Air Attack Questions

[Mike_in_Texas]

This is in regard to Hill 235.5, but it essentially applies to any air attack, so I wanted to make sure I'm interpreting these rules correctly.

First, I take it smoke in the target hex is applied to the IFT dice roll for the first attack phase (against infantry) in the form of a third die being rolled, right? But, what, if any, effect does smoke have against armor? For example, does it get applied to the TK dice roll since it's considered an automatic hit? This seems to be somewhat addressed in Q&A #691: 101.3 "May aircraft attack units in a smoke-filled hex? A. Yes, with the same additions to the attack dice roll normally attributed to smoke. {COI4-72}". And, does smoke play a factor in the second phase (i.e., bombing run)? If so, how specifically?

Second, does vehicle size play any part in air attacks? It seems only the movement DRMs apply per Q&A #699. 101.421 Are there any DRMs for the bombing TO HIT procedure? A. Yes, all movement DRMs for the TO HIT procedure (cases J, O & P) apply.{COD-105}.

Again, I just wanted to make sure I'm interpreting the rules correctly and not missing out on something.

Thanks,
Mike

[Squad Leader Tournament & Ladder]

>  I take it smoke in the target hex is applied to the IFT dice roll for the first attack phase (against infantry) in the form of a third die being rolled, right?

MMG and 20L fire automatically hit infantry targets.  Resolution on the IFT applies all normal TEMs apply, including smoke (101.414).

>  what, if any, effect does smoke have against armor?

MMG,  20L & 37L fire automatically hit the target.  Resolution on the AFV TO KILL TABLE is not affected by smoke.

However, Smoke may subject friendly AFVs to mistaken air attack.  One must always roll for Mistake Air Attacks (101.81) even if the only target type is an AFV.  A nearest friendly AFV in or adjacent to Smoke would be attacked (101.82-.821).  Otherwise friendly AFVs can never be mistakenly attacked, instead they are ignored as a potential mistaken target hex.

> does smoke play a factor in the second phase (i.e., bombing run)?

Yes, per Q&A 101.3 which you cited.  Note the TH is a single dr, so one would roll one for the TO HIT and one for the Smoke.

> Second, does vehicle size play any part in air attacks?

No, only those sited in Q&A 101.421 and smoke.

[btrap2930]

Good questions Mike- for my two cents, I'll respectfully non-concur with smoke being part of Phase 2 (bomb) To Hit.  The Q&A specifically states only movement DRMs apply (#699. 101.421 Are there any DRMs for the bombing TO HIT procedure? A. Yes, all movement DRMs for the TO HIT procedure (cases J, O & P) apply.{COD-105}).  

We are told to play as the rules allow.  This one is cannot be more clear. Only movement DRMs..no Smoke DRM. Even if 101.3 Q&A says smoke affects the attack, it is superseed by the 101.421 Q&A. Intuitively, to me, it makes sense. The To Hit procedure is not necessarily to get the bomb to hit the tank, but to hit "close enough" to the tank to upend it or otherwise damage it (think German tanks in Falaise Pocket or Normandy being subject to bombing raids).  Thus the To Hit procedure is primarily vs the bomb hex, not to hit the target in the bomb hex.  If vehicle size does not contribute to the To Hit, then smoke would not as well- since it isn't really about the bomb physically hitting the tank. I am ok with the Movement DRMs (Case J, O, P) being To Hit DRMs due to a moving target being tougher to time exactly when or where it (the moving target) is in the bomb hex (the abstractness of the game system).  I imagine Case O and P are meant only for moving targets in bomb hexes that are not the initial Phase 1 target hex. 

As for Gameplay- allowing smoke to be a To Hit DRM for a bomb attack provides a huge advantage for the player who moves first, since possibility of air assets is rolled for at start of each Game Turn, and game-turn-lasting smoke can impair the air attack effects. The player moving second can't get that same opportunity.   Maybe that is what the designers intended, but I would be skeptical of that. 

As the Soviet player in this battle..I need all the help I can get!  So yes, there is some selfishness here. Don't really appreciate or interpret rules until one gets into the situation.  But it is my take on how the rules are written and what the rules allow.

Thanks! 

Brian

[montyj...@gmail.com]

Hi Brian,

These are some tough questions and you have to appreciate the work that Scott has done in the past to keep us within the rule books.  

I tend to agree with Scott on this one.  I lean toward the interpretation that the Q&A 101.3 and 101.421 actually add-on to each other.  That being said, I think the rules are bit broken here.  The use of smoke could virtually guarantee a Russian miss with the bomb attack.  The Russians have no opportunity in this scenario to do the same to the Germans and it puts them at a disadvantage.  

As an alternative for this tournament I would do this following:

In the event that the primary target(s) for the air attack are in smoke, the air attack can be delayed for one additional player turn.  This would be similar to the mistaken air attack rule (rule 101.83)

This ties back to the rule for mistaken air attack where no alternative attack is available.  

It also leads toward ASL were a Task Check (DR ≤ 8) must be rolled to see if target is actually sighted.  In that case, the smoke modifier is added (amongst others) to the Task Check dice.  

Monty

[Mike_in_Texas]

Thanks for the comments, everyone.

So, Monty, let me know if my following interpretation of your alternative suggestion is accurate.

Say the German AFVs are currently in the open when the Russian player successfully rolls for air support. The Germans want to help protect their tanks from being obliterated by the approaching Sturmoviks, and so the Engineers deploy smoke into hexes the German tanks will subsequently rush into during their Movement phase. The Russian player has the option to attack the moving tanks during the Defensive Fire phase, but must account for the moving target DRMs as well as the smoke (for the bomb portion) assuming they opt to target the tanks in the smoke-filled hexes. Of course, the Russian player can wait until the subsequent (Russian) Prep Fire phase to use either one of their Sturmoviks in order to avoid the moving target DRMs. But, if the AFVs are now in smoke-filled hexes, the smoke die roll still applies, right? Now, your alternative suggestion is to apply the mistaken air attack rule (101.83), which would delay the air attack to the next Defensive Fire phase, correct? And, if so, the original smoke would have been removed. However, the Germans could theoretically place more smoke in the prior (German) Prep Fire phase and, once again, provide smoke cover to the AFVs, correct? I suppose the only advantage this gives to the Russian player is forcing the Germans to successfully place smoke a second time, right? Or, am I missing something here in which the Russians can avoid the German smoke altogether?

For what it's worth, I agree that a smoke die roll could be very significant in determining a hit or miss with the bomb attack. But, I'm just trying to give my AFVs their best chance at surviving the air attack within the rules. :-)

Mike

[Monty Jasper]

Hi Mike,

I think you have it.  The German player would have to burn another turn with the armor moves/fire to protect them from the air support in that situation.

Monty

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[btrap2930]

Thanks Monty!

(and I do appreciate Scott and everything he does...amazing guy!)

Brian