PADI written exam
Tim J. Patterson
A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
good excuse to make her work it all over again.
Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
Tim
ann stockham
PADI rules state that a student must demonstrate mastery of each exam
item. A student must either score 100% on the exam initially or the
instructor must review each item missed with the student until mastery is
reached. Anyone scoring less then 75% should be retested No were does it
say one has to repeat the entire class.
General Chang
In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>,
I am in the middle of a PADI OW course. We are taking the final next week
and our inst. said that you have two chances to take the final. She never
mentioned the fact that if you failed you had to retake the course.
Brian Tierney
btie...@sunset.backbone.olemiss.edu
--
**********************
Be the ball Danny.....
Bernard Louis Esposito
In <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com> patt...@spudboy.ads.com
(Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>
>
>A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
>if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
>good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>
>Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>
>Tim
It is my understanding that if someone fails the written exams they
fail the course. This means that the student has to take the class over
from the start.
BERN
George Durden
In article <btierney-150...@ip30.birmingham.al.interramp.com>,
General Chang <btie...@sunset.backbone.olemiss.edu> wrote:
>In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>,
>patt...@spudboy.ads.com (Tim J. Patterson) wrote:
>
>> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>> Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
The shop that I deal with most here in Austin (TX/USA) has a policy
that if you fail, you repeat the sections that you're having
problems with and retake the written test... (all at no additional
cost to you). They are a PADI shop, and one of the best shops I've
ever dealt with. Their instructors are methodical, detailed, and
almost military in their seriousness and approach. I really
appreciated this but some people didn't. Oddly enough it was
those same people that failed the OW certification exam. FYI,
I know of one other shop here in Austin that will pass anybody
that gives them the $$$ for the course. It's a PADI shop too.
YMMV...
George
Donna Souza
Hmmm. I've read three responses to the original post and all three have said
something different. How about a definitive, accurate, knowledgable response?
D.
>In <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com> patt...@spudboy.ads.com
>(Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>>
>>
>>A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>>work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>>understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>>the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>>Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
Bob Fornasar
On May 16, 1996 04:23:06 in article <Re: PADI written exam>,
'ber...@ix.netcom.com(Bernard Louis Esposito)' wrote:
>In <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com> patt...@spudboy.ads.com
>(Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>>A friend who is trying to get certified..... She took the writen exam
last night and flunked. Her current understanding from the instructor is
that she has to completely repeat the class before being able to take the
>>Tim
>It is my understanding that if someone fails the written exams they
>fail the course. This means that the student has to take the class over
>from the start.
>
>BERN
"understanding"....
From the PADI Instructor Manual..."To make it possible to determine what
acceptable performance is, a "passing" score of 75% or higher has been set
for all quizzes and exams. This score will help you determine whether to
retest a student. If a student scores less than 75%, you should give a
retest. However, certification criteria for PADI Open Water ratings are
performanced-based .........."
BOTTOM LINE- An instructor does NOT HAVE TO PASS ANYONE. MASTERY of the
material must be exibited.
How badly did the student fail? How were her pool skills?
We constantly read on this very Newsgroup people complaining that the
certification agencies are mass producing under-qualified divers and then
you get someone crying "CASH" when someone fails a course.
An instructor is responsible and LIABLE. What makes you think the
INSTRUCTOR is going to get any more cash by having this student repeat the
course? What makes you think an Instructor is going to be so anxious to go
through another course with someone who JUST CAN'T GET IT?
When people ask for an OPINION, you should feel free to mouth off. When
people ask for STANDARDS or FACTS, DO A LITTLE RESEARCH.
Happy & Safe Diving,
Bob
Don W. Ward
Bob Fornasar wrote:
>[SNIP]
> through another course with someone who JUST CAN'T GET IT?
> When people ask for an OPINION, you should feel free to mouth off. When
> people ask for STANDARDS or FACTS, DO A LITTLE RESEARCH.
> Happy & Safe Diving,
> Bob
Well put Bob. I find it very interesting, the amount of rank speculation passed off as
fact online.
Since we have no facts whatsoever regarding this students performance other than she
failed the final, I think we should give the instructor the benefit of doubt. Having
taken the PADI course, I will add that the final and the end of the course in which
everything one needs to know is spoon feed, is really pretty easy. It reminded me of my
days in boy scouts working on a merit badge with some tables thrown in. It may be the
best thing for this student to take the whole course again. If she were my friend, I
would try and identify what area(s) she was having trouble with and help her out a
little. The tables can be confusing and a little help might go a long way.
Regards and safe diving,
Don.
Joe Koontz
Tim J. Patterson wrote:
>
> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
> Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
> if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
> good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>
>
joe
Michael Levy
.Donna Souza expounded on Thu, 16 May 1996 09:40:28 LOCAL:
>Hmmm. I've read three responses to the original post and all three have said
>something different. How about a definitive, accurate, knowledgable response?
Maybe one should give more strength to posts that state the guidelines
rather than one's that say it is my opinion that... On the other hand maybe
those who don't really know should not put forth speculation, but then this
would not be Usenet ;-)
Two that I have seen (Ann Stockham & Bob Fornasar), have clearly stated the
PADI policy that 100% understanding is required and below 75% requires
that the test be re written.
>>In <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com> patt...@spudboy.ads.com
>>(Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>>>A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>>>work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>>>understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>>>the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
Did she ask why? Is this the academic portion only or pool & class?
Did she flunk with 25%?
There is likely more to this than meets the eye, especially if the student
is also unsure herself!
>>>Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
>>>if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
>>>good excuse to make her work it all over again.
When you take ski, tennis, driving or golf lessons and fail any test....
are the extra classes free? I have found that scuba course makeups are more
likely to be free than not.
Don't jump on the put another $ bandwagon without really thinking it out
first! Has anyone really compared the cost per hour of a Scuba course with
any other sport training? Scuba courses maybe underpriced on that basis
alone.
>>>Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>>It is my understanding that if someone fails the written exams they
>>fail the course. This means that the student has to take the class over
>>from the start.
Wrong. The PADI course is performance based and the student must achieve
the required performance levels.
This may require repeating classroom and/or pool work.
Michael
--
Michael Levy
mjl...@myna.com
Divers know the meaning of peace of mind
Jason O'Rourke
Tim J. Patterson <patt...@spudboy.ads.com> wrote:
>A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
Exactly what does 'flunked' mean? She got 90% instead of 100, or 50%
instead of 70%? The written test should be easy and I would have some
doubts about someone who did poorly on it. Is the Padi test a standard
one, or written up by the instructor personally?
If she does in fact have to retake the course, I'd suggest a different
instructor perhaps? (ie, one that will teach her something).
Jason
naui ow2
--
Jason O'Rourke jas...@netcom.com
'96 BMW r850R '83 GS450
last dive: April 27th, night dive
at McAbee (Monterey), 22 mins at 51 feet.
joan coval
In the interest of accuracy you could call PADI and talk to them
directly.
This would avoid having to listen to personal opinions that most often
are not supported by fact or remotely referenced to actual PADI
documents.
The number is 1-800-729-7234 in the U.S. and those outside of the U.S.
it is 714-540-7234.
Information and assistance regarding instruction, technical matters,
training and education, and application processing can be directed to:
Jeff Myers, Education Coordinator x290
Mal Fousek, Educational Consultant x516
Debbie Logan, Educational Consultant x353
Brad Smith, Educational Consultant x224
-Joan-
In <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com> patt...@spudboy.ads.com
(Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>
>
>A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
>if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
>good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>
>Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>
>Tim
Dave Howlett
> In article <btierney-150...@ip30.birmingham.al.interramp.com>,
> General Chang <btie...@sunset.backbone.olemiss.edu> wrote:
> >In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>,
> >patt...@spudboy.ads.com (Tim J. Patterson) wrote:
> >
> >> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
> >> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
> >> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
> >> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
> >> Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
PADI standards are performance based. Academically, this means the
student achieves mastery either by scoring 100% on the exam initially, or
the instructor must review each missed question with the student.
Protocol may vary from store to store. Many instructors set a "rewrite"
score (ie 75%), whereupon students need to retake the exam (generally an
exam B) to achieve mastery. The store in question however, may indeed
require their students to retake the entire course.
From a business perspective, most customers appreciate being informed in
advance of exam rewriting procedures.
In this circumstance, there may be extenuating factors that are
influencing the instructor's decision to ask his student to retake the
entire program.
Hope this helped!
Dave Howlett
Toronto, Canada
Lee Bell
I believe, but don't know for sure, that the reason there ara a variety
of answers to this question is because there is no one right answer. I
don't think PADI specifies that the test be passed on the first try.
What I do know is that there are PADI certification courses in South
Florida which advertise that if you fail the course, you can take it
again free of charge until you do pass. Guess a pretty good
demonstration of a better instructor versus one who does not care as
much. Feel free to chose which one is which as you like.
Lee
Chuck Narad
In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>, patt...@spudboy.ads.com writes:
>
> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
> Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
> if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
> good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>
> Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>
> Tim
for what it's worth, the instructors I've worked with
(who are either NAUI or both NAUI and PADI certified)
will allow students to retake the class or any part of
it for free, if they fail the exam the first time. I
have no idea if this is personal policy, shop policy, or
agency policy.
cheers,
chuck/
--------------------------------------------------------------------
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Stephen M Dodd
In article <4ng39j$2...@fido.asd.sgi.com>,
Chuck Narad <na...@nudibranch.asd.sgi.com> wrote:
>
>In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>, patt...@spudboy.ads.com writes:
>>
>> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>> Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
>> if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
>> good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>>
>> Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>>
>> Tim
>
>for what it's worth, the instructors I've worked with
>(who are either NAUI or both NAUI and PADI certified)
>will allow students to retake the class or any part of
>it for free, if they fail the exam the first time. I
>have no idea if this is personal policy, shop policy, or
>agency policy.
>
>cheers,
>chuck/
All students or former students, passed or otherwise, are free to join
ongoing classes with our group forever. How would management get any
divemasters otherwise. The only requirement is that you don't cause a
problem or detract from the instructor.
This goes for anyone paying the fee regardless of passing the exam or
not.
We've never seen anyone hang on after failing a few times.
Steve
--
- Stephen M. Dodd, Computer Systems Coordinator ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Oregon State University Extension Service
sd...@oes.orst.edu Internet Oregon State University
Voice 503-737-3550 FAX 503-737-4423 Corvallis, OR 97331
Diane Boettcher
Donna...@brown.edu (Donna Souza) wrote:
>Hmmm. I've read three responses to the original post and all three have said
>something different. How about a definitive, accurate, knowledgable response?
needs to be taken over. There are only two versions of the test, so
she would get the one she hadn't taken. If she failed that one, then
she would take the first one over again. This keeps on going until
she passes. As noted before, retaking the whole course may be the
shop's policy.
I recommend that you call PADI. Afterall, you can't expect that
telling the instructor, "I read it on rec.scuba from a total stranger"
will help you. PADI HQ's number is (in the US) 1-800-SAY-PADI.
Aloha, Diane
dia...@aloha.net
PADI MSDT #90765
Diane's Aloha SCUBA Page: http://www.aloha.net/~dianeb/dscuba.html
Everette O Carter
Flunked the course?
I thought PADI stood for Pass And Damn Idiot!
E.C. PADI Rescue Diver
Donna Souza
>I was certified PADI OW two weeks ago (5/5/96)
>My wife and I took the High Speed OW (one weekend
>pool/class) (next weekend OW dives).
Man, things sure have changed since I did my OW with PADI in '84. The cert.
course was structured so that each Saturday (maybe it was Sunday?) we spent 2
hours of course work and 2 hours of pool work. There were 6 class meetings.
That's a total of 12 classroom hours and 12 pool hours. We did our OW dives
over the course of two weekends.
Well, I guess everything changes.....
D.
Stig A. Schibbye
Tim J. Patterson wrote:
>
> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
I'm in the middle of OW right now, and according to my instructor I can
repeat the course and exam as many times as neccecary (at no additional
cost.)
"My" school even says that if you for some reason do not pass (you're not
bright enough, don't pass the medical tests etc) you will get a full refound.
This is PADI in Oslo.
Stig
Terry Moore
Tim J. Patterson wrote:
>
> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
> if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
> good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>
> Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>
> Tim
I was certified PADI OW two weeks ago (5/5/96)
My wife and I took the High Speed OW (one weekend
pool/class) (next weekend OW dives).
The class went over each module one at a time.
After covering two modules we took a quiz.
The class went over the answers and taked over
any problems that we had.
We took module five test that was a final covering
everything. The test was 90% multiple choice. There
are several fill in the blank questions dealing
with emergency proceedures. The part that stumped
some students was multi-dive table problems. I
noted that the instructions are on the PADI rec
table.
We were told that the test was written at a 12year
old level. Well IMHO it was more difficult.
I belive that your friend was not prepared for the
book work. My wife read the book over a period of
three weeks and watched the module tapes one time
and her grade was 90%. I watched the tapes several
times read the book once but I studied the module
tests from the book untill It was almost a
memorized thing. My grade was 95%.
There may be more to your story. You can help your
friend by going over the material with her before
she test again.
Regards
Terry
Lee Jones
>I was certified PADI OW two weeks ago (5/5/96)
>My wife and I took the High Speed OW (one weekend
>pool/class) (next weekend OW dives).
Oh merciful heavens. Is really *called* "High Speed Open Water". Seems
like such C-cards oughta be appropriately labelled:
"Diver Lite"
or some such thing.
Regards, Lee
--
Lee Jones | "Act your age, not your shoe size
le...@sgi.com | And maybe we could do the twirl."
415-933-3356 | -the artist formerly known as "Prince" :-)
Jennifer L. McGee
patt...@spudboy.ads.com (Tim J. Patterson) wrote:
>A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
>if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
>good excuse to make her work it all over again.
>Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
>Tim
As far as I know, all PADI exams have a make-up. I assume this is for
Open Water? Then each module & the final have a make-up. She must
simply wait 3-5 days to take it.
Brian-PADI Instructor #69275
Charlie Hammond
In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>,
patt...@spudboy.ads.com (Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>A friend who is trying to get certified ... took the writen exam last night
>and flunked. Her current understanding ...is that she has to completely repeat
>the class... I wonder if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that
>this is agood excuse to make her work it all over again.
>
>Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
Unless the instructor is a complete idiot -- which IS a possiblitiy -- I would
guess that your friend effectively fluncked the entire course, not just the
final exam. My recommendation is that your friend should have a serious talk
with the instsructor. If whe isn't comfortable doing this, or if the instructor
doesn't give here a reasonable explaination, she should find another instructor.
If she really needs the additional work to be safe she should take it.
Some, probably many dive shops and instructors are willing to provide any
reasonable amount of extra help without additional charge. My own feeling
is that she shouldn't have to pay twice for the same instruction, but it
would be reasonable if she is asked to pay someting for the use of equipment.
If a professional instructor is, in effect, telling your friend that she isn't
a safe diver -- at least not yet -- she should take this seriously. There is
at least the possiblity that diving is not for her.
--
Charlie Hammond -- Digital Equipment Corporation -- Nashua NH USA
(ham...@peek.enet.dec.com)
All opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily reflect
my employer's position.
Michael Workman
In article <4niii3$4...@fido.asd.sgi.com>, le...@diver.asd.sgi.com
says...
>
>In article <319C7D...@ti.com>, Terry Moore <af...@ti.com> wrote:
>
>>I was certified PADI OW two weeks ago (5/5/96)
>>My wife and I took the High Speed OW (one weekend
>>pool/class) (next weekend OW dives).
>
>Oh merciful heavens. Is really *called* "High Speed Open Water".
Seems
>like such C-cards oughta be appropriately labelled:
>
>"Diver Lite"
>
>or some such thing.
>
too long.
Charles Fox
jas...@netcom.com (Jason O'Rourke) wrote:
> <SNIP>
>Is the Padi test a standard one, or written up by the instructor personally?
All the PADI exams are standard exams written by PADI, not by the
individual instructors.
>If she does in fact have to retake the course, I'd suggest a different
>instructor perhaps? (ie, one that will teach her something).
I know of no standard that would require taking the whole course over
if the only problem was failing the final exam. Generally, allowing
more study and a retake would be in order. (There may have been more
involved than simply failing a final in this case, but I'm not going
to speculate in the absense of more information.)
Jason Rogers
Wow! Failed the *Padi* exam! Don't take the course again, don't
re sit the test. Give up diving. Everyone will be safer.
Cheers Jason =:)
Brian
On Fri, 17 May 1996 08:20:35 -0500, Terry Moore <af...@ti.com> wrote:
>Tim J. Patterson wrote:
>>
>> A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
>> work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
>> understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
>> the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
>> Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
>> if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
>> good excuse to make her work it all over again.
No she does not have to do all the classroom work again, but she will
have to resit the exam. Of course she will need some extra work to
bring her up to speed, perhaps this is what the instructor meant by
redoing the theory work again.
I don't think that anyone could call the open water exam hard by any
stretch of the imagination, is there any particular area she is having
trouble with?
Brian
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
\|/ ____ \|/Brian Grant A8 18 3D 5C 3E 3B 2C 64 04 82 68 F3 5C 62 33 C5
@~/ ,. \~@ Phone: +64 (25) 316 709 Key on server
/_( \_ / )_\Email: brian...@stonebow.otago.ac.nz
\__U_/ Email: brg...@sol.otago.ac.nz as...@es.co.nz
ICBM : 45 deg 51min 11.4 sec S, 170 deg 29 min 7.2sec E
PADI IDC Staff #65640 SSI AOWI #5048 CMAS #18044 NZFPC #C799
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Terry Moore
Lee Jones (le...@diver.asd.sgi.com) wrote:
: >I was certified PADI OW two weeks ago (5/5/96)
: >My wife and I took the High Speed OW (one weekend
: >pool/class) (next weekend OW dives).
: Oh merciful heavens. Is really *called* "High Speed Open Water". Seems
: like such C-cards oughta be appropriately labelled:
: "Diver Lite"
: or some such thing.
: Regards, Lee
: --
: Lee Jones | "Act your age, not your shoe size
: le...@sgi.com | And maybe we could do the twirl."
: 415-933-3356 | -the artist formerly known as "Prince" :-)
Lee
this kind of remark is not like you.
Let me clarify
THe class is called Head Start
you are required to study at home and not at the store.
strict PADI
regards
Terry af...@ti.com
Miss Lo
In article <31A085...@hgu.mrc.ac.uk>, David Kipling
<dav...@hgu.mrc.ac.uk> writes
>Donna Souza wrote:
>>
>> Hmmm. I've read three responses to the original post and all three have said
>> something different. How about a definitive, accurate, knowledgable response?
>
>her away to do some
>more work at home then tested her with the other version of the exam the
>following weekend. She
>passed. Certainly she did NOT have to take the entire course again. Mind you,
>one could
>imagine a dubious dive shop suggesting this as a money-making scheme ;-(
Ok - I'll admit it. I flunked my written test the first time. I am a
terrible test-taker, was on my lunch hour, and was admittedly competing
with my husband. My instructor said I had to wait 5 days before the
retake.
I went back alone, took the B version of the test and got only one
question wrong. I finished the test about half an hour. I did NOT have
to take the course again. That is why there are two versions of the
exam. The exam is very easy, and it is my understanding that most dive
shops will work with you until you get it.
---
Miss Lo
********************
aaj01.dial.pipex.com
Thomas Degel
HI,
This may sound arogant but comes from self-preservation: If you fail the exam
something has gone *seriously* wrong during the course. It is the easiest of
all c-exams and failing this one suggest a completely different frame of mind
than the one needed for diving.
Look at it from another perspective: Would you dive with a newbie who is
unsure of even the basics? I certainly wouldn't but have seen horrible
examples of goofs made by divers only focusing on getting the C-card and not
on learning how to dive, endangering the group as a whole.
My 2 bits: Do the full course again - it will probably save your life.
--
:-)
Thomas Degel
---------------------
E-mail: t...@iir.dk
Dphone: (+45) 33 36 90 34
Roy Roper
FWIW
I took the final exam last night and passed.
I missed one.
Then I found out that one could miss a bunch and still pass.
One would have to a) not watch the tapes, b) not read the book
and do the quizes, c) not listen to the instructor in class
and in dives and d) not reread the book and do the table work before
the final in order to flunk.
95% is common sense
4% is a bit "tricky" in concepts
1% is raw math skills
It is not beyond comprehension that if someone "flunked" that
the instructor might find it ethical to require repeating the
whole class....
fwiw
////
Charlie Hammond wrote:
>
> In article <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com>,
> patt...@spudboy.ads.com (Tim J. Patterson) writes:
>
> >A friend who is trying to get certified ... took the writen exam last night
> >and flunked. Her current understanding ...is that she has to completely repeat
> >the class... I wonder if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that
Chris Fulmer
In article <31A31F...@pop.life.uiuc.edu>, Roy Roper <royr...@pop.life.uiuc.edu> writes:
> FWIW
>
> I took the final exam last night and passed.
> I missed one.
> Then I found out that one could miss a bunch and still pass.
> One would have to a) not watch the tapes, b) not read the book
> and do the quizes, c) not listen to the instructor in class
> and in dives and d) not reread the book and do the table work before
> the final in order to flunk.
>
> 95% is common sense
> 4% is a bit "tricky" in concepts
> 1% is raw math skills
>
> It is not beyond comprehension that if someone "flunked" that
> the instructor might find it ethical to require repeating the
> whole class....
The PADI teaching system tries to repeat the important concepts
in various media... That's why you read the book, watch the same
things on tape, talk about it with the instructor, maybe watch a
slide show, etc.... They all cover pretty much the same things,
but repeating it like that makes it very easy to learn.
I'd say that your percentages are a bit off... A good part of
scuba diving is common sense -- "don't hold your breath when you
come up, or your lungs will pop like a balloon" is an example.
However, there are some non-intuitive things about diving, such
as slow ascends, the order in which you should try various
ascents, letting air *out* of your BC when you ascend. And,
tables take some getting used to.
The other thing that you have to do when taking a PADI course is
to demonstrate comfort (and competancy) with the various in-water
skills. So, the other way to flunk would be to miss a class and
never make it up.
In general, though, it's very rare for a student to flunk, because
instructors are generally willing to work with students until they
get it right. At least, that's been my experience.
--
Chris Fulmer
These opinions are my own and not those of my employer.
Chris Deutschmann
> In <PATTERSO.96...@spudboy.ads.com> patt...@spudboy.ads.com
> (Tim J. Patterson) writes:
> >
> >
> >A friend who is trying to get certified has finished all the pool
> >work. She took the writen exam last night and flunked. Her current
> >understanding from the instructor is that she has to completely repeat
> >the class before being able to take the exam again. I know it's Put
> >Another Dollar In but this seems extreme. On the other hand, I wonder
> >if she appears to be enough of a danger in the pool that this is a
> >good excuse to make her work it all over again.
> >
> >Anybody know the PADI policy on retaking the written part?
> >
> >Tim
>
> It is my understanding that if someone fails the written exams they
> fail the course. This means that the student has to take the class over
> from the start.
>
> BERN
This is incorrect. Current PADI policy is as follows:
Students need to exhibit mastery of each exam item. This may be accomplished
in one of two ways. Either the student atains 100% on the written exam, or the
instructor reviews each incorrectly answered question until the student
understands the related subject matter thoroughly.
It is recommended that students re-write the exam if they atain a score of less
than 75% on the exam. There is no reference to students having to re-take the
entire course, although it is probably a good idea for students to sit in on
the academic sessions of another course before re-writing the exam.
----
Chris Deutschmann cdeu...@iafrica.com
Michael Kates
cdeu...@iafrica.com (Chris Deutschmann) wrote:
>This is incorrect. Current PADI policy is as follows:
>Students need to exhibit mastery of each exam item. This may be accomplished
>in one of two ways. Either the student atains 100% on the written exam, or the
>instructor reviews each incorrectly answered question until the student
>understands the related subject matter thoroughly.
>It is recommended that students re-write the exam if they atain a score of less
>than 75% on the exam. There is no reference to students having to re-take the
>entire course, although it is probably a good idea for students to sit in on
>the academic sessions of another course before re-writing the exam.
>----
>Chris Deutschmann cdeu...@iafrica.com
That policy looks good on paper, so to speak. But I think anyone who,
after taking the time to sit through each classroom unit and
supposedly reading the chapters, still does not understand 25% or more
of basic cert material, should be considered as possibly being too
unintelligent to engage in this sport. (I've typed and re-typed that
last sentence for about 20 minutes, trying to find a nicer way to put
it, but I lack the subtle touch, I guess)
Though people and circumstances vary (obviously), I feel an instructor
should nonetheless question, at least in his/her own mind, the ability
of such a student to *ever* understand the material thoroughly. I can
only hope that in such a case the instructor would have the integrity
to be as objective as possible in evaluating the student's REAL grasp
(or lack thereof) of the material during the subsequent review.
The lack of sharply defined limits in the PADI policy certainly makes
it easy to help a student who may have missed just a few key points
without a lot of fuss. The requirement that 100% be either answered
correctly or reviewed to completion is right on target. Clearly, the
student is solely responsible for retaining and using what they have
learned, and it is not the responsibility of the instructor to "screen
out" people who might hurt themselves, nor to administer tests for
intelligence or common sense! But sometimes to refuse to pass a
student is to do them a favor.
Just my $.02
--
Michael Kates
na...@atl.mindspring.com
MikeS57620
Ya know, there is another aspect of this. I've dove with "DM's" in 3rd
world place that were illiterate. They wouldn't be right on ONE question
on a written exam. But they taught me diving techniques and safe dving
that I retain to this day.