Unstepping carbon fiber mast

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Craig Stanley

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Oct 15, 2021, 2:48:56 PM10/15/21
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Good afternoon,

Our '95 354 is in the yard and the mast is being pulled for, what I believe is, the first time.

The yard manager just called to say the mast is stuck.  He's familiar with Nonsuchs and with carbon fiber masts, but not Nonsuchs with carbon fiber masts.  He thinks the problem is not at the deck with the Spartite, but at the step.

Can anyone tell me something about the mast step on the newer Nonsuchs?

Anyone had this problem?

Thanks.
Craig Stanley
S/V Matou, Nonsuch 354 #70
Tampa

Michael Jabara

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Oct 15, 2021, 2:56:48 PM10/15/21
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Dear Craig,

I have never unstepped my mast and don't know anything about how it is stepped. Sorry. 

Michael Jabara
Hobbes II - 1995 NS 354
San Rafael, California

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willi powell

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Oct 15, 2021, 3:19:04 PM10/15/21
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Hi Craig

I have a 324 and had similar issue last season. 

1. There is a turnbuckle tension device at the base of the mast. It should be somewhat obvious when you disconnect at the wires. Mine is about a foot long with a t-terminal that slips into the front of the mast about a foot from the base.

This will need to be loosened and removed before the mast can come out. 

2. The Spartite mast collar on mine was so tight they lifted the bow a foot out of the water. 

The collar needed to be hammered out using a thin metal bar. 2 minutes later the mast lifted out with ease. 

Hope that helps


~~~~~~~~~~~~_/)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Willi Powell
Toronto Canada
VXone - CAN255 - Airbender
Nonsuch 324 - 109 - Brigadoon X
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~_/)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


On Oct 15, 2021, at 2:56 PM, Michael Jabara <mja...@redrockpartners.com> wrote:



Bob Gehrman

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Oct 15, 2021, 9:26:29 PM10/15/21
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Hi Craig - I just unstepped mine for the first time, too. If you can, send some photos of the mast step etc so this forum can assist with what they know, it would help. Are they pulling it with the boat in the water? That apparently helps.

Bob Gehrman
NS30U #396 “Quickbeam”
Finally coming home to Baltimore tomorrow.

W C

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Oct 16, 2021, 1:58:57 PM10/16/21
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I have the same boat, a '95 NS 354 (#71).  Somewhere I think I have some pics of the mast step.  If I can find them, I will send them to you.  Otherwise I will be going to my boat on Tuesday, and I will try to get some pics then.

Barry Clark
Swan's Wing, NS 354, #71
Urbanna, VA

On Fri, Oct 15, 2021 at 2:56 PM Michael Jabara <mja...@redrockpartners.com> wrote:
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Craig Stanley

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Oct 19, 2021, 6:40:40 PM10/19/21
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Thanks to all for the input.  Mast is out.  Cooler morning temperatures helped.

Couple more questions for the carbon fiber mast folks.

How is your chocker turning block attached to the mast padeye?

Has anybody replaced their Tides Marine track?  Mine was fastened directly to the mast and fasteners failed in numerous places.  Looking for the best replacement.

Thanks again.
Craig

Michael Jabara

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Oct 19, 2021, 7:02:39 PM10/19/21
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Hi Craig,

  1. Not at the boat, so I couldn't answer the turning block/padeye question
  2. My boat was ordered from Hinterhoeller with all Harken rigging hardware, including the then new mid-90s Battcar system. I'm a big fan of Harken although it is bloody expensive. The rigging has suffered through plenty of my idiocy in the legendary San Francisco blows and held on...
  3. When I replaced my main last summer, I went with two full and two half battens, as follows:
    1. 2 Harken 1774 - 22mm non-CB Battcars (for the track) and two Sailpower 1 5/8" Aluminum Batten Holders (for the luff of the sail) for the top two full battens 
    2. 14  Harken 1777 - 22mm Sliders for the rest of the luff.
    3. 1 Harken 1792 - 22mm non-CB Double Head car and headboard for the head
  4. Today's Harken systems are all CB "captive ball" and more streamlined in cost and weight. 


Michael Jabara

Hobbes II - 1995 NS 354
San Rafael, California

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Joe Valinoti

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Oct 19, 2021, 7:28:05 PM10/19/21
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I’ve never heard of a “Tides” track directly fastened to the mast.  I guess you can, but I’m not sure.  I would go to the manufacturer for advice.
 
Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

~~~~~(\_ ~(\_ ~(\_~~~~~~~~~~

willi powell

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Oct 19, 2021, 8:08:45 PM10/19/21
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Hi Craig

I have been getting quotes for a new main. All all the sailmakers I have talked to are advising only one pressure batten at the top. The reason is the full-batten cars put a lot of stress on the track in gybes. This in turn can result in the track pulling off.

Good news though. Because you have a composite mast you can fill the holes and re-fasten. Maybe even composite glue the truck to the mast. This is how all the high performance skiffs do it. 

Mine is screwed in, not sure if it is glued as well


~~~~~~~~~~~~_/)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Willi Powell
Toronto Canada
VXone - CAN255 - Airbender
Nonsuch 324 - 109 - Brigadoon X
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~_/)~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

On Oct 19, 2021, at 6:40 PM, Craig Stanley <craig.s...@gmail.com> wrote:

Thanks to all for the input.  Mast is out.  Cooler morning temperatures helped.

Steve Romeyn

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Oct 20, 2021, 7:11:35 PM10/20/21
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A few weeks ago, we un-stepped the aluminum mast on my 2005 Wiggers Nonsuch 33. I did this in order to replace the Tides Marine track. It was 16 years old and disintegrated when I tacked in a 15 knot wind, leaving the sail attached in only three corners. Previous to that I had also noticed that some of the stainless steel clips that secure the track to the mast had loosened up leaving a gap between the mast and the track.  The clips are screwed into the mast about 3" apart at the lower and upper  ends. The clips are 5-6" apart for the balance of the track. Just to make sure, I replaced all the clips (they come with the new track) and screws (I supplied) and used the famous Tefgel. Once all the clips were in place, it took Ed Strazzini and me only 20 minutes to run the new track up the length of the mast (sitting on sawhorses.) I am very pleased with the new track. 

Steve Romeyn
S/V WINDSONG
2005 Wiggers NS 33 
Deltaville, VA

Bill Wildman

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Oct 21, 2021, 7:05:53 AM10/21/21
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I put spar tight at the deck and it was definitely stuck. My carbon fiber mast just sits on a slotted pedestal with a turnbuckle holding it down. Once turnbuckle is released it is loose. I worry about it being too loose and experienced some movement this season. Some repairs to the carbon fiber where the “slot” is, are now required 
Bill
Coddiwomple 
324.    114
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On Oct 15, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Bob Gehrman <b...@gehrman.net> wrote:



Mark Powers La Reina 26C Vancouver, B.C.

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Oct 22, 2021, 1:15:04 AM10/22/21
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In the Nonsuch Photo Galleries   https://pbase.com/nonsuch/service_repair_sail_track_36
You can find a discussion on repairing the Strong Track on carbon fibre mast for a 36.
Mark Powers

Mark Powers La Reina 26C Vancouver, B.C.

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Oct 22, 2021, 1:27:58 AM10/22/21
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A cautionary note. steel expands at 3 times the rate of carbon fibre. A continuous length of stainless steel track attached to a carbon fibre mast on a hot day will lengthen at 3 times the rate of the mast and may try to pull the rivets out of the carbon fibre. There will be limits to how long of a continuous stainless track that can be used.
Mark Powers

Richard Lane

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Oct 22, 2021, 1:43:28 AM10/22/21
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Mark, that’s interesting, perhaps it’s best to install the track at the half point of the expected temperature range, Slots, rather than holes in the SS track.
NS26c #35
Swoose

Richard Lane
Port Townsend

On Oct 21, 2021, at 10:28 PM, Mark Powers La Reina 26C Vancouver, B.C. <r...@shaw.ca> wrote:

A cautionary note. steel expands at 3 times the rate of carbon fibre. A continuous length of stainless steel track attached to a carbon fibre mast on a hot day will lengthen at 3 times the rate of the mast and may try to pull the rivets out of the carbon fibre. There will be limits to how long of a continuous stainless track that can be used.

Joe Valinoti

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Oct 22, 2021, 1:02:06 PM10/22/21
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That’s interesting, Mark and a good point.  I know that the Wiggers 33 doesn’t have a continuous SS track with a StrongTrack installed, but every 6 inches or so has a fitting that the Strong Track attaches to.  Maybe that’s why.
Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

~~~~~(\_ ~(\_ ~(\_~~~~~~~~~~

 
Sent: Friday, October 22, 2021 1:27 AM
Subject: Re: Unstepping carbon fiber mast
 
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