How to go about getting quotes on metal printing

[Nathan Simers]

Looking to get my job into 3d printing metal. I have a few stainless 316 .25 hex threaded disks and think they are perfect to 3d print. If you have a ballpark figure on like 5000 of those and who to go to for this. I would really be grateful for this and really love the podcast.  

[TobyCWood]

Dang good question. All our experience of contracting metal prints were one offs, never production numbers.
Xometry, Protolabs… at least try them.

[Kurt at VRFX]

I agree w/Andy - I think Xometry is one of your best bets to get a quote. I will say, 5000 units is a pretty big # for getting something 3D Printed. And, I think - for printing of metal parts - that could get Very expensive. I know that 3D Systems also does metal 3D Printing - so, you may want to check their website and see if they offer it as a service.

-Kurt

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[Ron Frazier (3DPGRP)]

Shapeways might be able to do it. Probably not cheap.

Ron

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[Kurt at VRFX]

I think probably worst option - as its probably most expensive option. Their Biz is centered around people doing One-Offs, so, 5000 units - they probably will be a tough one to get volume pricing!

Just my WAG...

-K

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[jfka...@gmail.com]

I compare 3d printing vs machining to the offset printing on paper vs a copy machine. In the traditional print world on paper the magic number was about 1000. Anything over 1000 it made sense to commit a job to an offset press. There was of course a gray area around 1000-1500 where we would still use a BW or 4 color copy machine. I imagine the number for 3d print is far lower, maybe 100 or so, to break over to machining. This of course is only true if the part can be machined at all. There are things you can do with a 3d printer that can never be machined. With a custom infill a part can cost 10x what a machined part would be, however over the useful life of the part many times that in $ can be saved due to lower part weight. 

[LukeH]

Sometimes 3D printing metal is the only way to produce the desired results. Some techniques allow you to to do multi material prints, printing steel, stainless steel, copper, nickel, and titanium together on the same job. Some even allow you to use custom alloys, or even change the alloy composition in the fly for different parts of the print.

Some technologies even combine laser sintered powder and deposition via what is effectively TIG welding in the same machine at the same time to produce metal objects that until now could not be made by humans.

Very powerful technology. Way more sophisticated that plastics printing. 

[jfka...@gmail.com]

Cool stuff for sure. Aren't they 3d printing jet engine fan blades now and probably many other parts. They are able to print the parts semi hollow with a custom infill. They retain the strength of the solid machined part at 1/2 the weight. I think the show I watch said the reduced weight pays for itself many times over the life of the engine and reduces wear on other engine components at the same time. A huge investment, but one that should pay off in a short amount of time. 

[Luke Hartfiel]

Sounds plausible. 

I was at a trade show a couple of years ago where someone was displaying titanium alloy turbine blades with copper bearing surfaces, all printed in one go, which through both destructive and non-destructive testing were shown to meet the requirements for the high speed application of the part it was replacing, but was actually both cheaper and faster to produce.

On 11 Jul 2022, at 7:21 am, jfka...@gmail.com <jfka...@gmail.com> wrote:

Cool stuff for sure. Aren't they 3d printing jet engine fan blades now and probably many other parts. They are able to print the parts semi hollow with a custom infill. They retain the strength of the solid machined part at 1/2 the weight. I think the show I watch said the reduced weight pays for itself many times over the life of the engine and reduces wear on other engine components at the same time. A huge investment, but one that should pay off in a short amount of time. 

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[jfka...@gmail.com]

Are the "printers" big enough to do it all in one piece or do they still bolt the blades to a hub? I imagine it would be better to bolt them on a hub anyway so a single blade could be replaced if it develops a stress fracture over time. 

I'm sure the raw material for printing per pound is much higher than an equivalent chuuk of titanium in weight, but there is far less waste and overall material used if printed. It sounds like a perfect application GE kicks out about 4 engines per day. So they must have a "farm" of printers to keep up with production. 

[Kurt at VRFX]

Hell - U kidding?

I did a couple interviews with Relativity Space, here in Long Beach, CA - and they CLAIM that they 3D Print the Whole Damn Rockets!!!

Feel free to look them up online.

I ALSO went to a presentation by 3D Systems a couple months ago - and saw some REALLY Cool 3D Printed metal parts - INCLUDING Rockets engines and more!

Yup - Metal Printing kinda Rock-ets!!!

-K

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[Luke Hartfiel]

The one I saw and touched was printed all in one piece, and was perfectly balanced. It wasn’t large (as in it must have weighed less than 5kg/11lbs), but I was told that was just because it is the object they drag through airports to trade shows, not because it was the largest thing they could print in one go.

And it wouldn’t just be large turbines for power generation (be that steam turbines, gas turbine, jet engines, etc), but also think rotary compressors, turbo chargers, and the like.

Basically anything that can take advantage of complexly metallurgy (different alloys with different performance characteristics) in complex shapes.

I read an article not so long back about Naval Group (the French shipbuilder), 3D printing propellers for the French navy that were 5m across and weighed about one tonne. That was a big deal because the lead time for a traditionally manufactured propellor is about 18 months, and this reduced it to a few weeks, which reduces the cost and depth of the spares a navy needs to carry and store, and translates to big cost savings overall.

On 11 Jul 2022, at 8:47 am, jfka...@gmail.com <jfka...@gmail.com> wrote:

Are the "printers" big enough to do it all in one piece or do they still bolt the blades to a hub? I imagine it would be better to bolt them on a hub anyway so a single blade could be replaced if it develops a stress fracture over time. 

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/3d-printing-tips--tricks/7346bc6e-e6ba-4456-aa91-d7881bf7a84fn%40googlegroups.com.