Fwd: GLOW

[Paola Di Maio]

I replied to JS with a request to forward to list, but he did neither acknowledge nor

repost . Here is some background about OK.

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Paola Di Maio <paola....@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 7:35 PM
Subject: GLOW
To: joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>

Joseph

below some info, please repost to list WITHOUT my email address and signature

re GLOW

Thanks for sharing-

I had been working (as a researcher, editor and online publisher) on 'open knowledge' topics for some years, and eventually came across OKF online, tried to connect via their many mailing lists, exchanged a few mails, but did not manage to integrate much with them,  other academic colleagues felt their grassroot unstructured approach was maybe more appealing to less experienced, not so fussy folks. (aw, how I dont like to say that)

in 2009 met two of the founders, Jo and Rufus. (Rufus made a wonderful home made pesto for lunch at Jo's flat). _

Jo tried to get me involved in some of the projects, related to my work and research topics, but things did not work out much.

She then said that things had changed since she started the project, that was supposed to be a self organising thing and that now Rufus has started controlling things contrary to the initial philosophy.

Obviously I asked questions about everything (I can be very inquisitive) but could not put my finger on some of the administrative issues, funding, decision making etc. 

Jo wanted me to help improve some things, , Rufus did not want to make things more transparent and accountable

That is where I started feeling someone had something to hide. Ha.

My conclusion is that they do some good work, but some of that may be a cover up for some not so clear stuff people behind the scenes may be doing without anyone knowing

The lack of transparency and accountability of the so called stewards of transparency and accountability (the open data thing) made me worry most.  I shared openly my concerns with everyone on the mailiing list, especially with Jo and Rufus. Some people would invite me to get involved, and dig in, other people said I had nothing to do with their projects.  .

I was especially concerned that some legitimate community initiatives, within OKF and their partner organisations, were driven and managed  by insider manipulators due to lack of transparency and lack of good practices. I was worried that the whole openness argument would become ridiculed and that when these people were caught with their hands in some illegal pie, the whole open data movement would suffer -at some point there were in the middle (as in controlling the traffick of) of all open things online.

 It became clear that something is not clear about OK

Uhm.

The suddenly they changed name from OKF to OK, without a word, without a community discussion. nobody, including community members, said they had no clue what is happening and why/ and when you ask they say 'we do everything in the open'

I came across Lies,  contradictions and malpractice unfortunately 

Possibly dark finance, political intrigue and covert lobbying being done. Most of it with good intentions, and possibly without being aware that poor practices may lead to

systemic deviation.

Do let us know if something interesting comes out of their work,

On Tue, Sep 6, 2016 at 4:53 PM, <syss...@googlegroups.com> wrote:

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• Trump and Clinton - 17 Updates
• GLOW 2016 - Community Hangout: Open Parliamentary Data and Tech Tools - 1 Update

Trump and Clinton

"Aleksandar Malečić" <ljma...@gmail.com>: Sep 06 01:27AM +0200 Jack's response is great on so many levels. It's interesting to me to compare Trump and Michael Moore (http://michaelmoore.com/trumpwillwin). He is an exemplar of not complaining too much and making entertainment and business out of complaining and at the same time demonstrating that you live in the best possible society where you are free to talk and have an occasional (bitter, but still symbiotic and profitable) laugh with Clint Eastwood: http://reagancoalition.com/articles/2015/clint-eastwood-to-michael-moore-come-to-my-door-with-a-camera-and-ill-kill-you.html .   Aleksandar

joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 06:13PM -0700 Aleksandar:   Interesting response... Michael Moore appears to encapsulate and craft his messages to bypass a logical human response (conscious) and make an appeal directly to the subconscious.   Trump does the same thing by taking every position, on every issue, all the time with no logical consistency, only a constant appeal to subconscious feeling of fear, social dislocation and loss of power. (Make America Great Again)   See:   http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3495577/Is-Donald-Trump-s-broken-speech-key-success-Linguists-say-strange-patterns-make-authentic-relatable-trustworthy.html   https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/theory-knowledge/201509/trump-psychosocial-analysis   These speech patterns and communication appeals are designed as small-scale communications. Every individual will put their own spin on what Trump says and say, "He tells it like it is!", when in fact he takes every position possible on almost every issue.   Jacks response is an appeal to fear that the top-down (large scale) control system will not work on one candidate but will work on the other... which of course is taking both sides of that issue... which leaves the impression that the top-down control system is broken... and only a strong leader can make everything OK....   The open access to mass media channels make this all possible..   Constant subconscious conditioning all the time 24/7 by 365..   It is all about stimulus -- response.... people need to be conditioned to respond in the correct manner.... which means they should not think ... respond without thinking... is called?   Take care, be good to yourself and have fun,   Joe       On Mon, Sep 5, 2016 at 4:27 PM, Aleksandar Malečić <ljma...@gmail.com> wrote:     -- Joe Simpson “Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore, depends on unreasonable people.” George Bernard Shaw

Steven Krane <sk5...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:26PM -0600 Leaving all pretenses of serious discussion about the notion of system in the context of being human in 2016 on the 3rd rock from the sun, I would simply recommend that people compare what any supportive source is saying about Donald Trump now to what they said about Sarah Palin then.

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 08:27PM -0700 Methinks Aleksandar misinterprets my model. My model explicitly seeks to avoid the ‘strong leader’ in favor of a 'strong facilitator' of dialog. A strong leader presumes the government should control all things. Therefore has a plan for everything (except apparently no plan for avoiding the inevitable Lucifer Effect). Every speech is a sermon. The strong facilitator presumes that dialog among the citizens is preferable and seeks to stimulate it by suggesting various ways of considering the situation. Every speech is a probe. A variety of probes stimulates dialog. Jack

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 08:30PM -0700 Please cite a ‘supportive source’ and explain why a Trump-Palin ‘equivalency’ is valid.

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 08:58PM -0700 Thank you for this, Hillary. FYI I consider "a successful senior politician in a democracy” is NOT of benefit to society. I think we should strive to avoid this kind of person particularly in the U.S. which is NOT a democracy. Our original constitution described a Representative Republic, a governance architecture that explicitly avoided democracy and other forms of mob rule. Note the use of Electoral College instead of popular vote for electing President (executive branch). Also the method of electing Senators (by the members of the legislators in the respective States). Unfortunately the progressives were able to gain an amendment circa 1820 that changed Senator elections to popular vote, making them representatives of the people and no longer guardians of ‘systemness.’ cheers, Jack

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:16PM -0700 Please consider that the recent rash of mass media channels is fostering mob violence and mob rule. When did Flash Mobs first occur? Was Arab Spring a Google-based demo? Does what used to be ACORN fund thousands of trash-mouth posts per day at a ratio of >500 anti-Republican to 1 anti-progressive? Are these examples of cyber attacks on attempts and dialog? Jack

joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:23PM -0700 There are many uses of mass media channels...   For example....   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6d6Yo3DwVI   Take care, be good to yourself and have fun,   Joe     -- Joe Simpson “Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore, depends on unreasonable people.” George Bernard Shaw

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:24PM -0700 Joseph, Or perhaps a constant appeal to the Very Conscious experience of fear, social dislocation and power being experienced by too many U.S. citizens. Or maybe the situation by 30% of the U.S. population is acceptable to you. Jack

joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:24PM -0700 OK...   Try the link again..   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6d6Yo3DwVI         -- Joe Simpson “Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore, depends on unreasonable people.” George Bernard Shaw

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:34PM -0700 Yes, and there are many uses of AK47’s. What logic are exemplifying? Jack

Steven Krane <sk5...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 10:37PM -0600 There are many from 2012. I needn't bother. As for why the equivalency, and the record, and why records ( of commentators) matter, that is for individuals to decide, in the same way they decide to believe or disbelieve anyone in the absence of fact. The obvious equivalency is both are instances of commentary about the Republican ticket, but that didnt need to be said.   Are we out of bounds yet James? I'm done.

joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:45PM -0700 Jack:   I think it is best to make a clear distinction between the situation being addressed in a communication channel....   And the situation itself..   I have been addressing the characteristics of the communication channel and the content that is most easily communicated by different channels..   These types of mass marketing advertising campaigns are used to sell everything from soap to ideas to political positions....   It is nothing new.... see:   https://newstyledigital.com/donald-trump-the-subliminal- marketing-behind-the-campaign   http://www.rawstory.com/2016/03/follow-the-bleater-donald- trump-and-the-power-of-the-subconscious/   I have said nothing about the situation itself...   Take care, be good to yourself and have fun,   Joe     -- Joe Simpson “Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore, depends on unreasonable people.” George Bernard Shaw

joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 09:47PM -0700 Jack:   You lost me on that one...   Take care, be good to yourself and have fun...   Joe     -- Joe Simpson “Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore, depends on unreasonable people.” George Bernard Shaw

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 06 02:24AM -0700 Suit yourself. I am trying to highlight some system principles in the panoply of interactions happening today. Specifically, whether the resiliency of the architecture of a representative republic as evidenced in the U.S. Constitution may survive the several current maneuvers to change or subvert it. Names of specific persons and innuendos only distract. Onward,

Jack Ring <jri...@gmail.com>: Sep 06 02:44AM -0700 Joe, You lost me on that one. A system science perspective on the architecture of the U.S. Constitution, specifically its resiliency, can be explored without the drama of specific names. Also, I fail to see how the opinions of the owners of newstyledigital and rawstory merit referencing on the SysSci forum. Jack

Hillary Sillitto <hsil...@googlemail.com>: Sep 06 10:47AM +0100 I understand the original architects of the constitution set it up so that deal making and compromise would be essential to make progress, and assumed that the need for this would be obvious to the 'reasonable people' they assumed would be running it. (Source: US author Arthur Herman's book on the 18th Century Scottish Enlightenment)   If the electoral system doesn't select reasonable people willing to make compromises for the common good, the constitution is being used outside its design envelope, outside its "dynamic integrity limits".   New constitution anyone?   Hillary         -- Sent from Gmail Mobile

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GLOW 2016 - Community Hangout: Open Parliamentary Data and Tech Tools

joseph simpson <jjs...@gmail.com>: Sep 05 05:47PM -0700 Does anyone know anything about this group?   If so, any information you can share?   Take care and have fun,   Joe ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Open Knowledge <in...@okfn.org> Date: Mon, Sep 5, 2016 at 10:01 AM Subject: GLOW 2016 - Community Hangout: Open Parliamentary Data and Tech Tools To: jjs...@gmail.com     *Come join our Community Hangout on September 15 to** learn more about GLOW and open legislative data. * View this email in your browser <http://us9.campaign-archive1.com/?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=e3d98833b4&e=745f29742f> Community Hangout: Open Parliamentary Data and Tech Tools   *It’s that time of the year again! The Global Legislative Openness Week (GLOW) is coming. *   *From September 12 to 18, we will celebrate the open, participatory legislative processes around the world. *     *For this year’s edition, we’re organising a Community Hangout on September 15 with the National Democratic Institute (NDI) to discuss legislative open data and an overview of tools around it. Joining us on the Hangout will be Scott Hubli and Greg Brown from NDI to talk about GLOW and show the Legislative Openness Data Explorer <http://okfn.us9.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=fb69b6db48&e=745f29742f> a <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=de335bf6d1&e=745f29742f>nd <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=77b4f4966c&e=745f29742f> representatives from the Open Government Partnership’s Legislative Openness Working Group. EtaLab the French task force for Open Data will also be on hand to talk about the OGP Toolbox <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=dab473c1ad&e=745f29742f>, an effort to compile a catalog of civic <http://okfn.us9.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=809b57279a&e=745f29742f>technology tools, and <http://okfn.us9.list-manage2.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=75b8925b14&e=745f29742f>use cases for those tools <http://okfn.us9.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=c3b4b2a3aa&e=745f29742f>. And our very own Rufus Pollock will facilitate the discussion around legislative openness. *     *Come join us to learn more about GLOW and open legislative data. Please register here <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=e72a951768&e=745f29742f> if you want to submit questions and if you want us to remind you about the event as the date approaches. Or simply click here <http://okfn.us9.list-manage2.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=7439a74a7f&e=745f29742f> to watch the livestream on September 15 at 10 AM EST. * <http://okfn.us9.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=4d8df6958b&e=745f29742f> <http://okfn.us9.list-manage1.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=71a1f2996e&e=745f29742f> <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/track/click?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=9bddeece1f&e=745f29742f> *Copyright © 2016 Open Knowledge, All rights reserved.* You subscribed to the Open Knowledge newsletter list (formerly the Open Knowledge Foundation).   *Our mailing address is:* Open Knowledge Cowley Road Cambridge, England CB4 0WS United Kingdom   Add us to your address book <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/vcard?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=32d370a7fc>     Want to change how you receive these emails? You can update your preferences <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/profile?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=32d370a7fc&e=745f29742f> or unsubscribe from this list <http://okfn.us9.list-manage.com/unsubscribe?u=73f922f8e68e21a10efa21f02&id=32d370a7fc&e=745f29742f&c=e3d98833b4>         -- Joe Simpson “Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore, depends on unreasonable people.” George Bernard Shaw

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Paola Di Maio about.me/paoladimaio

[Aleksandar Malečić]

Now that's an interesting mashup of the topic digest.

In a way any long-term and unselfish initiative with uncertain outcomes is almost a violation of our nature. If it fails, those who were behind it will move on and exhibit their brilliance somewhere else. In order to have a successful network/initiative you need many people and in order to have many people you need a successful network/initiative. I was a member of two social networks (there were more, but that's another story) started with intents to allow to people to gain some insights and whatever. I was the last active member of one and banned from another.

Aleksandar