Still root access after update?

[Tobias Lindulf]

I have a couple of questions that I would like to get answered before
making the update.

1. If I flash my dev phone with one of the signed dream devphone
images, will I then...
A. loose my root access forever?
B. be able to flash it with the developer image again (back to the
image that was shipped with the phone + where can I find that image)?

2. What are the differencies between the shipped developer image and
the signed images?

3. If I manage to update my dev phone, will I then get access to the
paid apps from Sweden (which is where I live)?

4. If NO is the answer on the previous question, is there any way for
me to get access to paid apps from Sweden?

Thanks in advance!

Tobias Lindulf

[Andrew]

On Apr 2, 7:54 am, Tobias Lindulf <tobias.lind...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have a couple of questions that I would like to get
> answered before making the update.
> 1. If I flash my dev phone with one of the signed dream
> devphone images, will I then...
> A. loose my root access forever?

As long as you flash you mobile with the official devphone images
(there is currently only one - 1.1) you will keep root access. If you
flash it with anything else you may loose root access and/or even
loose control with the phone!

I am not saying that you cannot flash it with other versions, e.g.,
the builds made from Git, e.g., cupcake betas, but you must know what
you are doing or you may brick your phone altogether!

> B. be able to flash it with the developer image again (back
> to the image that was shipped with the phone + where can I
> find that image)?

I have not seen version 1.0 out there? But as long as you don't flash
the phone with something that restricts flashing you may always
reflash it.

> 2. What are the differencies between the shipped developer
> image and the signed images?

Hm, what signed images are you talking about? There is for instance
the "Holiday" update which is the firmware for the phones given to the
Google employees but that is not a developer version so you will loose
root access!

> 3. If I manage to update my dev phone, will I then get
> access to the paid apps from Sweden (which is where I live)?

If you update with a developer version of the software you will not
get access to copy protected apps. This will probably be the case
until another copy protection scheme is implemented in Android.

> 4. If NO is the answer on the previous question, is there
> any way for me to get access to paid apps from Sweden?

I think that until Android is introduced to the country/company where
you sim card is originating from you will not be able to see paid apps
- and if you are using a devphone you will still not be able to see
paid apps as I wrote in 3!

> Thanks in advance!
> Tobias Lindulf

You are welcome/Velbekomme
Andrew Engels Rump

[McLin]

With Holiday Firmware you still get root.

[Tobias Lindulf]

Thanks for all your answers!

Andrew, in question nr 2:

>Hm, what signed images are you talking about? There is for instance
>the "Holiday" update which is the firmware for the phones given to the
>Google employees but that is not a developer version so you will loose
>root access!

I was referring to the signed images "signed-dream_devphone-
img-142608.zip" and "signed-dream_devphone-img-116222.zip" mentioned
at http://www.htc.com/www/support/android/adp.html , sorry I did not
clarify that in my first post.
According to an article at
http://www.androidauthority.com/index.php/2009/03/10/htc-offers-solution-for-paid-apps-on-your-android-dev-1-smartphone/
this update would solve the problem that dev phones can not access
paid apps.
I now also realise that this will not be enough to solve my problem
due to the fact that my sim card originates from Sweden (in which
Android is not introduced yet) this will block me from seeing paid
apps (as you have mentioned already).

Tobias

[Andrew]

On Apr 2, 12:21 pm, McLin <mcli...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> With Holiday Firmware you still get root.

Ah, thanks! I didn't know what! Why - or is it a bug?

/Andrew

[Jean-Baptiste Queru]

1A) no, you don't lose root access. The1.1 images distributed by HTC
are configured identically to the original 1.0 system that came with
the ADP1.

1B) yes, you can go back to the original 1.0 image that came with your
phone, it is available on the same HTC page.

2) the 1.0 image on HTC's site is exactly the one that originally came
with your device.

3) I don't believe so. While the Market client in 1.1 has support for
paid apps, there are also some restrictions be geography that only
currently allow paid apps to be seen in a handful of countries.

4) See above. I don't think that's supported at the moment.

BTW, the signatures being used in the "signed" images aren't secret.
Those are the default "test" signatures that are part of the Android
source tree.

To address a few other questions that popped up in the thread:

-I strongly recommend against using the pirated holiday images. Those
aren't meant for developer devices, and using them could result in
adverse effects (most notably, getting automatically updated into
versions that lock some of the phone features back, in a way that
would have harmful for development). The official 1.1 images for ADP1
are functionally identical to the current holiday image. Sticking with
official ADP1 images and your own home-built images avoids those
risks.

-The system is designed such that bricking your phone while working on
custom images is unlikely. I'm not saying it's impossible, but regular
development tasks make it really hard: the normal process to develop
custom images involves working with fastboot, and the ADP1 0.95.3
bootloader is configured such that fastboot cannot brick itself. Even
if you flash a custom system image with a custom kernel that crashes
at startup, you can still use fastboot, flash the original images
back, and you're back in business. Risks come when updating either the
radio or the "hboot" bootloader itself, but those operations are rare.
I've personally flashed systems hundreds of times on my devices, and
dozens of bootloaders and radios (without the safeguards that 0.95.3
gives you), even with pre-production systems where flashing was known
to not be as reliable, and I've yet to brick a device.

JBQ

--
Jean-Baptiste M. "JBQ" Queru
Android Engineer, Google.

Questions sent directly to me that have no reason for being private
will likely get ignored or forwarded to a public forum with no further
warning.

[Andrew]

On Apr 2, 1:00 pm, Tobias Lindulf <tobias.lind...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks for all your answers!
> Andrew, in question nr 2:
>> Hm, what signed images are you talking about? There is for
>> instance the "Holiday" update which is the firmware for
>> the phones given to the Google employees but that is not a
>> developer version so you will loose root access!
> I was referring to the signed images "signed-dream_devphone-
> img-142608.zip" and "signed-dream_devphone-img-116222.zip"
> mentioned at http://www.htc.com/www/support/android

> /adp.html, sorry I did not clarify that in my first post.

Ah http://www.htc.com/www/support/android/adp.html

Well sorry for spreading incorrect information. I've been to that page
but forgot about 1.0. You are correct. There you can download the
original and the update of the firmware (1.1) for the ADP1.

Version 1.1 will give access to paid apps - as long as they are not
copy protected - and your sim card are from one of the approved
regions!

But the questions is if the paid apps are using Android's copy
protection or not because then you can't see then anyways! :-(

> According to an article athttp://www.androidauthority.com/index.php/2009/03/10/htc-offers-solut...

[McLin]

Nop not identical, cos on holiday is latitude is enabled;)

[Jean-Baptiste Queru]

Ooops, yes, you're right. In that domain they're not functionally
identical (even though they're running the exact same code). Sorry
about the confusion. My point about sticking with your own home-built
images or with official ADP1 images remains.

JBQ

[McLin]

Hey was just joking, the life is serious enough...

[Tobias Lindulf]

Thank you all for your good answers!

[Chrigi]

It seems like something about root access has changed because a simple
"su" in the Terminal Emulator doesn't do the trick anymore. How do I
have to do it now?

[jjd]

After updating my ADP1 to the HTC 1.5 images posted today, I also
cannot "su" to root in the terminal emulator.

I get "su: uid 10038 not allowed to su".

Did I do something wrong? Why can't I su?

--Jim--

[Jean-Baptiste Queru]

In 1.5, su is restricted to only be accessible through an adb shell,
not from regular apps.

JBQ

[jjd]

Thanks, JBQ. Indeed, su from adb shell does continue to work for me.

I'm not quite sure how I feel about this, but I'm sure it will make
the phone at least slightly more secure.

--Jim--

[Craig]

Does that mean my tethering app won't work anymore? I'm using
aNetShare.

[Michael Vincent]

"Task Manager" no longer works after 1.5 update

[Douglas Whitfield]

On Apr 27, 2:37 pm, Jean-Baptiste Queru <j...@android.com> wrote:
> In 1.5, su is restricted to only be accessible through an adb shell,
> not from regular apps.
>
> JBQ

has no one come up with a workaround for this yet? The instructions
for installing Debian want me to su :(
http://www.androidfanatic.com/cms/community-forums.html?func=view&catid=9&id=2248&start=6

I really just want zomg so I can play the libre.fm stream, so if
someone has a better idea for that I'm up for suggestions.

Thanks!

[Craig]

On Mon, May 18, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Douglas Whitfield
<dougl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> has no one come up with a workaround for this yet?  The instructions
> for installing Debian want me to su :(
> http://www.androidfanatic.com/cms/community-forums.html?func=view&catid=9&id=2248&start=6

Your best bet is to install the JesueFreke 1.5 firmware
http://jf.andblogs.net/2009/05/01/when-is-your-15-coming-out/

I didn't really want to hack up my phone too much, but installing the
above was dead easy and gives you, among other things, notification
when something tries to use 'su'. It also allows you to Wifi tether,
which rocks!

good luck!

[Srdjan Rosic]

Hi,
Haven't tried this,
but adb shell should give you root,
so then, you could use adb to copy /bin/sh into something else and do
chmod +s /bin/something_else, so when started it would run under root
permissions.

Srdjan Rosic