School Shooting

[Eric Loumeau]

I don't understand how this could've happened.  Didn't that school have a rule against bringing guns on the campus?!

[adam loumeau]

It's interesting that you sent this email out because Christopher, Andre, Mark, and I have been passionately discussing school shootings and what should be done about them.  Those of you have participated in the text discussion can feel free to correct me or add your two cents as I attempt to convey to the group our general consensus on the matter.

1. There are smart gun control laws that ought to be passed and conservatives who balk at any and all legislation that can be construed as some form of gun control are being ridiculous at best and callous at worst.  Perhaps raising the age limit for purchasing guns to at least 21 or having limits on the types of weapons that can be bought legally would help.  We need to do a better job enforcing our background check laws as well.  (As a side note, it's really stupid when the mainstream media repeatedly pounds the idea that we need new gun control laws.  That's like saying you are in favor of sex laws.  Wait a minute, what exactly is a sex law?  Is it outlawing sodomy?  Is it outlawing prostitution?  Is it outlawing interracial marriage?  Is it outlawing sex with pre-teens?  What the hell is a "sex law"?  The same goes for "gun control")

2. That being said, while smart gun control laws should be passed, they will likely make minimal impact on school shootings.  While this wasn't discussed in our text exchange, gun control laws would probably do more to reduce incidences of severe domestic violence.  The only gun control laws that would really assure us of significantly reducing school shootings would be to make the sale of guns illegal moving forward and then somehow try to ensure that the 300 million guns in circulation currently are given over to the government, probably with the combination of a buy back program and severe punishments for being caught with a gun.  For many reasons that weren't articulated, such a scenario will never ever ever happen in America.

3. The most promising proposal for reducing school shootings was probably the idea that the media should treat school shooters in the same way they treat minors who have been victims of a sex crime.  Why are we naming these shooters and giving them the fame they seek?!  Remember, all school shooters fantasize about the act before committing the act and arguably the greatest appeal of being a school shooter is the fame the media heaps on them afterwards.

4. A public campaign bringing awareness to the potential problems caused by teenagers playing violent video games (which extends beyond school shootings) would probably help as well.  A vigorous public campaign against the ill effects of cigarette smoking has been a huge success and hopefully the same could be accomplished on this front.

5. There was mixed opinions on having an armed guard or two at each school.

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 12:19 PM, Eric Loumeau <ejlo...@gmail.com> wrote:

I don't understand how this could've happened.  Didn't that school have a rule against bringing guns on the campus?!

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[Christopher Loumeau]

1) I'm not scared of guns. I own a gun. Christina and I have talked about owning other guns. I've had fun shooting guns 

2) I strongly support the right of people to get concealed weapons permits, and the thought of more people with concealed weapons doesn't scare me. I also side with the people who think that "gun-free" zones are pointless and counter-productive.

3) It's mind-bogglingly stupid that we don't require a skills course for anyone who wants to carry a gun. We require them for people who want to drive, hunt, cut hair, or clean teeth. We don't require them for someone who wants to carry a pistol and potentially engage in a shootout with a mass-shooter in a crowded restaurant. That's insane.

4) There's a huge difference between the right to reasonable gun ownership and someone's desire to own an AR-15. There's no reasonable or constitutional right to own such a weapon. Your desire to own a cool-looking, fun-to-shoot AR-15 shouldn't trump schoolchildren's desire to attend school without worrying about dying. Essentially what I'm saying is that, an AR-15 owner could make a list of arguments FOR owning an AR-15, and that list could be well-reasoned and extensive, and my list AGAINST would only be a single item: that AR-15s are used in a high number of mass shootings and that banning them would save the lives of schoolchildren who might survive if their mass shooter uses a less efficient and effective weapon.

And I think that my single item would be more important and would trump everything the gun owner could possibly fit on his list.

5) Mass shootings are 100% the fault of the shooter. The shooter alone bears the responsibility for his (and it's ALWAYS a HIM) decision to kill people.

6) The availability of guns to people who carry out mass shootings is 100% the fault of feckless politicians who are too scared of a vocal minority of their base to enact reasonable gun control laws. It's also 100% the fault of the voters for not demanding action from their politicians.

7) Rabid gun-control opponents (not to be confused with gun owners, because a vast majority of gun owners support reasonable restrictions on gun ownership), urged along by scare propaganda from the NRA and other organizations, are single-issue voters, while gun-control supporters (again, encompassing the vast majority of gun owners) are not. This guarantees that the small, but vocal minority will always get their way on guns.

8) There is very little we can do to stop mass shootings in the short term. There are too many guns out there for anything to have an immediate effect.

9) Because of this, it's reasonable for people to worry about their safety and want to carry concealed weapons. It's contradictory to claim that we need gun-control laws because there are so many bad guys with guns, but then deride people for wanting to protect themselves from bad guys with guns.

10) This doesn't mean we shouldn't think long-term and at least make an effort. Taking steps now will result in fewer mass shootings in the future, even if that future is years away.

11) Supporters of reasonable gun-control laws need to become as vocal and as single-minded as their counterparts on the other side of the argument. We need to demand action from our politicians and refuse to support anyone who won't back common-sense regulation.

12) We'll have this discussion again in a couple of months.

On Fri, Feb 16, 2018 at 12:19 PM, Eric Loumeau <ejlo...@gmail.com> wrote:

I don't understand how this could've happened.  Didn't that school have a rule against bringing guns on the campus?!

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[adam loumeau]

" It's mind-bogglingly stupid that we don't require a skills course for anyone who wants to carry a gun. We require them for people who want to drive, hunt, cut hair, or clean teeth. We don't require them for someone who wants to carry a pistol and potentially engage in a shootout with a mass-shooter in a crowded restaurant. That's insane. "

Fantastic point!

" Rabid gun-control opponents (not to be confused with gun owners, because a vast majority of gun owners support reasonable restrictions on gun ownership), urged along by scare propaganda from the NRA and other organizations, are single-issue voters, while gun-control supporters (again, encompassing the vast majority of gun owners) are not. This guarantees that the small, but vocal minority will always get their way on guns. "

Another fantastic point!

[Eric Loumeau]

Excellent post, Christopher.  I agree 100% with all of your points.

I know in California you have to pass a test in order to purchase a gun.  I thought this was a national requirement, but I could be wrong.  Not sure if this is the type of test you were referring to, or if you meant a person needs to shoot skillfully and accurately in order to purchase a gun.

[Eric Loumeau]

By the way, I also had a discussion with some friends this morning about how to curtail school shootings.  In addition to the security guards idea, another idea that was brought up was metal detectors (although it was mentioned that there are many ways to get onto school grounds other than through the entrance, and this could easily be circumvented).

What about allowing teacher and administration leaders the right to have guns on campus, in locked safes?

[Christopher Loumeau]

Yeah Eric I was referring to a more hands-on course and training. You don't ever even touch a gun when you go through a concealed weapons permit course!

[Monique]

I love all of your comments! Agree with all! Christopher, you spent so much time articulating that all so well-have you posted it on Facebook? I would love to ditto it there :)

Best,

Monique Derr

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[adam loumeau]

I think asking the media to have a shred of moral responsibility every once in a blue moon is probably reasonable.  Taking away the fame that school shooters receive with the help of a complicit national media would be the single best way to reduce school shootings.

I personally am in favor of having at least one armed guard on campus and maybe two depending on the size of the school.  I also am in favor of allowing certain teachers or administrators to have a gun locked in a safe.  From a practical standpoint, school shooters could still do a lot of damage even if these changes are enacted.  But it can't be said enough times: potential school shooters fantasize about the act before committing the act.  I have to assume that part of that fantasy is being able to shoot "fish in a barrel" because no one is armed at the school.

[Eric Loumeau]

When I purchased a gun, I had to demonstrate how to handle the gun, load it, take it apart, clean it, turn the safety on/off, etc.  There was also a written test, which is what you're referring to.

[Christopher Loumeau]

Yeah I think that's a start Eric. But I think that's like 10% of the hands on training that should be required to own a gun

[Eric Loumeau]

I don't disagree.