"rapid" filaments

[Jeff Ratner]

Just saw an ad from Hatchbox for their new "rapid" PETG. Anyone know the difference between regular and "rapid" filaments? What is different to allow them to be printed faster? What happens if you print them at "regular" speeds, not especially fast? Do the prints come out different than regular filaments?

[Levi Smith]

I don't know the details but can definitely tell you that there are differences as I tried a roll of Duramic PETG on my Anycubic S1 with "normal"(high speed) settings and  it was horrid.  Layers were barely bonding at all and actual pieces of filament just sticking out all over on the print.  Then I noticed the label on the spool said "recommended 70mm/s print speed".  So I went in and changed all the settings I could find for actual filament speeds down to there and it started working correctly.

However, I've used at least one other "normal" spool of PETG that's printing at high speed just fine...

On Wed, Apr 23, 2025 at 9:09 PM Jeff Ratner <jeff117...@gmail.com> wrote:

Just saw an ad from Hatchbox for their new "rapid" PETG. Anyone know the difference between regular and "rapid" filaments? What is different to allow them to be printed faster? What happens if you print them at "regular" speeds, not especially fast? Do the prints come out different than regular filaments?

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[Jody Harris]

I've been wondering, too. I finally picked up some VoxelPLA "VOXELPETG+ HS (Pro) 1.75mm Filament (1kg) (PETG+)" out of curiosity. My son printed a almost 1Kg, 49 hour​​ dice tower as soon as it came out of the dryer on the old Prusa Mk3S..... NOT ONE STRING in the whole print. It looks gorgeous. The sharp overhangs are obviously PETG-droopy, but the print looks perfect all things considered.

I haven't take time to do any speed tuning with it, but at my stock PETG settings, this stuff prints great.

• Can it handle heat like regular PETG? Don't know
• Impact resistance? Don't know
• Creep? Don't know
• Long term UV durability? Don't know

(all things I use PETG and PCTG for.)

But it LOOKS great right off the build plate.

-j

Think carefully

On Wednesday, April 23rd, 2025 at 7:09 PM, Jeff Ratner <jeff117...@gmail.com> wrote:

Just saw an ad from Hatchbox for their new "rapid" PETG. Anyone know the difference between regular and "rapid" filaments? What is different to allow them to be printed faster? What happens if you print them at "regular" speeds, not especially fast? Do the prints come out different than regular filaments?

[Kurt Gluck]

My issue is I like to have some idea whats in my fillament.   Printed Solid PLA is PLA, their PETG is PETG and their PLA ELIXAR is PLA with some TPU.    Likewise Mitch at Polar seems very open about what he is doing. 

I dont really want to print toys and stuff with things like Talc in it.   

Kurt-A (the other Kurt, not the evil one )

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!!]

Levi - VERY Interesting feedback - especially since you posted that in another Thread here. 

Jeff - Ditto - VERY Interesting post here. I'd love to hear more feedback from folks!

Interesting WHY???

Cause, over time - folks talk about 3D Printing - and the problems with it being SO DAMN Slow! Up till now - most of the Tech changes have been related to HOW to make a printer go faster - like Core-XY as the biggest Example - as well as things like increasing Nozzle sizes & bigger layer heights - as well as things like slicer changes including lower Infill, Fewer Perimeters - stuff like that. 

So - the idea of going faster based upon the formulation of the filament - that is a TOTALLY Different Angle! I'd LOVE to see what Andy has to say! 

Keep in mind - there are PHYSICS involved - in regards to Melt Chambers in a nozzle - that limits speed of printing, or rather - speed of Throughput of filament thru the Hot End!

But, would LOVE to see Serious Testing of a filament like this - to see the TRUE Implications!!!

Heck - final joke - Go Fast or Go Home!

-K

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!!]

Jody - how DARE You speak of your son doing a GREAT 49 Hour print - and yet - you did NOT SHARE A PIC!!!

I AM SO ANGRY WITH YOU!!!!

OF course - Mr. Doppelgänger would say - HERE We Go - Proof of Evil Kurt!

Stilll........

Come On Jody - I DEMAND A Pic!

Who knows - maybe if you do so - I might reveal some of my New Deep Dive into the world of AI!

Yeah - as my Dad would say - Is that a Threat or a Promise? - Butt - it's Def a  Threat!

-K

On Thursday, April 24, 2025 at 10:18:45 AM UTC-4 Jody Harris wrote:

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!!]

So - Mr. Non-Evil-Kurt, what's the deal with Talc? Is it ACTUALLY in some filaments?

I'm Honestly curious! 

And - yeah - I DO Understand where you're coming from - and not wanting to breath in more dangerous particles...

Did I tell you how I got SICK - or rather - Filled my Lungs with Plastic particles in the Height of Covid - Circa Feb 2020 - working at Northrop-Gumman - and agreeing to Quarantine myself at home - to work remotely - but NOT BECAUSE I had Covid - but, I KNEW my Lungs were filled with plastic particles & VOC's - and I literally told my manager - I know I didn't have Covid, and was not REAL Sick - but, I was going to work Remote. Yeah - I started really coughing up Phlem - or really Gagging it up - and, knowing post from the past in the 3DP world - I KNEW what I did to myself - and, I took a time to stay AWAY from coworkers - until my lungs Cleared up - which they did in about a WEEK! And - yeah - it wasn't till AFTER I messed up my lungs - that I went - DUHHHHH - - WTF - I did it to myself! 

So - Been There - Done That...

-K

[Kurt Gluck]

This YouTube video with Mitch from Polar as a guest was very interesting: https://www.youtube.com/live/1HtGT565Tw0?si=dul10rMLFurohz1G Around the 48 minute mark Mitch is jokeing about PLA vs PLA+ and his urge to produce PLA- :-)

I am away from my PC but on my ipad when I skim through the transcript I see at least that calcium carbonate for example its a filler. 

I do remember TALC from the episode.

Now let’s discuss TALC: https://www.bcpp.org/resource/johnson-and-johnsons-toxic-talc-a-timeline-toward-victory/. 

I dont want to get into a debate with folks who say “it hasn’t killed me so its fine” since unlike you my lungs did not fill up with plastic instead about 20 years ago my lungs got real real bad for no known reason. My Pulseox droped to 86.  Anyway Lots of steroids for 9 months and I recovered - the steroids left me with diabetes.  

Anyway Talc can be ok, or it can contain asbestos etc.. so can lots of other stuff - I mean there was that entire controversy about recycled black plastics having toxic flame retardens in them: https://www.acsh.org/news/2024/12/23/dont-throw-out-your-black-plastic-spatulas-49201 - I mean sure how much of a risk is a debate…. But basically as I understand it when you are making fillament as long as the ‘crap’ you shove in is less than like 50% and not incompatible   the good 50% will do fine. 

So there is a temptation to add whatever since of course we buy it by weight. The heavier the additive the better :-).   

Some additives will make it flow better and print better …. But just because it prints better doesnt mean it’s food safe.  Now of course because of the gaps and layer lines and the inability to run it through a dishwasher you cant print food safe stuff… BUT when making a toy for a relative I think we can all agree that its better to do so out of relatively safer materials.  Sure my parents generation had Lead toy soldiers and my generation had chemistry sets with actual Mercury that we played with (fun stuff) - maybe thats why I have some loss of feeling in my fingers :-).  And I am sure there are risks not thought of or invented yet for my grand children - but that doesnt mean I want to expose them to risks that I know about under the view that ehh everyone dies of something.

Kurt-A

[John Schneider]

Most of the additives aren't talc, but calcium carbonate. 

Polymaker is a masterclass in marketing spin - their entire Polyterra line of filament is simply PLA + about 30% calcium carbonate. It's typically used as a filler material, and they spun it as a low cost, earth-friendly, matte 3D printing material. When what they really did was stuff it with filler lol

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/3d-printing-tips--tricks/af98ef34-1596-432c-8c9d-db0c1c4930cen%40googlegroups.com.

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Best Regards,

John Schneider

CEO

 

www.3dfuel.com

Cell: 701-318-0686

Email: jschn...@3dfuel.com

[Kurt Gluck]

Thanks John.  Yeah I didnt say that most was Talc, just that there is random ‘stuff’ in non trivial quantities and that I prefer to buy fillament where I have some assurance that its almost all what I think it is and not random things.  Also, I do find Talc highly concerning considering that some Talc is probably not a good idea. 

I do think that perhaps we would all be better served it the stuff was sold by length and not weight :-) 

Kurt-A

[Joseph Larson]

Theoretically they're designed to melt easier and flow better. However, sometimes it's nothing but a label change. 

[Jody Harris]

I received an email yesterday from a filament manufacturer yesterday saying exactly that.

From Numakers:
PETG-HS, formerly known as PETG Economy, is undergoing a transition. While our packaging and labels may still display PETG Economy, rest assured, the filament quality and performance remain the same.

Think carefully

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[Vishal Pai]

Many manufacturers are using HF as a gimmick so that the fast printer crowds will adopt this material. 

A flow modifier additive STPA229C started to be added to PETG back in 2018-19 to make color dispersion better. Previous PETGs would look translucent because of the base grain being slightly translucent. Adding this flow modifier increased pigment dispersion and made the PETG filament flow better during the manufacturing process and look opaque as a final product.

In the race to the bottom several cheaper grades of PETG are now available from $1.5/kg of grain. These are anywhere from 1st grade industrial waste to PET contaminated PETG waste. Adding STPA229C to these low quality grains will make them 3D Printable however there are tradeoffs. 

1.Contaminated r-petg can off gas dangerous fumes when printing.

2. Adding this paraffin based additive means you get prints faster but the shelf life post printing gets substantially reduced. As the olefins in the print start evaporating from ageing, you will see layers delaminating and the underlying print absorbing more humidity and eventually going brittle. 

3. The shelf life once the vacuum packing is opened goes down. Think the filament dryer will remove the humidity? It will also remove the olefins added making the filament unprintable. 

Disclaimer: This is not a diss or commentary on any filament brands mentioned on this thread. They could have their own formulations which I am not familiar with.  

Best

Vishal

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[Kurt Gluck]

Vishal

Great information THANKS!    Anyway as I said,  Mitch at Polar seems to say he doesnt put lots of crap in.  The dudes at Printed Solid also say things like that to me.   I am willing to pay a slight premium to get fillament made in the US or the EU because I feel it is less likely to have as you say industrial-waste in it.    Note I say “less likely”.       I have 3DFuel and Atomic on my list of other places to try.    I like buying fillament from companies that are selling fillament THEY make and not relabeling others products.

Currently I mostly print Printed Solid,  Prusament and Polar.   I have not been as successful with Printed Solid PETG as I would like but their PLA and PLA-Elixer (PLA with TPU they say, but who knows) are great.     Polar I have bought their PLA, their Pink is more Barbie like for my granddaughters.      

I am interested in 3Dfuels PCTG (is that right?) since I like to use PETG for supports for PLA and trying vise-versa.   My biggest problem with that is I find the PrintedSolid PETG needs a 90 degree bed and their PLA wants a 60.   If the bed is 60 the PETG doesnt stick and if it’s 90 the PLA slowly ‘melts :-(‘.    I am not sure but that PCTG? Looks like it can stand a slightly warmer bed. On the otherhand I like to pay about $20/kg (free shipping) and that stuff looks like it’s $30.    

Kurt-A

[3D Printing Tips and Tricks]

Kurt’s

Are you using Aquanet? If you do the temp can be 50c for both pla and PETG.

[John Schneider]

John from 3D-Fuel here: you won't want to use PCTG as a support for PETG. PCTG bonds VERY well to PETG.

We don't put additives in our filaments except for the colorants, and we don't use regrind or recycled materials except for our ReFuel line of products and even that is just using internal scrap material that has been repelletized.

We're not the cheapest material, but we are one of the best and purest out there.

Best Regards,

John Schneider

CEO

 

www.3dfuel.com

Cell: 701-318-0686

Email: jschn...@3dfuel.com

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/3d-printing-tips--tricks/22e65f43-3925-4dfa-92ab-97f78d41cbfen%40googlegroups.com.

[Ed Street]

I just looked and didn't see most of the filaments I use from 3d fuel. (ASA), I did see ABS, which is out of stock.  I am not sure about the PLA+ either, by default I stay away from anything +  

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!!]

John - No - Kurt my Doppelgänger simply meant using PCTG as supports for PLA - not PCTG as supports for PETG. He knows, based upon my own discussions - that PETG & PCTG are VERY Chemically similar - and thus WILL fuse together!

-K

On Saturday, April 26, 2025 at 7:31:59 PM UTC-4 John Schneider wrote:

[John Schneider]

You can use PCTG as a support material for PLA, but we haven't tested that extensively yet.

Bed temp of 70-80C is recommended for the PCTG

Best Regards,

John Schneider

CEO

 

www.3dfuel.com

Cell: 701-318-0686

Email: jschn...@3dfuel.com

To view this discussion visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/3d-printing-tips--tricks/a0c74ac1-9188-41c2-8be3-6f57fa28799bn%40googlegroups.com.

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!!]

John - FYI - I did a bit of testing - Semi rigorous - at Essentium - with the PLA/PCTG combo. I actually printed a REALLY MASSIVE part - that was part of a really big Star Wars racer unit. And, Yup - it worked GREAT!

In fact, I did Initial testing where I made a small kind of "L" shape - maybe like 2" square. And, I would float the L-shape in the air - such that it would be fully supported - and it would print GREAT! And, only needed VERY Minimal effort to pull the 2 L-shapes apart! So, yeah - after I learned of Andy's trick - I was doing a Good Bit of testing at Essentium to prove it would work - and was even working with the Process team at one point - in regards to this full support concept. 

As such, yeah - testing has been done. And, I felt that PCTG/PLA combo may Potentially work BETTER than the PETG/PLA combo!

Heck - if I had an IDEX Machine - I would love to SERIOUSLY Test this! In fact, the Bambu H2D is essentially an IDEX machine - and I would Love to do Extensive testing of Full Contact support on the H2D - IF and only IF I could get a FREE machine from Bambu!!!

-K

[Kurt Gluck]

Kurt-1 

If you’re dreaming of free machines dream of a free 2 ToolHead Prusa XL.  That way you can upgrade it to a 5 ToolHead XL someday.       

I want some genius to figgure out how to stick a MMU3 or two on a 5 ToolHead XL someday :-) 

Kurt-A

[Kurt Gluck]

John

Definitely on my list of things to try.   Right now I am trying to deal with my Fillament Addition problem by using up as much of my backlog of fillament from last year as I can before I buy more.

Kurt-A

[Kurt Gluck]

John 

This is great to hear.  Like I said elsewhere when I print-down my mound of fillament I plan on adding 3Dfuel to my supplier list.

Here is a joke I wrote about my condition last year:: 

Fillament Addiction (FA) not known in the mainstream may be the driveing force behind additive manufacturing.  People who have the FA monkey on their backs build/purchase/modify 3d printers as a cover for what is truely going on - their unsatable desire to continually acquire filament.  While it is true that printing things reduces the hord of filament, it is clear that in except in a few odd cases (of FWA more on this later) - the hord continually increases over time.   In some cases the geometric load is enormous.  For every spool consumed 4 more spools are purchased.     Terminal stages of this addiction can be observed when the addict starts to watch endless YouTube streams in the sad hope of snagging the ‘free’ spool - which they do not need. 

We hope to found Filament-Anonymous a program whereby addicts can get together, share stores, and exchange mostly false claims like “Im Ben, its been 6 hours since I have ordered my last kilogram” 

FWA (Fillament Waste Addiction) - a related condition whereby the goal is to produce the largest pile of used fillament 

——-

I hope I have not offended anyone.  I DO UNDERSTAND that addiction is awful and I DO NOT MEAN to minimize the challenges faced by people, their families and friends who have TRUE illnesses.

Sent from my iPad

On Apr 26, 2025, at 7:31 PM, John Schneider <jschn...@3dfuel.com> wrote:



[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!!]

Mr. Doppelgänger - VERY Funny indeed Sir!!!!!

-K

[Petr Ptacek]

Ed, I understand your sentiment about anything +, mostly used as a gimmick by cheap filament makers to make you pay more, but this is a very different case altogether. 

I use the 3D-Fuel PLA Pro as my go-to PLA for semi-functional parts, and it is one of the best (strongest) PLA filaments I've ever used. The fact that they have TDSes for almost all filaments with physical properties, including tensile and flexural strengths, is hard to beat. Very few filament companies offer that, and it eliminates the guesswork.

Just my 2 cents.

-P

p.s. No affiliation with 3D-Fuel, just a happy customer.

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