Ebisu All purpose

[Toby]

Does anyone have any experience with these frames?

[Max]

Yes. 700c and 650b. What would you like to know? 

- Max 

[Jerry Lynn]

I have brand new custom Moten-Orange, Ebisu All-Purpose/650B, it arrived a few months ago. It's gorgeous and clearly well crafted - not to mention surprisingly light weight. 

Problem though - it's too small for me. I need at least a 58cm C-C/ST, mine is 56cm. It's an "all-purpose" and I so assumed it came with rear-rack eyelet mounts - my error.

I hold myself 100% accountable for the miscues and regard my experience as an outlier; albeit an expensive one.

All the best,

Jerry

[Toby]

I'm looking for a fast and comfortable bike, that I can repair myself and keep for a long time. And I have a bunch of parts I would like to use, like Paul racer medium brakes, Chris King gripnut, phil wood bb, Nitto handlebar and stem etc. 

I was looking at Rivendell bikes, but found them to be overly decorative for normal use, whereas ebisu are the cleanest looking bikes I've seen. But I haven't owned a steel bike of this price range before, so I don't know what to expect compared to vintage frames or frames that cost one third of the price

[Sam Weinberg]

to me the primary difference between a low volume factory frame (eg. crust) and something from an individual frame builder is knowing you bought something made with artisan craftsmanship that supports a dwindling tradition. there’s a little more attention to detail and maybe some artistic flourishes you wouldn’t find from a taiwanese frame (not a slight against taiwanese frame builders).

is that worth $3500 to you? does your builder offer custom sizing and geometry? do they offer bespoke additions?

with any craftsman oriented hobby, there’s always a diminishing return as you reach towards the highest echelons of the craft. are they actually smoother? are they actually better made? do they actually handle better? maybe? probably? 

like buying and original painting instead of a print, sometimes perception is reality and sometimes owning high quality craftsmanship is just fun.

- sam

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[Greg J]

"But I haven't owned a steel bike of this price range before, so I don't know what to expect compared to vintage frames or frames that cost one third of the price"

Hiroshi (owner of Jitensha and designer of all Ebisu bikes) has been doing this a long time in his very elegant shop in Berkeley, and in fact was one of Grant's influences in the early days.  

I don't know that an Ebisu will be "better" than vintage high end frames assuming the vintage frame fits well and was built by an expert craftsman in the stye that you prefer.  What you will get with an Ebisu are:  (1) it should fit well (I'm not sure what happened with the other poster above, but I assume Hiroshi would fit you); (2)  you get proven design and proven quality; (3) it is new, so unlike vintage frames, you have no concerns about its history (damage/repair) or unseen issues; (4) it is modern so no compatibility issues (spreading the stays, tire clearance, brake reach) and modern materials (not that there's anything wrong with the old stuff); (5) it is handmade (hence the 3x cost in your scenario); and (6) if it matters, you're supporting a current company/craftsmen.

In other words, you could potentially buy a used or "production" frameset and get something just as good for lower cost.  But it would be a trial-and-error process, and it's entirely possible that you won't get there.  

What I don't know is whether Hiroshi would agree to spec an Ebisu with Paul Racers.

best, Greg 

(I don't have an Ebisu but have been going to Jitensha for ~25 years and have purchased one frameset from the shop)

[Max]

Toby, 

My Ebisu All Purpose bikes are very understated, but every functional detail is executed extremely well, with a very high level of craftsmanship. For example, the brake and chainstay bridges are brazed in equidistant from the hub, so that it's easy to get a good fenderline. The fork crowns have threaded mounting holes for the front fender. The 650b bike is "low trail" and works better with a front load. The 700c bike doesn't need a front load, yet steering is more on the "light" side, working well with a small front load. I don't like wheelflop, so these work well for me. 

One thing to note is that the All Purpose model uses cantilever brakes by default. Even though mine were made in the 21st century, the canti posts are spaced somewhat narrowly by modern standards. The benefit of that is that it minimizes "pad dive" (an issue affecting all cantilever designs in principle more than in practice), and maximizes mechanical advantage. The downside is that you're looking for combinations of  narrow-ish rims and cantilever designs that allow enough room between pad and rim. Shimano CX-50/70 are great in that regard, as are older cantis (e.g., Shimano XT and LX that use smooth post brake shoes). Finally, you mention that you'd like to use your Paul Racer Medium brakes, in which case you'd probably be looking at getting the Ebisu Road model, rather than an All Purpose, unless you have it custom-configured to omit the canti posts. 

I really like the Japanese color palette, so that is also part of the appeal of Ebisu for me. In short, it's a very understated frame / bike that is full of great details and function "up close" and in actual use. And oddly, when showing up at a typical group ride (which I don't do much anymore), this bike will stand out from the mass of molded plastic frames with their fat tubes and bulky stems. I prefer the older aesthetic. 

- Max "old skool" in A2

[belopol...@gmail.com]

Warning- showing up to a group ride on an Ebisu will prompt on-lookers to ask "Was this built in the 80s?" even if it is circa 2024 

[DB]

Lol.  I took mine to Scotland this Summer for a 600k.  Everyone was clowning my Ebisu so hard it was absurd.  I wouldn't expect an Ebisu to win you any friends among the carbon crowd.  

[Max]

Thinking a 60cm would fit me better, but still having good miles with this baby! 

- Max  

[Jerry Lynn]

a 58cm would fit me better than my new 56cm C-C All-Purpose/650B 56cm C-C that only collects dust

[Tyler Ryan]

Jerry, what is the top tube length?

[Jerry Lynn]

56cm C-C