You shouldn't be there! - Long
Sniper8052(L96A1)
needed few more bits and bobs, blowtorch, flux, joints etc...
I could not get the car out for a 'quick' 6 miles to the shop as the
community skip lorry was doing its thing so I took the jolly old - new -
racing bike for a spin.
Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I
crossed the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers
side and a head pops out.
Young Plod - "Nice bike you've got there"
Me - "Yes"
Young Plod - "Going out for a ride"
Me - "Yes"
Young Plod - "Where you going"
Me - "Over there"
Young Plod - "You know your in the wrong lane"
Me - "Hows that"
Young Plod - "You should be over there" - Points to the near side lane
four over.
Me - "Can't turn right from there"
Young Plod - "It's dangerous to ride your bike in this lane"
Me - "Be a lot more dangerous turning right from over there"
Young Plod - "Is it yours"
Me - "What"
Young Plod - "The bike"
Me - "Yes"
Young Plod - "Your not wearing cycling clothing"
Me - "No" - wearing old combats, boots and sweatshirt, very dirty as had
been crawling around under the floorboards.
Young Plod - "Your not wearing a helmet either"
Me - "No"
Young Plod - "Just pull up over there for me"
Me - "Why"
Young plod - "I want a word with you"
Me - "What for"
Young Plod - "Don't argue"
Me - "About what"
At this point young plod had had enough and tripped his blue lights...
Young Plod - "get off"
Me - Feeling a bit like finding out how far he would go - "Have I done
something wrong"
Young Plod - "Like I said your in the wrong lane"
Me - "Is that a road traffic offence" - he should have picked up on this!
Young Plod - "Yes"
Me - "Oh" - Get off bike
Young Plod then gets out of car and tells me how he could do me for
dangerous cycling and how I should be wearing a cycle helmet.
Me - "Is that the law then - cycle helmets"
Young Plod - "No but its a lot safer"
Me - "There's never been a study that proved that you know"
Young Plod - "I cycle and I always wear a helmet"
Me - "That's your choice"
Young Plod - "Your not taking this very seriously"
Me - "Aren't I"
Young Plod - "Right - Lets see what you think about getting a fine for
dangerous cycling"
Me - "Your going to give me a ticket"
Young Plod - "I might if you continue like this"
Me - "Am I riding dangerously then"
Young Plod - "Yes"
Me - "How"
Young Plod - "You shouldn't be in the outside lane you should turn right
from the nearside kerb"
Me - "Oh, does it say that in the Road Traffic Act then"
Young Plod - "Do you have any ID"
Me - "What for"
Young Plod - "Because I asked you"
Me - "Are you going to give me a ticket then"
Young Plod - "I've had enough of this what's your name"
Me - "******"
Young Plod - "What do you do for a living"
Me - "I train people"
Young Plod - "Who for"
Me - "The police"
Young Plod - "Oh"
Me - "Does that make a difference"
Young Plod - "Err"
Me - "Do I get a copy of a stop form then"
Young Plod -"Err"
Me - "I really think I should get a copy of a stop form"
Young Plod -"Do we need to do that"
Me - "Yes"
Young Plod - writes out stop form - Name?
Me - "Sgt..."
Young Plod - Finishes the stop form - hands it to me
Me - "Next time you think of abusing your powers you might like to think
about who your talking to first"
Young Plod -"Yes Sarge"
Me - "Do I need to write to your skipper about this"
Young Plod - "No Sarge"
Me - "You think you've learnt your lesson then"
Young Plod - "Yes Sarge"
Me - "You think I should let you get away with this then"
Young Plod - "I think I made a mistake"
Me - "I think you did"
Young Plod - "Are you going to write to my Sergeant then Sarge"
Me - "I think he needs to know, don't you"
Me - "I'll tell you what, You tell your Sergeant and get them to call me
later"
Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant"
Me - "Be sure you do - or I will be writing officially"
Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant" Gets back in car and drives off.
Had chat with female sergeant later - turns out he did tell her and got
bulled for his actions.
Obviously the above is not a word for word but it's pretty close.
Sniper8052
Tony Raven
>
> Obviously the above is not a word for word but it's pretty close.
>
> Sniper8052
>
:-) :-) :-)
--
Tony
"The most savage controversies are those about matters as to which there
is no good evidence either way."
- Bertrand Russell
Colin McKenzie
> Whilst indulging in a spot of the obligatory DIY today I discovered I
> needed few more bits and bobs, blowtorch, flux, joints etc...
> I could not get the car out for a 'quick' 6 miles to the shop as the
> community skip lorry was doing its thing so I took the jolly old - new -
> racing bike for a spin.
>
> Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I
> crossed the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
> Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
> anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers
> side and a head pops out.
> Me - "I'll tell you what, You tell your Sergeant and get them to
> call me later"
> Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant"
> Me - "Be sure you do - or I will be writing officially"
All I can say is that I go round Hanger Lane Gyratory 5 days a week,
starting in lane 4 of 4, which turns into 4 of 5, then 3 of 5, then 1
of about 8 as I exit. I would hate to do it any other way. So far no
plod have commented, which is just as well, as I have no rank to pull
on them.
Colin McKenzie
--
No-one has ever proved that cycle helmets make cycling any safer at
the population level, and anyway cycling is about as safe per mile as
walking.
Make an informed choice - visit www.cyclehelmets.org.
Clive George
news:iMs%h.111196$aB1....@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
> Whilst indulging in a spot of the obligatory DIY today I discovered I
> needed few more bits and bobs, blowtorch, flux, joints etc...
> I could not get the car out for a 'quick' 6 miles to the shop as the
> community skip lorry was doing its thing so I took the jolly old - new -
> racing bike for a spin.
>
> Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I crossed
> the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
> Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
> anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers side
> and a head pops out.
(snip story)
It's like a Frank Spencer programme :-)
Hopefully he'll have learned his lesson early..
cheers,
clive
Membrane
>Young Plod - "Nice bike you've got there"
>Me - "Yes"
[...]
LOL, great story.
>Me - "Next time you think of abusing your powers you might like to think
>about who your talking to first"
I hope you don't mean to say that it would have been ok had it been an
ordinary citizen :-)
--
Membrane
Helen Deborah Vecht
The story does say something about the education of some Plod, doesn't it?
--
Helen D. Vecht: helen...@zetnet.co.uk
Edgware.
Slark
"Sniper8052(L96A1)" <snipe...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:iMs%h.111196$aB1....@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
Was I the only one to get incredibly annoyed at this story?
Who's to say it doesn't happen all the time, but we don't get to hear about
it.
Good for Sniper - but slightly worrying about the whole tone of 'bullying'
the cyclist...
Graham
Simon Brooke
(L96A1) ('snipe...@yahoo.co.uk') wrote:
> Whilst indulging in a spot of the obligatory DIY today I discovered I
> needed few more bits and bobs, blowtorch, flux, joints etc...
> I could not get the car out for a 'quick' 6 miles to the shop as the
> community skip lorry was doing its thing so I took the jolly old - new -
> racing bike for a spin.
>
> Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I
> crossed the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
> Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
> anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers
> side and a head pops out.
Wunderbar!
Most excellent.
--
si...@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; Human history becomes more and more a race between
;; education and catastrophe.
H.G. Wells, "The Outline of History"
Helen Deborah Vecht
> Was I the only one to get incredibly annoyed at this story?
> Who's to say it doesn't happen all the time, but we don't get to hear about
> it.
> Good for Sniper - but slightly worrying about the whole tone of 'bullying'
> the cyclist...
Bike is the new Black...
Mark Thompson
> Me - "I train people"
> Young Plod - "Who for"
> Me - "The police"
> Young Plod - "Oh"
It was only when I got to this bit that I realised it was you posting :)
Tosspot
<snip>
> Young Plod - "What do you do for a living"
> Me - "I train people"
> Young Plod - "Who for"
> Me - "The police"
<snip>
> Me - "Do I need to write to your skipper about this"
> Young Plod - "No Sarge"
<snip>
Priceless. But its idiots like this that give the Police a bad name.
Most of them do a good job under diffilcult conditions, then you bump
into one of these and tend to tar the whole lot with the same brush.
Good story though.
Tom Crispin
<snipe...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>Young Plod - "I've had enough of this what's your name"
>Me - "******"
>Young Plod - "What do you do for a living"
>Me - "I train people"
>Young Plod - "Who for"
>Me - "The police"
>Young Plod - "Oh"
>Me - "Does that make a difference"
>Young Plod - "Err"
>Me - "Do I get a copy of a stop form then"
>Young Plod -"Err"
>Me - "I really think I should get a copy of a stop form"
>Young Plod -"Do we need to do that"
>Me - "Yes"
>Young Plod - writes out stop form - Name?
>Me - "Sgt..."
Apart from asking, did the constable ever confirm your identity?
Tony Raven
>
> (snip story)
>
> It's like a Frank Spencer programme :-)
>
> Hopefully he'll have learned his lesson early..
>
The problem being the police are institutionally anti-cyclist especially
at the "too much power for their own ego" constable level. If it had not
been Sniper on the bike we could have had Daniel Cadden II here. Its
just not good enough.
wafflycat
Well done. I do hope he has learnt his lesson. Funny story with serious
aspect to it. If it had happened to a 'civilian' with no rank to pull.
Shades of the Daniel Cadden case, methinks?
squeaker
Thanks for sharing.
Don Whybrow
>
> Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I
> crossed the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
> Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
> anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers
> side and a head pops out.
>
....
Apart from being an amusing story, this raises some interesting points.
- Should the police stop people if it looks as though they don't fit the
bike they are on. It could be argued that one of YP's concerns was that
Sniper was riding a stolen bike.
- If YP had done this to someone who did not know their stuff, it would
have intimidated them into taking up a more dangerous road position.
- If YP had done this to someone who did know their stuff, but did not
have the backing of the job, what would the outcome have been?
--
Don Whybrow
Sequi Bonum Non Time
A child of five could understand this! Fetch me a child of five.
permajeo
I am so glad you're here.
--
permajeo
sothach
wrote:
> "Slark" <s...@dev.null>typed
>
> > Was I the only one to get incredibly annoyed at this story?
> > Who's to say it doesn't happen all the time, but we don't get to hear about
> > it.
> > Good for Sniper - but slightly worrying about the whole tone of 'bullying'
> > the cyclist...
>
> Bike is the new Black...
"Say it once, say it loud; I'm black and I'm proud."
permajeo
The Police are mostly pro law not anti-cyclist. It's just that like in
every walk of life the young ones are often somewhat enthusiastic and
filled with self importance with new power.
Next time Young Plod might think before acting. It might be Sniper in
new clothes ;-)
--
permajeo
Ekul Namsob
> Me - "You think I should let you get away with this then"
> Young Plod - "I think I made a mistake"
> Me - "I think you did"
> Young Plod - "Are you going to write to my Sergeant then Sarge"
> Me - "I think he needs to know, don't you"
> Me - "I'll tell you what, You tell your Sergeant and get them to call me
> later"
> Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant"
> Me - "Be sure you do - or I will be writing officially"
> Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant" Gets back in car and drives off.
>
> Had chat with female sergeant later - turns out he did tell her and got
> bulled for his actions.
I've only once had an issue with a copper. (I can't count being stopped
for cycling the wrong way down a one way street across a pedestrian
crossing as an issue. I learnt my lesson.)
I had been filtering up through a line of stopped traffic when a lone
plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
Well done for pursuing the issue above. At the point where Young Plod
was trying to weasel his way out of things I was concerned that he might
have been allowed to do so.
Cheers,
Luke
--
Lincoln City 0-2 Southend United (AET)
Swansea City 2-2 Southend United
We went up twice with Tilly and Brush
Andy Leighton
Don Whybrow <d...@fwhybrow.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote:
> Sniper8052(L96A1) wrote:
>>
>> Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I
>> crossed the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
>> Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
>> anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers
>> side and a head pops out.
>>
>
> ....
>
> Apart from being an amusing story, this raises some interesting points.
>
> - Should the police stop people if it looks as though they don't fit the
> bike they are on. It could be argued that one of YP's concerns was that
> Sniper was riding a stolen bike.
Not at first it wasn't. However I know that when I'm out riding I cannot
prove that the bike is mine - I cannot even prove who I am. I routinely
don't carry any identification at all.
> - If YP had done this to someone who did not know their stuff, it would
> have intimidated them into taking up a more dangerous road position.
>
> - If YP had done this to someone who did know their stuff, but did not
> have the backing of the job, what would the outcome have been?
These are probably the two most important points in my opinion. I guess
more training could solve the problem - but dealing with people cycling
on the road forms such a small part of their job it currently gets
very little time spent on it. From the sound of Sniper's story it seems
that the YP just seemed to use his prejudices and "common sense".
I would assume that those plod who ride cycles are given more and better
education (but I could be wrong).
As for what happens if you or I were substituted for Sniper in this
case. Well we would probably have to go to a Magistrate's Court and
defend ourselves against the charge the YP wanted to write us up for.
We may even have to go to the appeals court like Daniel Cadden did.
Once a few cases go that way and get reported the police and the CPS
may get a clue.
--
Andy Leighton => an...@azaal.plus.com
"The Lord is my shepherd, but we still lost the sheep dog trials"
- Robert Rankin, _They Came And Ate Us_
Dan Gregory
goo...@woodall.me.uk
>
> As for what happens if you or I were substituted for Sniper in this
> case. Well we would probably have to go to a Magistrate's Court and
> defend ourselves against the charge the YP wanted to write us up for.
> We may even have to go to the appeals court like Daniel Cadden did.
> Once a few cases go that way and get reported the police and the CPS
> may get a clue.
>
giving up a day or two of holiday to battle ignorance in the courts. I
can't buy more holiday but I'd swap pay for holiday - infact, in my
last pay review I offered to take a 20% paycut in return for a four
day week - it did manage to raise a smile on my boss' face but that
was it.
I can't say for certain what I would do if I was ever in Daniel
Cadden's position but a significant issue would be whether I was
willing to give up a significant fraction of my annual holiday
entitlement in order to avoid a fine (for me) of a completely trivial
amount. I'm glad Daniel Cadden did fight his corner. I can imagine
just the stress would be enough for most people to think "bugger it -
I'm just going to pay the fine and be done with it"
Maybe there are cases like this that we never hear about. I've only
been stopped once, and, on further investigation, I _think_ the police
were wrong[1] - but when they said "you shouldn't have been cycling
there" I said "I'm sorry, I didn't realize" and that was the end of it
- although I've continued to cycle in exactly the same way ever since
because the definitely legal way of doing the same thing has been
carefully engineered to be as dangerous as possible. (I've also
cycled in exactly the same way since when there has been a police car
present and I didn't get stopped)
[1] I turn right, cycle up a bus lane on the RH side of the traffic,
and then turn right again. The definitely legal way of doing it is to
cross all the traffic, up onto the pavement and then across the front
of all the traffic again to turn right. (There are two sets of lights
to allow buses and cyclists to get infront of the rest of the traffic,
both the bus lane and the cycle lane bypasses the first set of lights.
The bus lane has it's own set of lights but the cycle lane just dumps
you into the road ahead of the traffic - but you have no way of
telling if the lights for the traffic behind you have changed.
Additionally, if a bus comes up the RH side you can't then get to the
right lane to turn right as the cycle lane dumps you into the road
right at the second stop lane)
The start of the bus lane is definitely a cycle lane - there's a sign.
About 10 feet further up there's a tiny gap (18 inches?) to allow
cyclists to turn R into a dead end (back entrances to some solicitors
along the road) and also a sign saying "end of cycle lane" which I
assume is for the people turning off the bus lane but it _could_ be
saying that it's the end of the cycle lane on the bus lane.
The other thing I've seen cyclists doing (which I'm not sure is legal)
is to cycle up the cycle lane on the other pavement (which then dumps
you onto the wrong side of the road at the lights.) The cycle lane
does have an arrow painted on it midway along but I'm not sure there
is anything else other than common sense to tell you not to cycle
along it that way.
My camera has had to go in for repair (my new lens uncovered a fault -
fortunately the camera still had 4 days of warranty :-) ) but once it
is back I'll try and get some pictures.
I'm coming out of that unlabled dead end (the station), turning R. The
tiny gap is to turn up the road marked "Bridle path" and then I'm
turning R onto the A412 (St Albans Road)
If you zoom right in you can actually see a bus ahead of the traffic
and the cars stopped at the other stop line.
Tim.
Steve Watkin
> plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
> pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
Illegal to pass a queue of stationary or slow moving traffic??
I thought it was OK to do this.
SW
Nick Kew
> Young Plod - "What do you do for a living"
> Me - "I train people"
> Young Plod - "Who for"
> Me - "The police"
Can you fit this as an anecdote into your training?
A nice practical/real life example in the back of Young Plod's
mind might've usefully deterred him from ...
> Me - "Next time you think of abusing your powers you might like to
> think about who your talking to first"
... in the first place.
And making cycling the subject of an anecdote is an extra bonus:-)
--
not me guv
Tony Raven
>
> Not at first it wasn't. However I know that when I'm out riding I cannot
> prove that the bike is mine - I cannot even prove who I am. I routinely
> don't carry any identification at all.
>
I always carry enough identification and a programme ICE number on my
phone that if something happens people will know who I am and who to
contact.
Adam Lea
"Andy Leighton" <an...@azaal.plus.com> wrote in message
news:slrnf3tsfo...@azaal.plus.com...
> As for what happens if you or I were substituted for Sniper in this
> case. Well we would probably have to go to a Magistrate's Court and
> defend ourselves against the charge the YP wanted to write us up for.
> We may even have to go to the appeals court like Daniel Cadden did.
> Once a few cases go that way and get reported the police and the CPS
> may get a clue.
>
I was wondering - if faced with such a situation and the officer did issue a
charge as well as contesting it in court would you have the right to obtain
the officers identity and then make a formal complaint?
Adam Lea
"Steve Watkin" <steve....@btinternet.com> wrote in message
news:pNadnQDq4YgEYqPb...@bt.com...
It is:
http://www.motorcycle-training.f2s.com/filtering.html
Tony Raven
If faced with such a situation I suspect I may take Sniper's line and
encourage them to charge me. At least then the stupidity will become
very apparent as in the Daniel Cadden case and a few high profile
embarrassments can only help encouragé les autres
Tony B
> when I'm out riding I cannot prove that the bike is mine - I cannot even prove who I am. I routinely
> don't carry any identification at all.
That's fine, you don't have to - we don't live in the sort of country
where some ID nazi can stop you and shout "Papers!Papers!" before
hauling you off to the big house. Not yet, anyway...
As for proving ownership, well... (looks round house) I'd be hard
pressed to show proof of ownership of nearly ALL my stuff. Even the kids...
Tony B
Nick Kew
Yep. Long ago when I did motorcycle training[1], this was part of
that training. And you'd fail the test (for failing to make
reasonable progress) if you didn't.
But we don't have sufficient context here. In some circumstances
it's right; in others it's stupid and dangerous.
[1] In 1983 as a young graduate with a job in central London,
I thought some proper training made good sense, so I took
Star Rider "silver".
--
not me guv
Andy Leighton
> On May 7, 10:31 am, Andy Leighton <a...@azaal.plus.com> wrote:
>>
>> As for what happens if you or I were substituted for Sniper in this
>> case. Well we would probably have to go to a Magistrate's Court and
>> defend ourselves against the charge the YP wanted to write us up for.
>> We may even have to go to the appeals court like Daniel Cadden did.
>> Once a few cases go that way and get reported the police and the CPS
>> may get a clue.
>
> The problem is that for some of us, a 60GBP fine is far "cheaper" than
> giving up a day or two of holiday to battle ignorance in the courts.
Would be for me too, but that doesn't alter the fact that going to
court is the right and proper thing to do if you haven't broken the
law. Not only for yourself, but also to increase awareness of the
issues amongst less well-informed cyclists and motorists and more
importantly to make the police and CPS more aware of the law. If
enough people stand up to the plate and fight such charges they will
protect everyone's right to cycle on the road.
Josey
It's not illegal, but care needs to be taken.
See Cyclecraft, page 128/129.
Jc
Andy Leighton
Tony Raven <ju...@raven-family.invalid> wrote:
> Andy Leighton wrote on 07/05/2007 10:31 +0100:
>>
>> Not at first it wasn't. However I know that when I'm out riding I cannot
>> prove that the bike is mine - I cannot even prove who I am. I routinely
>> don't carry any identification at all.
>
> I always carry enough identification and a programme ICE number on my
> phone that if something happens people will know who I am and who to
> contact.
It is something I have never done. Either walking or cycling, even when
on holiday sometimes. I don't carry a mobile phone, apart from exceptional
circumstances, either.
Bob Downie
<ju...@raven-family.invalid> writes
>Adam Lea wrote on 07/05/2007 12:17 +0100:
>> "Andy Leighton" <an...@azaal.plus.com> wrote in message
>>news:slrnf3tsfo...@azaal.plus.com...
>>> As for what happens if you or I were substituted for Sniper in this
>>> case. Well we would probably have to go to a Magistrate's Court and
>>> defend ourselves against the charge the YP wanted to write us up for.
>>> We may even have to go to the appeals court like Daniel Cadden did.
>>> Once a few cases go that way and get reported the police and the CPS
>>> may get a clue.
>>>
>> I was wondering - if faced with such a situation and the officer did
>>issue a charge as well as contesting it in court would you have the
>>right to obtain the officers identity and then make a formal
>>complaint?
>
>If faced with such a situation I suspect I may take Sniper's line and
>encourage them to charge me. At least then the stupidity will become
>very apparent as in the Daniel Cadden case and a few high profile
>embarrassments can only help encouragé les autres
>
>
responded to the YP, bearing in mind that one does not want to inflame
any situation?
Would a response along the lines of the following be appropriate?
"I understand what you are saying officer, but that is an opinion (e.g.
"It's dangerous to ride your bike in this lane") rather than a fact in
law. I suggest that if you feel I am breaking the law then give me a
ticket and we will let the court decide".
--
Bob Downie
Devotee of the wheel
please remove #n0spam# to reply directly
M-gineering
>
> That's fine, you don't have to - we don't live in the sort of country
> where some ID nazi can stop you and shout "Papers!Papers!" before
> hauling you off to the big house. Not yet, anyway...
>
But it's only a short boattrip away though!
--
---
Marten Gerritsen
INFOapestaartjeM-GINEERINGpuntNL
www.m-gineering.nl
John B
Andy Leighton wrote:
>
> > Apart from being an amusing story, this raises some interesting points.
> >
> > - Should the police stop people if it looks as though they don't fit the
> > bike they are on. It could be argued that one of YP's concerns was that
> > Sniper was riding a stolen bike.
>
> Not at first it wasn't. However I know that when I'm out riding I cannot
> prove that the bike is mine - I cannot even prove who I am. I routinely
> don't carry any identification at all.
I have been accused by a Young Plod of riding a stolen tricycle.
I was riding home from a TT in full racing garb when a moped overtook me
followed by a patrol car.
They pulled up a couple of hundred yards in front of me - the police having
pulled the moped rider over.
On reaching them I started to overtake the car and plod opened his door on me
:-(
I slammed on the brakes and stopped (OK it was a bit theatrical).
Perhaps it was because I then asked him not to do that again as he might kill
someone, or maybe it was because the moped rider was laughing his socks off,
but YP lost his cool.
To extracate himself from his embarrassment - his face had turned bright red -
he asked if I owned the trike. He then asked could I prove it. Of course I
couldn't - at least not there and then.
He bumbled something about there being a report of a stolen trike so I
suggested he might like to continue in a more reasonable manner and record his
suspicions officially.
By now the moped rider had been joined by the other PC and they were both
sniggling at YPs foolish behaviour.
I just looked at him and firmly told him firmly I was now leaving and if he
had any disagreement with that he could arrest me.
I just rode off smiling.
John B
Peter Clinch
> I always carry enough identification and a programme ICE number on my
> phone that if something happens people will know who I am and who to
> contact.
Typically don't have a 'phone... but *do* carry a Donor card almost
the whole time. Hope it's never needed, but I'd sooner it was than
all the bits went to waste.
Pete.
--
Peter Clinch Medical Physics IT Officer
Tel 44 1382 660111 ext. 33637 Univ. of Dundee, Ninewells Hospital
Fax 44 1382 640177 Dundee DD1 9SY Scotland UK
net p.j.c...@dundee.ac.uk http://www.dundee.ac.uk/~pjclinch/
John Hearns
>
>
> As for proving ownership, well... (looks round house) I'd be hard
> pressed to show proof of ownership of nearly ALL my stuff. Even the kids...
>
I THINK the way it works is the notion of "title" - I have no legal
knowledge.
I had a bicked nicked from the supermarket once (Trek 820). Filled in a
theft report that day. A few weeks later I was contacted by a police
sergeant, and asked for a description of the bike, and any
distinguishing features (one for instance I gave was the brand of tyres).
Turns out he had found it in the posession of someone "well known" to
him, who claimed it was his. The police officer was more convinced that
the property was mine, and returned it to me. Said person was never
charged with anything, as he simply claimed it was his.
Its a bit sad really - I guess that a thief actually has to be seen or
videoed nicking something before being charged.
Again, I would guess this is why TWOCing is so called - "But I only
intended to drive the car round and round in circles then give it back,
honest officer."
Helen Deborah Vecht
> The Police are mostly pro law not anti-cyclist. It's just that like in
> every walk of life the young ones are often somewhat enthusiastic and
> filled with self importance with new power.
I think police represent society's attitudes in general.
There is a substantial anti-cyclist culture in Britain, reflected by
some anti-cyclist plod.
Whilst it is now unacceptable to display prejudice against ethnic
minorities, it is considered acceptable to do so against cyclists.
As I said, bike is the new Black...
--
Helen D. Vecht: helen...@zetnet.co.uk
Edgware.
Ekul Namsob
> Tony B wrote:
> > As for proving ownership, well... (looks round house) I'd be hard
> > pressed to show proof of ownership of nearly ALL my stuff. Even the kids...
> I THINK the way it works is the notion of "title" - I have no legal
> knowledge.
> I had a bicked nicked from the supermarket once (Trek 820). Filled in a
> theft report that day. A few weeks later I was contacted by a police
> sergeant, and asked for a description of the bike, and any
> distinguishing features (one for instance I gave was the brand of tyres).
I would have thought the frame number would be a useful identifying
mark. Consequently, I keep a record of frame numbers, serial numbers,
etc of valuable items in a spreadsheet on Google docs. It also helps to
keep track of who insures what (what would I otherwise do if someone
stole my box of insurance documents?) and how much insurance I need.
I used to keep the list on my laptop but then realised that it wouldn't
be very useful if the laptop were stolen.
Ekul Namsob
> Adam Lea wrote on 07/05/2007 12:17 +0100:
> > I was wondering - if faced with such a situation and the officer did issue a
> > charge as well as contesting it in court would you have the right to obtain
> > the officers identity and then make a formal complaint?
Doesn't one always have the right to obtain the officer's identity? As I
understand it, they wear their identity on their shoulders.
> If faced with such a situation I suspect I may take Sniper's line and
> encourage them to charge me. At least then the stupidity will become
> very apparent as in the Daniel Cadden case and a few high profile
> embarrassments can only help encouragé les autres
Pardon, m'sieur... encourager les autres.
Salut,
Ekul Namsob
> On Mon, 7 May 2007 11:29:44 +0100
> "Steve Watkin" <steve....@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> > I had been filtering up through a line of stopped traffic when a lone
> > > plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
> > > pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
> > Illegal to pass a queue of stationary or slow moving traffic??
> > I thought it was OK to do this.
>
> Yep. Long ago when I did motorcycle training[1], this was part of
> that training. And you'd fail the test (for failing to make
> reasonable progress) if you didn't.
>
> But we don't have sufficient context here. In some circumstances
> it's right; in others it's stupid and dangerous.
I, similarly, thought it was legal until the copper told me otherwise.
At the age of 14 I wasn't going to argue. The line of traffic was
stationary on a wide two-lane stretch of Eastwood Road North in
Leigh-on-Sea by the park. This stretch of road has now been repainted to
allow for one lane of parked cars and two of traffic.
Stupid and dangerous are two words that I would not use to describe the
manoeuvre.
Tony Raven
>
> Whilst it is now unacceptable to display prejudice against ethnic
> minorities, it is considered acceptable to do so against cyclists.
>
> As I said, bike is the new Black...
>
And there's me thinking that was a fashion statement ;-)
dkahn400
> That's fine, you don't have to - we don't live in the sort of country
> where some ID nazi can stop you and shout "Papers!Papers!" before
> hauling you off to the big house. Not yet, anyway...
Enjoy it while it lasts.
> As for proving ownership, well... (looks round house) I'd be hard
> pressed to show proof of ownership of nearly ALL my stuff.
> Even the kids...
I'd just produce the school bills. I must have paid for them many
times over.
--
Dave...
Nick Maclaren
In article <3130303037363...@zetnet.co.uk>,
Helen Deborah Vecht <helen...@zetnet.co.uk> writes:
|>
|> I think police represent society's attitudes in general.
|> There is a substantial anti-cyclist culture in Britain, reflected by
|> some anti-cyclist plod.
|>
|> Whilst it is now unacceptable to display prejudice against ethnic
|> minorities, it is considered acceptable to do so against cyclists.
Which is why I now drive to work :-(
Regards,
Nick Maclaren.
spam@thanks.com Tim
> from the nearside kerb"
Is the point I think I would have lost it a bit!
Thanks for the story
Tim
--
http://www.timdenning.myby.co.uk/
Martin Dann
> The Police are mostly pro law not anti-cyclist. It's just that like in
> every walk of life the young ones are often somewhat enthusiastic and
> filled with self importance with new power.
I think many people, including the police do not know what the laws says
(or does not say) about cycling. The new HC will just make this worse.
Martin.
Martin Dann
> I had been filtering up through a line of stopped traffic when a lone
> plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
> pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
What about all those cars that rocket past me, then brake to a halt as I
am freewheeling up to a set of red traffic lights, or don't they count.
Martin.
Tosspot
> I had been filtering up through a line of stopped traffic when a lone
>
>>plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
>>pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
>
>
>
>
> I thought it was OK to do this.
The motorbike test (and I believe in law as well) is "When it is safe to
do so", which is invariably translated as, "If you crash it wasn't".
So be careful when it's slow moving rather than stationary, as the
numpties go spazzie and change lanes violently without indicating.
Roger Merriman
indeed they they do there best to push you into the gutter don't they.
buses are the ones who seem to get the closest or at least the most
unneaving.
roger
M-gineering
>
> The motorbike test (and I believe in law as well) is "When it is safe to
> do so", which is invariably translated as, "If you crash it wasn't".
>
> So be careful when it's slow moving rather than stationary, as the
> numpties go spazzie and change lanes violently without indicating.
Er.... isn't that what you're supposed to do when the pacecar is out? ;)
Rob Morley
Merriman
NE...@wodger.demon.co.uk says...
<snip>
> indeed they they do there best to push you into the gutter don't they.
> buses are the ones who seem to get the closest or at least the most
> unneaving.
>
them and squeeze past with only a dirty mark on your shoulder to show
for it. Vans tend to have door handles and mirrors sticking out in
inconvenient places.
Ekul Namsob
> Martin Dann <marti...@virgin.net> wrote:
>
> > Ekul Namsob wrote:
> >
> > > I had been filtering up through a line of stopped traffic when a lone
> > > plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
> > > pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
> >
> > What about all those cars that rocket past me, then brake to a halt as I
> > am freewheeling up to a set of red traffic lights, or don't they count.
> indeed they they do there best to push you into the gutter don't they.
> buses are the ones who seem to get the closest or at least the most
> unneaving.
That's perhaps one of the advantages of Preston Bus's near monopoly on
the service round here: the drivers are almost invariably considerate of
vulnerable road users. I assume the lack of competition means they are
less worried about keeping to a strict timetable.
It's a pity they don't give change however. That, all too often, means
that the fragile economic balance tilts towards driving into town rather
than taking the bus. At present, cycling into town isn't an option most
of the time as my not-quite-four-year-old daughter and I are not yet
confident enough with the Trailgator to make the trip. Any advice on
that would be well appreciated, particularly around this bit:
<http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?q=&ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=1120047456
07520906437.0000011267ff84e340052&ll=53.760827,-2.691286&spn=0.005987,0.
013583&z=16&om=1>
Roger Merriman
ah the bus was over taking me, i was't in the gutter, and doing mid 20's
so it chuged past very close.
roger
Roger Merriman
> Roger Merriman <NE...@wodger.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Martin Dann <marti...@virgin.net> wrote:
> >
> > > Ekul Namsob wrote:
> > >
> > > > I had been filtering up through a line of stopped traffic when a lone
> > > > plod stopped me and made me wait for the line of stopped traffic to
> > > > pass. Apparently it's illegal to jump the queue.
> > >
> > > What about all those cars that rocket past me, then brake to a halt as I
> > > am freewheeling up to a set of red traffic lights, or don't they count.
>
> > indeed they they do there best to push you into the gutter don't they.
> > buses are the ones who seem to get the closest or at least the most
> > unneaving.
>
> That's perhaps one of the advantages of Preston Bus's near monopoly on
> the service round here: the drivers are almost invariably considerate of
> vulnerable road users. I assume the lack of competition means they are
> less worried about keeping to a strict timetable.
>
the trouble is the road is rather wide, though not quite two car wide,
else where don't have a problem as my postion forces them to either over
take or not.
> It's a pity they don't give change however. That, all too often, means
> that the fragile economic balance tilts towards driving into town rather
> than taking the bus. At present, cycling into town isn't an option most
> of the time as my not-quite-four-year-old daughter and I are not yet
> confident enough with the Trailgator to make the trip. Any advice on
> that would be well appreciated, particularly around this bit:
> <http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?q=&ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=1120047456
> 07520906437.0000011267ff84e340052&ll=53.760827,-2.691286&spn=0.005987,0.
> 013583&z=16&om=1>
>
as the buses are forced into the same traffic ie no bus lane, or not
enought any way. i very rarely use bus, i tend to use car or bike.
locally and car for longer.
looks a big busy road yes i can see that it's going to itmidating to
father and daughter. maybe quieter routes in?
i'd of thought that traffic would keep a fairly clear of you? but i've
never used a tailgater nor likely too.
> Cheers,
> Luke
_
> i'd of thought that traffic would keep a fairly clear of you? but i've
> never used a tailgater nor likely too.
>
>> Cheers,
>> Luke
Unless Carl Baxter has been let out...
Roger Merriman
two year jail term in 2003 so i would guess so. at least thats what
google says.
roger
Tim Forcer
Be fair, there is so much law (and more every Parliamentary session)
that nobody can keep up with all of it. Interested cyclists will tend
to be expert in relevant road-use law, but perhaps not on (say) public
order, drugs, sex offences, evidence admissibility, etc, etc. Yet
police are expected to have all that expertise and to be up to date.
Of course, in an ideal world, they would all have the up-to-date
comprehensive knowledge, but it's not an ideal world, police forces
often don't have the resources to do all the updating training they
would like to provide, etc, etc. Therefore, coppers being human
beings, they pick up at least some of their "knowledge" from
inaccurate sources.
Still, at least one copper has now had the necessary ad-hoc training
on one aspect of road use law! And perhaps he will mention it to some
of his otherwise ill-informed mates?
As an aside, I think the story is a useful lesson in how to respond to
a police officer - I hope I've learned at least something too.
--
Tim Forcer t...@ecs.soton.ac.uk
The University of Southampton, UK
The University is not responsible for my opinions
Tim Forcer
>
> I was wondering - if faced with such a situation and the officer
> did issue a charge as well as contesting it in court would you
> have the right to obtain the officers identity and then make a
> formal complaint?
AIUI, an officer is obliged to tell you his official number (and, I
presume, the force so that the number identifies a unique individual).
Tony Raven
>
> Be fair, there is so much law (and more every Parliamentary session)
> that nobody can keep up with all of it. Interested cyclists will tend
> to be expert in relevant road-use law, but perhaps not on (say) public
> order, drugs, sex offences, evidence admissibility, etc, etc. Yet
> police are expected to have all that expertise and to be up to date.
> Of course, in an ideal world, they would all have the up-to-date
> comprehensive knowledge, but it's not an ideal world, police forces
> often don't have the resources to do all the updating training they
> would like to provide, etc, etc. Therefore, coppers being human
> beings, they pick up at least some of their "knowledge" from
> inaccurate sources.
>
That's fine except a) its their job and that of their employer to make
sure they do know - that's what they are paid for. They won't accept
ignorance of the law as an excuse from a member of the public so it can
hardly be an excuse for a law professional and b) if they don't know the
law then they should hold off and not as in this and the Daniel Cadden
case invent laws that have been broken.
Ekul Namsob
> Ekul Namsob <notmyaddress...@wronghead.com> wrote:
> > At present, cycling into town isn't an option most
> > of the time as my not-quite-four-year-old daughter and I are not yet
> > confident enough with the Trailgator to make the trip. Any advice on
> > that would be well appreciated, particularly around this bit:
> > <http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?q=&ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=1120047456
> > 07520906437.0000011267ff84e340052&ll=53.760827,-2.691286&spn=0.005987,0.
> > 013583&z=16&om=1>
> >
> as the buses are forced into the same traffic ie no bus lane, or not
> enought any way. i very rarely use bus, i tend to use car or bike.
> locally and car for longer.
>
> looks a big busy road yes i can see that it's going to itmidating to
> father and daughter. maybe quieter routes in?
I've wracked my brains to think of one and cannot. The council and
Sustrans have provided a section of the NCN6 which connects us with the
city centre. Unhelpfully, it relies on descending Brockholes Brow
(average of one death and several injured each year), taking a hairpin
left at the bottom, riding over a good hundred yards of mud and
traversing two kissing gates and a stile before climbing an even steeper
hill into town.
Yay Sustrans. :-(
> i'd of thought that traffic would keep a fairly clear of you? but i've
> never used a tailgater nor likely too.
I too would hope that traffic would keep clear but it only takes one
idiot.
Roger Merriman
> Tim Forcer wrote on 08/05/2007 08:57 +0100:
> >
> > Be fair, there is so much law (and more every Parliamentary session)
> > that nobody can keep up with all of it. Interested cyclists will tend
> > to be expert in relevant road-use law, but perhaps not on (say) public
> > order, drugs, sex offences, evidence admissibility, etc, etc. Yet
> > police are expected to have all that expertise and to be up to date.
> > Of course, in an ideal world, they would all have the up-to-date
> > comprehensive knowledge, but it's not an ideal world, police forces
> > often don't have the resources to do all the updating training they
> > would like to provide, etc, etc. Therefore, coppers being human
> > beings, they pick up at least some of their "knowledge" from
> > inaccurate sources.
> >
>
> That's fine except a) its their job and that of their employer to make
> sure they do know - that's what they are paid for. They won't accept
> ignorance of the law as an excuse from a member of the public so it can
> hardly be an excuse for a law professional and b) if they don't know the
> law then they should hold off and not as in this and the Daniel Cadden
> case invent laws that have been broken.
indeed it really is the police's job to know the laws if not they are in
the wrong job. there is no to be fair to be had here.
roger
Roger Merriman
> Roger Merriman <NE...@wodger.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Ekul Namsob <notmyaddress...@wronghead.com> wrote:
>
> > > At present, cycling into town isn't an option most
> > > of the time as my not-quite-four-year-old daughter and I are not yet
> > > confident enough with the Trailgator to make the trip. Any advice on
> > > that would be well appreciated, particularly around this bit:
> > > <http://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?q=&ie=UTF8&hl=en&msa=0&msid=1120047456
> > > 07520906437.0000011267ff84e340052&ll=53.760827,-2.691286&spn=0.005987,0.
> > > 013583&z=16&om=1>
> > >
> > as the buses are forced into the same traffic ie no bus lane, or not
> > enought any way. i very rarely use bus, i tend to use car or bike.
> > locally and car for longer.
> >
> > looks a big busy road yes i can see that it's going to itmidating to
> > father and daughter. maybe quieter routes in?
>
> I've wracked my brains to think of one and cannot. The council and
> Sustrans have provided a section of the NCN6 which connects us with the
> city centre. Unhelpfully, it relies on descending Brockholes Brow
> (average of one death and several injured each year), taking a hairpin
> left at the bottom, riding over a good hundred yards of mud and
> traversing two kissing gates and a stile before climbing an even steeper
> hill into town.
>
> Yay Sustrans. :-(
>
sounds less than ideal.
> > i'd of thought that traffic would keep a fairly clear of you? but i've
> > never used a tailgater nor likely too.
>
> I too would hope that traffic would keep clear but it only takes one
> idiot.
indeed, i guess then maybe use the tailgater on quieter roads and get
into town other ways for the time being?
>
> Cheers,
> Luke
roger
permajeo
That says it can be not it is.
It is:
http://www.motorcycle-training.f2s.com/filtering.html
--
permajeo
goo...@woodall.me.uk
mx.forums.cyclingforums.com> wrote:
> That says it can be not it is.
>
> It is:
>
> http://www.motorcycle-training.f2s.com/filtering.html
>
cause that I hadn't thought of before:
When filtering in urban traffic, keep an eye open for cycle lanes and
expect your gaps to narrow (particularly when there are cycle lanes on
both sides of the road).
He also says:
You may have noticed the massive increase in the use of 'advisory'
cycle lanes across the UK as the government attempts to encourage more
people to use pedal cycles. As a pedal cyclist (as well as
motorcyclists) I hold the opinion that on-road cycle lanes do little
to encourage pedal cycling as they are often in inappropriate and in
inconvenient places. I have also found that they discourage car
drivers from giving you space when passing as the driver tends to see
you as segregated in a different lane.
Which is something often discussed here.
Tim.
Roger Merriman
> Ekul Namsob wrote:
>
> >I've wracked my brains to think of one and cannot. The council and
> >Sustrans have provided a section of the NCN6 which connects us with the
> >city centre. Unhelpfully, it relies on descending Brockholes Brow
> >(average of one death and several injured each year), taking a hairpin
> >left at the bottom, riding over a good hundred yards of mud and
> >traversing two kissing gates and a stile before climbing an even steeper
> >hill into town.
>
> See, the trick is to keep up your speed over the gates and stile, then
> the uphill's much easier. With wide enough tyres you should be able just
> to surf across the mud.
>
> R
over the gate and stile? some bike. as the idea is to safely transport a
child i suspect that high speed charging over mud would probably not go
down well.
roger
_
> Good story, but disturbing that the Young Plod was so daft. Hopefully
> he *will* have learned a bit about safe cycling the next time he's
> on patrol. It really should be the case that traffic police should
> receive special training about cyclists, and even including actual
> cycling experience to help them understand the situation better.
>
>
> Sniper8052(L96A1) wrote in uk.rec.cycling
> about: You shouldn't be there! - Long
>
>> Young Plod - "What do you do for a living"
>> Me - "I train people"
>> Young Plod - "Who for"
>> Me - "The police"
>> Young Plod - "Oh"
>> Me - "Does that make a difference"
>> Young Plod - "Err"
>> Me - "Do I get a copy of a stop form then"
>
> ..umm, what's a stop form?
>
http://www.mpa.gov.uk/issues/stop-search/rec61.htm
> Or if I were to try this trick would I get done for "impersonating a
> police officer"? :-(
Shouldn't.
Unless you have another clone of YP in front of you...
Tony Raven
>
> http://www.mpa.gov.uk/issues/stop-search/rec61.htm
>
What would happen in CM if the whole assembly requested one when it was
stopped. They would be there writing out forms all night and sending
for more books of forms ;-)
Don Whybrow
>
> http://www.mpa.gov.uk/issues/stop-search/rec61.htm
Is this still in trials or has it been rolled out to the rest of the UK yet?
--
Don Whybrow
Sequi Bonum Non Time
Sense is not cognition but sensation. (Douglas Robinson)
John Kane
See where sniper says
Me - "Do I get a copy of a stop form then"
Young Plod -"Err"
Me - "I really think I should get a copy of a stop form"
so it sounds like it in his area.
John Kane, Kingston ON Canada
Sniper8052(L96A1)
Stop records have technically always been required. Even the notorious
section 66 of the Metropolitan Police Act 1839 required a record to be
made.
Stop records were formally required after the Phillips Commission report
1981 and the Policy Studies Institute report 1983 were published and
became part of PACE 1984.
The requirement for a copy to be given to the person stopped came about
relativly recently, perhaps three or four years ago. Before then a
duplicate was to be kept for inspection if requested by the person
stopped; they had a year from the date of the stop to request a copy.
Stop forms must now be kept for 12 years from the date of the stop.
This is a national provision and an entitlement for the public however
it is only a requirment if the interaction is a 'Stop' and not an
'Encounter'.
A 'Stop' is where a police officer asks a person to account for their
movements, ownership of property, requests personal details, delays a
person for any period of time or makes a search of a person or a vehicle
in which that person is travelling.
An encounter is a short interaction where a person may be asked brief
details that are less specific.
So, technically - An officer stops a vehicle and asks "Is this your
vehicle, can you tell me the registration number" is a 'Stop' and
requires a record to be made as it asks the driver to account for the
vehicle and reveal personal information.
In practice it would be unreasonable for an officer to delay a person
just to fill out a Stop Form to say that they had asked the registration
number of a vehicle for screening and then let it go so Stop Forms a
rarely filled out for this. If the driver didn't know and was then
pulled over to prove the ownership of the vehicle a Stop Form would
definitly need to be completed.
An encounter might be where an officer stops a vehicle and asks the
driver "Can you tell me where the tax disc was purchased". This does
not require the driver to reveal any personal information but may reveal
ownership of the vehicle for a screening check. No record would be
required.
It's a little bit of a mismatch as to what qualifies as a Stop and what
qualifies as an encounter but in very general terms anything over a
couple of quick questions, or any question that asked you to account for
your movements might well be getting into the area of requiring a Stop
Form although each situation is different and should be assessed on the
interaction at the time and in the light of 'common sense'.
Also a Stop Form must be completed if one is requested by the person
stopped except where it is impracticable for this to be done.
You do not have to give your name or address unless an offence has been
committed and the officer suspects or reasonably suspects you to be
guilty of the offence and requires the information for service of a
summons or to issue a ticket for the offence.
If a ticket is issued for the offence a Stop Form does not need to be
completed.
Sniper8052
Tony Raven
>
> Also a Stop Form must be completed if one is requested by the person
> stopped except where it is impracticable for this to be done.
>
The Metropolitan Police Authority says even if it was not a Stop "if you
want to you can ask for a form and the officer must fill one out and
give it to you."
http://www.mpa.gov.uk/issues/stop-search/leaflet.htm
Snipe...@yahoo.co.uk
What has to be accepted is that this is one line in a short
description where as the full home office document runs to 88 pages
and appends the guide lines in PACE and from ACPO.
Perhaps though it was inadvisable to use the word 'stopped' in this
context as it could easily have been misconstrued.
An officer must complete a 'Stop Form" if one is requested by the
person subject to delay or to whom the officer has been speaking even
where such conversation or delay might not be classed as a Stop under
Home Office or ACPO guide lines.
This requirement does not apply where it would be impractical for an
officer to complete a record IE: In public order situations, football
matches etc
Sniper8052
Peter Amey
[snip]
>
> Perhaps though it was inadvisable to use the word 'stopped' in this
> context as it could easily have been misconstrued.
>
> An officer must complete a 'Stop Form" if one is requested by the
> person subject to delay or to whom the officer has been speaking even
> where such conversation or delay might not be classed as a Stop under
> Home Office or ACPO guide lines.
> This requirement does not apply where it would be impractical for an
> officer to complete a record IE: In public order situations, football
> matches etc
>
> Sniper8052
>
Sniper please don't ever leave this group! The benefit of informed
factual knowledge over speculative twaddle makes you invaluable.
Peter
MatSav
>
> I've only once had an issue with a copper...
More than 20 years ago, when I were a student, I'd been for a night out
- and was "cycling" back to my digs. I'd registered the presence of an
ambulance, moving very slowly, on the opposite carriageway with a police
car escorting it.
Without stopping, the passenger door opens - and "plod" got out from the
car and walks over to me:
"Do you think you should be riding that machine, sir?"
"Ermm....p'rapsh not", I slurred.
"Well, get off and F**kin' WALK it then!" was his response, as he
returned to the still moving car and got back in to continue the journey
escorting the ambulance!
--
MatSav
Robin
"Tony Raven" <ju...@raven-family.invalid> wrote in message
news:566dnfBIRe5zQaPb...@pipex.net...
> Clive George wrote on 07/05/2007 00:00 +0100:
>>
>> (snip story)
>>
>> It's like a Frank Spencer programme :-)
>>
>> Hopefully he'll have learned his lesson early..
>>
>
> The problem being the police are institutionally anti-cyclist especially
> at the "too much power for their own ego" constable level. If it had not
> been Sniper on the bike we could have had Daniel Cadden II here. Its just
> not good enough.
>
hehe Dan is my Brother, I have just forwarded this to him :)
iamcyb...@gmail.com
> - Robert Rankin, _They Came And Ate Us_
Brilliant Robert Rankin quote. Had quite forgotten that one!
laidbackaro...@gmail.com
dave.h...@gmail.com
> Whilst indulging in a spot of the obligatory DIY today I discovered I
> needed few more bits and bobs, blowtorch, flux, joints etc...
> I could not get the car out for a 'quick' 6 miles to the shop as the
> community skip lorry was doing its thing so I took the jolly old - new -
> racing bike for a spin.
>
> Flashing along and wanting to turn right over the bridge system I
> crossed the four lanes to take up position for the giratory road system.
> Pulled up at the lights and waited, not bothered by and not bothering
> anybody when up pulls a plod car, the window goes down on the drivers
> side and a head pops out.
>
> Young Plod - "Nice bike you've got there"
> Me - "Yes"
> Young Plod - "Going out for a ride"
> Me - "Yes"
> Young Plod - "Where you going"
> Me - "Over there"
> Young Plod - "You know your in the wrong lane"
> Me - "Hows that"
> Young Plod - "You should be over there" - Points to the near side lane
> four over.
> Me - "Can't turn right from there"
> Young Plod - "It's dangerous to ride your bike in this lane"
> Me - "Be a lot more dangerous turning right from over there"
> Young Plod - "Is it yours"
> Me - "What"
> Young Plod - "The bike"
> Me - "Yes"
> Young Plod - "Your not wearing cycling clothing"
> Me - "No" - wearing old combats, boots and sweatshirt, very dirty as had
> been crawling around under the floorboards.
> Young Plod - "Your not wearing a helmet either"
> Me - "No"
> Young Plod - "Just pull up over there for me"
> Me - "Why"
> Young plod - "I want a word with you"
> Me - "What for"
> Young Plod - "Don't argue"
> Me - "About what"
>
> At this point young plod had had enough and tripped his blue lights...
>
> Young Plod - "get off"
> Me - Feeling a bit like finding out how far he would go - "Have I done
> something wrong"
> Young Plod - "Like I said your in the wrong lane"
> Me - "Is that a road traffic offence" - he should have picked up on this!
> Young Plod - "Yes"
> Me - "Oh" - Get off bike
>
> Young Plod then gets out of car and tells me how he could do me for
> dangerous cycling and how I should be wearing a cycle helmet.
>
> Me - "Is that the law then - cycle helmets"
> Young Plod - "No but its a lot safer"
> Me - "There's never been a study that proved that you know"
> Young Plod - "I cycle and I always wear a helmet"
> Me - "That's your choice"
> Young Plod - "Your not taking this very seriously"
> Me - "Aren't I"
> Young Plod - "Right - Lets see what you think about getting a fine for
> dangerous cycling"
> Me - "Your going to give me a ticket"
> Young Plod - "I might if you continue like this"
> Me - "Am I riding dangerously then"
> Young Plod - "Yes"
> Me - "How"
> Young Plod - "You shouldn't be in the outside lane you should turn right
> from the nearside kerb"
> Me - "Oh, does it say that in the Road Traffic Act then"
> Young Plod - "Do you have any ID"
> Me - "What for"
> Young Plod - "Because I asked you"
> Me - "Are you going to give me a ticket then"
> Young Plod - "I've had enough of this what's your name"
> Me - "******"
> Me - "I train people"
> Young Plod - "Who for"
> Me - "The police"
> Young Plod - "Oh"
> Me - "Does that make a difference"
> Me - "Do I get a copy of a stop form then"
> Young Plod -"Err"
> Me - "I really think I should get a copy of a stop form"
> Me - "Yes"
> Young Plod - writes out stop form - Name?
> Me - "Sgt..."
> Young Plod - Finishes the stop form - hands it to me
> Me - "Next time you think of abusing your powers you might like to think
> about who your talking to first"
> Young Plod -"Yes Sarge"
> Me - "Do I need to write to your skipper about this"
> Young Plod - "No Sarge"
> Me - "You think you've learnt your lesson then"
> Young Plod - "Yes Sarge"
> Me - "You think I should let you get away with this then"
> Young Plod - "I think I made a mistake"
> Me - "I think you did"
> Young Plod - "Are you going to write to my Sergeant then Sarge"
> Me - "I think he needs to know, don't you"
> Me - "I'll tell you what, You tell your Sergeant and get them to call me
> later"
> Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant"
> Me - "Be sure you do - or I will be writing officially"
> Young Plod - "Yes Sergeant" Gets back in car and drives off.
>
> Had chat with female sergeant later - turns out he did tell her and got
> bulled for his actions.
>
> Obviously the above is not a word for word but it's pretty close.
>
> Sniper8052
OMG So that's where Tony Raven and our Helen Deborah are lurking!
Reminds me of a stop I had when walking from Dobbies Loan/City Road through to Charing Cross - a route I normally cycle but on this occasion was on foot. The Polis pulls up alongside and driver leans over - rather than his passenger.
In synopsis of slightly longer conversation
"Do you know its illegal to walk on the Motorway"
"Yes but I'm not on the Motorway"
"Oh so where are you then?"
"I'm walking along the A803 to Charing Cross" Points to white sign with black lettering and symbols and one spur of the road plan with a blue square, white lettering M8, the other Charing Cross A803.
As I left to carry on walking on this rather nice wide red tarmac footway I was sure I could see the passenger trying not to giggle. In retrospect but probably too cheeky I might have suggested that they booked most of the drivers flying past as the general purpose road I was walking along has a 30mph speed limit - the 50mph M8 limit begins at the point that the junction diverges.
A second event was shortly after I'd recovered my car after it had been stolen. On a foggy M1 I was pulled over and standing by the car with engine running and all the services demisting, lighting etc on a moderate slope I was asked if the handbrake worked "Well if it was in gear now...." Stopped twice in 24 hours that weekend by same car but different crews.
Dave H
cdms...@gmail.com
richard...@virgin.net
> Young Plod - "You should be over there" - Points to the near side lane
> four over.
