Java vs Smalltalk Cage Match

[Richard Eng]

http://www.reddit.com/r/software/comments/2zktsa/java_vs_smalltalk_cage_match/

Join in the conversation. The commenter provides a strong counter-argument and I don't know how to respond.

[James Ladd]

I'll respond to this later today.
It's an interesting bet. Wish I had spare cash to make this a real competition.
W Redline Smalltalk the library issue is moot
- James

[Joachim Tuchel]

Well, you know, the guy is making a sensible argument. There's a lot of truth in it. Ignoring this problem of missing bindings for X  means being ignorant of real life. I love Smalltalk, I prefer it over many alternatives, including Java and Javascript. But sometimes it feels like being overly religious rather than based on hard facts. There is a lot of wishful thinking to not switching to some other language.

So let's put it more positively: if your business domain is extremely complex and you can live without bindings for a lot of stuff, then Smalltalk is one of the best choices you can make. If you want to build something cool and modern-looking or leverage code from very C-oriented communities, it is probably easier to byte the bullet and go that route. Programming against C-APIs  in Smalltalk is not fun and tool support is poor.

So what do you think we should answer?

[Richard Eng]

I finally gave a response. It's the best I could do. What do you think?

[Craig Latta]

> Programming against C-APIs in Smalltalk is not fun and tool support

> is poor... So what do you think we should answer?

How about expressing gratitude for the feedback, and diverting half
the energy we would have put into a response into improving the system? :)


-C

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Craig Latta
netjam.org
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[James Ladd]

>> How about expressing gratitude for the feedback, and diverting half the energy we would have put into a response into improving the system? :)

Any feedback is good feedback and I'm sure all those involved are grateful for the feedback.

I know I am.

The first step in fixing anything is acknowledging there is a problem. A fix is the next step. :) 

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[Reinout Heeck]

Does Redline have the Browser/Inspector/Debugger combo?

If not I wouldn't qualify it as a Smalltalk (yet)...




Either way this cage fight has been on for quite a while now and the
results are known :-/



R
-

[James Ladd]

Good question - yes it does have the browser/inspector etc combo
You use an IDE like intellij and the Resline plugin.
All are still a work in progress.

Your question raises a very important point, that Smalltalkers don't see the syntax alone as the language yet for 99.99% of other languages the user does think the language is just the syntax.

To move Smalltalk forward in discussions this differentiation should be made more clear.

Sent from the holodeck.