Help Reading Name

[Dennis Munise]

Hi all, can anyone tell me what the son's name is here?

Link to record here (left page, bottom):  http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-PD-RELVA-B-1827-1848/SMG-PD-RELVA-B-1827-1848_item1/index.html?page=58

Thanks!

[Cheri Mello]

Escolastico.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

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[Boyd McKee Kitchen]

Could it be Escolartico?

Boyd

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[Dennis Munise]

Ahh thank you.  This is the first time I've seen that name used in the male form!

[Linda Mare]

I don’t believe it’s a male. If you look at the handwriting of the priest throughout the record he does not hook his “o” when they are at the end of words. Also words that end in “a” have the hook really high. Look at where he writes Espírito Santo and Maia. You’ll see what I mean. So Escolástica.  

Sent from my iPhone

On Jan 23, 2023, at 8:31 AM, Dennis Munise <djmu...@gmail.com> wrote:

Ahh thank you.  This is the first time I've seen that name used in the male form!

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[Cheri Mello]

First time I've seen it in male form as well.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/30e96f71-0051-4a76-8ff5-70b49bcc4af6n%40googlegroups.com.

[Cheri Mello]

Dennis, Linda M. got it right. It's a girl. Escolastica. I only looked at the first line and didn't read further to compare the way he writes his ending "o" vs. the ending "a" which is just an "o" with a high flying tail. Linda noticed, so yeah, it's a girl. Escolastica.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/D1FC5FC5-B7B1-411C-813D-A33E15FB10F9%40gmail.com.

[Dennis Munise]

Ahh yes, great catch Linda!  

Another question I have with this father.  I'm confident that in the list below these are all his children, based on the frequency and grandparents, however on 2 baptismal records he is listed as being from Furnas.  I get that Arrifes/Revla may be interchangeable depending on the date but these two parishes don't appear to be near each other.  More of a curiosity than anything on why he would give a different parish.  One time I could chalk up to an error by the priest/scribe, but it's listed twice, so far.  

Also kind of throws me off that Manoel is born middle of the pack, as opposed to first - although I am still working backwards with this family so it's possible there was another Manoel and he died.  And I know that the first son being Manoel is not a hard and fast rule, just interesting is all.  I don't know Joao's age yet so I haven't gone through the records for either parish to find him.

[Cheri Mello]

Dennis,

A modern map shows Furnas and Maia adjacent.

I can see the microfilm dates; either seems to plausible for your time period.

The question probably is about where the boundaries of the 2 parishes were in the 1820s. Either that, or the father was not present for the baptism and the godfather took a guess. I'd

add a godparent column to your spreadsheet and see if that makes sense with the location of Furnas. Maybe the godfather was from Furnas and misspoke about the biological dad

being from Furnas.

Maybe others here have other theories.

[Dennis Munise]

Ah that make sense.  I was looking at Google Maps which had Maia up on the coast and Furnas quite a distance away but your map shows the actual boundaries.  Like I said I felt confident based on the other data that it was the same person and your explanation makes perfect sense.

Thanks!

[Cheri Mello]

Yeah, the Azores GenWeb is your best friend. Bookmark this one: http://www.azoresgenweb.org/

Click on the Maps, Databases, Indexes button. I submitted that Map to Kathy who runs the Azores GenWeb. It's rather busy looking but shows the boundaries.

It'll have to do for now, until a better map with boundaries can be found for Sao Miguel.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

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[JR]

Here is what I have. 

Descendants of Jose Moniz


Generation No. 1

1.  JOSE1 MONIZ was born in Divino Espirito Santo de Maia.  He married LUISA JACINTA.  She was born in Santa Catarina, Calheta, Ilha Sao Jorge.
   
Children of JOSE MONIZ and LUISA are:
    i.    FRANCISCA2, b. 08 Dec 1798, NS da Alegria, Furnas.
2.    ii.    JOAO MONIZ, b. 19 Jun 1801, NS da Alegria, Furnas; d. Bef. 29 Sep 1873.


Generation No. 2

2.  JOAO2 MONIZ (JOSE1) was born 19 Jun 1801 in NS da Alegria, Furnas, and died Bef. 29 Sep 1873.  He married ROSA JACINTA OR DE JESUS 18 Jan 1824 in NS das Neves, Relva, daughter of MANUEL CORDEIRO and ANA.  She was born Abt. 1801 in NS das Neves, Relva.
   
    i.    MANUEL MONIZ CORDEIRO, b. 01 Apr 1832, NS das Neves, Relva; m. (1) FRANCISCA DE JESUS OR AMOR DIVINO, 01 Oct 1849, NS da Saude, Arrifes; b. 1825, NS das Neves, Relva; m. (2) MARIA DA ESTRELA, 29 Sep 1875, NS da Saude, Arrifes; b. Abt. 1847, NS da Saude, Arrifes.

[Joseph Mendonca]

There may be some confusion since the parish of Maia oversaw the parish of Furnas (Santa Ana) for a period of time and those records were maintained in Maia.

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Joseph Mendonca

[JR]

Well it appears that Joao Moniz ( 19 Jun 1801, ) was definitely born in Furnas, but I only found two children for his parents Jose Moniz and Luisa Jacinta, who is reported to be from St Catarina, Ilha Sao Jorge. I could not find their marriage which occurred some time before 1798, most likely in Maia. They do not appear in any of the indices either. Occasionally, when people come from another island, they appear and marry in one of the parishes of Ponta Delgada before settling in their home village.

JR

[Cheri Mello]

That makes sense for the time period. A man could not have an unmarried woman in his house. He'd have to marry her first and if her boat landed in Ponta Delgada where the main port is, then it makes sense to marry there. Never thought about that until your comment, JR.

Cheri Mello
Listowner, Azores-Gen
Researching: São Miguel island: Vila Franca, Ponta Garca, Ribeira Quente, Ribeira das Tainhas, Achada

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/azores/d85685b4-8342-4874-8168-64f9b82c6f94n%40googlegroups.com.

[Joseph Mendonca]

Luisa Jacinta was Jose Moniz's 2nd wife.  He was previously married to Maria de Jesus and it doesn't appear they had children. Here is their marriage record in Maia (22 Jun 1789) and it is challenging to read:

Right side

http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-RG-MAIA-C-1777-1797/SMG-RG-MAIA-C-1777-1797_item1/index.html?page=125

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Joseph Mendonca

[Dennis Munise]

Challenging is an understatement!  Thank you for that info.

Also, thank you JR and Cheri for the historical background.  Good to know this!

[JR]

Below is the said marriage. You can find the rest here:

https://gw.geneanet.org/jmcamara?lang=en&iz=2&p=antonia&n=do+amaral&oc=3

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http://culturacores.azores.gov.pt/biblioteca_digital/SMG-RG-MAIA-C-1777-1797/SMG-RG-MAIA-C-1777-1797_item1/index.html?page=125

Page 123, Maia casamentos, 22-June-1789
Joze Muniz, filho de Manoel Muniz Pacheco and Antonia do Amaral, ja defunta, com Maria de Jesus, filha de Francisco de Souza, defunto and Maria dos Anjos, ambos baptizados ermida da NS da Alegria do Vale das Furnas.

JR

[Joseph Mendonca]

JR, these are my direct ancestors.

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Joseph Mendonca

[JR]

Very cool, Joe!!