Cloth bar tape question

[Tom Norton]

I have had the supplies,for doing cloth tape with twine, sitting for some time. Now with my recently aquired Velo Orange Polyvalent I think it might be time to put them to use.
But have a question. I was wondering about prewrapping the bars with an old inner tube to provide more cushion.
Would like to hear from those of you with cloth bar tape.
Thanks!

[Scott Henry]

What were you wondering?   Should you do it?   Sure.

If you like cushion on your bars its a good thing.   I either pad with tubes, foam or just cork tape.   The cloth tape then goes on, then the shellack.

I don't wear gloves though and like thin bars.   Often I will just lay some foam rubber on the top surface of the bars, I never understood padding the bottom of bars....

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[Brian Campbell]

IME it makes the bars very thick feeling. If your hands are sore or numb while riding, that is a issue of fitting. Adding padding, for me, only offers temporary relief for improper fit. Maybe bring the bars up a bit or adjust your saddle for a different reach to the bars?

I found that adding an initial layer of cloth tape, that I did not overlap ends on provided a nice compromise. I then wrapped a second layer of clth tape in the normal manner.

On Wednesday, November 1, 2017 at 9:29:41 AM UTC-4, Scott Henry wrote:

What were you wondering?   Should you do it?   Sure.

If you like cushion on your bars its a good thing.   I either pad with tubes, foam or just cork tape.   The cloth tape then goes on, then the shellack.

I don't wear gloves though and like thin bars.   Often I will just lay some foam rubber on the top surface of the bars, I never understood padding the bottom of bars....

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 8:43 AM, Tom Norton <tnort...@gmail.com> wrote:

I have had the supplies,for doing cloth tape with twine, sitting for some time. Now with my recently aquired Velo Orange Polyvalent I think it might be time to put them to use.
But have a question. I was wondering about prewrapping the bars with an old inner tube to provide more cushion.
Would like to hear from those of you with cloth bar tape.
Thanks!

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[Reed Kennedy]

In the past I have padded with typical “cork” (aka plastic foam) bar tape before wrapping cloth over that and shellacking. Since the underlying foam tape has some give to it and the hardened shellac doesn’t, the shellac ended up with a lattice of tiny cracks in it. This was with platinum (nearly clear) shellac on bright red Newbaums, and  while it looked great at first it eventually resulted in a matte, cloudy appearance. Still felt ok, but I was unhappy with the look of it. Perhaps it would be less obvious with a darker shellac or less vibrantly colored cloth tape? Dunno. 

Jan Heine said somewhere that bar padding isn’t needed if you put your bars in the right place, so I tried that next. So far so good! Even though I have big hands I like the narrower feel of the bars, and the shellac looks and lasts better. 

Short version: You can pad under cloth and shellac, but it won’t be or look the same. 

A pic of the aforementioned under-padded bars with cloudy appearance:

Best,

Reed

[Reed Kennedy]

Looks like that photo didn’t make it. Let’s try a link:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/GF3u2gEDwPp2SbgJ2

Best, 

Reed

[Matthew J]

Jan Heine said somewhere that bar padding isn’t needed if you put your bars in the right place, so I tried that next. So far so good! Even though I have big hands I like the narrower feel of the bars, and the shellac looks and lasts better. 

My take as well.  I wear gloves when it is cold, not otherwise.  With proper placement, cloth on bar is does well enough for me.    

On a recent visit to my sister in Nantucket I rented a road bike.  The padded tape did not prevent numbness with the poorly set bars on the rental.

[Matthew J]

Speaking of cloth bar tape - I am sadly down to my last roll of Viva/Toshi yellow.  Newbaum's is an acceptable but not perfect substitute. 

Some Japanese sites that do not ship to the US appear to have yellow available.  Guess I have to visit the land of the rising sun soon.

[Tom Norton]

Thanks for the replies! I think I will forego the padding.

[Tom Norton]

Wrapping question. I was watching the Rivendell video and it appears they cut the tape at the brake lever then start again. Is there a reason for this?
Those of you who have wrapped with cloth how did you go about it?

[Greg Achtem]

Been awhile since I watched that Riv clip. But I really like this method.

https://velo-orange.blogspot.ca/2014/02/wrapping-handlebars-alex-singer-style.html

No whipping or taping needed. The downside for me is that it makes it difficult to move brake levers if needed.

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 10:46 AM, Tom Norton <tnort...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wrapping question. I was watching the Rivendell video and it appears they cut the tape at the brake lever then start again. Is there a reason for this?
Those of you who have wrapped with cloth how did you go about it?

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[Reed Kennedy]

Tom, cutting the tape like that lets you work around the lump of the installed brake lever body. I have found a different way to manage, which is more work but gives a result I prefer:

1) Place the brake levers, tape down the handlebar bands, remove brake levers.

2) Start wrapping bar tape near the stem clamp and wrap until the cloth covers the brake lever band on one side (so the brake lever body will clamp over it when the brake lever is installed).

3) Cut off rest of cloth tape.

4) With rest of tape, start wrapping same bar at the bar end. Don't stick any in the hole, just do it like you did near the clamp. Make sure to spiral the same way you did in step 2.

5) Tape will naturally cover the other side of the brake lever band 

6) Install brake lever body, which will clamp down over both cloth tape ends, one on each side.

7) Repeat steps 2-5 with other side of handlebar. 

8) Shove wine corks in the ends.

9) Cover bike frame and components if you don't like splatter, or invite chaos in to your life and live dangerously.

10) Shellac 3-6 coats, until desired color and finish, generally one coat in the morning and one at night.

Advantage of the above: 

No loose ends to twine or electrical tape. 

No need for a cut section of tape behind the levers, no weird winds around the level, so bulk back there.

A super regular pretty looking wrap. Durable too.

Disadvantages:

Real fiddly. 

If you are using aero brake levers, real real fiddly.

If you are using STI, give up now. (And why are you using cloth tape and shellac?!?)

The red-bars photo I posted previously doesn't show this method. Here's a not-great photograph that does:

I should take better pictures when I get that bike back.

Best,

Reed

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 9:46 AM, Tom Norton <tnort...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wrapping question. I was watching the Rivendell video and it appears they cut the tape at the brake lever then start again. Is there a reason for this?
Those of you who have wrapped with cloth how did you go about it?

[Tom Norton]

After looking at the VO way and then the idea of temporarily removing the brake lever I am liking the " no twine" look.
Any buyers for a ball of twine!

[Louis]

After years of taping bars I'm somewhat bewildered that taping from both directions has never occurred to me. I, however, really like the twine look, so from now on I shall employ both methods. Thanks to the above posters for the enlightenment.

Louis Pastor

Norton Ohio US

[Michael Mann]

I use only cloth tape on my own bikes, and since i learned to do a harlequin wrap that's all I do now. Took a few tries to get it down but the end result is worth it. I do two wraps per side, end to brake lever, center to brake lever. No twine, ends hidden under hood, shellac holds it all down.

Only time I use twine on a wrap is for straight-ish or upright bars where the wrap is all on one side of the brake lever. But i still do a harlequin wrap even if it's short.

Mike M

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 9:46 AM, Tom Norton <tnort...@gmail.com> wrote:

Wrapping question. I was watching the Rivendell video and it appears they cut the tape at the brake lever then start again. Is there a reason for this?
Those of you who have wrapped with cloth how did you go about it?

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Michael Mann

[Tom Norton]

Reed,
I just reread your post and I really like this idea. What kind of tape do you use to hold the brake clamps?

[David Banzer]

Grand Bois has it in Viva tape stock. They ship to the US.
http://www.cyclesgrandbois.com/SHOP/BT_viva.html

[Reed Kennedy]

Hey Tom,

I just use simple electrical tape because it is what I have around. Two pieces, making an X in the back (inside of the hook of the drop). 

3M stuff seems to stick best: https://www.amazon.com/3M-Temflex-1700-Electrical-10-Pack/dp/B008CVPF7W/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1509576192&sr=8-4&keywords=3m+electrical+tape&dpID=41XXyw7uD6L&preST=_SX300_QL70_&dpSrc=srch

It's a little stretchy though, so you have to be careful not to move the brake clamp/band thing. Next time I might try this sorta foil tape, which doesn't stretch:

https://www.amazon.com/Aluminum-Tape-Foil-Ducts-Insulation/dp/B01FROBUXE/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1509576256&sr=8-3&keywords=duct+tape+metal

Lemme know if you have any questions, I could take a shot at taking better photos.

Best,

Reed

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 2:20 PM, Tom Norton <tnort...@gmail.com> wrote:

Reed,
I just reread your post and I really like this idea. What kind of tape do you use to hold the brake clamps?

[Reed Kennedy]

Hey Matthew,

What do you like better about the Viva / Toshi tape? I love the Newbaums stuff, but I've never tried the other one. What am I missing out on?

Best,

Reed

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 7:21 AM, Matthew J <matth...@gmail.com> wrote:

Speaking of cloth bar tape - I am sadly down to my last roll of Viva/Toshi yellow.  Newbaum's is an acceptable but not perfect substitute. 

Some Japanese sites that do not ship to the US appear to have yellow available.  Guess I have to visit the land of the rising sun soon.

--

[Matthew Joly]

Reed:  Viva cotton is thicker and has a plush almost satin like feel. Viva rolls are shorter than Newbaums and the cotton seems to get dirtier faster. So not like it’s night and day better. Just more luxurious I guess. 

Sent from my iPhone

[satanas]

Harlequin tape?!? I'm of the opinion that Henry Ford had the right idea - "You can have any colour you like, as long as it's black." Since bar tape always ends up black IME - assuming the bike is actually ridden - you may as well avoid flouting the 2nd law of thermodynamics and just start out with black. Plus it goes with everything. Just saying.

"Black is the new black." :-)

Later,
Stephen

[Michael Mann]

Couple thousand miles on this so far. Just say no to black tape.
Mike
Sent from my iPhone

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[Matthew J]

Thanks David.  Guess my searches did not pick up the site.  They had only one yellow left, unfortunately.  Still bought so I could (possibly) have one last Viva hurrah!

[Matthew J]

Viva is thicker and has a more velvet like feel than Newbaums.  The color is more vivid.  Viva rolls contain less tape and seems to get dirty faster.  Principally the indulgence is what appeals to me.

On Wednesday, November 1, 2017 at 5:47:36 PM UTC-5, Reed Kennedy wrote:

Hey Matthew,

What do you like better about the Viva / Toshi tape? I love the Newbaums stuff, but I've never tried the other one. What am I missing out on?

Best,

Reed

On Wed, Nov 1, 2017 at 7:21 AM, Matthew J <matth...@gmail.com> wrote:

Speaking of cloth bar tape - I am sadly down to my last roll of Viva/Toshi yellow.  Newbaum's is an acceptable but not perfect substitute. 

Some Japanese sites that do not ship to the US appear to have yellow available.  Guess I have to visit the land of the rising sun soon.

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[Evan Estern]

I like my bars with just cloth tape and shellac.  I'll second the idea of wrapping from the stem towards the brake levers, then wrapping from the bar end towards the brake levers.  Really clean looking and durable (if you shellac). No twine or tape required.  I first read about it here, and these are great general instructions:

http://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2009/01/shellac-and-bar-tape-guide.html

I don't bother to mix my own shellac, I buy Zinzer's Clear at the hardware store.  I like Newbaums tape and the method above will require 3 rolls.  Expensive, I guess, but once shellaced it seems to last indefinitely.  I apply about 6-8 coats with a disposable bristle brush (store in ziplock bag between coats), with about an hour between coats.  Shellac darkens the tape considerably and some colors take on a reddish hue which is not always pleasant.  I had gray tape on for a while that turned a nasty shade of brown.  Last couple of bars I did with Newbaums blue tape and it darkened to a lovely dark navy very close to the Berthoud bag color. 

[Steve Palincsar]

I can see where shellac might help with the big problem with wrapping
bars that way: the wrap just "inboard" of the brake hood, where you rest
your hands, tends to separate and slide down when you wrap from the stem
to the levers.  Shellac would paste the layers down, so they couldn't
slide apart, provided you put on enough coats.

--
Steve Palincsar
Alexandria, Virginia
USA

[Evan Estern]

It totally eliminates that problem.  I've done 3 sets of bars so far.  No slipping or separating over many thousands of miles.  They just keep looking better as they age.

[Mark Guglielmana]

I've been wrapping my bars with an old inner tube, split down the middle so it's more like tape, for three decades. It doesn't really give more cushion, but it does increase the bar diameter to match what my hands want. I don't have really large hands, but I do have very large palms. A standard drop handlebar with one wrap of tape digs into my palms - the bars are just too skinny for them. One wrap of inner tube + one wrap of tape is perfect for me. YMMV

I used to do this with plastic tape, now I do it with cloth + shellac. Same effect. 

I do have one bike with cork tape over inner tube. Cinelli cork tape does provide a bit of cushion.