We're running Panther so upgraded to Suitecase 11. I tried making separate suitcases for the Adobe fonts and Agfa fonts, but it still bundles them. Tried moving them into the Adobe font library, tried only moving the Book fonts there, removed the Gill dfonts and nothing works. Oddly, right now I have one document that shows a fonts in Book and I don't have Book activated. And wouldn't you know that this one of our main corporate fonts.

[eran_...@adobeforums.com]

Sounds like InDesign has "family problems" in general. I did come up with a workaround for my specific Scala problem. I opened the entire font family in a font editor (TypeTool2) and changed all the font names to match the errant one that wasn't linking to the rest of the family ( "Scala Sans" with a space). Now the font appears in a single submenu and documents can "see" the bold variants etc.

While this (tedious) fix worked for me, there is still something very wrong with the CS font family handling, as noted by others. Adobe are you listening??

[Kenny...@adobeforums.com]

Concerning editing the font names with TypeTool2, does just opening the font to edit the name introduce any chance that font characteristics may change (hinting, outlines, etc.)? If the program needs to interpret the font at all, it seems a risky proposition. My boss uses Fontographer, and that was his reservation about doing the same.

I'll put a call into Adobe to let them know that others are having similar problems.

[Kenny...@adobeforums.com]

I just heard back from Adobe Tech Support and they 'discovered' that it is indeed a bug with InDesign CS. So I guess we'll have to wait for an update.

One workaround they suggested is to put the problem face in a style and then apply that to the text. Not an optimum solution, but it may work.

I'm also curious to know more about how safe and effective editing the Postscript Name in a font editor is.

[Carole...@adobeforums.com]

I just tried that style workaround on my Gill Sans problem (won't recognize Regular and switches it to Book) and it doesn't work there either.

[Ann_She...@adobeforums.com]

Could this be a Suitcase problem rather than an InDesign CS problem? I use FontAgent Pro and don't have this problem.

Or is it just a font conflict?

As far as Gill Sans is concerned: I did find that the presence of the .dfont version in Library/Fonts caused a conflict with the Adobe version.

I don't have Agfa's font so don't know how that might be affected, or if the Agfa and Adobe versions conflict.

[Carole...@adobeforums.com]

I don't think it's Suitcase problem, unless it's Suitcase and InDesign problem, because the fonts work fine in Photoshop and Illustrator. As to the dfonts, I trashed them ages ago. I also tried taking the fonts out of Suitcase and putting them in the InDesign font folder and had the same problem. As to conflict, if there is one, it's brand new because the fonts have worked fine for me in all previous versions of InDesign.

I might see if I can download a demo of FontAgent Pro to see if the problem goes away.

[Marco_Antoni...@adobeforums.com]

An important tip for those considering FAP as a font management; It does not suport double bite fonts. So no control over Asian fonts. Which make this software a not professional enough for me. I am glad for those users that can use it, but keep in mind that you will have to invest in another font manager if you will start using Asian fonts.

[Richard_...@adobeforums.com]

I have recently installed Panther and I am getting crashes like crazy. Font Doctor shows no font misfires. I've been advised to try FAP. It's amazing the grief fonts have caused sinced the introduction of X. Drives me nuts.

[Marco_Antoni...@adobeforums.com]

For some suers, I would storngly add.

[Kenny...@adobeforums.com]

Well the Adobe tech support guy I spoke to researched the whole thing for a week or so and called me back to say they discovered it IS an InDesign CS bug. It sounded like they had a couple people looking into it so I think they researched it pretty well.

In our case, we've temporarily moved the Book version of Bodoni out of the suitcase so it is not activated. Now we can use the Roman version OK. That's the one we really needed. Might be able to use Font Doctor or something to split the Book & Roman into 2 different families. Not sure if that would do it or not.

Hopefully, now that they internally are aware and admit to it being a bug, we'll get an update in the somewhat near future. Won't hold my breath, though.

[tait_ent...@adobeforums.com]

Some might find this interesting, as I read through most of the posts and this discussion dealt most with "interesting" font issues not appearing in ID 2.x / CS menus.

I discovered an IN DESIGN specific font conflict with OS X system fonts (dfonts) ... specifically futura.

(note that the fonts loaded properly and as expected in PSD 7 / AI 10 as well as other OS X and classic apps)

After lots of troubleshooting and research, the answer that worked for me was a combo of Suitcase 10 and pruning of various system-generated FONT FOLDER caches.

Go here <http://www.creativepro.com/story/feature/20000.html> for the solution.

I'm getting ready to upgrade to CS, so I'd be curious to know if this solution applies in CS land as well.

[Bu...@adobeforums.com]

I discovered an IN DESIGN specific font conflict with OS X system fonts
(dfonts)

tait enterprises, not to burst your bubble but this is old news.