Battery under aft starboard berth

[jerome.b...@gmail.com]

Hello All,

A couple of years ago I was speaking with another 30 Classic owner who told me that his batteries were located under the aft starboard berth. I am wondering if anyone else has this arrangement. I do also have a storage area in that same location that is not used. I was thinking that I would use that area to add a 4th battery to increase my amp capacity.  Any thoughts or feedback would be appreciated.

Jerome Bertuglia

Purr Diem NS 30C #269

Stonington, CT

[Rob Powers]

Hi,

Our boat came with the batteries under the quarter earth's, bank one on one side and bank 2 on the other. These are aft of the fuel tank and the holding tank on our 26C.

They were originally wet cells, but this did not provide any venting. It looked like a factory install. I replaced them with AGMs.

the boat has been surveyed a number of times and no issue was taken with this install. Some people have the batteries in the side cockpit lockers but I did not like the heat from the engine. Our batteries are always closer to water temp plus some. Out here probably 60 - 70 degrees in the storage area.

Rob Powers 

Respite 26C #50

Sidney BC

[Joe Valinoti]

Yes, there is a 30C, currently hauled in Oriental that I delivered from Wilmington, NC,  and it has 4 batteries under the aft starboard berth.

 

Joe Valinoti
S/V iL Gatto NS30U #221
Sea Harbour YC
Oriental, NC USA

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[Jerome Bertuglia]

Thank you for the replies. 

I currently have wet cell batteries, do you think that the venting would be an issue?

Jerome Bertuglia

Purr Diem NS 30C #269

Stonington, CT

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[Mike Parfett]

Jerome,

My NS30C has 3 wet cell batteries (two 6 volt golf cart batteries, and a 12 volt marine battery) under the aft end of the quarter berth. There are a couple of vent holes (one inch diameter) on the access covers, and I leave the cushion off that area of the berth for most of the time.  There was no comment on this arrangement during a 2023 survey.

Mike

NS30C #26

Port Moody, BC

[Eric Larsen]

Jerome,

My 30C has the batteries under the starboard quarter berth in the aft area -- forward of that is the holding tank.  When I obtained the boat, there were 4) 100AH house AGM batteries and 1) 100AH starting battery in that compartment.  Quite snug.  In the first week of ownership, I had a battery bank runaway secondary to a shorted cell when charging.  Nearly catastrophic.  Had to chisel the 4 batteries apart as they had welded together.

I now have a single 300AH LiFePO4 house battery and a 100AH starting battery in that compartment.  A little more room to run the lead/LiFePO4 hybrid charging system now.  I do like this location for batteries, though. 

Eric Larsen

S/V Felix 1981 30C #115

Olympia, WA

[Mark Powers La Reina 26C Vancouver, B.C.]

Here is what Practical Sailor has to say about safe locations for batteries.

https://www.practical-sailor.com/systems-propulsion/ensuring-a-safe-space-for-batteries

Mark Powers

[Jerome Bertuglia]

Thank you everyone for your help!

Eric-- I am curious about your Lead/LifePO4 Hybrid Charging System. Would you mind telling me more about it? I currently have 2  6-volt house batteries and 1 amp 12 volt starting battery. I am also pretty sure that I have the original standard alternator on my W-27.

Jerome Bertuglia

Purr Diem NS 30C #269

Stonington, CT

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[Eric Larsen]

Hi Jerome,

I sort of backed into the whole LiFePO4 thing when I had the previous batteries melt down followed by a number of -- shall we say -- less than reliable marine electricians, all of whom wanted to replicate the multiple parallel AGM battery setup but never actually followed through.  I decided that I had to deal with the battery system myself and spent a few months researching and becoming competent.  

I settled on using the lithium along with lead (in my case the starting battery) in a hybrid arrangement.  There are a number of advantages to doing this but to do so, you need a controller specific to hybrid setups.  The only one I know of that exists currently is the BankManager and probably the most important thing it does is allows for optimal charging of LiFePO4 -- something lacking currently in the industry.

Essentially, the system is comprised of a lead battery in parallel with a LiFePO4 battery through a contactor managed by the BankManager controller.  What it does is it connects the two battery types when the voltages of both are close enough to do so without serious inrush one way or the other.  So, on a typical day, your house system is powered by the entire lithium and lead system and when the lithium gets to a point where it is sufficiently discharged, the system safely disconnects the lithium and then runs only off of the lead until a charge is applied.  Conversely, when charging, the charge goes through the lead battery and into the lithium until such a time that the lithium is fully charged, after which the controller disconnects the lead and lithium as to not overcharge the lithium.  This is a simplistic explanation in that it can do all of that incrementally.  The controller knows the state of charge and discharge of the lead and lithium, and controls all elements of the charging, discharging, and connection.  Using the lead as a buffer is a really slick way to employ safe charging of lithium.  LiFePO4 will not tolerate overcharging -- it will be killed.  An added bonus is that by using the lead as a buffer with the BankManager controller, you can use any traditional charge source (like the ones you already have) including (in my case) Victron 50amp shore power charger, solar panel MPPT, and an externally regulated alternator.

Anyway, it's a pretty slick setup and offers a number of advantages.  One of the best is that by replacing 400ah of AGM lead with a 300ah LiFePO4 increased by house capacity from 200ah (50% usable of 400ah of lead) to 300ah (100% usable) while reducing the footprint and weight of the batteries.  I pulled out 250 lbs of lead and replaced it with 75 lbs of lithium while increasing house capacity by 50%.

If you want to learn more about how to add lithium in your traditional lead setup, check out the BankManager here:

https://www.emilyandclarksadventure.com/bbms

I get nothing for advocating this as a solution but it has been working fantastically for me for almost a year now.

Cheers,

Eric Larsen

S/V Felix 1981 30C #115

Olympia, WA

[Roger Peebles]

My newly acquired 30 C view inside the starbd lazarette.

The arrows point to two house batteries. There are 4 of them beneath the cockpit. They are not easily accessed as you have to be a small person to fit into the lazarettes. Not to mention of herculean strength to 

deal with the weight of moving these batteries, which in this case will have to be done as all are no good. 

Is this a standard setup for the 30? I would like them more accessible. 

Thanks!

[Don Crossley]

Roger, for safety, the battery in the photo should be strapped down, and have a cover in case something falls on it and shorts across the terminals. Same for the 2 (4?) house batteries that we can't see.

Don

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[Jerome Bertuglia]

Hi Eric,

I spent some time looking over the information on the emilyandclarksadventure website. I am intrigued and will look into it further. Thank you for the info.

Jerome Bertuglia

Purr Diem NS 30C #269

Stonington, CT

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[Roger Peebles]

Don,

Thank you. I am actually looking to see if anyone has the house batteries in a different location.

Roger

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--

Roger Peebles, PhD
Editor, JEH

[BRIAN CAYER]

My boat has 4 batteries between the lazarettes. 1 start, 2house , 1 winch/head all in cases behind engine. Luckily all pretty new. I could hump them out but only if absolutely necessary. I have been in both lazarettes for various tasks but it was very tight. I can not see any other alternative for my setup.

Brian Cayer

Spirit~Wind

N30U 419

Deep River, Ct

On Apr 16, 2024, at 6:04 PM, Roger Peebles <hydr...@gmail.com> wrote:



Don,

Thank you. I am actually looking to see if anyone has the house batteries in a different location.

Roger

On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:19 PM Don Crossley <doncr...@gmail.com> wrote:

Roger, for safety, the battery in the photo should be strapped down, and have a cover in case something falls on it and shorts across the terminals. Same for the 2 (4?) house batteries that we can't see.

Don

On Tue., Apr. 16, 2024, 1:51 p.m. Roger Peebles, <hydr...@gmail.com> wrote:

My newly acquired 30 C view inside the starbd lazarette.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/INA-Nonsuch-Discussion-Group/CAFfPnct-kACXPD_Xw0EKV8bN%2BpN-pwGU7hcqmKjniAScKQ0siw%40mail.gmail.com.

[Roger Peebles]

Brian thanks for the information. I will keep looking for a more user friendly arrangement!

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[Chris Forbath N30C - #27 "Scatter" Penetanguishene]

Hi,

A previous owner of 'Scatter' had a 4x house battery box constructed which makes up the lower part of the steps to/from the cockpit (in addition to 2x house and 1x starter in the starboard berth).  The top step of the unit is a tool box.  Can send more pics at a later day if helpful.

Best,

Chris Forbath

Scatter

N30C 27

Penetanguishene ON

[Roger Peebles]

Chris some more pictures would be great! Do you move that box to get to the engine?

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[Chris F]

Hi Roger,

The engine is accessible (for all routine maintenance) without having to remove the battery box, just the top step.  This is the only photo I have at the moment - I will take and send some more when I'm back at the boat in the next couple of weeks.  

Best,

Chris

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[BRIAN CAYER]

Well now there’s an idea. Bottom step of companionway a box with four easy to maintain batteries, top step a toolbox. For that to work I would want an electric motor turning the prop. Engine maintenance eliminated. Tool box that is easy to get to for the thousand other things you need to do on a good day.

Brian Cayer

Spirit~Wind

N30U 419 W27

Deep River, Ct

On Apr 17, 2024, at 2:49 PM, Chris Forbath N30C - #27 "Scatter" Penetanguishene <cfor...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

A previous owner of 'Scatter' had a 4x house battery box constructed which makes up the lower part of the steps to/from the cockpit (in addition to 2x house and 1x starter in the starboard berth).  The top step of the unit is a tool box.  Can send more pics at a later day if helpful.

Best,

Chris Forbath

Scatter

N30C 27

Penetanguishene ON

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/INA-Nonsuch-Discussion-Group/ac0cf6e2-3b83-49be-85ba-0cda64c6ca8fn%40googlegroups.com.

<IMG_7990.jpg>

[Chris Forbath]

Hi,

…here are more photos of the battery + toolbox gangway steps.

Best,

Chris Forbath

Scatter

N30C 27

Penetanguishene ON

On Apr 17, 2024, at 4:14 PM, Roger Peebles <hydr...@gmail.com> wrote:



Chris some more pictures would be great! Do you move that box to get to the engine?

On Wed, Apr 17, 2024 at 12:49 PM Chris Forbath N30C - #27 "Scatter" Penetanguishene <cfor...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi,

A previous owner of 'Scatter' had a 4x house battery box constructed which makes up the lower part of the steps to/from the cockpit (in addition to 2x house and 1x starter in the starboard berth).  The top step of the unit is a tool box.  Can send more pics at a later day if helpful.

Best,

Chris Forbath

Scatter

N30C 27

Penetanguishene ON

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/INA-Nonsuch-Discussion-Group/CAFfPncv1gWojsT8fdGvUrA36-bgEGaJ7jem7DKzBeRpX494dMQ%40mail.gmail.com.

[BRIAN CAYER]

Chris,

Very inventive.

Brian

Spirit~Wind

N30U 419

Deep River (soon to be Westbrook) Ct.

On Apr 26, 2024, at 8:57 PM, Chris Forbath <cfor...@gmail.com> wrote:



Hi,

…here are more photos of the battery + toolbox gangway steps.

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[Roger Peebles]

Chris thanks much appreciated … a good arrangement!

On Apr 26, 2024, at 8:34 PM, BRIAN CAYER <b.k....@sbcglobal.net> wrote:



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[Bruce Clark]

Good idea. On Nonsuch, there is a battery box (2 house batteries, 1 engine) just in front of the engine bulkhead. Convenient location, but makes engine access more difficult and you can’t hand crank the engine. Interestingly, between the first four boats in 1978 and the production boats in 1979-, they moved the batteries.

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