AI 3D Model Generators???

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!]

I wanted to bring this up as a separate topic - even though it was just discussed as one of the segments in Ep #548 of the podcast. 

But, yeah - I'm dying to know if anyone has come across a Good version of an AI app that can actually Generate a 3D Model.

I have heard of NVidia working on something - but, I don't think anything solidly is out yet for that one. And, the one by Bambu Labs - I think it's Totally Silly. As Andy mentioned - not only is it limited to making a Pokemon Type of character. Even then, the inputs are limited. 

Something I thought about a while ago, and I keep coming back to - is the idea of using AI to generate something like OpenSCAD - since it IS a Text type scripting language. And, I DID dabble in it about a year ago, using ChatGPT to try and generate OpenSCAD objects. But, even trying to generate a VERY Simple object - it was failing. I did "teach" it how to properly make that object, and it Did spit it back out to me when I fed it a slight variant to the prompt. But, it was still painful. 

Then, this past August I was at SIGGraph in Colorado - and I got to see Nvidia/Jenson & FaceBook/Zuck - on stage chatting - largely about AI. And, it was Fascinating. If you look at this webpage - then scroll down - you can see the video of the chat - its long at like 58 min. - of course, not the same as being there as I was:

     https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/zuckerberg-huang/

And, prior to SIGGraph, a buddy of mine at FaceBook, who works in research, actually doing AI - he told me about software to spin up your own AI server - I think it was called Llama. Well, while watching Jensen & Zuck chatting - it hit me that maybe now is the time to do my idea - of spinning up an AI server, and training it Specifically in the realm of teaching it how to create proper OpenSCAD scripts!

But, would it make sense to spend time on doing something like this?

Do people feel that it would be a potentially lucrative venture? Assuming it could be DONE Correctly - and that it would actually work!?!?!

Either way, I would enjoy hearing what others think - about create an OpenSCAD AI. Also, if people have run across any really good AI 3D Model Generators!

Thanks,

-Kurt the 3DP Vagabond!

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!]

Wow - 17 views - but, nobody has a reply?

I REALLY Want to know if anyone has seen any Cool AI 3D Model Generators! 

But...

I also REALLY Want to know if it even makes Sense to consider the possibility of creating an AI Engine that can produce Viable OpenSCAD code! OR - do this make NO Sense at all...

-Kurt The Enquiring Mind!

[markni...@gmail.com]

Kurt,

Yes, a AI based OpenSCAD generator makes a great deal of sense.

However, since I know little about AI and nothing about OpenSCAD, there is little I can contribute.

[Sophie]

When you find a way Kurt!! Consider me a beta tester. I would say Alpha, but I have no idea how to generate commands for 2D/3D modelling... Programming languages are not my forte. When I started on Autodesk at university for 2D modelling, line commands were an alternative option but a more user friendly gui had already been implemented by that point, so we were just never taught...so I wouldn't be able to tell you why something wasn't working correctly if it was due to a  fault in the code or commands generated by the AI.

But I can certainly use modelling language to describe the desired output to see if AI can handle that.

It makes sense, it's a good idea, and when something that actually works flawlessly is invented...I'd be interested. For now...I'll just lean on my modelling skills to do it myself.

Also...I did view your message, but when I'm on my phone it's a real great hassle to reply to a thread compared to being on my pc...as you know most of my messages are sent to you only (instead of everyone in the thread) when I reply via my phone email...and then I forgot :P

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!]

Mark - thanks for the input! I really appreciate it!!!

Now, in theory - if an AI prompt engine was created to specifically produce OpenSCAD scripts/objects - you really should NOT need to know how to operate OpenSCAD - which is the whole point. Rather - you would simply feed it a prompt like:

     Can you please generate an OpenSCAD script which  will create a hemisphere that has an inner diameter of 13mm and an outer diameter of 15mm. 

Of course, for an OpenSCAD specific engine - there would be no need to specify that the output is OpenSCAD. But, in my semi-recent testing using ChatGPT (which I was last attempting to do over a year ago) - I of course needed to specify OpenSCAD as the output. 

And, for those curious as to what OpenSCAD looks like, here's a piece of code that Neil M. generated using ChatGPT which was posted in the Point-E thread in this forum back in Feb 2023:

     union() { sphere(r=2); cylinder(r=1, h=4); }

-K

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!]

Hey Sophie - I totally hear you - in regards to the reply problems when using the forum on your phone. I've personally seen the issue. Myself - I NEVER reply by my phone anymore, since I have to be logged into GG on the phone, with my alternate email addy - thus I ONLY reply on the PC. And, you probably noticed that at times my replies come from "VRFX" vs. "3D Printer Guy". They are both Me. but, the VRFX is me replying via email, where as the other is me logged into the forum in a webpage. I used to ONLY reply via emails, but, for me - that changed a while ago...

And, sure - you could definitely be a person to test the system, should I get around to creating it. And, it will NOT require knowledge of scripting commands, as mentioned in my prior reply to Mark. 

Of course, for now - it's just a concept...

-K

[david merten]

I have played around with chatgpt trying to generate accurate models is openscad. Even simple things went horribly wrong. And the code was so wild I had trouble understanding what it was doing. Not that I am very familiar with it in the first place. I am a machinist by trade and use mastercam for all my work. It seems like it could be a huge undertaking trying to wrestle chatgpt into producing good models.  I would definitely be interested if you could do it. Anything that could speed up modeling work flow, would be a good thing.

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[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!]

Thanks for your feedback David. 

Yeah, even my earlier attempts on trying to get ChatGPT to generate OpenSCAD was Frustrating at best. 

That being said, I have an Extensive experience as a programmer, so, looking directly at OpenSCAD scripts - I Can read and understand them fairly easily. I just don't have extensive experience actually creating the OpenSCAD scripts. Turns out, the example of the hemisphere above, that was Exactly what I was trying to get ChatGPT to generate. And, it kept failing. But, at one point, I figured - let me look at the script directly, see if I can modify it - to get the proper results. And, I was able to do that. Then, in that particular ChatGPT session - I Fed that Script Back into  ChatGPT - then changed the prompt a little - and it WAS able to get me a proper script back. But, that was a lot of effort for a single simple object. 

I have some ideas on How to potentially train an AI server on how to proper generate OpenSCAD - but, I need to run those ideas past either my Son (who just got an MS in CS/AI from Stanford) - or from a good buddy of mine who does AI research at FaceBook. 

So, we shall see...

-K

[Joseph Larson]

Well, on a related topic, I got invited by an AI mesh generator company to test out their program. Any idea what prompts I should test it out with?

[Joseph Larson]

Here's my long-winded take on the idea of generating OpenSCAD code with ChatGPT.

Putting aside the topics of the dubious morality of stolen training data or the flat out evil practices of saying it's AI, but having it actually be underpaid 3rd world workers (true story), Generative AI has a number of problems.

First of all, I have never seen a Generative AI that can keep it up for more than a few paragraphs. Oh, they start out fine, all  authoritative  and stuff, and then somewhere down the line they have a stroke. I'm reminded of a scene from the 1985 movie Return to Oz where TikTok's thinking cog winds down before his speech and actions do, and he starts spouting nonsense. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BlKRNyJipL8

See Generative AI must generate something. It doesn't matter if that something isn't factual or functional or even makes sense. Someone on twitter once asked ChatGPT who the top 3D printing YouTubers were, and I almost made the list. Almost. Because after say that that it's really subjective, but that some people really like Joel Telling, the 3D Printing Nerd, Tom Sanladerer, and the 3D printing Professor R. Lachlean. Who's R. Lachlean? I've looked it up, and I still have no idea where that name came from.

So what's going to happen when it generates code? Well it'll start out okay. It's pulling from every line of OpenSCAD ever posted online, so it'll at least have the form right. But it doesn't have the complier, so it's not going to check if it even works. It might work for simple shapes. But ask it to do something like my buddy MakerBlock's OpenSCAD Pirate ship (https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:12856) (an amazing example of OpenSCAD's capabilities if ever there was one) and suddenly there are so many problem. First of all, does the AI even know what a pirate ship is supposed to look like? If it did (which it doesn't), how will it check that the output is being formed properly? It's not going to test and debug. It's like a really confident programmer who skips sanity testing their code! Who knows what will happen. If it even compiles, the output will be completely unpredictable.

Whenever I see someone say "I asked AI to write a country song" and it writes this actually coherent thing that maintains some kind of joke from beginning to end I have to call BS. AI can't even remember what it's talking about from sentence to sentence. No way it's can pull off a running gag.

I guess what I'm saying is AI has a lot of problems that make it a fun toy, but not really useful as an authority on anything. Again, it must generate an output when you ask it to, but there's no sanity or fact checking on that output. And yet most of the time we treat it like it does know what it's talking about.

You know what I think could be the greatest contribution that AI makes to the world? If some clever programmer decides to add a sanity check step to AI's generation. Ask it to generate code and it'll run the appropriate compiler and check the output. Or ask it about a topic and it'll fact check before answering (and maybe even be able to site sources). And then, we take that sanity check and run it through everything said on the news or a presidential debate. Forget the generation. I want automated fact checking.

On Wednesday, November 6, 2024 at 5:58:47 PM UTC-7 Kurt The 3D Printer GUY! wrote:

[Kamesh M Sundaram]

Googling Ai cad model generator shows so many web sites. Can we go through them and have a review?

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[Joseph Larson]

Again, what prompts would you like to see them tested with?

[Nat Brooks]

Hi Jo.

I have the same reservations as I think you do from the training data, but if you want to run actual modelling tests, I'm thinking a logical approach with ever more difficult models if there is no limitation to your number of models.

This would check for manifold type models, but also for the ability to print the model in the real world.

For example,

- a simple cube

- a cube with the X, Y and Z on the faces

- a test cube which requires no supports, but will need bridges being printed.

- a model which will need supports on an overhang in parts. Maybe a rubber duck type shape? Supports will be required under the beak.

- a more complex model which will need to separated for printing. Think a skate board with wheels which would snap on after.

[Chris Jones]

For what it's worth, Gemini doesn't seem to be any better...

[Kurt The 3D Printer GUY!]

That's a bummer Chris!

-K