Re: Crust Lightning Bolt Disc, V2

[David Parsons]

On Monday, May 4, 2020 at 1:09:07 PM UTC-7, Sean PNW wrote:

There have been a few postings recently about the new batch of Lightning Bolts(LB) and I thought that instead of burying this info in an already super long thread centered primarily around the initial V1 LB, I'd start a new thread catered toward this second version of framesets.

Pics - https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-FXzisx-sFQbza_Nk4dnjFb2NB5KKg8b

That's a really nice fork.    A handmade airplane crown is not something you see everyday.

-david parsons

[Andrew Demack]

That's a beautiful looking frame IMHO ... it really doesn't look like a production frame. I cannot think of another fillet-brazed production bike, TIG welding has been ubiquitous on steel production bikes at most price points since the 90s.

--Andrew in Brisbane.

On Tuesday, 5 May 2020 06:09:07 UTC+10, Sean PNW wrote:

There have been a few postings recently about the new batch of Lightning Bolts(LB) and I thought that instead of burying this info in an already super long thread centered primarily around the initial V1 LB, I'd start a new thread catered toward this second version of framesets.

Pics - https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-FXzisx-sFQbza_Nk4dnjFb2NB5KKg8b

I ordered a medium on a Sat just over a week ago and it arrived today, a Monday, UPS tried to deliver it on Friday but of course it was during the only hour of the day I wasn't home while walking the dog, Murphy's Law.

Overall I'm very pleased with the frameset, it checks many boxes for me no other production frame has been able to achieve, thin standard gauge tubing, low trail, thru axle, enough but not too many braze ons, etc.

The following are merely observations, things I wasn't aware off, weren't particularly clear on the site, oddities, etc; in no way am I trying to disparage Matt or Crust, I'm well aware how difficult it is source/manufacture products like this at this scale and am consistently amazed by how much he's able to get done with so little. I'm thrilled he's brought this frameset to the market, b/c as I mentioned above, I can't think of any other that offers the combination this does w/o going full custom.

The fillets all look nice, no visible voids in the brass, and smooth transitions with no evidence the steel was touched as they were filed/ground down.

I've seen the color mentioned a few different places and is different from the green tinted clear coat of the last batch, the box lists it as 'GOLDEN TINTED CLEAR COAT' and in person it looks nice, showing off much of the frame's unique character, though the fillets on the frame tend to stand out a bit more than on the fork. It's not much of a concern for me as I intend to repaint after adding a few braze-ons/changes, as explained below.

The box also lists the medium as a 57.5cm despite the frame measuring ST-55.2cm(c-c) / TT-55.4cm(c-c), which my rough measurement via tape measure validates.

The fork is a 1" THREADLESS, which could be a problem for some, Crust did release a small batch of tall 1" threadless steel stems but as of my writing this there's only one left in stock at 80mm in length.

I've a few steel 1" threadless stems in my parts stash I'll build with in addition to the Miche Primato 1" needle bearing headset I bought for this project. They're pretty light, have clean looking silver alloy cups, rebuildable, the needle bearings help mitigate shimmy w/the low trail front end, and they can still be found NOS for pretty cheap on eBay/etc.

The fork has 2x threaded fender mounts under the crown that are set at an angle, a nice touch, and provisions for internal dynamo wiring up the right leg with the upper hole reinforced by a star braze on and the lower without.

The frame however does not have a port on the underside of the DT for internal dynamo wiring, so you'll have to add one if you want to run an integrated tail light, however the 3rd bottle mount on the underside of the DT has an extra boss to enable an anything cage.

The internal brake routing along the TT is a continuous piece of tubing so the housing enters and exits easily.

The BB shell lacks a drain hole, so might be advisable to add one or two, depending upon your climate, when you treat/frame saver the frame internals.

The ST and SS bridges both have integrated threaded fender mounts, although the ST bridge mount is a bit odd in that its also drilled and mildly dimpled on the top as well.

Placed on my decently accurate kitchen scale the frame and fork, with stainless button head screws as pictured and thru axles in place, weigh as follows:

Fork w/16" uncut steerer - 1,325 g / 2 lb, 14.7398 oz

Frame - 2,330 g / 5 lb, 2.1883 oz

Overall I'm thrilled with the frameset, it's 97% what I want, far more than any other production frame has ever offered per my tastes. I'll be making a few slight modifications to make it 100% exactly what I want, including:

-Reinforced dynamo wiring port on the underside of the DT

-Mount to the ST for a Velo Lumino tail light

-Rubber chain slap mounts to the drive side CS

-Possible pump pegs for a Lezyne to either the ST or non drive side SS, depending on fit/clearance

As a result, I'll more than likely end up repainting the frame and fork along with one of the older 1" steel threadless stems from my stash and the rack/decaleur I settle upon; strong odds it'll be a shade of grey or black.

Thanks Matt/Crust, the frame is great and just what I've been looking for, bravo!

[Murray Watson]

This is quite the update on V1 isn't it? I thought the V1 was much beefier tubing (OS) and 1 1/8 steerer, or am I misremembering?

Murray Watson - Bungendore, Australia

[Chuck Anderson]

Thanks for all that.  I wavered for weeks between the disc & canti versions before eventually ordering the latter.  No fancy brazing or gorgeous biplane crown, but the relatively understated tig-welded frame has grown on me.  Hope to have all the bits in place to put this together within a couple weeks.

For a rough weight comparison, I plopped the frame and fork, as-is with no QR or anything, on my own kitchen scale. 

frame: 4 lb, 7.6 oz

fork: 1 lb, 13.0 oz

[Cary Weitzman]

Sean PNW

May 5, 2020 at 5:24 AM

Yes, the V1 frames were 1 1/8” threadless, but I'm not certain of what tubing spec they were.

Its not clear to me why they shifted to 1” with the V2s, but they definitely have nice light gauge tubing, particularly in the XS/S/M frames:

“Down tube on sizes XS, Small and Medium is 28.6, 0.75/0.45/0.75
Top tube on sizes XS, Small and Medium is 25.4, 0.7/0.4/0.75
Down tube on sizes Large and XL is 31.8 -0.8/0.5/0.8
Top tube is sizes Large and XL 28.6 – 0.8/0.5/0.8”

Phew. Most of the time I'm just the tiniest bit annoyed with how poor Matts's communication skills are. For example, if you wanted to know the tube specs for the Canti LB before it actually went on sale you had to either be part of the Crust "insider" crowd or be prepared to read all the comment threads on every Crust Instagram post. Then the specs appeared on the Crust web site initially and and have now disappeared.

In this case, it was a blessing. Had I know the Disc LB was going to have the same tubing spec as the Canti version beforehand, not to mention fillet brazed 853 as opposed to the canti LB's mystery tubing, I would have been wracked by indecision about which to get.

Very happy with my Canti LB, but not ideologically opposed to threadless 1" and thru axles.

Cary
PTBO.ON.CA

[Joseph Albert]

Beautiful frame and great information for interested parties. 

Sean's been helping me with my own build and I should have my frame by next Monday. 

As Sean knows, finding a 1" threadless stem had me running in circles but I eventually caved in and bought the one Crust supplies. Can anyone speculate as to why Matt may have made that decision?

[zybariver]

Likely for visual balance.  Maybe a little for weight savings.  A 25.4 top tube butted to a head tube sized for 1 1/8" steerer  looks out of whack to some of us.  Here is a close up of my Rawland rSogn, you can see the issue.  https://www.flickr.com/photos/29302617@N05/16883947795/in/datetaken/

I am not a fan, and it particularly bugged me that the diameter of every aluminum stem is greater than the top tube.  I ended up sourcing an old Salsa Cromoto S.U.L steel stem.

Pro tip - if you can find on of those Salsa stems that is the correct geometry for you, use a shim to fit your 1" steerer.  The outside diameter of 1" aluminum spacers is almost the same as the stem, so it works better than about anything other than custom.  Bonus: removable face plate.

https://www.sefiles.net/images/library/large/salsa_cromotothrdlss_08_m.jpg

Greg Walton

Seattle

[David Parsons]

On Tuesday, May 5, 2020 at 9:24:21 PM UTC-7, zybariver wrote:

Likely for visual balance.  Maybe a little for weight savings.  A 25.4 top tube butted to a head tube sized for 1 1/8" steerer  looks out of whack to some of us.  Here is a close up of my Rawland rSogn, you can see the issue.  https://www.flickr.com/photos/29302617@N05/16883947795/in/datetaken/

    Well, I think that's made worse by being (a) such a long headtube and (b) welded.   If those headtube welds been done as bilaminate joints with the lug part on the TT/DT it wouldn't be quite so obviously huge.

     I do 3t mutants; the steertube clamp is only slightly larger than a 1" HT and the swoopy lines of the stem hide a lot of the mass (eg: https://www.flickr.com/photos/tysasi/49800575277/in/datetaken/ )

    -david parsons

[C Lin]

Kona Roadhouse is brazed, the price reflects it as well

[Randall Daniels]

Thanks for the detailed info. I've mocked up LB builds several times but it's out of my budget for the time being. Wrt the frame weight, 5 pounds seems like a lot, without the bolts and TA it'd probably be right under, but still. Are the fillets that much of a contributor to the weight or am I missing something? A frame with those tubing profiles and 1" ht seems like it should weigh a lot less. The only other midtech supple frameset I've seen weight for is the Fairlight Secan and their M size is also right at 5 pounds and shares similar tubing specs. I know it likely doesn't matter for ride quality, just curious.

Randy Daniels Atlanta, GA

[Michael McArthur]

The 5 lbs for the LB frame isn't the head-scratcher so much as the 2.9lb fork. For comparison, my thru-axle unicrown NFE fork is ~ 1/3 lighter (and LB canti fork is reported to be just under 2lbs) and has 1 1/8" steerer. I like bi-plane forks looks as much as the next guy, but how is the LB disc fork getting so heavy? Is it the crown, steerer or fork blade spec? 

[Tim Quinlan]

Disc fork blades need to be stronger than rim brake fork blades. So that is probably a good portion of the difference.  

[Bob Ehrenbeck]

Can I get schooled on using those fender mounts on the underside of the fork crown (image 2945 in the OP)? (I've got a similar setup on my rSogn, and I might want to put fenders on it in the future.)

 

*  Why are there two threaded holes? Why not a single hole in the center of the head tube?

*  Which one of these holes is typically used?

I've used a daruma bolt for putting fenders on another bike, and it was pretty straightforward. The threaded-hole mount -- especially when the plate is angled --seems to be easier, but does the daruma setup provide more security (being that it involves a bolt that gets nutted)?

 

Bob E

Cranford, NJ

[Tim Quinlan]

I figured it was so you could use 2 bolts to secure your fender.

Tim, Pittsburgh, PA, USA

[Jocelyn]

Beautiful frame, thanks for the post and all the details! Always hard to find this kind of info on Crust bikes.

I'm also a bit surprised by the frame weight.
I just got a size large Bombora, and the frame comes at 2335g. The fork is much beefier thought, and weight 1468g with and uncut 16"/40cm steerer tube.

Would this mean that the Bombora has relatively similar tubing as the disc LB?

[Bob Ehrenbeck]

Thanks for the reply, Tim. 

I'm just used to seeing only one fastener used at each mount (as is done for the rear mounts and for the front when using a daruma), but I guess another screw up front doesn't hurt here.

Bob E

Cranford, NJ

[Hoffsta]

Damn, that looks really nice. I was hoping Matt would upgrade the rear dropouts to thru-axle for the V2 and he did. May have to sell something from the stable for this frame.

[arvi1000]

For comparison, I weighed my medium canti lightning bolt at 2037g / 824g for frame / fork (including 9 button head bolts in the water bottle and low rider bosses).