Windows 10 update version 1709

[Alison Murney]

Hi

I am having so much trouble with Windows 10 update version 1709 on our schools HP laptops - just wanted to how others are going with it?

I had 10 new Tela HP laptops all needing the update and all responding differently to the process.

Most I had to uninstall HP drive encryption and Symantec Endpoint. Sometimes the update process would uninstall it automatically for me, sometimes I had manually uninstall it. Many times at the end of download it would error with ' setup couldn't start properly - please reboot and try again". Several times it would error after install and then go through uninstalling all the changes.

Tela - if you could update your HP laptop image so that this update in already included - it would be a great help.

I still have multiple staff around the school struggling with the update so if anyone has any handy advise to help it run smoothly I would greatly appreciate it.

Thanks

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Kind regards,

Alison Murney

Waimate High School
027 611 8490

[Gillian Ellison]

Same here.

Most teachers laptops will be unable to uninstall Symantec as our management console won’t allow this.

Am interested how others are going too.

Gillian Ellison

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[Kevin Whelan]

you need a later version of symantec then it doesn't need to uninstall, sounds like your IT guys need to update your symantec school wide first or just give you the symantec files first.
The HP software has to come off which is a pain but its best left off anyway, let windows handle it all you will save yourself a lot of grief.
BTW 1709 has had a ton of issues and is really regarded as the vista version of windows 10,has a had a multide of seriously faulty updates that cause BSOD on boot etc, best left on 1703 and the new 1803 is due any day so may as well wait for that now

[Kevin Whelan]

https://www.windowscentral.com/windows-10-redstone-4-changelog

to clarify the HP fingerprint software has some real bugs which usually appear months after working flawlessly when some windows update borks it.
I always remove all the related HP security software because windows hello just works so much better

[Alison Murney]

Great - thanks for the info Kevin about the next windows update. That is very helpful.

Would also be helpful if Tela sent laptops out with the latest version of Symantec!

Cheers

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Kind regards,

Alison Murney
027 611 8490
03-612-9947

[Nick Steenson]

Not that it's without issues and effort, but the first thing I do when I get TELA laptops is deploy a W10 image prepared without the bloatware, just BIOS (manual) then image with drivers and applications. Means I don't have to worry about update processes etc, which often take much longer than just deploying an updated image anyway.

Not that it's great practice either, but if a teacher comes in with a well-out-of-date machine and doesn't mind a wipe (nearly all data is on the cloud, plus chrome settings etc are all synced) I find it easier to just redeploy a new image and voila!

Nick

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Nick Steenson IT Manager Mt Aspiring College p: +643 443 0463 (Ext 830) w: https://nick.mtaspiring.school.nz/ e: stee...@mtaspiring.school.nz

[Simon Wright]

Agree With Nick,

Roll your own image, even using MDT, once setup, updating packages is quick and easy.

When a deployed laptop becomes stale, just re-image (which all going well can take less than an hour) and they're away again.

Regards
Simon Wright
ICT Manager

Best for boys through the right learning
2 Arthur Street, Dunedin, 9016, New Zealand p: 03 477 5527 | f: 03 477 5468 | c: 021 773 229 | w: obhs.school.nz

Respect - Whakaute | Courage - Toa | Honour - Hōnore | Perseverance - Manawanui | Excellence - Hiranga

On 6 March 2018 at 10:55, Nick Steenson <stee...@mtaspiring.school.nz> wrote:

Not that it's without issues and effort, but the first thing I do when I get TELA laptops is deploy a W10 image prepared without the bloatware, just BIOS (manual) then image with drivers and applications. Means I don't have to worry about update processes etc, which often take much longer than just deploying an updated image anyway.

Not that it's great practice either, but if a teacher comes in with a well-out-of-date machine and doesn't mind a wipe (nearly all data is on the cloud, plus chrome settings etc are all synced) I find it easier to just redeploy a new image and voila!

Nick

On 6 March 2018 at 10:43, Kevin Whelan <kwhel...@gmail.com> wrote:

https://www.windowscentral.com/windows-10-redstone-4-changelog

to clarify the HP fingerprint software has some real bugs which usually appear months after working flawlessly when some windows update borks it.
I always remove all the related HP security software because windows hello just works so much better

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Nick Steenson IT Manager Mt Aspiring College p: +643 443 0463 (Ext 830) w: https://nick.mtaspiring.school.nz/ e: stee...@mtaspiring.school.nz

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DISCLAIMER
This e-mail is intended for the addressee only and may contain information which is subject to legal privilege. This e-mail message and accompanying data may contain information that is confidential and subject to privilege. Its contents are not necessarily the official view Otago Boys’ High School or communication of the Otago Boys’ High School. If you are not the intended recipient you must not use, disclose, copy or distribute this e-mail or any information in, or attached to it. If you have received this e-mail in error, please contact the sender immediately or return the original message to Otago Boys’ High School by e-mail, and destroy any copies. Otago Boys’ High School does not accept any liability for changes made to this e-mail or attachments after sending.

[Landyn Frisby]

I have been imaging with 1709.1 + cumulative updates and while I was initially unable to use MDT, a few updates[MDT & ADK] later (and a hack)  - it is now all running perfectly. It is frustrating dealing with the built in W10 apps which are all rubbish. Don't even think about touching these[built in apps] or letting the reference VM connect to the Internet - it will not sysprep otherwise. 

Really enjoy MDT as a imaging tool - after a bit of work everything is automated and it sets up the machine with everything our teachers need. 

Done a lot of 55 Tela Laptops (HP Elitebook 840 G3) with this and it took about 30mins per machine, 10 at a time. 

Have had very few issues with this:

One was an issue with Windows 10 going to sleep after 2 mins despite the sleep settings being set to something else. 

Skipping the HP[and any other] Bloatware is definitely a good option. 

issues can be fun to deal with - test your might :)

On Tuesday, March 6, 2018 at 11:12:26 AM UTC+13, Simon - OBHS wrote:

Agree With Nick,

Roll your own image, even using MDT, once setup, updating packages is quick and easy.

When a deployed laptop becomes stale, just re-image (which all going well can take less than an hour) and they're away again.

Regards
Simon Wright
ICT Manager

Best for boys through the right learning
2 Arthur Street, Dunedin, 9016, New Zealand p: 03 477 5527 | f: 03 477 5468 | c: 021 773 229 | w: obhs.school.nz

Respect - Whakaute | Courage - Toa | Honour - Hōnore | Perseverance - Manawanui | Excellence - Hiranga

On 6 March 2018 at 10:55, Nick Steenson <stee...@mtaspiring.school.nz> wrote:

Not that it's without issues and effort, but the first thing I do when I get TELA laptops is deploy a W10 image prepared without the bloatware, just BIOS (manual) then image with drivers and applications. Means I don't have to worry about update processes etc, which often take much longer than just deploying an updated image anyway.

Not that it's great practice either, but if a teacher comes in with a well-out-of-date machine and doesn't mind a wipe (nearly all data is on the cloud, plus chrome settings etc are all synced) I find it easier to just redeploy a new image and voila!

Nick

On 6 March 2018 at 10:43, Kevin Whelan <kwhel...@gmail.com> wrote:

https://www.windowscentral.com/windows-10-redstone-4-changelog

to clarify the HP fingerprint software has some real bugs which usually appear months after working flawlessly when some windows update borks it.
I always remove all the related HP security software because windows hello just works so much better

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Nick Steenson IT Manager Mt Aspiring College p: +643 443 0463 (Ext 830) w: https://nick.mtaspiring.school.nz/ e: stee...@mtaspiring.school.nz

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[Kevin Whelan]

be nice to see a stripped enterprise version that didn't include all the candy crush etc, how hard could it be in the version  install script really, they can remove network and gp processess easily enough on home versions so why can't we have a enterprise version

[Andrew Godfrey]

There is the "10 Enterprise 2016 LTSB" version available through the MoE funding you can download. We've rolled it out school-wide this year and are very happy with it. A couple of earlier Win10 test builds from last year broke over the holidays as they weren't on LTSB.

Andrew Godfrey  |  Network Manager

[Kevin Whelan]

can you explain the differences apart from long term servicing, its all very vague

[Simon Wright]

Attached is a powershell script which you can add to an MDT task sequence or even run standalone (i believe) to remove any "store apps".

This works for me for removing the stuff i don't want students to have access to.

Regards
Simon Wright
ICT Manager

Best for boys through the right learning
2 Arthur Street, Dunedin, 9016, New Zealand p: 03 477 5527 | f: 03 477 5468 | c: 021 773 229 | w: obhs.school.nz

Respect - Whakaute | Courage - Toa | Honour - Hōnore | Perseverance - Manawanui | Excellence - Hiranga

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[Landyn Frisby]

Nice Simon, thanks for sharing this :)​

On 7 March 2018 at 11:31, Simon Wright <simon....@obhs.school.nz> wrote:

Attached is a powershell script which you can add to an MDT task sequence or even run standalone (i believe) to remove any "store apps".

This works for me for removing the stuff i don't want students to have access to.

Regards
Simon Wright
ICT Manager

Best for boys through the right learning
2 Arthur Street, Dunedin, 9016, New Zealand p: 03 477 5527 | f: 03 477 5468 | c: 021 773 229 | w: obhs.school.nz

Respect - Whakaute | Courage - Toa | Honour - Hōnore | Perseverance - Manawanui | Excellence - Hiranga

On 7 March 2018 at 11:04, Kevin Whelan <kwhel...@gmail.com> wrote:

can you explain the differences apart from long term servicing, its all very vague

On Wednesday, March 7, 2018 at 10:50:21 AM UTC+13, Andrew Godfrey wrote:

There is the "10 Enterprise 2016 LTSB" version available through the MoE funding you can download. We've rolled it out school-wide this year and are very happy with it. A couple of earlier Win10 test builds from last year broke over the holidays as they weren't on LTSB.

Andrew Godfrey  |  Network Manager

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Kind Regards,

Landyn Frisby

ICT Systems Engineer

Please log jobs with the Cyclone Helpdesk

E: help...@jameshargest.school.nz

P: 0508 436 225

[Andrew Godfrey]

Kevin,

LTSB remains exactly the same version without the feature "upgrades".

Like remaining on the same OS without automatically receiving in-place OS upgrades.

One of the Gotchas is it doesn't allow access to the Microsoft App Store which might be a problem for some users.

Some apps you try install may also assume you have access to the app store. Skype does this but there are workarounds for downloading and installing it like an old-school application.

Andrew Godfrey  |  Network Manager

On 7 March 2018 at 11:04, Kevin Whelan <kwhel...@gmail.com> wrote:

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[Sam McNeill]

I know a few schools that have opted for LTSB and it delivers in the sense of it keeps the OS identical (apart from managed security updates).

Depending on your requirements, the 'downside' is that you don't get the feature updates as Andrew pointed out i.e. none of the additional features around Creators Update, Fall Creators Update etc. This may not be a problem for the school, although I have been in one where teachers were getting frustrated because the student's devices had later versions of Win10 and had features the teachers wanted e.g. Mixed Reality, Paint3D etc.

Again, depending on your requirements, this may not be an issue, but worth being aware of.

Cheers

Sam

[Landyn Frisby]

I am going to start investigating LTSB but think it's lack of features might put off some of the more techie teachers - which did request the 1709 update specifically. I do like the appeal of it being more stable because W10 updates have caused many issues in my experience. Some of which have been 

* after update no USB devices work ie no keyboard and mouse

* w10 updating to drivers which cause a bsod boot loop

* w10 updates that cause the machine to be unbootable 

* after updates resetting all application defaults namely setting edge as default 

and that is before we get into the /rushed/ spectre and meltdown patches

Happy days

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[Andrew Godfrey]

And for the very Techie - One of our teachers is very happy with his Ubuntu workstation with a Terminal Server 2012 session available via RDP for running Kamar. He did build it himself so he's no techie slouch.

BTW: we are also using the Terminal server to allow our Kamar administrator to have two Kamar sessions running concurrently which she loves, especially when it comes to doing big mail-outs which can tie up the workstation for a looong time.

Andrew Godfrey  |  Network Manager

On 8 March 2018 at 09:31, Landyn Frisby <lfr...@jameshargest.school.nz> wrote:

I am going to start investigating LTSB but think it's lack of features might put off some of the more techie teachers - which did request the 1709 update specifically. I do like the appeal of it being more stable because W10 updates have caused many issues in my experience. Some of which have been 

* after update no USB devices work ie no keyboard and mouse

* w10 updating to drivers which cause a bsod boot loop

* w10 updates that cause the machine to be unbootable 

* after updates resetting all application defaults namely setting edge as default 

and that is before we get into the /rushed/ spectre and meltdown patches

Happy days

On 7 March 2018 at 17:16, Sam McNeill <s...@mcneill.co.nz> wrote:

I know a few schools that have opted for LTSB and it delivers in the sense of it keeps the OS identical (apart from managed security updates).

Depending on your requirements, the 'downside' is that you don't get the feature updates as Andrew pointed out i.e. none of the additional features around Creators Update, Fall Creators Update etc. This may not be a problem for the school, although I have been in one where teachers were getting frustrated because the student's devices had later versions of Win10 and had features the teachers wanted e.g. Mixed Reality, Paint3D etc.

Again, depending on your requirements, this may not be an issue, but worth being aware of.

Cheers

Sam

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Kind Regards,

Landyn Frisby

ICT Systems Engineer

Please log jobs with the Cyclone Helpdesk

E: help...@jameshargest.school.nz

P: 0508 436 225

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[Craig Knights]

My boss is the kamar admin. He uses his MacBook and an old windows desktop that I have threatened many times to upgrade the hardware on.  And RDPs from both as well...  and the phone app... 

Craig

On Thu, 8 Mar 2018, 10:31 AM Andrew Godfrey, <godf...@burnside.school.nz> wrote:

And for the very Techie - One of our teachers is very happy with his Ubuntu workstation with a Terminal Server 2012 session available via RDP for running Kamar. He did build it himself so he's no techie slouch.

BTW: we are also using the Terminal server to allow our Kamar administrator to have two Kamar sessions running concurrently which she loves, especially when it comes to doing big mail-outs which can tie up the workstation for a looong time.

Andrew Godfrey  |  Network Manager

On 8 March 2018 at 09:31, Landyn Frisby <lfr...@jameshargest.school.nz> wrote:

I am going to start investigating LTSB but think it's lack of features might put off some of the more techie teachers - which did request the 1709 update specifically. I do like the appeal of it being more stable because W10 updates have caused many issues in my experience. Some of which have been 

* after update no USB devices work ie no keyboard and mouse

* w10 updating to drivers which cause a bsod boot loop

* w10 updates that cause the machine to be unbootable 

* after updates resetting all application defaults namely setting edge as default 

and that is before we get into the /rushed/ spectre and meltdown patches

Happy days

On 7 March 2018 at 17:16, Sam McNeill <s...@mcneill.co.nz> wrote:

I know a few schools that have opted for LTSB and it delivers in the sense of it keeps the OS identical (apart from managed security updates).

Depending on your requirements, the 'downside' is that you don't get the feature updates as Andrew pointed out i.e. none of the additional features around Creators Update, Fall Creators Update etc. This may not be a problem for the school, although I have been in one where teachers were getting frustrated because the student's devices had later versions of Win10 and had features the teachers wanted e.g. Mixed Reality, Paint3D etc.

Again, depending on your requirements, this may not be an issue, but worth being aware of.

Cheers

Sam

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Landyn Frisby

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[Matt Strickland]

Hi all,

I've been using LTSB on most of our student desktop / kiosk type computers no problem (devices that don't have a single owner).

I think the 'gotcha' for us is being O365 and using OneDrive (I use the store based app) so for Teachers I don't use LTSB.

As for Symantec I haven't had any issues with staff upgrading to 1709, however I always use the latest version available, and force the client to update/install based on OU in Active Directory.

My version is 14.0 RU1 MP1 build 3876 (The filename should be 14.0.1.MP1...)

I don't use Tela images. All imaged via MDT and often refreshed a few times throughout the lease period.

Matt

[Dave Hartley]

Couldn't agree more, the first thing I do when I get a new TELA laptop is to wipe it and put a flvour of Linux on (currently Ubuntu 16.04 LTS). Zero problems with any of the four I've had (both Toshiba and HP) 😊

On 8 March 2018 at 10:31, Andrew Godfrey <godf...@burnside.school.nz> wrote:

And for the very Techie - One of our teachers is very happy with his Ubuntu workstation with a Terminal Server 2012 session available via RDP for running Kamar. He did build it himself so he's no techie slouch.

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Stop the Madness.  Boycott Word attachments.

[Andrew Godfrey]

Ahh - good old LTS for those who like stability. Got that particular one on my old Athlon64 at home which still does what it needs to do when the phone screen is too small.

Andrew Godfrey  |  Network Manager

On 8 March 2018 at 13:30, Dave Hartley <dhar...@verdoncollege.school.nz> wrote:

Couldn't agree more, the first thing I do when I get a new TELA laptop is to wipe it and put a flvour of Linux on (currently Ubuntu 16.04 LTS). Zero problems with any of the four I've had (both Toshiba and HP) 😊

On 8 March 2018 at 10:31, Andrew Godfrey <godf...@burnside.school.nz> wrote:

And for the very Techie - One of our teachers is very happy with his Ubuntu workstation with a Terminal Server 2012 session available via RDP for running Kamar. He did build it himself so he's no techie slouch.

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Stop the Madness.  Boycott Word attachments.

[Patrick Dunford]

Heh :)

I used Linux myself in the last school I worked in, just had an old laptop for Windows very occasionally.

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[Patrick Dunford]

Those must be hardware specific? I only have one Windows machine now, at
home, and it doesn't seem to see any problems with any updates at all.

[Dave Hartley]

Don't even have that, just use VirtualBox running Win10 for any Windoze stuff I need (which is hardly anything these days 😊)

On 8 March 2018 at 20:29, Patrick Dunford <blackw...@gmail.com> wrote:

Heh :)

I used Linux myself in the last school I worked in, just had an old laptop for Windows very occasionally

[Landyn Frisby]

Yes generally hardware specific but with about 400 clients, issues pop up from time to time. 

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[Patrick Dunford]

I keep a box because it needs to run a scanner and some cameras that only have Windows drivers.

[andy....@linewize.com]

Greetings all!

Has anyone seen an odd issue with machines running Win 10 1709, as follows:

When shut down and restarted, these machines seem to have "forgotten" the school's wifi PSK that they had previously saved...

However, this oddity doesn't seem to affect saved SSIDs/PSKs for home/non-school wifi networks.

I suspect there may be some rogue GPO at play, but just wondering if the above makes any sense to anyone here... I've been told the issue only started occurring when the computer were updated to 1709!

Thanks!

Andy

[andy....@linewize.com]

Hey Kevin,

Have you looked at using Win 10 LTSB? https://www.howtogeek.com/273824/windows-10-without-the-cruft-windows-10-ltsb-explained/

I love the fact that it doesn't come with Edge and all that other garbage ;)

Cheers,
Andy

[andy....@linewize.com]

Gee, maybe I should have read the whole thread first! Sorry folks!!

[andy....@linewize.com]

Perhaps CBB might be a decent compromise, if you need more features that LTSB offers, but don't want to suffer being bleeding edge, aka MS beta testers 😅

https://www.neowin.net/news/windows-10-current-branch-and-current-branch-for-business-now-the-semi-annual-channel

As per ^ it seems LTSB is now called LTSC... okayyyyyy....