Millenium Ring at the MET
RAFAEL MAZA HOYO
My God !, do you really like Wagner ?. How can you propose Bryn Terfel as
Wotan ?
On Thu, 8 May 1997, James Jorden wrote:
> Terrymelin wrote:
>
> > How about this for the cast:
> >
> > Brunnhilde: Eaglen
> > Wotan: Bryn Terfel
> > Siegfried: Ben Heppner
> > Sieglinde: Deborah Voigt
> > Siegmund: Peter Sieffert
> > Fricka: Waltraud Meier
> >
> > Any thoughts?
>
> Yes. Apart from Voigt, ecccch.
>
> --
> james jorden
> jjo...@ix.netcom.com
> http://www.anaserve.com/~parterre
>
> "Without Jews, Gypsies and homosexuals, there is no theater."
> -- Mel Brooks in "To Be or Not to Be"
>
>
Peter
RAFAEL MAZA HOYO wrote:
> My God !, do you really like Wagner ?. How can you propose Bryn Terfel > as Wotan ?
Why not, pray tell? I think that he would be great!
Peter
Michael Black wrote:
> Met, I pondered his foray into the Wagner repertoire. I pondered it because, his voice
> simply isn't big enough IMO. His Wolfram was beautifully sung, but I think that Terfel's
> voice is better suited to Mozart and the bel canto rep.
>
> Just my opinion...
>
> --
> "Dolora Zajick Rules!!! Any questions?"
> http://www.stairway.org/bjorling/
> My Suggested Recordings
> http://www.stairway.org/bjorling/suggest.htm
Since my comments are strictly based on what I have heard of Terfel on
CD's, it shows once more how we are at the mercy of the recording
engineers. They can obviously make a voice sound much more "heroic"
than it really is.
Michael Black
Daniel F. Tritter
recorded v. live, always a consideration. i'll stake this view, michael
black notwithstanding, that i own about 8 cd's and a video with terfel's
work, and i was present for two tannhauser performances this season at
the met. i believe that in the latter, the wolfram of terfel was audible
in every cranny of the house, on a scale that fully merits the category
known as heldenbariton. if you want the current standard of comparison,
i think his voice is easily equal in size to that of james morris. as to
quality, i would run, not walk, to hear his wotan.
dft
Jacob
Michael Black wrote:
>
> Peter wrote:
>
> > RAFAEL MAZA HOYO wrote:
> >
> > > My God !, do you really like Wagner ?. How can you propose Bryn Terfel > as Wotan ?
> >
> > Why not, pray tell? I think that he would be great!
>
> Mind you, I'm a fan of Terfel's, BUT...., having recently seen Terfel's Wolfram at the
> Met, I pondered his foray into the Wagner repertoire. I pondered it because, his voice
> simply isn't big enough IMO. His Wolfram was beautifully sung, but I think that Terfel's
> voice is better suited to Mozart and the bel canto rep.
>
> Just my opinion...
JACOB WROTE:
Last week I saw him in Amsterdam performing his first Scarpia, and I
must say he surprised me in a very positive way. JUST FABULOUS! He WAS
Il Barone Scarpia.
And Catherine?.... Who?.... Catherine (Tosca)Malfitano?? How did she
do?? Uhh......well.... I don't no. Let me say this, the bravo's were not
for Malfitano this evening, but for Bryn Terfel, Richard Margison (who
was a great Cavaradossi), Riccardo Chailly and Nikolaus Lehnhof.
Jacob
Richard C. Wall
And you are 100% correct, Michael!
Richard
Michael Black wrote:
>
> Peter wrote:
>
> > RAFAEL MAZA HOYO wrote:
> >
> > > My God !, do you really like Wagner ?. How can you propose Bryn Terfel > as Wotan ?
> >
> > Why not, pray tell? I think that he would be great!
>
> Mind you, I'm a fan of Terfel's, BUT...., having recently seen Terfel's Wolfram at the
> Met, I pondered his foray into the Wagner repertoire. I pondered it because, his voice
> simply isn't big enough IMO. His Wolfram was beautifully sung, but I think that Terfel's
> voice is better suited to Mozart and the bel canto rep.
>
> Just my opinion...
>
Richard C. Wall
Wolfram ain't Wotan, my friend. The vocal stamina required for a
heldonbariton to sing the Ring is not in Mr. Terfel's purvey. I adore him,
don't get me wrong. Wolfram is also orchestrated differently than Wotan.
They are two separate items, indeed. Terfel might record Wotan, but for him
to sing it onstage at this point would be suicide.
Richard C. Wall
ros...@theory.lcs.mit.edu
In article <6j99v4$g7g$1...@news6.ispnews.com>,
"dtri...@bway.net"@bway.net wrote:
>
> recorded v. live, always a consideration. i'll stake this view, michael
> black notwithstanding, that i own about 8 cd's and a video with terfel's
> work, and i was present for two tannhauser performances this season at
> the met. i believe that in the latter, the wolfram of terfel was audible
> in every cranny of the house, on a scale that fully merits the category
> known as heldenbariton. if you want the current standard of comparison,
> i think his voice is easily equal in size to that of james morris. as to
> quality, i would run, not walk, to hear his wotan.
I was in the house for one of the Tannhauser. Last row family circle,
no problem at all to hear Terfel. I wouldn't run to hear his Wotan
for the simple reason that I wouldn't run to any performance of a
Ring Cycle (dragged would probably be a better term for me :)
but it is definitely a role that lies in his possibilities.
Indeed he is seriously considering it if one has to believe
an interview he gave a couple of months ago.
As an aside, in my experience Terfel's voice live has always been as strong,
heroic and full-bodied as the recording sounds.
---Rosario
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
Sara Freeman
>Since my comments are strictly based on what I have heard of Terfel on
>CD's, it shows once more how we are at the mercy of the recording
>engineers. They can obviously make a voice sound much more "heroic"
>than it really is.
I've heard Terfel in person and I think he certainly has a big enough
voice to carry the Wagnerian roles, but I don't think he has the
maturity and subtletly it takes to be a good Wotan. A good Wotan does
not bluster. Maybe I should say "my" idea of a good Wotan. But then,
hey, I like Wotan.
--
"If you think of reality as the software for the universe,
all it would take is for someone to change a comma
in the program, and the chair you are sitting on
wouldn't be a chair at all." - Jacques Vallee
The Clark Family
> Mind you, I'm a fan of Terfel's, BUT...., having recently seen > Terfel's Wolfram at the Met, I pondered his foray into the Wagner > repertoire. I pondered it because, his voice simply isn't big enough > IMO. His Wolfram was beautifully sung, but I think that Terfel's
> voice is better suited to Mozart and the bel canto rep.
Basically, I agree with you. Terfel would have the perfect (almost)
voice, if only he had a little more weight. Then again, people said the
same thing when it was suggested that Jerusalem sing Siegfried. I think
a good studio recording job could make the right adjustments in volume,
though Decca achieved the opposite effect in its outstanding new Don
Giovanni.
-Graham Clark (not THAT one)
The Clark Family
> Brunnhilde: Eaglen
> Wotan: Bryn Terfel
> Siegfried: Ben Heppner
> Sieglinde: Deborah Voigt
> Siegmund: Peter Sieffert
> Fricka: Waltraud Meier
>
> Any thoughts?
Yes; my thoughts exactly! Terfel may not have the volume, but has the
voice (for once). An alternative would be Hale. I just hope they don't
put up Jimmy Morris again. The only change I might make is the swap
Heppner and Seiffert in their roles; Heppner really does not have the
range for Siegfried, and Seiffert lacks the volume/lyrical combination
for Siegmund (IMHO). As for Mime, guess who!
George Murnu
Agree with swapping Heppner and Seiffert. By the way when is Seiffert
due to make his Met debut?
George Murnu
I have attended Terfel's Tannhauser Met performances as well and his
voice was clearly audible from family circle. My only complaint for his
performance was that Terfel bought so much charisma to a characted that
is basically a nice guy but a loser.
PV
JACOB WROTE:
Last week I saw him in Amsterdam performing his first Scarpia, and I
must say he surprised me in a very positive way. JUST FABULOUS! He WAS
Il Barone Scarpia.
And Catherine?.... Who?.... Catherine (Tosca)Malfitano?? How did she
do?? Uhh......well.... I don't no. Let me say this, the bravo's were not
for Malfitano this evening, but for Bryn Terfel, Richard Margison (who
was a great Cavaradossi), Riccardo Chailly and Nikolaus Lehnhof.
Jacob
For people who are interested. This Tosca performance, whit
Terfel-Marginson-Malfitano, will be broadcast on Dutch Television on 27
december 1998.
Peter Scotto
The Clark Family <clark...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>> Brunnhilde: Eaglen
>> Wotan: Bryn Terfel
>> Siegfried: Ben Heppner
>> Sieglinde: Deborah Voigt
>> Siegmund: Peter Sieffert
>> Fricka: Waltraud Meier
How about Petra Lang as Fricka and saving Meier (if she has any voice then
at all) for Waltraute? And I agree with others that Heppner shouldn't
tackle Siegfried. Mattila as Gutrune and Freia. Struckmann as Donner and
Gunther or Alberich if he'd sing it.
Maria Ewing as second cover Schwertleite.
David Shengold (dshe...@mhc.mtholyoke.edu)
George Murnu
Wlashika ( sp ? ) as Alberich, Salminen as Fafner and Hagen, Rene Pape
as Fasolt.
David Meadows
> Brunnhilde: Eaglen
Yeah, if you don't mind a bit of wobble (and I ain't talking about the
voice!).
Erik Jan van Sten
Haha...I thought the bravo's were for Terfel's cat (there is an article
about it in the NRC newspaper, saturday appendix). I wasn't able to get
tickets, unfortunately.
Regards,
EJ
> ....Let me say this, the bravo's were not
Marc Musnick
From what I have heard so far, I think Terfel could be an excellent Wotan at the
right time and right place. I would like to hear his Dutchman and look forward
to his "Figaro" at the Met this coming season.
"As an aside, in my experience Terfel's voice live has always been as strong,
> heroic and full-bodied as the recording sounds."
>
> ---Rosario
>
> -----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
> http://www.dejanews.com/ Now offering spam-free web-based newsreading
--
Marc Musnick
e-mail address: mmus...@bellatlantic.net
The Clark Family
> Wlashika ( sp ? ) as Alberich, Salminen as Fafner and Hagen, Rene Pape
> as Fasolt.
I agree here, except for Salminen as Hagen. On stage, he looks a little
to old/big to really play the part convincingly. There may not be anyone
that agrees with me, but I think that Simon Keenlyside, provided that
his instrument stays in good condition, might be ready for Hagen is a
year or two.
-Graham Clark
James Jorden
The Clark Family wrote:
> There may not be anyone
> that agrees with me, but I think that Simon Keenlyside, provided that
> his instrument stays in good condition, might be ready for Hagen is a
> year or two.
Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
--
james jorden
jjo...@ix.netcom.com
latest opera gossip from parterre box:
http://www.anaserve.com/~parterre/lacieca.htm
Michael Black
James Jorden wrote:
> The Clark Family wrote:
> > There may not be anyone
> > that agrees with me, but I think that Simon Keenlyside, provided that
> > his instrument stays in good condition, might be ready for Hagen is a
> > year or two.
>
> Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
> from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
> performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
> Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
Well James, ya never know...
Brian Newhouse
"The Clark Family wrote:
"> There may not be anyone
"> that agrees with me, but I think that Simon Keenlyside, provided that
"> his instrument stays in good condition, might be ready for Hagen is a
"> year or two.
"
"Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
"from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
"performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
"Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
"
"--
No! No! It's Dawn Upshaw as _Brunnhilde_, and Ian Bostridge (debut) as
Siegfried. Debuting also will be Christine Schaefer and Sanford Sylvan
as Gutrune & Gunther Gibich. Waltraute will be sung by Lorraine Hunt,
and Alberich by Michele Pertusi. The Rhinemaidens will be sung by Deborah
Voigt, Sharon Sweet & Dolora Zajick.
<very sick grin>
--
Brian Newhouse
newh...@newton.crisp.net
Ed Boxer
>From: David Meadows <dmea...@ozemail.com.australia>
>Date: Mon, May 18, 1998 10:03 EDT
>Message-id: <35603F...@ozemail.com.australia>
>
>Michael Black wrote:
>>
>> James Jorden wrote:
>>
>> > The Clark Family wrote:
>> > > There may not be anyone
>> > > that agrees with me, but I think that Simon Keenlyside, provided that
>> > > his instrument stays in good condition, might be ready for Hagen is a
>> > > year or two.
>> >
>> > Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
>> > from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
>> > performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
>> > Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
>>
>>
>
Jeez - then we could have Bette Midler as Erda!!!!
Ed "Boxer" Jones
Check out my home page: http://www.GeoCities.com/WestHollywood/9172
A Guide to Opera on CD; Boxing; my Lego creations; Drum and Bugle Corps; Key
West
David Meadows
Scarlet Cockrel
> Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
> from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
> performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
> Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
James, I pity you in that you cannot see things from other people's
points of view (do you really have nothing better to do on this
newsgroup?); but I wish that you would at least look at the facts of
what you post before sending it here. Keenlyside is a baritone, but
hardly an exclusively "lyrical" one. If you have not had the chance to
hear him in any truly dramatic roles, check out his Mercutio with the
Alagnas. As for Gheorghiu as Bruennhilde, I doubt she would be a first
choice, both because of her own vocal style and ability with the German
language, she might manage to pull it off someday. As for Upshaw as
Gutrune, I see no problem except a slight danger of her volume not being
that of the chosen Gunther, which you need for balance.
-Scarlet Cockrel
The Clark Family
> Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
> from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
> performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
> Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
James, what have I ever done to deserve such a comment?
James Jorden
The Clark Family wrote:
> James, what have I ever done to deserve such a comment?
I apologize for making you the butt of that joke, but, honestly, how can
you think Keenlyside could sing Hagen? The suggestion is no more absurd
than the others I offered in jest.
James Jorden
Scarlet Cockrel wrote:
> James, I pity you in that you cannot see things from other people's
> points of view (do you really have nothing better to do on this
> newsgroup?); but I wish that you would at least look at the facts of
> what you post before sending it here. Keenlyside is a baritone,
Which is to say, he is not a bass.
> but
> hardly an exclusively "lyrical" one. If you have not had the chance to
> hear him in any truly dramatic roles, check out his Mercutio with the
> Alagnas.
Mercutio is a lyric baritone role.
> As for Gheorghiu as Bruennhilde, I doubt she would be a first
> choice, both because of her own vocal style and ability with the German
> language, she might manage to pull it off someday. As for Upshaw as
> Gutrune, I see no problem except a slight danger of her volume not being
> that of the chosen Gunther, which you need for balance.
Go away, Mr. Bollman, you bore me.
Brian Newhouse
In article <3561D26A...@mediaone.net>, Scarlet Cockrel
<coc...@mediaone.net> wrote:
"> Assuming, of course, that Mr. Keenlyside makes that tricky transition
"> from high lyric baritone to dramatic bass. Perhaps this same
"> performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde and Siegfried, and
"> Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
"
"James, I pity you in that you cannot see things from other people's
"points of view (do you really have nothing better to do on this
"newsgroup?); but I wish that you would at least look at the facts of
"what you post before sending it here. Keenlyside is a baritone, but
"hardly an exclusively "lyrical" one. If you have not had the chance to
"hear him in any truly dramatic roles, check out his Mercutio with the
"Alagnas...
Mercutio may be a "truly dramatic role" in the theatrical sense; but the
Cockrel confuses the dramatic sense with the vocal sense. Gounod's music
for Mercutio still does not require the weight of voice and sheer stamina
characteristic of the dramatic baritone proper. Not to mention the whole
question of tessitura; the occasional high baritones may venture downwards
into Heldenbariton territory--consider Fischer-Dieskau--but they don't
become full-scale basses.
"As for Gheorghiu as Bruennhilde, I doubt she would be a first
"choice, both because of her own vocal style and ability with the German
"language, she might manage to pull it off someday.
But would Gheorghiu command the dramatic persona to pull it off and make
up for a voice that will always be less weighty than has been customary
for a Bruennhilde? From Violetta, let alone from conventional ingenue
roles such as Micaela and Juliette, to Bruennhilde is quite a stretch.
And frankly, Upshaw, who's at her most dramatically comfortable away from
conventional romantic or soubrette roles, would be more capable of such a
dramatic stretch.
"As for Upshaw as
"Gutrune, I see no problem except a slight danger of her volume not being
"that of the chosen Gunther, which you need for balance.
"
In other words, we really _will_ have to get Sanford Sylvan as Gunther to
balance Upshaw. Or has it become Ruth Ann Swenson since last I checked?
--
Brian Newhouse
newh...@newton.crisp.net
Charles Bollman
Wrong again Crisco boy. Scarlet Cockrel and I are not the same person.This
is easily discoverable by right-clicking on the post header, clicking on
Properties, then on Details, then on Message Source.
However, I do want to compliment SC on his (or her, if that be the case)
ability to recognize a mean-spirited pedant, and for having the grit to
point it out.
--
Ciao Babes!
Charles Bollman
James Jorden wrote in message <35624E...@ix.netcom.com>...
>Scarlet Cockrel wrote:
>
>> James, I pity you in that you cannot see things from other people's
>> points of view (do you really have nothing better to do on this
>> newsgroup?); but I wish that you would at least look at the facts of
>> what you post before sending it here. Keenlyside is a baritone,
>
>Which is to say, he is not a bass.
>
>> but
>> hardly an exclusively "lyrical" one. If you have not had the chance to
>> hear him in any truly dramatic roles, check out his Mercutio with the
>> Alagnas.
>
>Mercutio is a lyric baritone role.
>
>> As for Gheorghiu as Bruennhilde, I doubt she would be a first
>> choice, both because of her own vocal style and ability with the German
>> language, she might manage to pull it off someday. As for Upshaw as
>> Gutrune, I see no problem except a slight danger of her volume not being
>> that of the chosen Gunther, which you need for balance.
>
no...@m.com
On Wed, 20 May 1998, Charles Bollman wrote:
> Wrong again Crisco boy. Scarlet Cockrel and I are not the same
> person.This is easily discoverable by right-clicking on the post
> header, clicking on Properties, then on Details, then on Message
> Source.
I hate when people do this!
You are so confident that all readers of this ng is using exactly the
same news-reader as you are, you don't even bother to mention which OS
you are using ... If you for some reason have to point out how to do
something in a particular news reader, PLS mention what news reader
you are referring to, and what OS you are using. (Even though it is
stated in the header that you are using "Microsoft Outlook Express
4.71.1712.3", people in need of the information you gave would have a
hard time finding the X-Newsreader field as well.)
But because of the variety of news readers used it would be better
to say that the information is to be read in the header.
Regards
Fredrik <fax_at_df.lth.se> "_at_" == "@"
James Jorden
Charles Bollman wrote:
>
> Wrong again Crisco boy. Scarlet Cockrel and I are not the same person.
[etc etc etc]
Unless, of course, you are using more than one ISP.
I mean what I say, Mr. Bollman. You bore me. Go away.
Jacob
I consider the question whether Mr. Bollman is the same person as Mr.
Cockrel as the most *BORING* issue of today for this newsgroup.
Jacob
JDavis6627
>I consider the question whether Mr. Bollman is the same person as Mr.
>Cockrel as the most *BORING* issue of today for this newsgroup.
Ah, but the day's not over yet! More ennui to come, I'm sure.
Jon Davis
"Living well is the best revenge"
Oscar Wilde
Charles Bollman
James Jorden wrote
>Charles Bollman wrote:
>>
>> Wrong again Crisco boy. Scarlet Cockrel and I are not the same person.
>
>[etc etc etc]
>
>Unless, of course, you are using more than one ISP.
>
>I mean what I say, Mr. Bollman. You bore me. Go away.
Couldn"t help noticing that you deleted the "mean-spirited pedant" part of
my post. Oh, well.
As to the ISP matter-apparently I over estimated your knowledge (as many are
wont to do). Back when you were counseling this group on how to sabotage
Sara Freeman's access you managed to make it appear that you possessed a
modicum of technical knowledge. But I guess that was just more smoke and
mirrors, Crisco boy.
By the way, if I bore you just ignore me.
The Clark Family
> Perhaps this same performance might feature the Alagnas as Brunnhilde > and Siegfried, and Dawn Upshaw as Gutrune.
Once again, James, you amaze me. WHere have you found all this out?
I am not sure whether Gheorghiu should be tackling Bruennhilde, her
voice seems to light. Then again, people said the same thing about early
Altmeyer, who made a fine Bruennhilde for Janowski. Again, I am
skeptical as to whether Roberto can handle Siegfried, but his repetorie
is spilling into the more dramatic roles swifly, so who knows? I just
hope that the couples German is ready. As for Upshaw as Gutrune, I can't
wait. I find her voice to be very similar to my favorite Gutrune's,
Clair Watson. With luck she may leave a similar impression on me!