Fraternally,
Torence Evans Ake
Secretary – Auburn Park Lodge No. 789- Crete, Illinois
PM – Arcadia Lodge No. 1138 – Lansing, Illinois
You ask an "or" question. The actual answer is likely to be an "and"
one. It's an interesting point and it hammers home why discussion of
politics is not allowed in tiled meetings.
Note that staying loyal to the original Grand Lodge led to recognition
in recent decades. The lodges that descended from African petitioned
for recognition from UGLE based on that and recognition was granted.
Fraternally,
Torence Evans Ake
Secretary – Auburn Park Lodge No. 789 – Crete, Illinois
What that proves--if anything--is that he was a Mason or he wouldn't
have been admitted to the lodge. Where or when he joined the Craft
remains completely unknown.
Franklin certainly influenced many men in his day and was involved with
Nine Muses (and also an obscure lodge in the south of France). He
probably had something to do with getting Voltaire to join (which
happened practically on his V's deathbed). Franklin and Jefferson were
indeed in France at the same time. But again we haven't much to go on
in terms of leaping to the conclusion that Franklin got TJ into
masonry. Torence did not make that connection specifically, but one
sees the statement from time to time on the Net.
With regard to Paul Revere, Torence called him
> actually a very ordinary laborer and administrator.
Way off course. Revere was the preeminent silversmith of his era and an
artist in that medium whose work has never been surpassed in our part of
the world. I'm not sure what T. means by "administrator," but Revere
was the owner of his own smithy and had both subordinate workmen and
apprentices studying the art under his guidance.
The other info about Prince Hall is thought provoking. Could he have
assembled "an army of 700 African-American men" from the free blacks of
greater Boston? Seven hundred free in the 1770s in one city sounds
quite high.
Torence, what is your source for this statement:
> I know this, that his lodge was specifically
> prohibited from conducting raisings.
Have you seen/read the warrant for African Lodge #849, which was issued
by UGLE? If the warrant makes no reference to any such prohibition,
what else could possibly have the effect of nullifying what is arguably
the only purpose of a masonic lodge: to make masons.
--Janet
Yet no one can produce the minutes book with his signature.
> What that proves--if anything--is that he was a Mason or he wouldn't
> have been admitted to the lodge. Where or when he joined the Craft
> remains completely unknown.
It remains something a lot of folks wish to be true but there is still
no proof.
> With regard to Paul Revere, Torence called him
>> actually a very ordinary laborer and administrator.
> Way off course. Revere was the preeminent silversmith of his era and an
> artist in that medium whose work has never been surpassed in our part of
> the world. I'm not sure what T. means by "administrator," but Revere
> was the owner of his own smithy and had both subordinate workmen and
> apprentices studying the art under his guidance.
Revere was a Grand Master in his state. Bro Torrence regularly
disapproves of grand officers. I thought he referred the ritual work
that is attributed to him actually being written by his Grand Chaplain
plus a commonet on how he ran his GL during his tenure.
> Several notable Prince Hall historians have tried to put him in
> with us on the American side; but the facts that led to his being
> initiated into our order seem to put him squarely on the side of the
> Red Coats.
Really? What fact relating to his *initiation* put him "on the side of the
Red Coats"?
When he was initiated, the revolution was not under way - the UDI didn't
happen for another year. Even then, the only evidence I can find of his
involvement in the rebellion was on the side of the rebels:-
q.v. Sidney Kaplan and Emma Nogrady Kaplan, The Black Presence in the Era of
the American Revolution (Amherst: University of Massachusetts Press, 1989;
ISBN 0-87023-663-6), p. 203.
> The original fourteen "regular" American Grand Lodges that were
> organized between 1777 & 1800 were parochial incorporations and in
> only two instances, New York & Massachusetts, competing Grand Lodge
> organizations had to work out their differences within the same state.
> Each of the various Grand Lodges in England, Ireland & Scotland
> chartered Provincial Grand Lodges over here; and the ones that won out
> as incorporated American Grand Lodges seem to have done so more
> because their leadership maintained the popular political attitude
> then any firm pedigree leading back to one Mother Grand Lodge or other
> overseas.
Do have any citations for this?
At least one US GL in these early years was constituted from an assembly of
Freemasons (note: not representatives of lodges or an ad-hoc GL). See
http://bessel.org/masrec/phaugle.htm
> Is it possible to suppose, then, that having misaligned himself
> and his fourteen fellow free black men with the loosing side, that
> Prince Hall lost out on recognition for his Grand Lodge more for his
> political stance then any supposed bigotry about his pigment?
Thus claiming that the newly independent US GL's took masonic decisions for
political motives?
<snipped>
> But Prince Hall did not approach St. Andrew's Lodge. He went to the
> Red Coats at Castle William and petitioned the lodge accompanying the
> 38th Foot Regiment.
He didn't go to the Red Coats - he went to a Lodge.
> This regiment had recently taken in some drafts
> from the 18th foot who, notable for us here in Illinois, had just
> returned from service in the far west at Cahokia and Kaskaskia.
Yes - keeping the British/Irish American colonists safe from the French!
Look at the thanks they got for this ;-))
>Prince
> Hall's petition and the petition of the other fourteen were referred
> to one of these drafts, Sergeant Batt, and he was initiated by Batt on
> March 6th by Military Lodge No. 441, an Irish Constitution traveling
> lodge.
If you had read (or listened) to a previous Prestonian Lecture on the
history of British military lodges, you would know that a great many of them
were Irish Constitution, because the GLI issued warrants promptly which the
GLE took a month of Sundays by comparison.
> Seems that our British Brothers had not the time or the desire
> to initiate these free black men.
By British - does this include the colonists, who at that time were of
course also British?
For what it's worth, the British Army regiment was probably the only unit of
the army stationed in Boston in 1775. It may have been the only place where
Prince Hall could go to get initiated. I haven't researched this aspect, so
I can only speculate here.
<snipped>
Fraternally,
Torence Evans Ake
Secretary – Auburn Park Lodge No. 789 – Crete, Illinois
You have definitely confused your beers. ;^) That watery brown stuff
is pilsner and it's very American. The hearty black brew would be
Mackison Stout or Guinness depending on which GL on that side of the
pond was the sponsor. They definitely have the better of us when it
comes to beer. Unless the Belgian brews come into the discussion.
I was at one table lodge where they had wine. When debating the
relative merits of beers and ales it's the neutral approach. Vivat,
vivat, vivat.
======================================= MODERATOR'S COMMENT:
[ Bro. Doug, I think he means tea vs. coffee, not beer. :) ]
<snipped>
>> I know this, that his lodge was specifically
>> prohibited from conducting raisings.
> Have you seen/read the warrant for African Lodge #849, which was issued by
> UGLE? If the warrant makes no reference to any such prohibition, what
> else could possibly have the effect of nullifying what is arguably the
> only purpose of a masonic lodge: to make masons.
Hi Janet,
The Warrant was not issued by UGLE - it didn't exist then. It was issued
by the 'moderns' GL of England (the one originally founded (as the GL of
London and Westminster iirc) in 1717.
The lodge no. was originally no. 459 (not 849) and was renumbered to no. 350
in 1792. It was a regularly constituted lodge, and is the only lodge in
the USA whose original warrant still exists to this day - though somewhat
charred around the edges as a result of a fire in 1863.
This is the text of the Warrant:-
"Effingham, A.G.M. To all and every Right Worshipful and loving Brethren,
we, Thomas Howard, &c., &c., &c., Earl of Effingham, Lord Howard, Acting
Grand Master under the authority of His Royal Highness Henry Frederick, Duke
of Cumberland, &c., &c., &c., Grand Master of the Most Ancient and Honorable
Society of Free and Accepted Masons, sends Greeting:
"Know ye, that we, at the humble petition of our right trusty and well
beloved brethren, Prince Hall, Boston Smith, Thomas Sanderson, and several
other brethren residing in Boston, New Zealand, in North America, do hereby
constitute the said brethren into a regular Lodge of Free and accepted
Masons, under the title or denomination of the African Lodge,
to be opened in Boston, aforesaid; and do further, at their said petition,
hereby appoint the said Prince Hall to be Master, Boston Smith, Senior
Warden, and Thomas Sanderson, Junior Warden, for opening the said Lodge, and
for such further time only as shall be thought proper by the brethren
thereof,
it being any future election of officers of the Lodge, but that such
election shall be regulated agreeably to such By-Laws of the said Lodge as
shall be consistent with the general laws of the society, contained in the
Book of Constitutions; and we hereby will and require you, the said Prince
Hall, to take special care that all and every the said brethren are, or have
been, regularly made Masons, and that they do observe, perform, and keep all
the rules and orders contained in the Books of Constitutions; and further,
that you do, from time to time, cause to be entered in a book kept for that
purpose an account of your proceedings in the Lodges, together with all such
rules, orders, and regulations as shall be made for the good government of
the same; that in no wise you omit once in every year to send to us, our
successors Grand Masters or to Rowland Holt, Esq., our Deputy Grand Master,
for the time being, an account in writing of your proceedings, and copies of
all such rules, orders, and regulations as shall be made as aforesaid,
together with a list of the members of the Lodge, and such a sum of money as
may suit the circumstances of the Lodge and reasonably be expected towards
the Grand Charity. Moreover, we hereby will and require you, the said Prince
Hall, as soon as conveniently may be, to send an account in writing of what
may be done by virtue of these presents.
"Given at London, under our hand and seal of Masonry, this 29th day
September, A.L. 5784, A.D. 1784.
By the Grand Master's Command.
"ROWLAND HOLT, D.G.M.,
Witness
WILLIAM WHITE,
"Grand Secretary."
No mention of any prohibition on the making of masons .... let alone on the
ceremony of Raising.
Sure, but where's the fun in that? ;^)
>> I was at one table lodge where they had wine.
>
> Can our Illinois Brothers handle the Truth at Table Lodge?
At least on the first degree. Later the topics get more metaphorical.
We can certainly handle wine at Table Lodge so I think the rule against
it should be removed. I don't feel strongly enough about the rule to
write a proposal about it. Most Illinois Table Lodge meetings I've been
to have been at a location with a bar that was available before the
meeting not during the meeting. Close enough.
Fraternally,
Torence Evans Ake
Secreatry - Auburn Park Lodge No. 789 - Crete, Illinois
PM - Arcadia Lodge No. 1138 - Lansing, Illinois
Which is totally irrelevant. The wording of a GLofE warrant is probably
slightly different from that used by any other GL.
What you stated earlier is that the African Lodge no. 459 was specifically
prohibited from conducting Raisings.
To quote: "I know this, that his lodge was specifically prohibited from
conducting raisings."
I am sure you will agree that there is nothing in its Warrant which states
this "specifically".
What the Warrant does state is that the new lodge must act within the rules
of the Book of Constitutions. These rules provide for the election of
officers, the proposal and initiation of candidates, and their passings and
raisings. No more need be written within the Warrant.
<...snipped...>
> The regular lodges in America at the time of the Prince Hall
> warrant, such as the one in Fredericksburg, Va. for example, were not
> only fully vested with the Hiramaic lesson; but they incorporated the
> Royal Arch as part and parcel of their degree work. When I am Grand
> Master, the Royal Arch will be restored to the Craft lodges here in
> Illinois where the work should more properly reside.
Congratulations on your election to the office of Grand Master - can you
tell me when you will be installed?
As the Royal Arch is an independent sovereign body (at least in the USA),
won't they have something to say on the matter? What will you do if they
don't want to be "restored"?
<snipped>
> Given the names and activities of the players, IMHO, this "Prince
> Hall" warrant seems to be deficient and a lesser document.
In what manner deficient? Lesser than what? It is a legitimate Warrant to
constitute a regular Lodge - no more, no less. The wording and form of the
Warrant, and the names of the Grand Master, Acting Grand Master etc. are
consistent with what would have appeared on any 'moderns' GLofE Warrant
issued at that time.
S & F regards,
Richard