Walking with Dinosaurs debut + Utahraptor vs. Gastonia + pterosaur design + Khankhuuluu + Mesozic mammals + more

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Ben Creisler

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Jun 16, 2025, 4:44:34 PMJun 16
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Ben Creisler

A reminder that the new series episodes of "Walking with Dinosaurs" premier today, June 16, 2025 on PBS in the US.


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A preview sequence:

How An Evolutionary Arms Race Created History's Most Bizarre Dinosaurs | Walking With Dinosaurs
Utahraptor vs. Gastonia with Jim Kirkland

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E-jtwNGnQ5U

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A few other items:


Oldest Diagnosis of Bone Infection in a Dinosaur (Plateosaurus)

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How pterosaurs can inspire aircraft design

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Meet Khankhuuluu mongoliensis, the Dragon Prince of Mongolia.

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New T-Rex ancestor discovered in drawers of Mongolian institute

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A Mesozoic myth: Dinosaurs didn’t rule the Earth like we think (Riley Black)

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Paleo Nerds Podcast: Ep #86 Painting Prehistoric Worlds and Dinosaur Dreams with Mark Hallett

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Gregory Paul

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Jun 16, 2025, 10:17:51 PMJun 16
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Best things -- 

No snaggly teeth projecting from closed theropod mouths (although the upper lips being a littler broader than and overhanging the lower are not accurate). The Spinosaurus is a plausible exception. 

The big predator does not stand and roar at prey before attacking. 

Dinosaurs fairly well designed. 

Drones being used to find fossils indicates major advances in field work. 

Not so good things -- 

Somewhat Disneyish. 

Poor little cute baby Triceratops whimpering on occasion -- spare me. 

Lush dramatic music annoying. 

Ancient landscape much too hilly for TT-zone coastal floodplain, although this could be set further inland. 

As per prior, adorable little Clover diving into a cave to escape mighty T. rex. Plot stretch. 

Adult Tyranno chasing little juvie Tric on extended dash through dense trees in dark. That's a real stretch. 

Azhdarchid had ~360 degree vision so being ambushed by Tyranno implausible. 

Since this is very end of Maastrichtian the Tyrannosaurus could be T. rex. But postorbital bosses are wrong for that species as I am sure you all agree. 

But if they keep saying T. rex why not also T. prorsus, hmmmm? This sort of paleotaxon inconsistency will be further obsolesced in about 1.5 to 2 weeks:)

Small juvenile hadrosaurs with adult herd? No trackways show such, cause juvies too small to keep up and would be trampled. Juv ceratopsid hooking up with hadrosaurs even less likely -- Uncle Walt time:( 

Is there a rule now that dinosaur colors are always dull? Diplodocus seems to have been fairly colorful. 

Lean mean killing machine Tyrannosaurus was not 9 tonnes. Or as slow as rectigrade, short stiff footed, modest leg muscled elephants. 

Deep tail shows Spinosaurus used it too swim. Slender neural spines indicate display function. Does not mean Spino could not swim. But chase down marine fish? Crocs can't do that. 

Whimpering when scared juvenile Spinosaurus? 

Giant adult Spinosaurus caring for its little young ones. Ridiculous. Being all upset when one is lost. More Uncle Walt. 


A basic problem with this format is it does not allow alternative hypothesis to be presented to the public. 

Overall fairly tolerable. 

GSPaul




Ethan Schoales

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Jun 16, 2025, 11:59:31 PMJun 16
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Which one is better, the new one or the original?

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Jura

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Jun 17, 2025, 12:22:28 AMJun 17
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The new one has more up to date information and features scenes with real scientists and rarely seen locations such as the Lourinhã Formation , so it stands a step above the original for that. However, the science scenes are also very forced and often require the scientists to say some embarrassing lines to one another, which hurts the credibility of the show. It's also not the first show to do this format, so it won't ever hold the same place as the original. 

That said, I would consider it to be a solid effort. 

Jason

Ethan Schoales

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Jun 17, 2025, 12:23:09 AMJun 17
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Was the original good for its time?

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Jura

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Jun 17, 2025, 12:54:14 AMJun 17
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It was unprecedented for its time. Before Walking with Dinosaurs came out any animated reconstructions were done as small snippets that would be peppered throughout a documentary. WWD was the first time that someone tried to make an animated dinosaur series in the same vein as a nature documentary. The series still had problems (Postosuchus peeing, for instance), but it was an impressive undertaking at the time.

Jason

Ethan Schoales

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Jun 17, 2025, 12:56:04 AMJun 17
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Well, modern crocodilians can pee…

Leo Sham

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Jun 17, 2025, 10:11:10 AMJun 17
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In my opinion the original one is still better and, despite not perfect (remember we teased at the peeing Postosuchus), felt/feels more natural.
Nowadays many paleo "documentaries" are overdone in their interpretation of animal behavior. I can almost hair-raisingly see and feel the phantom humans behind the animated dinosaurs and pterosaurs. Many scenarios, as Greg has described above, look like wishful thinking of the filmmakers.

Adrian Boeye

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Jun 17, 2025, 3:04:43 PMJun 17
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So far, I think while this has been somewhat fun, as a lot of people have pointed out quite well, a lot of the scenarios and the way the animals act feels less like a nature doc and more like something out of disney. Following around small animals around is a good way to get attention but is deeply flawed. While it was fairly overused in prehistoric planet, it really is the exception for immature animals to make it to adulthood. Most of these cute baby dinosaurs would end up with an unpleasant fate.

I think the biggest issue with WWD 2025 is that it tries to do two things; show cool dinosaurs as well as paleontologists doing the science, and it falls short on both. The dino segments can be entertaining but it does not serve to show dinosaurs acting in a more realistic manner like a proper documentary. For that matter, there is also the effects which is a whole other can of worms. As for the science, the way the actual paleontologists talk without acknowledging the camera but interacting in such a way that is clearly for the benefit of the viewer is not engaging. These are professionals with some really cool stuff, let them talk to the viewer! I would point to the old pbs dinosaurs from 1992 or discovery's ultimate guide t. rex where the paleontologists actually talk to the audience, show the viewer what they are doing or their perspective etc, as an example on how to better get the viewers introduced to real science. 

Will toss in the original remains superior, but that is probably another discussion. Very simply, it feels more like a real documentary.

-Adrian

Gregory Paul

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Jun 17, 2025, 9:55:11 PMJun 17
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Now I am getting officially teed off. 

Again big adult dinosaurs portrayed as caring for their wee little adorable offspring outside the nest. That when as far as I know there is not the slightest evidence for such in herd bonebeds or trackways in any taxa. For instance the classic Paluxy TX adult-juvenile herd sauropod trackways has the smallest juvies at about a tonne, large enough to keep up with while not being stomped upon by the grownups (one was 50 tonnes, another 30, five 20, then on down). When juvenile did join up with adults the was probably no particular parent offspring relationship, it was just the latter seeking some safety by associated with the adults. When trackways of juveniles of giant taxa are found they are in independent pods. 

There is no evidence of sophisticated parent/child herds among large dinosaurs comparable to those of mammals. The adults forming rings around the young is limited to a few mammals, musk oxen especially. 

WWD is presenting to the public for lay audience pleasing Disneyfication purposes a false image of highly parental large dinosaurs for which evidence is scarce at best. Thus making them mere mammal mimics, while missing the truly fascinating differences between dinosaurs and mammals. 

Why would raptors obsess over going after well armored, big tailed ankylosaurs? They were largely ornithopod hunters. 

Top speed of raptors just 20 mph. Really? 

Highly social albertosaurs formed strong intimate bonds? Why I did not know that. Hunted in organized packs? Maybe or more likely not -- not that the WWD audience will know about the debate on that. 

Immature predators helping their parents hunt? Does that happen in any living species? 

The dorsal anterior neck muscles on the albertosaurs are too narrow, they would have been broad rounded in cross section as per the top edge of the occiput. 

I suspect that using lips to entirely or mostly cover the theropod's teeth saved on production costs. An advantage to paleoartists in general. 

It was interesting to see Jim K talking about his J/K extinction theory. 

Good that the ornithischians have cheeks, including the ankylosaurs. 

GSPaul

mkir...@gmail.com

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Jun 20, 2025, 4:32:45 PMJun 20
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In The River Dragon, Episode 2, the Spinosaurus was presented as swimming under water for quite a long time in pursuing Onchopristis.  It was practically seal-like!  "Sobek" could have gone to another bank along that big fishing hole instead of fighting for the already-occupied one.   (Alternative opinion is the 2022 Sereno et al paper Spinosaurus is not an aquatic dinosaur at https://elifesciences.org/articles/80092.)

Albertosaurs comforted each other by nuzzling?  A lot of these theories were presented as facts, so kids are going to think that everything in WWD 2025 is scientifically proven. 







Becky Huset

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Jun 20, 2025, 5:24:06 PMJun 20
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Anyone who was around in the 1980’s should remember the documentary series The Land Before Time. 

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Richard W. Travsky

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Jun 26, 2025, 1:23:34 AMJun 26
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Flintstones… narrated by David AttenRock…

 

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Sent: Friday, June 20, 2025 3:24 PM
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Subject: Re: [DMG] Re: More: PBS Walking with Dinosaurs review

 

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