Water tanks removal Helppppppp

[JMarc ARCANGELI]

HI guy if by any chance any of you had to remove both water tanks and could share some tips that would be tremendous. I am a bit stuck and I would not mind some helpppppp. If you do have any pic .

I have just started to look around and I am not too sure where to start from.

Thank you so much for your time.

Cheer from down under. JMarc 

[Donal Botkin]

The best place to start is to imagine where you want to finish. There is money, time and expertise: first decide what you have and what you can hire. Then consider the big question: how much water do you need? The trade-off here is between carrying water and making water as needed. The latter alternative was not an option when your boat was built, but if your plan is the go cruise the little islands of the South Pacific, a high capacity water-maker will be well worth the money. 

Now the easy part. The tanks are junk, don’t even think about repairing them or removing in one piece. Cut them up (or have a pro do it for you) and get them out of the boat. If you want something for your water supply while you consider your options, get a bladder tank and plumb it in to the deck fill and drinking water pump, you won't need the vent with a bladder. “Tie your bladder-tank down, sport . . ."

You might want to think about carpentry too. With the tanks out, repairs to water damage are easier. Also, there is the possibility of . . . (I’m sure something will come to mind)

Cheers,

Donal

View[+]Finder

Donal B. Botkin

556 Shagbark St

Windsor, CA  95492

415 497-5411

On Sep 2, 2021, at 20:31, JMarc ARCANGELI <jmarc.a...@gmail.com> wrote:

HI guy if by any chance any of you had to remove both water tanks and could share some tips that would be tremendous. I am a bit stuck and I would not mind some helpppppp. If you do have any pic .

I have just started to look around and I am not too sure where to start from.

Thank you so much for your time.

Cheer from down under. JMarc 

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[Marty McOmber]

Hi JMarc,

I removed, refurbished and modified the starboard water tank in 2018.  The purpose was to create space for a watermaker under the settee.  I see you've got the first part of the job done.  I'm including an album of photos of that project.  

https://photos.app.goo.gl/mScyFAu4qAuaT7MaA

The next step you need to do is remove the back of the settee.  You'll see in the pics how I did it -- and it was fairly easy.  If you sand the backing, you'll soon see it is mostly attached with screws. Sanding will show you where those screws are. Find and remove all of them.  Carefully remove the back from the settee. They spot glued here and there, and it is really a tight fit. But you should be able to take the entire back piece off.  Once that is done, you may have to modify one of the knees that sections off various holds behind the settee.  That done, you just need a helper to get the tank out. The starboard tank at about 12" tall fit through the companionway no problem. I'm not sure the port tank, which I believe is 16", will do the same.  

In my case, I brought the starboard tank to a local metal shop who does a lot of work on boats. Old school guys who love a unique project.  They checked out the tank and deemed it in very good shape for its age. They repassified the entire thing, and spot-welded a few small areas on the seams out of an abundance of caution. Per my instructions (to make room for the water maker), they shorten the tank.  They also did a new inspection port so I could clean out the other side of the baffle. However, it would have been cheaper to buy one of the stainless tank access plates that are now available and install that myself.  

I cleaned up and repainted the area under the tank. I added some rubber stips to make sure the tank was not touching the hull and had space for any water to evaporate. You'll see that in one of the pics. 

I took the various wood pieces of the settee home to refinish -- epoxied, faired and repainted them. 

It was fairly easy to rebuild the settee once the tank was back in. I could have screwed it back into place again and hidden the screw heads per the original construction. But I wanted it to remain easy to disassemble again if I needed to replace the tank someday or needed to run or access some of the hose or wires that go through that compartment.  So I just reattached the back using finishing washers. I think it looks sharp.  

 Hope that helps.  

I'd love to know from anyone if the port tank fits out the companionway.  I may have to go Donal's route and chop it up and have a new one fabricated that will fit back through the companion way.  On the other hand, my starboard tank was in such good shape after 35 years, I'm hoping the port tank is in similar condition. 

Cheers,

Marty McOmber

Rounder, Passport 40, 1984, Hull 75

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[JEAN-MARC ARCANGELI]

Thank you Donal very much for taking the time. I should have given a bit more info.

Yep, all your info/concern/ tips have been adressed and we know what we want, the only problem really for me at the moment is how to get them out. Do you have to pull apart the cabinetery. There is so many screws behind hidden and hard to access.

Cut them in pieces on the spot would be an other alternative but before going that way I was wondering if is was possible to get them out nicely without too much destruction.

Anyway thank you for your help.

Cheers mate 

JMarc

Sent from my iPad

On 4 Sep 2021, at 00:28, Donal Botkin <wcx...@gmail.com> wrote:

The best place to start is to imagine where you want to finish. There is money, time and expertise: first decide what you have and what you can hire. Then consider the big question: how much water do you need? The trade-off here is between carrying water and making water as needed. The latter alternative was not an option when your boat was built, but if your plan is the go cruise the little islands of the South Pacific, a high capacity water-maker will be well worth the money. 

[Donal Botkin]

When I removed one of my water tanks (smaller one, starboard) I used a Japan saw to remove the woodwork and reassembled after removing the tank so the woodwork is as good as new. getting the smaller tank out was a PITA, but faster than cutting. The larger port tank was still ok, so I left it alone. 

The boat cabinetry was built around the tank and that means there is no easy way to remove it. You can find the screws with a magnet (they are sorta 304, not 316, you know China) and clean out the Phillips screwdriver hole with a Dremel tool and a dental pick or other sharp tool. It is not worth the trouble and the destruction is to the tank, not the cabinetry.

The stainless used in the tanks  reacts with the stainless (NOT) in the welding rods used in 1985 (my boat) and you would not want to have the same problem in a few years.

Shape: the tank is curved to fit the hull. Useless if you have a decent water maker. Rectangular tanks closer to the centerline, well braced, and you gain some storage space. 

I’ve owned View[+]Finder since 1997 and between 1999 and 2005, cruised from San Francisco to NZ and back via HI, Micronesia, Marshals, Kiribati, Tuvalu, and Fiji. Return trip via Tonga, Niue, Cook I, Penrhyn and HI. I did all the electrical, electronic and plumbing work, but left the rigging and painting to experts. Safe fresh water was hard to come by in most locations, NZ Fiji and HI being the exceptions, so I collected rain water where possible. I would not go cheap on the water maker; Spectra is the choice for cruising Mexico, so I’m told, in the event I’d that way.

What are your plans?

Cheers

Donal

[JMarc ARCANGELI]

Hey Marty

First of all, thank you for taking the time and so sorry for my late answer. I just got my head out of the tank situation plus your message did not showed up into my inbox  dont know why ?????

Bugger, I did not see your comment earlier. I went Tim’s way and the all process was good too. I think yours is maybe a bit more straightforward and less destructive but I am still very happy.

The tank is out and now is decision making.

I went to see the local with the old tank.

He said he could give me a few more years out of the tank in repairing it in welding a long piece along the seams where the leaks come from, clean it, pressure test etc…. but I am not sure. The baffles seems a bit dodgy. The problem is after cleaning the tank you can see plenty of pin holes mainly where the weld is between the sections. So, I am not sure I will go this way.

Price wise stainless or  polyethylene  seems similar. I am still waiting for some quotes. It is around the $ 2200 AUD for a 8mm. I am going around today to see what it’s look like.

I will then when this one is finish start thinking of the port side grrrr................. a bit more difficult. I have read on that forum that it will have to be cut out as it does not pass via the companion way.

“The starboard (58 gallon) tank came out of the boat fairly easily once I found all the screw heads to disassemble the frame work for the settee. The factory hid the screw heads with putty so it was a real "Easter Egg Hunt" finding all the screws.  I had to cut the port (90 gallon) tank in half to get it out.  It was too long to wrestle it out of the boat in one piece.The new tank was made shorter.  Instead of the original 90 gallons the new one is 60 gallons. We used the space saved to mount the water maker we installed.”                        Jeff and Jane WoodwardAdagio, P-40 #109, 1986 

I am going to try to make a mock tank if I can out of cardboard to check if I can get it out. If not, it means that the new one will have to be in two sections. I will have to put some though on that. If you have any idea pleaseeeeee.

This is where I am at the moment thanks to you guys a big thank you again. I will let you know for the port side as it will be my next job if that can be of any help.

Have a lovely day

Cheers JMarc

Ps thank for the pic there are perfect

[Geoff Seager]

Hello,

My name is Geoff and have been reading the posts here for a few months. I joined this group because I am looking to purchase a Passport 40.

I am wondering why no one has mentioned replacing the tanks with bladders as they would be easy to install and come in different capacities.

Regards

Geoff Seager

Amesbury, Ma

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/PassportOwners/91281001-06f7-4ea4-aeeb-2bad019ffcd4n%40googlegroups.com

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[JMarc ARCANGELI]

Hey Geoff sorry fo the delay in responding but at the moment is head in the tanksssss and porthole. I have not been in that road and I have no knowledge but I just prefer something who looks like more sturdy and reliable. Bladders don't give me that feeling. I am waiting for my plastic starboard and I have started to sniff around the port tank.Sorry cannot help much on that.

All the best 

JMarc

[Gerard Knight]

Hi Jmarc,

 

I got my port tank out in one piece and out thru the companionway. I removed all of the teak trim around the companionway. It was still a serious wrestle to get it out (due to the length of tank) and I still managed to scratch up the varnish work alongside the stairs. I put protection over every surface i could.

Removing the companionway teak trim was a mission due a some hidden screws/fixings & adhesives but you’ve got your interior furniture apart, so you’re up to it. I went slowly and gently and used a hammer to slide a flat steel paint scraper between wood and fibreglass, to break sealant and this process identified when there was a screw i had missed. From memory there was one really difficult piece - perhaps the trim at top front of the opening - that stops hatch from coming out (not sure now).

Unfortunately my tank was not repairable so i should have just cut it up first. i made a slightly shorter new tank, which of course was a lot easier to get back in thru the companionway.

 

I was advised to purge weld the new tank, to prevent rusting at the welds. Welder said that it would significantly extend life of tank. From memory this involves filling the tank with argon(?), which in the Caribbean was a significant additional cost. Sorry to be a bit vague here but it was several years ago now. But any good stainless welder should be familiar with this process.

Regards

Gerard

SV Saltwhistle

https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/PassportOwners/52f8f863-4a62-4f4a-b805-0ada7e2739b0n%40googlegroups.com

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[JMarc ARCANGELI]

Hey Gerard 

Thank you for your help. Because of you or thanks to you ( I let you know when I finish !!) I have started the port side. The cabinetery port side is out but I will wait for the starboard tank to be built before I remove the port tank. Both tanks are leaking so I will cut it and I will not go the companionway. As I don't have really a good stainless welder around here I am going for the tanks in 10 mm plastic made to measure.

I think the 0.85 width of the tank should pass the companionway if I cut the length to .......................1.50 m to make it easy to wriggle it. The starboad side was 1.45 and was easy.

As your said finding Wally 's screws was a mission and I cursed a few time but I did it. Thank to you and all the others.

Thank you all  kindly for the advices, the pictures and point of views, very much appreciated.. As I am waiting for the tanks now I have also changed all the windows and resealed the lot.

Keep safe

" From that fellow downunder"