Centipede Review

[Sonny]

Monday I bought the 4X8. I thought, why pay $50 for a 2X4 when I can get the 4X8 for $100, at Lowes. HD, here, didn't have the 4X8.

If I ever want a smaller work surface, I don't have to open it up all the way. It's just as stable opened all the way, as half way... and points in between, as long as you secure an appropriately sized work surface/sheet good, using the holddowns. I can posibly foresee wanting more holddowns. Four may not be enough for multiple goings-ons on the worktop.

Opened all the way, it's 30" high. Opened partially, the height is taller, which suits me a little better than 30" high. But 30" high is fine, too.

Someone posted a Lowes reviewer review, about the 4X8 self leveling itself. Well, yes it stays level, but the feet that don't touch, a dip in the ground, need shims under them, for them not to "wobble".

The foot pads don't slide on the ground, as you're opening/expanding it. Easy fix to that is lift one end and it opens easily. Same with closing/folding it, just lift one end and it collaspes easily.

Once folded up, don't lay it down on its side to place it back in the carrying case. It's kinna like a slinky, all those legs and elbows wobble, when the 4X8 unit is laying on its side. So, once it's folded up, stand it on end and slip the bag over the top, then flip it over and pull the rest of the bag over the other end. Since the 2X4 unit has less elbows and legs, it may be easier to bag when laying on its side, rather than standing on its end.

When one worker is utilizing the unit, a 4X8 sheet good needs to be gingerly tilted/leaned onto the top "points" of support.... you can't just easily plop a ply sheet onto all those individual points of support. Two people can simply lay a sheet good on top. In that initial video, that Mike posted, the guy says "after initial set up....". Yep! For one person to lay a sheet good on top (for a work surface): I lifted the sheet good, stepped into the maze of centipede legs and rest the ply edge onto several points of support, then laid the sheet down, as I stepped from the maze of legs. I adjusted the ply onto all points and secure the ply with the supplied holddowns. That setup took 60-90 seconds. Setting up other tools (chop saw, etc.) on top, is probably what the video guy refers to, as to additional time "setting up".

With some good effort, I leaned on the sheet and tested lateral movements. It's pretty darn stable. The 4X8 unit support 3000 lbs. I think this tool will be a good helper. This weekend I hope to do some heavy work on/with it, give it a better testing.

I haven't tried the four 2X4 (stud) braces (called "X-Cups"), that come with the unit, and I have some ideas about adding custom X-cups. To use the cups that came with the unit, I surmise a situation, for my specific needs, and I may need additional cups, so I have in mind how to make additional cups.

So for, I like what I see. Stay tuned for further reviews.

Sonny

[Leon]

Sonny, Thank you for that "actual use" review!

[-MIKE-]

Nice review, Sonny.
Just a word of caution, however. You'll see on the website FAQ that
they do not recommend using it in any position except fully open. The
legs won't actually be touching the ground unless fully open. That's
what actually stops it from opening further: the legs bottoming out in
the feet tubes.
http://centipedetool.com/faq-height-adjustable/

I've also found that, like a truss, when one foot isn't touching the
ground, the whole apparatus sort of take its place and holds it stable.
I wonder how many legs could be off the ground and still be stable.
I'm sure with a massive load sitting on it, you'd want to have all the
legs on the ground.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com
mi...@mikedrumsDOT.com
---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

[Spalted Walt]

Sonny <cedar...@aol.com> wrote:

>I haven't tried the four 2X4 (stud) braces (called "X-Cups"), that come with the
>unit, and I have some ideas about adding custom X-cups. To use the cups that
>came with the unit, I surmise a situation, for my specific needs, and I may need
>additional cups, so I have in mind how to make additional cups.
>
>So for, I like what I see. Stay tuned for further reviews.

Edward Adkins, the inventor, said during a podcast with the annoying 'Mr
Question Mark' the plastic parts are actually spewed forth from a 3D printer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TW82hhRvMCs

Interesting success story for sure.

Are the X braces riveted together or screws w/nyloc nuts?

[Sonny]

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 2:06:28 PM UTC-6, Spalted Walt wrote:

> Are the X braces riveted together or screws w/nyloc nuts?

They are riveted with what looks like pretty hefty steel rivets. The rivet bodies, one on each side of the X brace connection/junction, are almost as thick as the X braces, themselves.

Sonny

[Sonny]

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 1:40:25 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:

> Nice review, Sonny.
> Just a word of caution, however. You'll see on the website FAQ that
> they do not recommend using it in any position except fully open.

I suspect, in part, that fully open recommendation is to avoid any gripe (liability type crap) from someone. Common sense should preval in using it. I'll further test fully open vs partially open. Once I laid the ply on top and installed the holddowns, the whole bound unit was stable, period. I will test a partial sheet of ply on the partially opened unit, apply the holddowns and see how stable it is, compared to the fully extended unit. I suspect the holddowns will help maintain the stability of a half-opened unit. And likely more than four holddowns would help even more.

> The legs won't actually be touching the ground unless fully open.

When partially open, all feet are the same height. They remain planor as it opens.

>
> I've also found that, like a truss, when one foot isn't touching the
> ground, the whole apparatus sort of take its place and holds it stable.

Right. It seems to be that way.

> I wonder how many legs could be off the ground and still be stable.
> I'm sure with a massive load sitting on it, you'd want to have all the
> legs on the ground.

Even with light weight, it's still easy to shim any feet that are off the ground

Some of the sections of this FAQ page are under maintenance, so I haven't read what they say about fully vs partially opened units.
http://centipedetool.com/centipede-portable-work-system/

Sonny

[Sonny]

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 1:40:25 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:

> http://centipedetool.com/faq-height-adjustable/

And thanks for that link. I see there are accessories, specifically the X cups. Rather than making custom cups, buying extras may be better, depending on price. The product catalogue won't download for me, at the moment, to check the price. I'll checkum out later.

We're still busy assisting Mom, health-wise. I probably won't get to more diligent testing until Fri., Sat. & Sun.

Sonny

[-MIKE-]

On 11/18/15 2:31 PM, Sonny wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 1:40:25 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:
>
>> Nice review, Sonny. Just a word of caution, however. You'll see
>> on the website FAQ that they do not recommend using it in any
>> position except fully open.
>
> I suspect, in part, that fully open recommendation is to avoid any
> gripe (liability type crap) from someone. Common sense should
> preval in using it. I'll further test fully open vs partially
> open. Once I laid the ply on top and installed the holddowns, the
> whole bound unit was stable, period. I will test a partial sheet of
> ply on the partially opened unit, apply the holddowns and see how
> stable it is, compared to the fully extended unit. I suspect the
> holddowns will help maintain the stability of a half-opened unit.
> And likely more than four holddowns would help even more.
>
>> The legs won't actually be touching the ground unless fully open.
>
> When partially open, all feet are the same height. They remain
> planor as it opens.
>

Sonny, I'm not trying to be argumentative here. This is a safety issue,
not a "who's right, who's wrong" issue.
Unless there is some major design difference (and I mean major), unless
it's fully extended, the legs are NOT touching the ground. The *feet*
might be, but the legs (that which bears all the weight) are not.
Take a close look at the design. The feet are attacked to tubes, into
which the steel legs insert and slide freely up and down. Those tubes
are only there to facilitate folding up/collapsing of the apparatus.
They allow the legs to travel without having to disengage the X-bracing.
Only when fully opened up are the legs actually toughing the feet and
bearing the weight of whatever is on top.

Yes, those bench dog clamps will hold some weight. But I would hate to
have to have to ripping a piece of plywood and all a sudden those bench
dogs slip and the thing immediately slides out into its fully open
position dropping you and the plywood down with a running saw.

Again, please take a look at those legs and their design again, if only
for your own safety.

[DerbyDad03]

Thanks for the review.

This guys lifts it by 2 center hubs and almost "throws" it open.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fby0UyKJzGo

Do the hold downs get in the way? They extend above the top of the
work surface, so I can see them getting in the way when trying to
put large objects on the surface. It may not be an issue, just curious.

This guy built a torsion box top for his Centipede Saw Horse *on* his
Centipede Saw Horse. :-)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDhrlpak6BI

[Unquestionably Confused]

I looked at the .pdf for the accessories yesterday, Sonny. The current
and projected offerings seemed to me to be quite reasonable. Pair of
the hold downs for something like $7, etc.

Thanks for the nice review.

What's your feeling on using this indoors on a finished hardwood floor?
Appears that the feet are made of the same material as the tops. Any
metal projecting on the bottom? Obviously, you can beat the crap out of
any tool and get stones, etc. jammed where you don't want them, but out
of the box with reasonable care and/or cleaning, would you sit this up
on a bare wood floor?

P.S. shame on recommending the 4x8, I almost had my mind made up to
head north to HD to pick up the 2x4 and you now have me rethinking that.
The blue box is south of me.<g>

[-MIKE-]

I'm not Sonny, but....
The feet are plastic, so no scratching. However, one might consider
some of those stick-on felt chair feet pads if it's a concern.

Consider your main use when choosing a size. While I see great
advantages to the 4x8, I like the 2x4 because it *is* small. I'm often
working in areas where a 4x8 would be too big to work around.

Just some thought to help you decide. :-)

[Unquestionably Confused]

On 11/18/2015 4:33 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> On 11/18/15 4:15 PM, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
>> On 11/18/2015 2:43 PM, Sonny wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 1:40:25 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:
>>>
>>>> http://centipedetool.com/faq-height-adjustable/

[snip]

> I'm not Sonny, but....
> The feet are plastic, so no scratching. However, one might consider
> some of those stick-on felt chair feet pads if it's a concern.
>

Thanks, Mike. That's how it looked to me. And either the felt pads or
maybe better yet to prevent marring AND damage, some rubber (cut up
mouse pads) pads.

> Consider your main use when choosing a size. While I see great
> advantages to the 4x8, I like the 2x4 because it *is* small. I'm often
> working in areas where a 4x8 would be too big to work around.

I'm on the horns of a dilemma (or maybe I'm horny and that's the
dilemma<g>) over the size thanks to Sonny. I may just cut the baby in
half and buy two of the 2x4. For the occasional use of carving up a 4 x
8 sheet of ply, I think that with two of them, planning the attack
carefully, they would be more than adequate and still better than
setting up sawhorses, etc. Offhand, my main use for them in a larger
size would be indoors while sanding down/refinishing doors. Two of the
2 x 4 units with the X-Cups should do the trick quite nicely. Thinking
two that with one or two of those nice little torsion boxes, I would
have a couple nice assembly tables or even one (using both) that is a
bit smaller than the 4x8.

> Just some thought to help you decide. :-)

Thanks again, just more data to mash before tripping the trigger. Still
have to wait for the Electric Comet to weigh in with the final answer.<g>

[-MIKE-]

On 11/18/15 5:06 PM, Unquestionably Confused wrote:
> On 11/18/2015 4:33 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
>> Consider your main use when choosing a size. While I see great
>> advantages to the 4x8, I like the 2x4 because it *is* small. I'm
>> often working in areas where a 4x8 would be too big to work
>> around.
>
> I'm on the horns of a dilemma (or maybe I'm horny and that's the
> dilemma<g>) over the size thanks to Sonny. I may just cut the baby
> in half and buy two of the 2x4. For the occasional use of carving up
> a 4 x 8 sheet of ply, I think that with two of them, planning the
> attack carefully, they would be more than adequate and still better
> than setting up sawhorses, etc. Offhand, my main use for them in a
> larger size would be indoors while sanding down/refinishing doors.
> Two of the 2 x 4 units with the X-Cups should do the trick quite
> nicely. Thinking two that with one or two of those nice little
> torsion boxes, I would have a couple nice assembly tables or even one
> (using both) that is a bit smaller than the 4x8.
>

I think two 2x4 ones would be a better choice than one big one.
Like you mentioned, when you need to work with large sheets, set two of
the small ones up like big, flat, sawhorses and span the middle. Heck
with 1 foot overhang on each end, you're now talking about only a 2'
span between them.

Then you always have the option of using one small one and aren't always
locked into 4x8.

[Swingman]

On 11/18/2015 5:55 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
> I think two 2x4 ones would be a better choice than one big one.
> Like you mentioned, when you need to work with large sheets, set two of
> the small ones up like big, flat, sawhorses and span the middle. Heck
> with 1 foot overhang on each end, you're now talking about only a 2'
> span between them.
>
> Then you always have the option of using one small one and aren't always
> locked into 4x8.

On reflection, those were my thoughts exactly...

My usual work surfaces onsite are old doors, destined for the dumpster,
on top of sawhorses, and it's rare in a remodel that I have the luxury
of being able to leave a work surface set up for the duration.

And, while I can still throw a 4 x 8 x 3/4" on top of a couple of saw
horses if I have to, it might take my decrepit old ass 2 weeks to get
over it; and, with a pickup full of material/tools, it is much easier to
carry/handle 2 x 4 sheets.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

[Swingman]

On 11/18/2015 2:31 PM, Sonny wrote:

> Even with light weight, it's still easy to shim any feet that are off the ground

Thanks for the review ... very helpful.

[Sonny]

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 4:33:35 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:

> > What's your feeling on using this indoors on a finished hardwood
> > floor? Appears that the feet are made of the same material as the
> > tops. Any metal projecting on the bottom?

No metal on the feet. Just flat composite/plastic pads

> Consider your main use when choosing a size. While I see great
> advantages to the 4x8, I like the 2x4 because it *is* small. I'm often
> working in areas where a 4x8 would be too big to work around.
>

I can understand your concern for space, and Karl comments, too. Having two 2X4 units would have its advantages, also.

I further tested a partial extension of the 4X8 unit. It's pretty stable, as well, enough for a chop saw, CMS or similar.

Also on this partial extension setup, I hand sawed the birdhouse pole, from 15' long to 13'. The support was stable, but a very slight wobble of the whole... I think more so because of the awkward pole. In this operation, the holddowns weren't that great, but I didn't/don't expect great things from plastic holddowns. A few more would help, though.

Partially extended with half sheet of ply. This height is 37":
https://www.flickr.com/photos/43836144@N04/22760588309/in/dateposted-public/

When I get home, I plan to toss a bunch of sawdust on the feet, see if they jam or clog up, preventing the legs from closing/folding properly. The joints appear to have enough space to prevent any glogging/jamming, that way.

Sonny

[Sonny]

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 4:23:58 PM UTC-6, Sonny wrote:

> Partially extended with half sheet of ply. This height is 37":
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/43836144@N04/22760588309/in/dateposted-public/

Oh, and don't leave your carry bag hanging around just anywhere or your Mom's puppy will pee on it.

Sonny

[-MIKE-]

On 11/19/15 4:23 PM, Sonny wrote:
> Also on this partial extension setup, I hand sawed the birdhouse
> pole, from 15' long to 13'. The support was stable, but a very
> slight wobble of the whole... I think more so because of the awkward
> pole. In this operation, the holddowns weren't that great, but I
> didn't/don't expect great things from plastic holddowns. A few more
> would help, though.
>
> Partially extended with half sheet of ply. This height is 37":
> https://www.flickr.com/photos/43836144@N04/22760588309/in/dateposted-public/
>
>
>
>

I'm telling you that is not safe.
All the weight is on the cross braces which aren't designed for it.
They are designed for tension, not compression. They are acting the
same as a cable would in a suspension bridge and were never meant to
take the force of being compressed.
I'm trying to warn you now. If those bench-dogs slip while you're
cutting something, you'll be sorry.
That thing was designed to only be used with the legs touching the
ground. Unless it is fully extended, they are not.

[Sonny]

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 7:22:49 PM UTC-6, -MIKE- wrote:

> Sonny, I'm not trying to be argumentative here. This is a safety issue,
not a "who's right, who's wrong" issue.

I understand completely. I didnt take anything you said as offensive or challenging.

> I'm telling you that is not safe.
> All the weight is on the cross braces which aren't designed for it.
> They are designed for tension, not compression. They are acting the
> same as a cable would in a suspension bridge and were never meant to
> take the force of being compressed.
> I'm trying to warn you now. If those bench-dogs slip while you're
> cutting something, you'll be sorry.
> That thing was designed to only be used with the legs touching the
> ground. Unless it is fully extended, they are not.
>

You are correct regarding the cross pieces and the legs not touching a firm base, when partially extended. The cross pieces are metal bars and do supply some rigidity. They aren't "loose" as dangling (sic) cable. For a small project, as my "test" birdhouse and pole use, both not being very heavy, the partial extension was fine. If the support was to collapse, it would collapse as a whole, not on one side. It would simple drop straight down. With a small or moderate amount of weight, I think any collapse would either not happen or be a slow descend, because of the resistance of the feet touching the ground and of the ply top. The "ridgid" cross pieces do supply some support and with a small or moderate weight, on top, there is sufficient stability.

I wouldn't work all day, with lots of weighty goings on, on a partially extended support, though. I understand your concern, in that respect and with the cross pieces.

Using a little common sense, a partially extended support and small to moderate weights/projects, as with my birdhouse/pole projects, I think it is safe to use partially extended. The initial thought, when Centipede was first mentioned, was the limited space one had to work in, hence the smaller 2X4 support was considered/preferred. To me, this meant the project, for the limited work area, would be somewhat small, also. My testing/review included the partial extended methods, also, to accommodate a limited work area, yet using the larger 4X8 support system.

During the sawing of the birdhouse pole, one of the holddowns did disengage. The holddowns aren't that great. There was no effect on the sawing job, the ply remained in position and the support didn't readjust or falter/fail, in any way.

I certainly wouldn't be comfortable with tossing something like a 100 lb sack of corn on top of a partially extended support. I would be comfortable with working on a smaller sized project, though. Those metal cross pieces do have some rigidity, to them, and will support smaller projects, in a limited/small work area, without failure.

None of my work areas are limited. I would likely always fully extend the support, when using it. I can see using it as a 30" tall scaffold/platform, to stand on, say when painting a ceiling or something just out of reach, yet too low for a regular size scaffold.

I think this support will suit me well, often, in place of the 3 sets of wooden saw horses I regularly use (and build new ones annually, as older ones become unusable), especially as to hauling the bulky wooden saw horses from one place to another.

Sonny

[Sonny]

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 3:52:52 PM UTC-6, DerbyDad03 wrote:

> This guys lifts it by 2 center hubs and almost "throws" it open.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fby0UyKJzGo

Yep, easy to open/extend. Just lift one end and spread it open.

>
> Do the hold downs get in the way? They extend above the top of the
> work surface, so I can see them getting in the way when trying to
> put large objects on the surface. It may not be an issue, just curious.

They do extend above the work surface. I haven't done anything to report on their getting in the way. If they are tapped by *anything-of-significance, they'd probably disengage from their holddown job. They don't grasp and hold, firmly, the ply that well, at all. Rather than grasp the ply, they might end up (after they disengage) performing as bench dogs, keeping the ply within their perimeters. I would need more experience with this/them to report otherwise or further.

Sonny