late 40's/early 50's pop music
sonique...@gmail.com
all "pre-rock" music, but I didn't understand at all how music really
worked, or how (IMO) there are no bad songs, but merely bad versions
of songs.
My biggest problem with early 50's pop music today, especially the
female-sung hits, isn't the songs or the singers, but the arrangements
- the string, violins and vocal choruses are often so overdone they
turn what otherwise was a good performance into something that borders
on saccharine. A good example of this would be something like Joni
James' "Why Don't You Believe Me" - she has a nice voice and she sings
the song well, but the arrangement is too saccharine for my tastes.
Late 40's pop music, on the other hand, seems to use more brass or
wind instruments and even electric guitars than string instruments,
which seem to be prevalent on most 50's pop hits. Sometimes other
instruments are present, too: the primary instrument in Dinah Shore's
"Buttons and Bows" is an accordion. The recordings from that era that
do use string instruments seem to be more subtle and not as overdone.
It does seem like string instrument arrangements became too
overwhelming in the 50's and brass and wind arrangements less so -
that is, until rock and roll came around.
On the other hand, my attitude about some singers and recordings
hasn't changed much. I hate Lawrence Welk with a passion, I don't like
anything by Eddie Fisher (particularly "Oh My Papa" where the
sappiness is so overdone it borders on comedy), I consider Patti
Page's "How Much Is That Doggie in the Window" a joke, and I have no
use for the limp covers of R&B songs by the Crew Cuts and other
artists of that ilk.
Sonic
the lily white, middle aged producers and arrangers that generally
made 40's and 50's Pop so crappy.....well that and Pat Boone....
Matt
Sharx35
<sonique...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:9abedbc5-6567-4325...@j20g2000vbp.googlegroups.com...
Frankly, I consider a whole lot of "rock" music to be nothing more than the
immature guitar pluckings and vocal screechings of egomaniacs who substitute
crack monkey behavior and far too much volume as substitutes for talent,
e.g. Little Richard aka Tiny Dick. On the other hand, for the most part, pop
music from the late 40's and early 50's represents a whole lot more talent
than the crap that music has degenerated into, especially since the cusp
years in the mid 60's.
Sharx35
"Sonic" <mattm...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:05541f35-1340-4b9b...@z5g2000vba.googlegroups.com...
Listen up, LIEbrawl asshole. What the FUCK does it matter WHAT the colour is
of ANYONE involved in the production whether it is the artist, label,
producer, arranger or the composer? You ignorant assholes who dis "white"
produced music are just as much racists as those who call black music
"jungle" music.
Scar...@searchhawkmail.com
If you think early 50s pop (females included) is all strings, you've
still only listened to a handful of top 40 hits. Not that there's
anything wrong with strings. Sinatra popularized them in the mid-40s,
setting a standard for pop arrangements throughout the next decade. I
like strings/sweet music, but admittedly my favorite songs tend to be
orchestrated with small combos featuring guitar, bass, piano, sax and
drums (or similar setup).
Returning to the ladies: I've got 360-odd tracks by Kay Starr
(including some repeats), and you'd be hard-pressed to find many
recordings by her with strings on them. She sings pop that can easily
double as jazz, blues, r&b, country, and gospel.
Also try Georgia Gibbs, Sarah Vaughan, Peggy Lee, Teresa Brewer,
Connie Haines, Jo Stafford, Connie Haines, The Fontanes (who rock) and
Patti Page (esp. her country numbers and early Mercury's). Yes, most
of these cut some ballads with strings (and some damn fine ones), but
they did at least as much work with r&b, country, blues, jazz, swing
and folk influenced arrangements.
The Chordettes' early (pre-Cadence) albums are all a cappella
barbershop (e.g., no strings or anything else).
And strings or no strings, late 40s-early 50s pop is still the
greatest music of all time.
sonique...@gmail.com
> Zat you, Chuck?
>
> If you think early 50s pop (females included) is all strings, you've
> still only listened to a handful of top 40 hits.
I've actually heard a bunch of tracks by the female artists on
RealRhapsody.
> Not that there's
> anything wrong with strings. Sinatra popularized them in the mid-40s,
> setting a standard for pop arrangements throughout the next decade. I
> like strings/sweet music, but admittedly my favorite songs tend to be
> orchestrated with small combos featuring guitar, bass, piano, sax and
> drums (or similar setup).
Mine too. I'm actually more of a jazz fan than a straight pop fan, but
my liking of standards in general; not to mention my ongoing love
(since last year) in general for that whole late 1940's period...
I've actually heard more 50's pop stuff lately thanks to RealRhapsody.
My favorites are:
>
> Kay Starr
I actually like her version of "You Were Only Fooling" better than the
Ink Spots'. I also like her "Bonaparte's Retreat", "Have You Talked to
the Man Upstairs" - and her duet with herself on "Side by Side".
>
> Sarah Vaughan
Excellent singer who handles most of what she recorded very well.
> Peggy Lee
I enjoy just about everything I've heard by her, from her early pop
hits to her later, more jazzy recordings. "Why Don't You Do Right",
"Waitin' For the Train to Come In", "I Don't Know Enough About You",
not to mention her entire Black Coffee album and (yep) "Fever" are
favorites - but my favorite of all her songs is "Lover" - which has a
really cool arrangement. Even "Manana" is kind of enjoyable, in a
nostalgic sorta way.
> Jo Stafford
Especially her - what a voice she had. My favorite Stafford songs are
"Haunted Heart", "The Things We Did Last Summer", "It Could Happen to
You", "Keep It a Secret" and (especially) "Early Autumn".
> Patti Page (esp. her country numbers and early Mercury's).
"Detour" is my favorite song by her's, along with "Tennessee
Waltz" (of course - I like her's as much as Jo's actually), "Confess"
and "With My Eyes Wide Open, I'm Dreaming".
You forgot to mention Dinah Shore. Most of what I've heard by her I
like; along with "Buttons and Bows", "Laughing On the Inside", "The
Gypsy", "Doing What Comes Naturally" and "Blues in the Night" (a song
I enjoy in just about all versions).
One standard from this era I really like is "My Foolish Heart" - my
favorite version of this is actually Tom's favorite as well, the Mindy
Carson one. Her version of that song is a much better record than
'Wake the Town and Tell the People'.
> And strings or no strings, late 40s-early 50s pop is still the greatest music of > all time.
While I am still very much a rock fan, especially of modern
alternative, it was learning music theory and getting into jazz two
years ago that finally led me to come around to realize that there's
nothing at all wrong with this music. I will admit that too many of my
opinions about pre-rock music was based on Bruce's - but later I
realized he also dislikes my other favorite style of music
(alternative rock and my favorite band, The Velvet Underground), and
that you should *never* let someone else judge your own tastes.
(BTW, my favorite female singer from the 50's is Anita O'Day.)
:-)
sonique...@gmail.com
Typo - I meant let someone else's taste judge your own opinions.
Scar...@searchhawkmail.com
<soniquemd21...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Jun 5, 2:26 pm, Scarlo...@searchhawkmail.com wrote:
>
> > Zat you, Chuck?
>
> > If you think early 50s pop (females included) is all strings, you've
> > still only listened to a handful of top 40 hits.
>
> I've actually heard a bunch of tracks by the female artists on
> RealRhapsody.
>
> > Not that there's
> > anything wrong with strings. Sinatra popularized them in the mid-40s,
> > setting a standard for pop arrangements throughout the next decade. I
> > like strings/sweet music, but admittedly my favorite songs tend to be
> > orchestrated with small combos featuring guitar, bass, piano, sax and
> > drums (or similar setup).
>
> Mine too. I'm actually more of a jazz fan than a straight pop fan, but
> my liking of standards in general; not to mention my ongoing love
> (since last year) in general for that whole late 1940's period...
>
> I've actually heard more 50's pop stuff lately thanks to RealRhapsody.
> My favorites are:
>
>
>
> > Kay Starr
>
> I actually like her version of "You Were Only Fooling" better than the
> Ink Spots'. I also like her "Bonaparte's Retreat", "Have You Talked to
> the Man Upstairs" - and her duet with herself on "Side by Side".
These are all terrific records, but they're also her hits. If you
want to hear Kay sing jazz, etc,, look for her albums. Her RCA albums
are my favorites: The One - The Only, Blue Starr, Rockin' With Kay,
and I Hear The Word. Of her Capitol lps, I Cry By Night and Losers
Weepers are my picks. Also check out her early cuts and
transcriptions with Charlie Barnett and Joe Venuti.
> > Sarah Vaughan
>
> Excellent singer who handles most of what she recorded very well.
I love Sarah Vaughan. Of the 3 legendary jazz songbirds, I rank her
above Billie and Ella. Those low notes really get me.
> > Peggy Lee
>
> I enjoy just about everything I've heard by her, from her early pop
> hits to her later, more jazzy recordings. "Why Don't You Do Right",
> "Waitin' For the Train to Come In", "I Don't Know Enough About You",
> not to mention her entire Black Coffee album and (yep) "Fever" are
> favorites - but my favorite of all her songs is "Lover" - which has a
> really cool arrangement. Even "Manana" is kind of enjoyable, in a
> nostalgic sorta way.
>
> > Jo Stafford
>
> Especially her - what a voice she had. My favorite Stafford songs are
> "Haunted Heart", "The Things We Did Last Summer", "It Could Happen to
> You", "Keep It a Secret" and (especially) "Early Autumn".
>
> > Patti Page (esp. her country numbers and early Mercury's).
>
> "Detour" is my favorite song by her's, along with "Tennessee
> Waltz" (of course - I like her's as much as Jo's actually), "Confess"
> and "With My Eyes Wide Open, I'm Dreaming".
With Patti you should also try to get ahold of her non-hits and album
cuts. Her hits are great, but very different from her jazz (Detour
Ahead, I Can't Get Started) and country (I Want To Be A Cowboy's
Sweetheart, Down the Trail of Achin' Hearts). She even yodels on
Cowboy's Sweetheart.
>
> You forgot to mention Dinah Shore. Most of what I've heard by her I
> like; along with "Buttons and Bows", "Laughing On the Inside", "The
> Gypsy", "Doing What Comes Naturally" and "Blues in the Night" (a song
> I enjoy in just about all versions).
I'm a fan of Dinah, but have only heard her sing straight pop (like
the above examples). I grew up with her Buttons & Bows on an old 78.
I love it (and have it on cd), but am still trying to get my hands on
a cd version of the flip side - Daddy-O (I'm Gonna Teach You Some
Blues).
> One standard from this era I really like is "My Foolish Heart" - my
> favorite version of this is actually Tom's favorite as well, the Mindy
> Carson one. Her version of that song is a much better record than
> 'Wake the Town and Tell the People'.
I'm watching 2 cd collections of Mindy's on Amazon for a good price.
Right now, I haven't got much by her (several duets from other
artists' albums, and one solo -- I'm Not Just Anybody's Baby).
> > And strings or no strings, late 40s-early 50s pop is still the greatest music of > all time.
>
> While I am still very much a rock fan, especially of modern
> alternative, it was learning music theory and getting into jazz two
> years ago that finally led me to come around to realize that there's
> nothing at all wrong with this music. I will admit that too many of my
> opinions about pre-rock music was based on Bruce's - but later I
> realized he also dislikes my other favorite style of music
> (alternative rock and my favorite band, The Velvet Underground), and
> that you should *never* let someone else judge your own tastes.
I also love rock -- almost as much as early 50s pop -- although Bruce
would claim that most of my favorite rock songs are just late 50s
pop. Dion, Elvis, and Brian Setzer all rank among my top 10 male
artists.
> (BTW, my favorite female singer from the 50's is Anita O'Day.)
I added a couple of Anita's albums to my library last month. Love
her. Jazzers will break out my wanted posters again for saying this,
but I hear a lot of Frankie Laine's influence in her delivery (he
coached her back in the 30s).
> :-)
DianeE
<sonique...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:de6737c6-f071-4ace...@h23g2000vbc.googlegroups.com...
One standard from this era I really like is "My Foolish Heart" - my
favorite version of this is actually Tom's favorite as well, the Mindy
Carson one.
---------------------
An instrumental version of "My Foolish Heart"--I think it's what today would
be called Smooth Jazz--by Gene Ammons made the R&B charts in 1950. To me,
it's absolutely beautiful. Check it out if you can. (Make sure it's not
the later re-recording which is 5 minutes long and stereo.)
Here's the right version, but it's scratchy:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kggJ-KfNXOA
DianeE