About Step Relays

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Putu Aryana

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Dec 8, 2016, 9:46:10 AM12/8/16
to souliss
Hello,

I read somewhere in this group that suggest to install step relay for the infrastructure of electricity in smart home. I tried to googling about these step relays, unfortunately the results were about stepper relays for cnc / 3d printer machine. One of the result is http://gfinder.findernet.com//assets/Series/402/IB1301EN.pdf . Is this the step relay that used for the purpose?

I need help about the main concept and further explanation about this step relay.

Thanks!

Putu Aryana

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Dec 8, 2016, 8:59:36 PM12/8/16
to souliss
I got a good explanation at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=541mxiW8LnU

At here where I live, we call it Contactor for 3 phase motor. Never hear about step relay before. 
Hope this will help others who will start a new system for their home.

Have a nice day all

Damian Gołda

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Dec 9, 2016, 4:43:23 AM12/9/16
to souliss
Yes, you can use this relay in step relay (bistable) mode.
So every time you connect B1 and B2 inputs (for short time) using wall switch for example, relay toggles.
You can also connect B1 and B2 using relay controlled by souliss board and Toggle command.
This solution has one great advantage: in case any failure of smart home system, you can use your wall switch as usually.

Another possibility is to use step/bistable relays powered from external, low voltage power supply, with additional inputs for set (on) and reset (off).
So you can simply put voltage (or connect to GND) to relay input to toggle, on or off relay, direct from your microcontroller.

Jarek Andrzejewski

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Dec 9, 2016, 5:54:11 AM12/9/16
to souliss


On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 10:43:23 AM UTC+1, Damian Gołda wrote:
Yes, you can use this relay in step relay (bistable) mode.
So every time you connect B1 and B2 inputs (for short time) using wall switch for example, relay toggles.

Doesn't it mean that you need 2 processor outputs per relay?

I already installed Relpol's RM85 relays (12V, 360 ohm coil) in the DIN-rail sockets (RM85-2011-35-1012 relay + GZM80 socket + GZT80-0040 lever + M21P flyback diode), so I probably won't change anything (the relay power consumption is 0,5%-3% of the power of the lamp it switches).
Message has been deleted

Damian Gołda

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Dec 9, 2016, 8:15:31 AM12/9/16
to souliss


W dniu piątek, 9 grudnia 2016 11:54:11 UTC+1 użytkownik Jarek Andrzejewski napisał:


On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 10:43:23 AM UTC+1, Damian Gołda wrote:
Yes, you can use this relay in step relay (bistable) mode.
So every time you connect B1 and B2 inputs (for short time) using wall switch for example, relay toggles.

Doesn't it mean that you need 2 processor outputs per relay?

I don't know what voltage is on inputs B1 and B2 so the safest solution is to connect them by another relay controlled by one microcontroller output.
 

I already installed Relpol's RM85 relays (12V, 360 ohm coil) in the DIN-rail sockets (RM85-2011-35-1012 relay + GZM80 socket + GZT80-0040 lever + M21P flyback diode), so I probably won't change anything (the relay power consumption is 0,5%-3% of the power of the lamp it switches).

But RM85 is simple relay not step (bistable).

Here is example bistable relay with Set and Reset Inputs (first google result):
http://audiowind.oss-cn-hongkong.aliyuncs.com/new-pdf/D-1022AB-Series.pdf
 
You can control it by connecting inputs R/S, Set or Reset to GND. They have pull-up resistors 4k7 so you can connect them directly to microcontroller pin and activate by putting LOW on output.

Using two pins (Set and Reset) is better than one (R/S), because in case of any failure (for example power failure) you don't need to know in what state is step relay - just activate Set or Reset.

Jarek Andrzejewski

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Dec 9, 2016, 8:30:44 AM12/9/16
to souliss


On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 2:15:31 PM UTC+1, Damian Gołda wrote:


W dniu piątek, 9 grudnia 2016 11:54:11 UTC+1 użytkownik Jarek Andrzejewski napisał:


On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 10:43:23 AM UTC+1, Damian Gołda wrote:
Yes, you can use this relay in step relay (bistable) mode.
So every time you connect B1 and B2 inputs (for short time) using wall switch for example, relay toggles.

Doesn't it mean that you need 2 processor outputs per relay?

I don't know what voltage is on inputs B1 and B2 so the safest solution is to connect them by another relay controlled by one microcontroller output.

The bistable relays I was looking at were not designed to be driven for a long time (e.g. time is minimum 15ms and maxiumum 1 minute), so one relay will not be sufficient in such case.
It is also not good solution for bistable wall switches.
 
 

I already installed Relpol's RM85 relays (12V, 360 ohm coil) in the DIN-rail sockets (RM85-2011-35-1012 relay + GZM80 socket + GZT80-0040 lever + M21P flyback diode), so I probably won't change anything (the relay power consumption is 0,5%-3% of the power of the lamp it switches).

But RM85 is simple relay not step (bistable).

Yes. I just gave some information about my setup and why I choose them.

Here is example bistable relay with Set and Reset Inputs (first google result):
http://audiowind.oss-cn-hongkong.aliyuncs.com/new-pdf/D-1022AB-Series.pdf
 
You can control it by connecting inputs R/S, Set or Reset to GND. They have pull-up resistors 4k7 so you can connect them directly to microcontroller pin and activate by putting LOW on output.


IMO much too big and much too complex. GZT80 is 15,6mm wide and it perfectly fits my rail (for 18 modules): I could install 3 fuses, 3-LED module showing the mains is on and 16 relays for 230V lights.

Using two pins (Set and Reset) is better than one (R/S), because in case of any failure (for example power failure) you don't need to know in what state is step relay - just activate Set or Reset.

using monostable (regular) relay I always know the state.
In case of some major failure of Souliss I'll diconnect driver board from relays and reconnect them to the wall switches (I'll prepare wires to do that by using one connector).

--
Kind Regards,
Jarek Andrzejewski


Putu Aryana

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Dec 9, 2016, 7:48:02 PM12/9/16
to souliss
On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 4:43:23 PM UTC+7, Damian Gołda wrote:
Another possibility is to use step/bistable relays powered from external, low voltage power supply, with additional inputs for set (on) and reset (off).
So you can simply put voltage (or connect to GND) to relay input to toggle, on or off relay, direct from your microcontroller.


 If I use this method, does manual switch still work if the microcontroller is broken?

Gabriele Ribichini

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Jan 12, 2017, 1:44:14 AM1/12/17
to souliss
No, but honestly after about 3 years I can tell you it never happened.
Of course you need to keep some spare.
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