Hebraeic time of making Haj (Chag) and Today > https://www.facebook.com/notes/ben-abrahamson/circling-seven-times-counter-clockwise-on-the-hajj-chag/144816165544432

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Circling seven times counter-clockwise on the Hajj (Chag) > https://www.facebook.com/notes/ben-abrahamson/circling-seven-times-counter-clockwise-on-the-hajj-chag/144816165544432

Videos: http://harunyahya.tv/en/watch/28891/Rabbi_Ben_Abrahamson_is_praying_for_peace_and_the_prompt_appearance_of_the_Mashiach_(Messiah)

http://harunyahya.tv/en/watch/20442/Mr_Adnan_Oktars_live_conversation_with_the_Israeli_delegation_(January_19_2010)

von Ben Abrahamson, Dienstag, 3. August 2010 um 10:52 ·


From a live broadcast on Turkish television (19 January 2010, Kocaeli TV and Mavi Karadeniz TV)


RABBI BEN ABRAHAMSON: In being here this evening it reminded me, since all the time I talk about history, it reminded me 2000 years ago the Jewish kings expanded the Temple Mount, Haram Al-Sharif. Basically there were 3 courts. There were the courts for the Priests, the courts for the Israelites and the courts for the nations. The courts for the nations they made very large, they intended that there should be many many believers with the yireh shomaym, the Fearers of God. They should come from Arabia, from Parthia, from Persia, from Syria, there should be Bedouins. All of them should come together with the Jews during the Tabernacles holiday and they should all pray together and in what we call in Hebrew the Chag or in Arabic it’s called the Hajj. They would all pray together and worship together in beauty and holiness. And in some small way this evening, we are seeing the children of the children of these people who worshipped together, sitting together at this table, together with unity and speaking words of God and promoting the devout faith in each other. This is what we call in Judaism B’nai Noah Teachings, which I’ve talked about with everybody here. and I hope that Messiah will come quickly, together we’ll celebrate in Jerusalem all in peace and devotion.

Additional Notes

When Herod became king of Judea, he enlarged the area of the Temple Mount to allow for over a million Jewish and non-Jewish pilgrims during the course of the Tabernacles holiday (see illustrations, and Jewish Antiquities, Book 15, Chapter 11, 382-387)


During the holiday, Jews and non-Jewish “Bnei Noah” would circle the Altar seven times, outside of the soreg (fence) that separated the court of the Israelites from the court of the nations.
Pilgrims join processions of hundreds of thousands of people, who simultaneously converge on Mecca for the week of the Hajj, and perform a series of rituals: Each person walks counter-clockwise seven times about the Ka'bah.

To see clip
http://en.harunyahya.tv/videoDetail/Lang/4/Product/28891/
To see full broadcast see
http://en.harunyahya.tv/videoDetail/Lang/4/Product/20442/


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Ihsan Karacabey und 16 anderen gefällt das.

6 mal geteilt

Sepehr Mohamadi Thanks Ben,

Just a reminder,

In Quran 28:27 we have
قالَ إِنِّي أُريدُ أَنْ أُنْكِحَكَ إِحْدَى ابْنَتَيَّ هاتَيْنِ عَلى أَنْ تَأْجُرَني ثَمانِيَ حِجَجٍ
He said:" I wish you to marry one of my two daughters, on condition that you work for me through eight pilgrimage periods;

The word that in most translations translate here as "year" is "Hejaj" or "حجج" which is plural for "haj"

That confirms that in time of moses and even before him yearly pilgrimage was customary.
4. August 2010 um 10:15 · Gefällt mir · 2


Ben Abrahamson Masha'Allah, this is true.

The word "Hajj" comes from the word "Chug" which means circle or to wrap around. This applies both to the custom of encircling as well as to the year itself, which circles through the season.
4. August 2010 um 10:19 · Gefällt mir · 2


Sepehr Mohamadi Thanks Ben,
Is there any refrence to "Chug" In Tanakh?
4. August 2010 um 10:37 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson See the definition for Chag http://www.tyndalearchive.com/tabs/jastrow/ppages/JastrowP108768.gif
4. August 2010 um 11:07 · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi According to your link it was also an Egyptian festival!
4. August 2010 um 11:54 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson This may refer to the Jewish Temple of Onias in Egypt from 150BCE to 72CE, or Egyptian custom. I will look up the quote Sot. 36b
4. August 2010 um 11:58 · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi I remember this verse:
Isa 19:19
In that day shall there be an altar to the LORD in the midst of the land of Egypt, and a pillar at the border thereof to the LORD

but pay attention that the time of Moses, the time of Isaiah and the time of Onias are three very far different times!
4. August 2010 um 12:14 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson
"altar to the LORD in the midst of the land of Egypt" = Heliopolis, Egypt
"pillar at the border thereof to the LORD" = Mecca, Arabia
The border of the land of Egypt during Onias IV / Ptolemy VI Philometor's day was Arabia. This could be a possible ind...Mehr anzeigen
4. August 2010 um 12:41 · Gefällt mir · 1


Sepehr Mohamadi Bene Isarel went to a pagan pilgrimage?
wondering!
also what is the reference that show that Arabia was in the border of Egypt?
I remember that Hagar was an Egyptian woman and from Ismael his son generated Arabs. So calling Arabs, Egyptian maybe possible!
4. August 2010 um 12:51 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson No, God forbid. Yosef was alone because he did NOT go to the pilgrimage in Egypt.

The Ka'aba was not always involved in idolatry. That happened only after the Adzites arrived and idols set up around it (approx 290CE).

According to Tabari the Jew...Mehr anzeigen
4. August 2010 um 13:02 · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi the best Map that I have found in wikipedia is this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ptolemaic-Empire_200bc.jpg
4. August 2010 um 14:11 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson Ptolemy VI Philometor considered Palestine, Cush, Axum and western Arabia as rightfully part of his kingdom.
4. August 2010 um 15:07 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab Egypt in the OT

http://www.1911encyclopedia.org/Mizraim
4. August 2010 um 16:27 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab J1 is the most recent common ancestor of the largest segments of the Cohenim, Arab, Nubian and Copt populations. As such, Arabia was not only a geographical part of the Egyptian empire, but it's population, even today shares a common ancestor with the ...Mehr anzeigen
6. August 2010 um 06:45 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab study by Hisham Y. Hassan et al., "Y-Chromosome Variation Among Sudanese: Restricted Gene Flow, Concordance With Language, Geography, and History," American Journal of Physical Anthropology (2008), in which it has been reported that approximately 40% o...Mehr anzeigen
6. August 2010 um 16:00 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab @R Abrahamson, re: Isa. 19, Does the Hebrew really say the middle of Egypt and on it's border? I ask because, it doesn't make sense to me, how can it be in the middle of Egypt and it's border? It would make more sense to me if it said the temple is between the Egypts on the border. In other words, the border land between upper Egypt (Yemen) and lower Egypt (Sinai) - the two Egypts (Misraim). regards, Kazim.
7. August 2010 um 04:44 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab Alternatively, could the verse be saying there would be two temples, one between the Egypts and another (copy) on their border? regards, Kazim.
7. August 2010 um 14:36 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson Yes, Isaiah the Prophet (as) refered to two altars. Onias IV,was a priest of the line of Zaddok. He lived several hundred years after Isaiah. He understood that Isaiah intended that one altar should be built in Heliopolis (near modern Cairo) and the ...Mehr anzeigen
8. August 2010 um 09:16 · Gefällt mir · 1


Sepehr Mohamadi Ben,
According to Quran, The role to sanctify Kaaba was given through a Covenant to Ibrahim and Ishmael and their descendants:

Remember We made the House a place of assembly for men and a place of safety; and take ye the Station of Abraham as a place ...Mehr anzeigen
8. August 2010 um 21:12 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab "An interesting issue is that in Arabs nationality comes from father, and in Israel it comes from mother." It is my understanding that anyone can convert to Judaism and become a member of the tribe of Judah. One doesnt need a Jewish mother to convert. ...Mehr anzeigen
9. August 2010 um 05:10 · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi Anyone can be a Jew by converting but no one can be a Children of Israel by converting!
Covenants was between God and Abraham, God and Israel, Gos and Ishmael and obviously their children.

It was not between God and members of any religion!
R Abrahamson Your opinion is appreciated.
9. August 2010 um 10:20 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson The term Am Israel, the Nation of Israel, which includes both people born as the children of Israel and people who join that nation. Everyone is born into a basic religion (you call it Islam, we call it Bnei Noah) and then afterwards they take on the religious obligations (sharia) of their parents.
9. August 2010 um 10:32 · Gefällt mir · 2


Kazim Nawab "Anyone can be a Jew by converting but no one can be a Children of Israel by converting!" Come on Sepehr, a religion could not exist thousands of years, if that were true. The children of Israel are among them and mixed with them in the tribe of Judah. The children of Israel are also among them in the Cohen families etc.

regards, Kazim.
9. August 2010 um 17:07 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab @Ben Abrahamson: Can you please comment on why Hanan abaondoned use of the Menorah in favor of lamp hanging from a string tied to two poles?

"Also very interesting here is Josephus' note that in the Temple of Onias there was not the seven branched lam...Mehr anzeigen
9. August 2010 um 21:51 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson Onias IV did not want to include the seven branched menorah in his structures because of the polytheists. He had only one light, to symbolize the Tawhid, Oneness of Allah (swt).

The light was placed on top of a tall structure. It was in the same po...Mehr anzeigen
10. August 2010 um 09:17 · Gefällt mir · 2


Kazim Nawab Inshallah all will become clear when the Messiah comes.

Is there a historical source for that view on Onias and the Minorah?

Personally, I wonder, if he did this to draw a distinction between his followers and those of the Hasmoneans who booted him ...Mehr anzeigen
11. August 2010 um 00:34 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab "The menorah is one of the things that will be found by the Mahdi (Messiah) at the beginning of his rule."

As a Muslim, I believe, it was possibly one of the tokens shown to Muhammad p on his journey to the distant masjid, described in the Quran. Ins...Mehr anzeigen
11. August 2010 um 05:09 · Gefällt mir · 1


Ben Abrahamson Be'ezrat Hashem (Insha'Allah) I will discuss these things in more detail in additional facebook notes.
11. August 2010 um 08:00 · Gefällt mir · 1


Sepehr Mohamadi Ben, Have you any track of Messiah, The king of Israel and Messiah, the king of nations?
12. August 2010 um 13:52 · Gefällt mir


Kazim Nawab "Is there any refrence to "Chug" In Tanakh?"

As far as circling an altar is concerned I have read it in the OT:

Ps 26:6 6 I will make my hands clean from sin; so will I go round your altar, O Lord;...Mehr anzeigen
14. August 2010 um 17:16 · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi Great reference Mr Kazim,

The word for "go round" is "סבב"
14. August 2010 um 19:27 · Gefällt mir · 1


Kazim Nawab Sepehr,

Which seems syn. to Strong 2329 & 2328 chuwg or chuwg. Which is the root of Strong 2282 Chag in Ex 23: 14-17. But, I am not sure if this is what u r asking?

regards,...Mehr anzeigen
14. August 2010 um 23:42 · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi yes, it was helpful!
Thanks!
15. August 2010 um 15:51 · Gefällt mir


Kazi Azizul Huq Mohtaram Rabbi Ben Abrahamson's note is a wise and generous way to bring closer the Faithfuls to fulfill Divine Will. May Allah Bless him.
27. August 2010 um 12:55 · Gefällt mir


Mareeam Muhammad Allahu Akbar! May Allah guide us, to the right path. I've learnt so much here.
12. Oktober 2010 um 21:17 via Handy · Gefällt mir


Sepehr Mohamadi Ben, Can you provide the exact reference for this claim:

The border of the land of Egypt during Onias IV / Ptolemy VI Philometor's day was Arabia.
6. November 2010 um 21:32 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson When Alexander died in 323 BC he left no heir to the throne. his general Ptolemy Lagi was awarded Egypt, Palestine, Arabia, and Peterea.

Ptolemy II held on to most of the territories conquered by his father, though his control was tenuous at times. Nu...Mehr anzeigen
7. November 2010 um 11:10 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson Ptolemy VI Philometor soon lost control of that area, but we know that Mark Antony in 35CE, reaffirmed the claims of Ptolemaic Egypt when he gave Cleopatra VII, daughter of Ptolemy Auletes,Cyprus, the Cilician coast, Phoenicia, Coele-Syria, Judea and Arabia. Ptolemaic garrisons were again stationed in Arabia.
7. November 2010 um 11:49 · Gefällt mir


Arie Qurniawan Dear Ben Abrahamson, thanks for the note.

Do you have any literature study related to the similarity of counterclockwise direction between Abrahamic pilgrimage ritual and revolution of the planet?

Usually your friend (Adnan Oktar) have interest on the relation between religion and science, so perhaps we can learn something that maybe there is hidden message from Allah to human trough this ritual.
8. August 2011 um 17:11 · Gefällt mir


Ben Abrahamson The "metaphysical" reason I have heard is that a person looking at the people will see them going from left to right, which represents strictness to kindness.
8. August 2011 um 18:31 · Gefällt mir


Sami Amin salamo allaykom
9. August 2011 um 00:43 · Gefällt mir


Imran Khan See his This Article
17. Juni um 20:58 · Gefällt mir


Imran Khan Saeed Talpur!
17. Juni um 20:58 · Gefällt mir

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