Happy LPG user

[Greg Buenas]

Hello guys,

One happy LPG user here. Happy because every time i fill up, now at
Php 30.50 per liter, it really puts a smile on my face knowing it's
good for the environment.
Had mine installed on an 01 Vitara (box type) at StarGas. Quite
pricey but i did not want to take the risk on DIY or Korean systems
because of the general complaints from taxi drivers. Four skeptical
friends have also taken the plunge because of my install.
Use it everyday now and have brought it to Baguio twice without any
hitches whatsoever.
Cheers!

rico

P.S.
Hi rem

[Eric Punzalan]

Glad to hear that :)

Didi you have the SGI type?

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Environmental and Organic Chemistry
DLSU-Manila

PADI Divemaster/ Emergency First Response Instructor #491061

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[Greg Buenas]

Hi Eric,
Yes sir SGI type.

Here are some questions i would like to ask here in this group:

1) Why do you think the petroleum companies are pushing for Ethanol? E10, E85...

2) Don't you think LPG prices will go up once more people get to use it?

Cheers!

[Cidni Mapa]

I'm still waiting to take the plunge. One reason is the availability
here in Negros. Any comment on performance on rough roads? I'm afraid
parts will come lose, need repairs, and even pose danger.
TIA, Cidni

[Eric Punzalan]

Hmm....the expensive type hehehe...more efficient though......

Debate on biofuels, which include ethanol,  are still "hot" .

Some resons for the shift include:

a) renewability (oil supply is finite)  
b) Greenhouse gas reduction , cleaner emissions (although newer engine technology can produce cleaner engines)
c) benefit to agriculture/farmers in terms of more demand for ethanol production feedstock.
d) reduced foreign fuel dependence for countries that import oil but can produce ethanol.

The food to fuel issue, however, needs to be resolved but there's promise coming from
the cellulose (non-food) to ethanol technology.

There's also fear that more forests may be lost to biofuel feedstock production.

Global trends show governments creating favorable policies for ethanol use (tax breaks, subsidies, etc.)

LPG? It's non-renewable, like oil....if the supply goes down, prices will go up too :)
I think because it's socially-sensitive, the price may remain "affordable" (?)

[Eric Punzalan]

Hmm....come loose?  ah rough roads.... hehehe....

The good thing about LPG is the odorant.....madali maamoy kung me singaw...
I drive a feroza and it's like driving on rough roads all the time hahahahaha

Seriously, I take my feroza on rough roads and , fortunately, no screw had to be tightened since June 2006 (date of installation). 

Availability:  The gasoline system remains intact anyway...pag ubos na ang LPG, switch sa gasoline.... until you find a LPG station....... or ask Ed (Garcia)  ...he has an idea on how to refill from a stove-type tank :) 

On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 6:59 PM, Cidni Mapa <cid...@gmail.com> wrote:

I'm still waiting to take the plunge. One reason is the availability
here in Negros. Any comment on performance on rough roads? I'm afraid
parts will come lose, need repairs, and even pose danger.
TIA, Cidni

>

[Greg Buenas]

Hi Cidni,

1) There are supposedly over 100 stations that sell LPG in and around
Metro-Manila. This is definitely was my decision whether to convert
or not. I started with Petron then moved to SEA OIL without any
perceived difference. Now i use CLEAN FUEL because it is the cheapest
I could find at Php 30.50 / liter.

2) It also largely depends on who will do the installation. A
properly installed unit should be as simple as a gasoline fed vehicle.
Once installed you will be driving a hybrid and every perception or
accepted practice that comes with it. We're just used to gasoline as a
fuel.

Hope this helps!

[Greg Buenas]

DR. ERIC,
MY RESPONSE IN CAPS... JUST THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS ONLY.

On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Eric Punzalan <punz...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmm....the expensive type hehehe...more efficient though......

I LOSE AN ESTIMATED 10-12% EFFICIENCY ON AN SGI SYSTEM BECAUSE OF THE
LOWER BTU BUT GAIN BIGTIME ON THE ANTI KNOCK PROPERTIES. WHAT ABOUT ON
CARBURATED SYSTEMS?

>
> Debate on biofuels, which include ethanol, are still "hot" .
>
> Some resons for the shift include:
>
> a) renewability (oil supply is finite)
> b) Greenhouse gas reduction , cleaner emissions (although newer engine
> technology can produce cleaner engines)

ISN'T LPG GREENER WITH WATER VAPOR AND CARBON DIOXIDE AS BI-PRODUCTS?

> c) benefit to agriculture/farmers in terms of more demand for ethanol
> production feedstock.
> d) reduced foreign fuel dependence for countries that import oil but can
> produce ethanol.

WE DON'T HAVE AS MUCH IDLE LAND AS BRAZIL OR OTHER SOUTH AMERICAN COUNTRIES.

>
> The food to fuel issue, however, needs to be resolved but there's promise
> coming from
> the cellulose (non-food) to ethanol technology.

DON'T WE NEED TO ENCOURAGE FARMERS TO PRODUCE/PLANT OUR STAPLE FOOD
RATHER THAN IMPORT RICE? KULANG SILA SA INCENTIVE TO PLANT.
FOOD TO FUEL SHOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE.

>
> There's also fear that more forests may be lost to biofuel feedstock
> production.
>
> Global trends show governments creating favorable policies for ethanol use
> (tax breaks, subsidies, etc.)
>
> LPG? It's non-renewable, like oil....if the supply goes down, prices will go
> up too :)

ISN'T IT A BI-PRODUCT WHEN PETROL IS PRODUCED? IT'S ALSO AVAILABLE IN
NATURAL GAS? WHAT HAPPENED TO MALAMPAYA ET AL?

> I think because it's socially-sensitive, the price may remain "affordable"
> (?)

HOUSEWIVES TAKING TO THE STREETS ARE LESS TOLERABLE THAN STUDENTS UP IN ARMS?

I'VE STOPPED CONVINCING THE DOUBTING THOMASES BECAUSE I BELIEVE IF
GOVERNMENT TAKES NOTICE THEY MAY INCREASE AUTOGAS PRICES.

AGAIN THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS. THANKS!

[Eric Punzalan]

On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 7:54 AM, Greg Buenas <gbu...@gmail.com> wrote:

DR. ERIC,
MY RESPONSE IN CAPS... JUST THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS ONLY.

On Sun, Aug 31, 2008 at 1:12 PM, Eric Punzalan <punz...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hmm....the expensive type hehehe...more efficient though......

I LOSE AN ESTIMATED 10-12% EFFICIENCY ON AN SGI SYSTEM BECAUSE OF THE
LOWER BTU BUT GAIN BIGTIME ON THE ANTI KNOCK PROPERTIES. WHAT ABOUT ON
CARBURATED SYSTEMS?

About the same in my case (Gasoline 9Km/L  , LPG 8Km/L), Carbed,
advance timing pushed only to V-power limit ...more is possible but that means I have to adjust when switching to gasoline.
My replies are in BOLd.

 

>
> Debate on biofuels, which include ethanol,  are still "hot" .
>
> Some resons for the shift include:
>
> a) renewability (oil supply is finite)
> b) Greenhouse gas reduction , cleaner emissions (although newer engine
> technology can produce cleaner engines)

ISN'T LPG GREENER WITH WATER VAPOR AND CARBON DIOXIDE AS BI-PRODUCTS?

All hydrocarbon fuels (alcohol, LPG, gasoline, diesel, kerosene) will produce only CO2 and H2O in a perfect world.   It's a matter of engine performance, setup, compatibility.

> c) benefit to agriculture/farmers in terms of more demand for ethanol
> production feedstock.
> d) reduced foreign fuel dependence for countries that import oil but can
> produce ethanol.

WE DON'T HAVE AS MUCH IDLE LAND AS BRAZIL OR OTHER SOUTH AMERICAN COUNTRIES.

No we don't hehehe... we might have to cut down on sugar intake and make ethanol instead  hahaha
 

>
> The food to fuel issue, however, needs to be resolved but there's promise
> coming from
> the cellulose (non-food) to ethanol technology.

DON'T WE NEED TO ENCOURAGE FARMERS TO PRODUCE/PLANT OUR STAPLE FOOD
RATHER THAN IMPORT RICE? KULANG SILA SA INCENTIVE TO PLANT.
FOOD TO FUEL SHOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE.

Let's tell that to the politicians.
But we have waste biomass (non food) which can be fermented to alcohol...

 

>
> There's also fear that more forests may be lost to biofuel feedstock
> production.
>
> Global trends show governments creating favorable policies for ethanol use
> (tax breaks, subsidies, etc.)
>
> LPG? It's non-renewable, like oil....if the supply goes down, prices will go
> up too :)

 

ISN'T IT A BI-PRODUCT WHEN PETROL IS PRODUCED?

Yes, No petrol, No LPG.
 

IT'S ALSO AVAILABLE IN
NATURAL GAS? WHAT HAPPENED TO MALAMPAYA ET AL?

Natural Gas is methane , sold as LNG). 
LPG is butane/propane. They're not the same.

 

> I think because it's socially-sensitive, the price may remain "affordable"
> (?)

HOUSEWIVES TAKING TO THE STREETS ARE LESS TOLERABLE THAN STUDENTS UP IN ARMS?  I'VE STOPPED CONVINCING THE DOUBTING THOMASES BECAUSE I BELIEVE IF GOVERNMENT TAKES NOTICE THEY MAY INCREASE AUTOGAS PRICES.  AGAIN THOUGHTS AND OPINIONS. THANKS!

Then we build electric cars....recharge from solar cells or waste energy from gyms.....the treadmill is a nice source of energy for battery charging.  Imagine if we install alternators in every treadmill?  hehehehe ....... you might have enough power to go home after a vigorous workout!!!
 

>
>
>

>
> On Sat, Aug 30, 2008 at 6:44 PM, Greg Buenas <gbu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Eric,
>> Yes sir SGI type.
>>
>> Here are some questions i would like to ask here in this group:
>>
>> 1) Why do you think the petroleum companies are pushing for Ethanol? E10,
>> E85...
>>
>> 2) Don't you think LPG prices will go up once more people get to use it?
>>
>> Cheers!

[Greg Buenas]

Hittin the bottle may make good sense after all! I like your sense of humor doc.
Cheers! Let's all have a drink but not of the denatured type. hehehe

[Eric Punzalan]

hahaha.....btw, natural gas is sold as CNG (compressed natural gas)  and not LNG ...my mistake :)

Drink?  why not ......hey my thesis students just completed their rice wine project....I kept one bottle of the best batch.....men, you get drunk just by staring at it...the alcohol travels to your system  even before you take a sip hehehehe

OT ?  no, we used LPG to heat the pasteurization bath!

:)))

On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 6:00 PM, Greg Buenas <gbu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hittin the bottle may make good sense after all! I like your sense of humor doc.
Cheers! Let's all have a drink but not of the denatured type. hehehe

[Cidni Mapa]

Happy Gasoline User?

My '90 16-valve Corolla gives me 13-14km/liter. I zero the odometer after every full tank, and compute kilometers travelled divided by liters loaded. It must be my driving style or the long distance from Tanjay City to Bacolod (180kms). I've wanted to sell it and buy a smaller engined car, but the car salesman says the new ones have similar efficiency ratio. So, why spend more for same rating? Efficient, but still a big carbon footprint. I've also purchased an electric bike, for my ride to work (city hall as councilor). But then again argue that I'd have to ride it 200 times (or all year) to make up the cost of fuel I saved using it (P20k, the cost of the bike).

Thus I'm still debating whether I'd shell/invest the P25k for an LPG system just for fuel savings, but also for Mother Earth, and setting an example...

Hmmm.

[Eric Punzalan]

Pag konsehal ka, importante yung "mother nature"...iboboto pa kita...pati asawa ko at mga katulong namin dyan ko papabotohin  hahaha....

I replaced my 2e  engine on a big body corolla (1996) with a turbo charged one (toyota 4efte, 135 hp stock)...efficiency has improved significantly ...power and fuel savings.... c/o  Ed Garcia. 

Initial test gave 12km/L in the city (used to be 10) .....no figure for long driving as I keep forgetting to reset the odometer. 

The downside is sometimes I can't help myself from overspeeding/racing  as if I was a teenager.  Power (as in horsepower) Corrupts, as they say!  

It's a candidate for LPG as soon as I set aside the 50k for a SGI + 10k for a toroidal tank.

Cidni, that car of yours has a body that is perfect for a 4efte transplant.....ask the drag racers here .... expect fuel savings and power at the same time....the turbo charger does it.


:)

[Eric Punzalan]

Teka me kaibigan ako dyan na mahilig sa RC planes ah ...Si Vince Abello.....but his planes fly on methanol and castor oil...not LPG hehehe (hmm....what if ?)

[Greg Buenas]

Hon. Sir Cidni,

Maayong aga sa imong tanan!
When you make that big switch...I believe you will lose somewhere between 10-12% efficiency using LPG.  Doc Eric please jump in anytime.  But because you spend less per liter you will still save money and help the environment.  Effectively your mileage, based purely on cost, will now be 18-20kms/liter from 13-14.
And if you save 1000 pesos for every fill. (I save almost 1000) Your ROI should be in 25 fills or 25 weeks or in 6.25 months. Not bad naka hybrid vehicle ka pa.  Mmmm... ;) :wink-wink:
Remember, i have decided not to advocate this anymore because of fear government will take notice and impose addition ek-ek to increase LPG prices.

Cheers!

[Ed Garcia]

In my case, it was very easy to justify switching to LPG.  Initial computations then at just P23/liter LPG vs P40/liter premium gasoline told me that I can get my ROI in just 12 months.

My KIA Pride performs 17km/liter on gasoline on the highway and nearly 15km/liter on LPG on the highway.  not bad!!!  to-date I can still go roundtrip manila-batangas with just about P700.00   And my last Baguio trip cost me only P750 in LPG (one-way). 

--
website administrator:
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PADI Divemaster #491048

[Greg Buenas]

Turbo? O-oh!  Am i on the right forum? ;)  My Jazz is, well, turbo charged. :guilty: :blush:

[Joel Tanangonan]

as the nike tag line goes...  just do it...  for mother earth.

 

the future is now.

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[Eric Punzalan]

GUilty? don't be!!!
It's a misconception........Turbo charging is meant to make the engine more efficient ...by harnessing otherwise wasted energy from the exhaust gas.

Yes, I know the commercial....they're wrong!   My non-turbo 2e engine is LESS efficient than the 4efte (turbo).

:)

[Ed Garcia]

Nothing bad about a turbo.  IMHO, it is actually a "pro-conservation" innovation in that it maximizes engine power output at better efficiency.  Big trucks and even ocean vessels come with a turbo in order to maximize power and conserve fuel.  If it were not for the turbocharger, the diesel engine would not shine in comparison to gasoline engines in terms of power and efficiency.

Yun nga lang ... for some people, when more power is available, they squeeze the power out for thrills ... eh di hindi ka na nakatipid kung ganoon!  hehehe

[Greg Buenas]

i guess i am in the right forum then.  So do i gather we're multi-tasking, pro conservation, hybrid technology, green peace loving, penny pinching and once in awhile speed freak advocates?  hehe

Cheers then!

[Ed Garcia]

hehehe bottom line ... to have the thrill and the fun while we exercise our technical skills without impacting our environment and saving our pesos. 

A turbo charged LPG powered car .... must be exciting!

[Eric Punzalan]

A turbo charged LPG powered car .... must be exciting!

Coming soon Ed hehehe




 

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 11:17 AM, Greg Buenas <gbu...@gmail.com> wrote:

i guess i am in the right forum then.  So do i gather we're multi-tasking, pro conservation, hybrid technology, green peace loving, penny pinching and once in awhile speed freak advocates?  hehe

Cheers then!

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 11:08 AM, Ed Garcia <eppg...@gmail.com> wrote:

Nothing bad about a turbo.  IMHO, it is actually a "pro-conservation" innovation in that it maximizes engine power output at better efficiency.  Big trucks and even ocean vessels come with a turbo in order to maximize power and conserve fuel.  If it were not for the turbocharger, the diesel engine would not shine in comparison to gasoline engines in terms of power and efficiency.

Yun nga lang ... for some people, when more power is available, they squeeze the power out for thrills ... eh di hindi ka na nakatipid kung ganoon!  hehehe

On Tue, Sep 2, 2008 at 10:56 AM, Greg Buenas <gbu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Turbo? O-oh!  Am i on the right forum? ;)  My Jazz is, well, turbo charged. :guilty: :blush:

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website administrator:
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PADI Divemaster #491048

[Dennis Ko]

turbo jazz with lpg. try to join honda club of the phils [www.hondaclub.com.ph] you will be the first jazz user with a turbo and an lpg hybrid.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Greg Buenas

To: LPG-Users--...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 11:17 AM

Subject: Re: Happy LPG user

[Dennis Ko]

before  valentines ill be switching to lpg. i have some questions before that.

 i use my feroza for trailing and offroading to destinations like maarat,  san mateo, bosoboso with some friends from the 4x4 philippines club. my question is

 

1. after converting to lpg is this possible? can i do this? switch to "Lpg" mode when travelling to the destination  a few kms before the actual offroad climb, then switch to  gas for more power when starting the ascent?

 

2. should i install a firewall for safety? [in the cabin area?]

[Eric Punzalan]

You might have to take off the rear seat to accomodate the 60-Liter LPG tank :)
Better cover it with something sturdy enough to protect the multivalve assembly which protrudes at ~ 30degree  angle from the tank....some make a "speaker cabinet" type of protection.

LPG power can manage trails ......set the tranny to 4L.

Regardless of fuel, always bring a fire extinguisher when trailing ...yung malaki ha?


:)

[Greg Buenas]

Thanks for the link Dennis. I'm the founder of the Jazz and City United. Feel free and visit our website: http://www.jazzcityunited.org/

[Greg Buenas]

I agree.  Some people just wait too long.  Trail blazing sometimes is the way to go!

[Greg Buenas]

Changing my tank to 70 or 75 liters so i'll load up less and drive more.   I can't make that speaker type box around it until the tank arrives.

Dennis,
Any significance on a before Valentine install?

[Dennis Dy Ko]

yes i will.

there is  GD united group in Hondaclub of the phil. try to visit. you will meet lotsa friends

thanks for inviting again. will visit.

sir sorry for the o.t.

 

----- Original Message -----

From: Greg Buenas

To: LPG-Users--...@googlegroups.com

Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 7:48 PM

Subject: Re: Happy LPG user

[Greg Buenas]

GD United aka Jazz and City United (JaCu)

[Eric Punzalan]

"Those who simply follow others' footsteps do not leave their own footprints."

[Greg Buenas]

For those who have made the shift to dual fuel autogas:

Did you change spark plug heat range?

Tnx!

[Ed Garcia]

for over 30,000 km on LPG now, I am still using the same original spark plug that was installed when I shifted to autogas ... same heat range, have not even replaced it at all.  the plugs has now served me for about 50,000+ km by now.

though, at about 25,000km ago,  I "modified" the plugs and side-gapped them (yes, still the same old plugs).  You can learn more about side-gapping plugs here: 

http://performanceunlimited.com/documents/plugsidegapping.html

btw, a nice value-added with autogas is, the engine oil is still relatively clean by 10,000kms!   So Instead of changing oils every 5,000kms, I change every 10,0000.  additional savings.


cheers!
ed

[Eric Punzalan]

 No :)   Since June 2006...Now that you reminded me, I'll check how they are later......no symptoms of bad plugs anyway.




 

On Thu, Sep 18, 2008 at 7:52 AM, Greg Buenas <gbu...@gmail.com> wrote:

For those who have made the shift to dual fuel autogas:

Did you change spark plug heat range?

Tnx!

[Greg Buenas]

Interesting read about side gapping the spark plugs.  Thanks!

My installer recommended i change my plugs to one step cooler. The only thing i noticed is that it takes a little longer to heat up the engine.