Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss
Hyperoptic rubbish?
1,234 views
Skip to first unread message
Bob Eager
Dec 30, 2017, 10:06:01 AM12/30/17
to
Is this company the one run by the school brat?
From a friend:
"I've just spent the past few hours setting up a VPN server to find I
can't do it because Hyperoptic has an IP per 8 houses meaning effectively
a dual NAT. This is madness!"
From a friend:
"I've just spent the past few hours setting up a VPN server to find I
can't do it because Hyperoptic has an IP per 8 houses meaning effectively
a dual NAT. This is madness!"
Graham J
Dec 30, 2017, 10:10:58 AM12/30/17
to
premium price. Maybe even IPv6 ...
--
Graham J
Bob Eager
Dec 30, 2017, 11:19:38 AM12/30/17
to
was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't matter.
Still like to know if it's our 7 idiot.
Stephen
Dec 30, 2017, 1:14:34 PM12/30/17
to
On 30 Dec 2017 16:19:35 GMT, Bob Eager <news...@eager.cx> wrote:
>On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 15:11:00 +0000, Graham J wrote:
>
>> Bob Eager wrote:
>>> Is this company the one run by the school brat?
>>>
>>> From a friend:
>>>
>>> "I've just spent the past few hours setting up a VPN server to find I
>>> can't do it because Hyperoptic has an IP per 8 houses meaning
>>> effectively a dual NAT. This is madness!"
>>>
But a VPN has to work through NAT anyway - which will remap the UDP
>On Sat, 30 Dec 2017 15:11:00 +0000, Graham J wrote:
>
>> Bob Eager wrote:
>>> Is this company the one run by the school brat?
>>>
>>> From a friend:
>>>
>>> "I've just spent the past few hours setting up a VPN server to find I
>>> can't do it because Hyperoptic has an IP per 8 houses meaning
>>> effectively a dual NAT. This is madness!"
>>>
ports?
So why would it not work through their carrier grade NAT?
>>>
>> I suspect that they would sell you a single IP if asked - possibly at a
>> premium price. Maybe even IPv6 ...
https://www.hyperoptic.com/faq/posts/static-ip-addresses/
>
>What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the reason
>was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't matter.
>
>Still like to know if it's our 7 idiot.
ISPreview carried some articles a year ago
>What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the reason
>was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't matter.
>
>Still like to know if it's our 7 idiot.
https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2016/09/uk-isp-hyperoptic-scraps-static-ip-shared-cgnat-internet-addresses.html
--
Stephen
R. Mark Clayton
Dec 30, 2017, 5:42:27 PM12/30/17
to
Brian Gregory
Dec 31, 2017, 11:34:13 AM12/31/17
to
On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the reason
> was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't matter.
It would still matter.
> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the reason
> was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't matter.
A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
> ...
--
Brian Gregory (in the UK).
To email me please remove all the letter vee from my email address.
Bob Eager
Dec 31, 2017, 4:16:51 PM12/31/17
to
On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
>> matter.
>
> It would still matter.
> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
>
>> ...
Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
>> matter.
>
> It would still matter.
> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
>
>> ...
Brian Gregory
Dec 31, 2017, 8:29:38 PM12/31/17
to
On 30/12/2017 18:14, Stephen wrote:
> But a VPN has to work through NAT anyway - which will remap the UDP
> ports?
>
> So why would it not work through their carrier grade NAT?
He wants to run a server.
> But a VPN has to work through NAT anyway - which will remap the UDP
> ports?
>
> So why would it not work through their carrier grade NAT?
A server behind a NAT needs a port forwarded inwards to the PC on the
LAN running the server.
As far as I know it's unheard of for ISPs using CGNAT to provide any way
for users to do port forwarding.
7
Jan 1, 2018, 6:30:45 AM1/1/18
to
Brian Gregory wrote:
> On 30/12/2017 18:14, Stephen wrote:
>> But a VPN has to work through NAT anyway - which will remap the UDP
>> ports?
>>
>> So why would it not work through their carrier grade NAT?
>
> He wants to run a server.
> A server behind a NAT needs a port forwarded inwards to the PC on the
> LAN running the server.
>
> As far as I know it's unheard of for ISPs using CGNAT to provide any way
> for users to do port forwarding.
Don't buy it - cheaper to install a fibre leased line for server
> On 30/12/2017 18:14, Stephen wrote:
>> But a VPN has to work through NAT anyway - which will remap the UDP
>> ports?
>>
>> So why would it not work through their carrier grade NAT?
>
> He wants to run a server.
> A server behind a NAT needs a port forwarded inwards to the PC on the
> LAN running the server.
>
> As far as I know it's unheard of for ISPs using CGNAT to provide any way
> for users to do port forwarding.
than any other technology. Its $14 for 1gbit 20km symmetric fibre modem and
$600 for 1U fibre routers if the fibre companies use them.
If they don't use such cheap tech, you will meet fraud and rip off install
charges and monthly charges.
grinch
Jan 1, 2018, 8:07:02 AM1/1/18
to
outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
much higher.
Why do you think that some ISP's change your outgoing public IP address
,there is no good technical reason assuming they have enough public IP
address for their customers to have at least an IPV4 /32.
I do hope the class idiot do not work for Hyperoptic ,to be that
clueless and work in the industry. Mummy and Daddy probably have
Hyperoptic at home.
One last thing while the spirit of the season is still with me please
kill file him then we don't clutter this news group with replys to his
ill informed posts.
7
Jan 1, 2018, 8:22:10 AM1/1/18
to
grinch wrote:
> On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
>> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
>>
>>> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
>>>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
>>>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
>>>> matter.
>>>
>>> It would still matter.
>>> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
>>> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
>>>
>>>> ...
>>
>> Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
>>
> The reasoning behind this is simple CGNAT will work for most home users
> outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
> server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
> much higher.
It shouldn't be higher.
> On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
>> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
>>
>>> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
>>>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
>>>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
>>>> matter.
>>>
>>> It would still matter.
>>> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
>>> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
>>>
>>>> ...
>>
>> Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
>>
> The reasoning behind this is simple CGNAT will work for most home users
> outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
> server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
> much higher.
It is business fraud to charge one rate for business and another for
private use. All instigate by BT (British Telecum) which insists
there is a difference through trolling in the market place
and lobbying pooliticians.
The cost is still $14 for fibre modem and router cost is $600 per 1U rack.
As far as the routers are concerned, there isn't any difference in the
packets. A heavy domestic user, a light business user, etc cannot physically
mark the packets as different so there is no legal basis on which to
charge filthy amounts of money for different customers.
The rule is you should only charge based on what it cost you to provide.
So heavy users can pay more if they need heavy use.
The router settings easily set to rate limit users without any
physical infrastructure changes.
> Why do you think that some ISP's change your outgoing public IP address
> ,there is no good technical reason assuming they have enough public IP
> address for their customers to have at least an IPV4 /32.
we the people who want to watch TV through internet.
If you got your own IP address, no problems with fully connected
internet TV and also making your own streaming channels that
subtracts their audience.
Now net neutrality to steal bandwidth that you paid for to speed
up their teevee and slow down your own (i.e. we the people) services and
servers.
>
> I do hope the class idiot do not work for Hyperoptic ,to be that
> clueless and work in the industry. Mummy and Daddy probably have
> Hyperoptic at home.
> One last thing while the spirit of the season is still with me please
> kill file him then we don't clutter this news group with replys to his
> ill informed posts.
Thin NG is specifically for the well being of broadband users
and discussing how we are getting ripped off is part of it.
Stephen
Jan 1, 2018, 5:36:02 PM1/1/18
to
On Mon, 1 Jan 2018 13:07:00 +0000, grinch <gri...@somewhere.com>
wrote:
>On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
>> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
>>
>>> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
>>>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
>>>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
>>>> matter.
>>>
>>> It would still matter.
>>> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
>>> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
>>>
>>>> ...
>>
>> Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
>>
>The reasoning behind this is simple CGNAT will work for most home users
>outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
>server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
>much higher.
>
>Why do you think that some ISP's change your outgoing public IP address
>,there is no good technical reason assuming they have enough public IP
>address for their customers to have at least an IPV4 /32.
>
It is simpler than that.
1 of the biggest costs for any carrier style company is "people time"
which here translates into manual config.
Using DHCP means all the customers get their IP addressing and related
config info from a central server and there is less tinkering needed
with per customer config.
A nice side effect is that
- you get to keep your IP address unless you leave the router turned
off (since DHCP bakes "refresh to current address" into the protocol -
although technically it is dynamic)
- IP addresses get recycled by defult when someone leaves.
Stephen
wrote:
>On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
>> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
>>
>>> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
>>>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
>>>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
>>>> matter.
>>>
>>> It would still matter.
>>> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
>>> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
>>>
>>>> ...
>>
>> Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
>>
>The reasoning behind this is simple CGNAT will work for most home users
>outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
>server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
>much higher.
>
>Why do you think that some ISP's change your outgoing public IP address
>,there is no good technical reason assuming they have enough public IP
>address for their customers to have at least an IPV4 /32.
>
1 of the biggest costs for any carrier style company is "people time"
which here translates into manual config.
Using DHCP means all the customers get their IP addressing and related
config info from a central server and there is less tinkering needed
with per customer config.
A nice side effect is that
- you get to keep your IP address unless you leave the router turned
off (since DHCP bakes "refresh to current address" into the protocol -
although technically it is dynamic)
- IP addresses get recycled by defult when someone leaves.
>
>I do hope the class idiot do not work for Hyperoptic ,to be that
>clueless and work in the industry. Mummy and Daddy probably have
>Hyperoptic at home.
>
>One last thing while the spirit of the season is still with me please
>kill file him then we don't clutter this news group with replys to his
>ill informed posts.
--
>I do hope the class idiot do not work for Hyperoptic ,to be that
>clueless and work in the industry. Mummy and Daddy probably have
>Hyperoptic at home.
>
>One last thing while the spirit of the season is still with me please
>kill file him then we don't clutter this news group with replys to his
>ill informed posts.
Stephen
R. Mark Clayton
Jan 2, 2018, 6:14:16 AM1/2/18
to
On Monday, 1 January 2018 13:22:10 UTC, 7 wrote:
> grinch wrote:
>
> > On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
> >> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
> >>>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
> >>>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
> >>>> matter.
> >>>
> >>> It would still matter.
> >>> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
> >>> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
> >>>
> >>>> ...
> >>
> >> Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
> >>
> > The reasoning behind this is simple CGNAT will work for most home users
> > outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
> > server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
> > much higher.
>
>
> It shouldn't be higher.
>
> It is business fraud to charge one rate for business and another for
> private use. All instigate by BT (British Telecum) which insists
> there is a difference through trolling in the market place
> and lobbying pooliticians.
>
So just who is perpetrating this fraud?
> grinch wrote:
>
> > On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
> >> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 30/12/2017 16:19, Bob Eager wrote:
> >>>> What they said was that they'd rent an IP for £5 a month. And the
> >>>> reason was that they would be rolling out IPv6 soon and it wouldn't
> >>>> matter.
> >>>
> >>> It would still matter.
> >>> A VPN server that you couldn't connect to unless you had IPv6 would very
> >>> much be a second class, not that useful at all, VPN server.
> >>>
> >>>> ...
> >>
> >> Naturally. Hence 'rubbish'!
> >>
> > The reasoning behind this is simple CGNAT will work for most home users
> > outgoing connections. Then if you complain you cant connect to your
> > server ,you get " well you are a business users then " and the price is
> > much higher.
>
>
> It shouldn't be higher.
>
> It is business fraud to charge one rate for business and another for
> private use. All instigate by BT (British Telecum) which insists
> there is a difference through trolling in the market place
> and lobbying pooliticians.
>
I looked up https://www.thinkbroadband.com/packages
This firm Hyperoptic is offering domestic fibre broadband and phone for an attractive £48 per month and free install*.
Same thing for business users is £360pm and £360 install.
"1 Gbps Full Fibre Broadband and phone by Hyperoptic
Special package 1,000Mbps Unlimited Free £48.00 £576.00 [pa]
Business 1 Gbps Fibre Broadband by Hyperoptic
Special package 1,000Mbps Unlimited £360.00 £360.00 £4,680.00 [pa]
"
* don't bother though - there are gotchas when the initial period runs out, for calls and of course they simply can't install where you or I are.
7
Jan 2, 2018, 6:36:35 AM1/2/18
to
to be selling full fibre when they are selling copper local poop.
That leaves Ofcum with a dilema for your list.
Either rename G.Slow to full-fibre or call it full-fibre and
rob consumers out of a lot of moneeey with deceptive marketing.
Me thinks offcum will choose the latter.
They always have to sell BT (British Telecum) local poop copper.
R. Mark Clayton
Jan 2, 2018, 7:42:00 AM1/2/18
to
>
>
> > This firm Hyperoptic is offering domestic fibre broadband and phone for an
> > attractive £48 per month and free install*.
> >
> > Same thing for business users is £360pm and £360 install.
> >
> > "1 Gbps Full Fibre Broadband and phone by Hyperoptic
> > Special package 1,000Mbps Unlimited Free £48.00 £576.00 [pa]
> >
> > Business 1 Gbps Fibre Broadband by Hyperoptic
> > Special package 1,000Mbps Unlimited £360.00 £360.00 £4,680.00 [pa]
> > "
> >
grinch
Jan 2, 2018, 5:26:01 PM1/2/18
to
On 01/01/18 22:35, Stephen wrote:
> On Mon, 1 Jan 2018 13:07:00 +0000, grinch <gri...@somewhere.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
>>> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
Err no, not dhcp
> On Mon, 1 Jan 2018 13:07:00 +0000, grinch <gri...@somewhere.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 31/12/17 21:16, Bob Eager wrote:
>>> On Sun, 31 Dec 2017 16:34:10 +0000, Brian Gregory wrote:
> Using DHCP means all the customers get their IP addressing and related
> config info from a central server and there is less tinkering needed
> with per customer config.
things to DHCP . I think it capable of more but I am not sure, read the
below if you are interested.
This assumes that the routers config is given in response to a user-name
and password combination usually called dialling in cisco parlance. BT
don't for instance do this they work on telephone numbers to allocate IP
details.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radius_server
0 new messages