Re: Digest for INA-Nonsuch-Discussion-Group@googlegroups.com - 5 updates in 2 topics

[John Newell]

Blue Water Sailing.

As much as I love my Nonsuch, she is the last yacht I would choose for ocean sailing. They were designed for coastal and great lakes cruising. If one wants to do offshore work with unstayed masts, have a good look at the Freedom 40 ketch with a full keel that allows her to track well.

If it is imperative to sail a Nonsuch across an ocean, stow the wishbone to reduce weight, windage and loads aloft. Replace the sail with a loose footed leg of mutton sail with little or no roach and the foot 20% less than the standard wishbone sail. It should be sheeted to the rail and trimmed as a genoa. This will make her well balanced to deal with heavy weather and reduce the need for reefing. Construct a bridge at the forade end of the cockpit to reduce the volume of the large cockpit. It also adds to storage below while reducing the chance of being pooped. Secure the lockers in the cockpit so they won't open in a knock down. Carry a sweep that can be secured to the taffrail that will stand in for a failed rudder and a means to scull the yacht into a dock when the engine fails. Note that in recent years some pods of Orcas get their kicks from ramming free standing rudders and watching the results. The Nonsuch rudder is particularly vulnerable and could be the source of a serious leak at the rudder post if it is damaged.

The Nonsuch wishbone has a habit of dipping in the waves as she reaches, runs and rolls. The seas drag it back then release it with a thud when the mainsheet takes up the slack. This is one thing on a course race on a lake and quite another when crossing an ocean in the trades. If the boat holds up, will the crew?

J. Newell

Mascouche 26C 1 Toronto

On Mon, Jul 15, 2024 at 12:42 PM <INA-Nonsuch-Di...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

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• Changing Ancient Primary Filter For New Racor 230R10 - 3 Updates
• New name for my Nonsuch - 2 Updates

Changing Ancient Primary Filter For New Racor 230R10

Michael Hoff <mrh...@mac.com>: Jul 14 05:22AM -0700 Thanks to Brian, Eric and Ward for the helpful information. Looks like the old Primary is a 200FG with 7/16” x 20 ports. The new the 230R10 has 1/4”- 18 NPTF ports. The existing copper fuel lines are 3/8”. Looking more closely at the photo of the old set-up, the outlet line to the engine may be rubber which would alleviate the concern about bending copper tubing, at least on that side.     As suggested, I will measure the outside diameter of the flare on the fuel tubing and get 1/4” - MPT (male pipe thread) 90 degree elbows to connect the flare on the fuel tubing with the 1/4” - 18 NPTF ports on the 230R10. If necessary I’ll adapt short pieces of approved rubber fuel line to extend the copper tubing to reach port(s) without bending the copper line.     I hope that should do it and thanks again. If I’m misunderstanding something (wouldn’t be a surprise), please advise.     Mike Hoff   NS26 Evelyn May   Lake Tashmoo, Martha’s Vineyard         On Friday, July 12, 2024 at 1:12:37 PM UTC-4 Eric Larsen wrote:

Michael Hoff <mrh...@mac.com>: Jul 13 07:23PM -0700 The information provided by Brian, Eric and Ward has provided helpful clues. From the information that Ward attached it looks like I’ve got an old 200FG with 7/16” x 20 ports. Looking again at the photo of the existing setup it appears that one of the fuel lines is 3/8” copper and the other is rubber, so hopefully reaching both ports on the new 230R10 won’t be a problem. Both fuel lines are connected to an elbow with screwed into a “second fitting” with a female end that fits the elbow and 7/16” x 20 male end that fits the port.   The new the 230R10 has 1/4”-NPTF ports. It arrived with no fittings. So I think I have to replace both “second fittings” with a new “second fittings” with a female end that fits the elbows and a 1/4”- 18 NPTF male end that fits ports on the 230R10. Does that make sense”? Can anyone identify the new “second fittings” I’ll need? Is there a better way?   Best,     Mike Hoff   NS 26 Evelyn May   Lake Tashmoo, Martha’s Vineyard   On Friday, July 12, 2024 at 1:12:37 PM UTC-4 Eric Larsen wrote:

Joe Valinoti <joes...@gmail.com>: Jul 14 04:00PM -0400 I’m not sure if it’s a good idea to go from 1/4 to 3/8. I also suggest you replace every single rubber fuel line while you’re at it.   Joe Valinoti S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221 Sea Harbour YC Oriental, NC USA       ~~~~~(\_ ~(\_ ~(\_~~~~~~~~~~       From: 'Michael Hoff' via INA Nonsuch Discussion Group Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2024 8:22 AM To: INA Nonsuch Discussion Group Subject: Re: Changing Ancient Primary Filter For New Racor 230R10   Thanks to Brian, Eric and Ward for the helpful information. Looks like the old Primary is a 200FG with 7/16” x 20 ports. The new the 230R10 has 1/4”- 18 NPTF ports. The existing copper fuel lines are 3/8”. Looking more closely at the photo of the old set-up, the outlet line to the engine may be rubber which would alleviate the concern about bending copper tubing, at least on that side.         As suggested, I will measure the outside diameter of the flare on the fuel tubing and get 1/4” - MPT (male pipe thread) 90 degree elbows to connect the flare on the fuel tubing with the 1/4” - 18 NPTF ports on the 230R10. If necessary I’ll adapt short pieces of approved rubber fuel line to extend the copper tubing to reach port(s) without bending the copper line.         I hope that should do it and thanks again. If I’m misunderstanding something (wouldn’t be a surprise), please advise.         Mike Hoff   NS26 Evelyn May   Lake Tashmoo, Martha’s Vineyard             On Friday, July 12, 2024 at 1:12:37 PM UTC-4 Eric Larsen wrote:       It looks like that may be a Racor 200FG filter. I have one on my Yanmar. I've attached the manual that I found online. I should probably change out mine as well but it seems to be working fine and I have multiple spare filters for it so not very motivated to do so!     Hope that helps!   Eric Larsen   S/V Felix 1981 30C #115   Olympia, WA   On Thursday, July 11, 2024 at 6:04:41 PM UTC-7 Brian M. Godfrey wrote:   Copper tubing can work harden and become brittle when exposed to vibration. It can then break when you bend it or form micro-cracks which break later. I know this from personal experience as well as training. It can be annealed to soften it back up, but for the amount in your boat, it would be better to just replace it when you replace the filter. Frankly, if it were my boat I think I'd probably replace it with modern rubber fuel hose.     --Brian M. Godfrey br...@wildbirdshop.com On 7/11/2024 4:18 PM, Ward Woodruff wrote:   Michael,   The tubing you have terminates in flare nuts. I guess the size is 3/8” and the flare angle is 45 degrees. Measure the outside diameter of the fuel tubing. That will identify the size.   You can get flare by 1/4” MPT (male pipe thread) 90 degree elbows, very common. So the fittings you will need will be the proper size male flare X 1/4” MPT.   Should be easy.   Ward Woodruff 413-847-0620 cell     On Jul 11, 2024, at 5:09 PM, 'Michael Hoff' via INA Nonsuch Discussion Group <INA-Nonsuch-Di...@googlegroups.com> wrote:      I’m replacing my old Primary fuel / water separator of unknown origin with a Racor 230R10 (photos of both old and new below). The new Racor comes standard with 1/4”-18 NPTF (SAE J476) inlet and outlet fuel ports. 14M ports are also available. The inlet and outlet ports are offset 90 degrees. The existing fuel lines are solid, not neoprene. Racor offers a variety of fittings if needed. (https://www.racorstore.com/racor/racor-fittings.html?product_list_limit=36)         I don’t know the make or model of the old filter or the size of the ports. Both ports on the old filter are on the same side.           <IMG_0346.jpeg> <Screenshot 2024-07-11 at 4.18.15 PM.png>           Questions:   1. Can anyone identify the old filter and advise what size the ports are?   2. If the ports on the old filter are incompatible with the 1/4”-18 NPTF (SAE J476) or 14M ports on the new Racor, can anyone suggest new Racor fitting(s) that will work?   3. Will I need to adapt the existing solid fuel lines to work with the Racor's 90 degree offset between the inlet and outlet ports? Any suggestions on how to do it?         Thanks in advance for the shared experience and expertise of the group.         Michael Hoff   NS 26, Evelyn May   Lake Tashmoo, Martha's Vineyard   -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "INA Nonsuch Discussion Group" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to INA-Nonsuch-Discussi...@googlegroups.com. 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New name for my Nonsuch

Bruce Clark <bwc...@gmail.com>: Jul 14 09:03PM +0200 Before commenting, I will mention that I have sailed more than 40,000 nm offshore, mainly during a circumnavigation with my wife on our Bristol 45.5. I have also done three New York City- Bermuda returns including getting caught by the first tropical storm of the year.   There are two different questions here. One is how to prep any boat for passage making; the other is suitability of a Nonsuch for passage making. I will leave the first since it is easy to find discussion of that topic, so on to the second.   First off I would say that a Nonsucj is far from an ideal passage maker, more on that later. A second comment is that there is blue water and then there. Is blue water. We sailed from Bali to South Africa and had weeks of broad reaching in 25 to 35 knots with higher winds near the end. Would I want to do it in a Nonsuch? Not a chance. NYC-Bermuda or the trade wind passage across the Atlantic to the Caribbean. With proper prep and to get somewhere, OK.   Things that are problematic on a Nonsuch. - You need to be able to dramatically reduce sail area, a deep third reef at least. - You can’t really rig a useful preventer when you are far off the wind which you will be east/west across the Atlantic. - You can’t heave-to which is useful at times. You can lie-ahull but this is not nearly as comfortable. - The cockpit is very large in relationship to the capacity of the deck drains. Useful to take up some volume with the life raft or jerrycans, well secured of course. You also need a secure means of closing off the cabin. - self steering is critical. You either need a good vane or redundant electrical ones. For either you need to be able to precisely balance the rig and this is obviously easier with two sails. -A Nonsuch has fewer things to break, but when something does break it tends to be serious.   Happy to answer questions here or at the Rendevous in Toronto.   On Thu, Jul 11, 2024 at 5:10 PM Rob Cohen "Soave" NS33 Westport, CT <

Bob Neches (Me Gusta, Nonsuch 26U #233) <rtne...@gmail.com>: Jul 14 12:40PM -0700 A quote I'm fond of repeating: "A skillful seaman avoids situations that would require skillful seamanship."   On the one hand, the Nonsuch designers have provided information about recommended modifications before taking one offshore, as I indicated in a previous post.   On the other hand, in line with Bruce's observation that, "A Nonsuch has fewer things to break, but when something does break it tends to be serious," that it is exactly this lack of redundancy that's one of the key reasons cited by the designer, Mark Ellis, for stating on the record that he personally would not take a Nonsuch offshore.   Individual owners should assess their own specific capabilities, resources, and boats very carefully in deciding what situations to venture into.   -- Bob Me Gusta Nonsuch e26U #233 Looking forward to seeing folks in Toronto: https://nonsuch.org/2024-INA-International-Rendezvous-Status   On Sunday, July 14, 2024 at 12:04:08 PM UTC-7 Bruce Clark/June Wan; N30 'Nonsuch': Hull 2/Sail 1 wrote:

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