Weekend treat -- Tchaikovsky Piano Concerto no. 1

[dk]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k__-8BjKBFg
Warning to Arri: the piano is out of tune
and the orchestra is far from the best!
Enjoy!
dk

[dk]

This MP is not Russian! ;-)

dk

[HT]

> This MP is not Russian! ;-)

Interesting. It reminded me of Horowitz/Toscanini. <g>

Henk

[dk]

On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 3:14:00 PM UTC-7, HT wrote:
> > This MP is not Russian! ;-)
>
> Interesting. It reminded me of Horowitz/Toscanini. <g>

Thanks for listening. It does
remind one of Horror/Tosca.
However this is not Horowitz.

dk

[dk]

BTW this quiz should be rather easy to
solve. Not many pianists can play this
fast and not skip over the smallest of
details. This MP is a towering genius!

Should I upload another piano concerto
by the same MP?

dk

[dk]

I have just uploaded a Grieg concerto by
the same pianist, IMHO the finest ever
recorded. It leaves Lipatti and everyone
else in the dust! It almost makes one
smell the codfish and the breeze in
the fjords! If this doesn't cure one
of chronic Lipattitis, nothing will ;-)

dk

[dk]

Oops! I got so carried away that I forgot
to post the link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exjk5NmrOBA

dk

[AB]

nothing much wrong with the orchestra. winds are in tune, flute solo is very nice and the conductor must be very skilled to have followed this maniac.
the pianist became unhinged in the last movement. the octaves at the end sounded very labored . there were some 'fun moments' but there is a little more beauty to the music than he allowed.. The piano was absolutely the worst i have ever heard (but the pianist did not deserve better), it matched his playing:-))) Maybe an outdoor concert or a piano competition where there was no time to prepare the instrument?

Beter off hearing Horowitz's live with Bruno Walter, 1948 IIRC. there is genuine excitement and musicality at the same time.
a lot of this playing is bullshit IMO

AB

[AB]

but H. was a true musician.... this pianist has a screw loose.....

AB

[AB]

the was enuf skipping of details..... maybe you did not notice, but i hoid them clearly.......

AB

[dk]

On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 5:59:09 PM UTC-7, AB wrote:
> On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 6:14:00 PM UTC-4, HT wrote:
> > > This MP is not Russian! ;-)
> >
> > Interesting. It reminded me of Horowitz/Toscanini. <g>
>

> but H. was a true musician....
> this pianist has a screw loose.....

Only one?

dk

[christian....@gmail.com]

Den söndag 23 oktober 2016 kl. 02:59:09 UTC+2 skrev AB:
> but H. was a true musician.... this pianist has a screw loose.....

I'm just getting more and more curious about this.

[dk]

On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 5:58:05 PM UTC-7, AB wrote:
> On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 5:34:55 PM UTC-4, dk wrote:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k__-8BjKBFg
> > Warning to Arri: the piano is out of tune
> > and the orchestra is far from the best!
>

> nothing much wrong with the orchestra. winds are in tune,
> flute solo is very nice and the conductor must be very
> skilled to have followed this maniac. the pianist became
> unhinged in the last movement. the octaves at the end
> sounded very labored . there were some 'fun moments'
> but there is a little more beauty to the music than he
> allowed..

Then try the Grieg PC by the same pianist.

> The piano was absolutely the worst i have ever heard

Rest assured the piano in the next quiz Tony or I will
post will be even worse.... ;-)

dk

[AB]

more tolerable. the 1st movt. cadenza was very well crafted. he adds lots of little extra turns which I enjoy.... also a lot of 'free expression' which one can accept or reject depending on the mood...
this is not better than Lipatti, it is a n totally diferent approach full of excitement but very little 'nobility or grandeur'. this is all abuot the pianist not the music

AB

[dk]

> more tolerable. the 1st movt. cadenza was very
> well crafted. he adds lots of little extra
> turns which I enjoy.... also a lot of 'free
> expression' which one can accept or reject
> depending on the mood...

Thanks for listening. If you think this is
merely "tolerable", please provide a link
to a better performance.

dk

[Kerrison]

Hmmm ... There's something very fishy about the sound, both of the piano and the orchestra. I will only say that wonders can be done these days with electronic jiggery-pokery, just as it can in the case of photographs with photo-shop ... In fact, I'll go out on a limb and will be very happy to be proved wrong but I don't think a pianist and orchestra are involved in this at all!

[dk]

> Hmmm ... There's something very fishy about the
> sound, both of the piano and the orchestra.

It is an old recording.

> I will only say that wonders can be done these
> days with electronic jiggery-pokery, just as it
> can in the case of photographs with photo-shop ...

Sorry, I don't play such games.

> In fact, I'll go out on a limb and will be very
> happy to be proved wrong but I don't think a
> pianist and orchestra are involved in this at
> all!

Are you planning to vote for Trump? Suspecting
the pianist and the orchestra are undocumented
musicians? ;-)

dk

[Kerrison]

Well, click this link and see what you think! ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR8CsIcdnHE

If I'm wrong about this "computerised concerto" then kindly come up with the name of the pianist, the orchestra, the conductor, the record label and date of the recording and I'll duly accept your findings with great pleasure!

[dk]

This is a quiz. Sooner or later someone will
figure out who is/was the mystery pianist
and all the details will be revealed. The
recording is from the 1940s and was made
in the US with a major orchestra under a
well known conductor.

dk

[dk]

Someone has actually identified the pianist and
e-mailed me privately. He graciously agreed to
keep it under his hat for a short while and let
the quiz run a little longer to give others a
chance to find the answer.

dk

[dk]

On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 5:59:09 PM UTC-7, AB wrote:

> On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 6:14:00 PM UTC-4, HT wrote:
> > > This MP is not Russian! ;-)
> >
> > Interesting. It reminded me of Horowitz/Toscanini. <g>
>

> but H. was a true musician.... this pianist has a screw loose.....

I have just uploaded a Chopin etude by the same pianist
so you can try to find more loose screws... Good luck!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRAmznLwa34

dk

[Frank Berger]

Somebody made a guess of Oscar Levant long ago (in this
thread, not just private e-mail) and you didn't respond.
I'm going to second that guess.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[AB]

the rest of the screws were so loose that they already fell out, therefore only one is left:-)

AB

[AB]

> >
> > nothing much wrong with the orchestra. winds are in tune,
> > flute solo is very nice and the conductor must be very
> > skilled to have followed this maniac. the pianist became
> > unhinged in the last movement. the octaves at the end
> > sounded very labored . there were some 'fun moments'
> > but there is a little more beauty to the music than he
> > allowed..
>
> Then try the Grieg PC by the same pianist.
>
> > The piano was absolutely the worst i have ever heard
>
> Rest assured the piano in the next quiz Tony or I will
> post will be even worse.... ;-)
>
> dk

glad to see that you guys cater to your customers' needs, your kindness is much appreciated:-))

AB

AB

[AB]

if i can find it, i have a live Grosvenor somewhere that is much more 'normal' and technically superior...

AB

[AB]

> This is a quiz. Sooner or later someone will
> figure out who is/was the mystery pianist
> and all the details will be revealed. The
> recording is from the 1940s and was made
> in the US with a major orchestra under a
> well known conductor.
>
> dk

Dan ,

why did you say that the orchestra is 'far from the best' when you say above that this is a 'major orchestra'....... very misleading. It is quite clear that this is a good group, well conducted as I have already said........
please be careful when you speak:-)

AB

[AB]

exciting but not that clean, like the concertos.

could this be Mark Hambourg

AB

[AB]

wonder if he had that kind of technique.
AB

[Frank Berger]

Hello? Hello?

[Gerard]

"Frank Berger" wrote in message
news:V-udnTUsQ79BbJHF...@supernews.com...

========================

Hi.

[Kerrison]

Unsurprisingly, the Molto Eduardo "Mystery Pianist" recording of the Grieg is also on You Tube under the real pianist's name. However, as this is seemingly an on-going quiz (I think) I won't spoil the fun, other than to say that switching between the two reveals the identity straight away. In particular, Mr Berger will be interested when the name is revealed!

[dk]

On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 9:25:15 AM UTC-7, AB wrote:
> > This is a quiz. Sooner or later someone will
> > figure out who is/was the mystery pianist
> > and all the details will be revealed. The
> > recording is from the 1940s and was made
> > in the US with a major orchestra under a
> > well known conductor.
>

> why did you say that the orchestra is 'far
> from the best' when you say above that this
> is a 'major orchestra'....... very misleading.

Far from the best in this particular recording.

dk

[dk]

On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 10:22:42 AM UTC-7, Frank Berger wrote:
> On 10/23/2016 9:40 AM, Frank Berger wrote:
> > On 10/23/2016 5:34 AM, dk wrote:
> >> On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 5:59:09 PM UTC-7, AB
> >> wrote:
> >>> On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 6:14:00 PM UTC-4, HT
> >>> wrote:
> >>>>> This MP is not Russian! ;-)
> >>>>
> >>>> Interesting. It reminded me of Horowitz/Toscanini.
> >>>> <g>
> >>>
> >>> but H. was a true musician.... this pianist has a screw
> >>> loose.....
> >>
> >> I have just uploaded a Chopin etude by the same pianist
> >> so you can try to find more loose screws... Good luck!
> >>
> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRAmznLwa34
> >

> > Somebody made a guess of Oscar Levant long ago (in this
> > thread, not just private e-mail) and you didn't respond.
> > I'm going to second that guess.
>

> Hello? Hello?

Good morning. People need to sleep sometimes,
don't they? John Gavin was actually the first
to correctly identify Henry Orient as the MP.
He graciously agreed to keep this quiet for a
few more spins and removed the message. Thanks,
John for being such a good sport!

The MP in this quiz is Henry Orient. He was
one of the best known American pianists from
roughly 1930 to 1970. He was often compared
to Rubinstein and Horowitz. He had his own
radio and TV shows, and more books written
about him during his lifetime than any
other pianist -- including 3 he wrote
himself!

The Tchaikovsky concerto was recorded in a
single take in 1947 with the Philadelphia
orchestra under Eugene Normandy. The Grieg
was also recorded in 1947 with the NYPO
under Efrem Kurtz -- there however more
recorded versions with other orchestras
and conductors.

Last but not list, Orient was as famous
for his mordant wit as he was for his
acting and for his piano playing. He
was an astute political commentator
who clairvoyantly said about the 2016
election: "The only difference between
the Democrats and the Republicans is
that the Democrats allow the poor to
be corrupt, too".

Hats off to Henry! ;-)

dk

[dk]

The quiz is obviously over. Thanks to John Gavin
and to everyone else who listened and tried to
guess Henry's identity! As you point out, both
recordings are on YT. Hope you enjoy them.

dk

[dk]

On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 9:12:36 AM UTC-7, AB wrote:
> > >
> > > nothing much wrong with the orchestra. winds are in tune,
> > > flute solo is very nice and the conductor must be very
> > > skilled to have followed this maniac. the pianist became
> > > unhinged in the last movement. the octaves at the end
> > > sounded very labored . there were some 'fun moments'
> > > but there is a little more beauty to the music than he
> > > allowed..
> >
> > Then try the Grieg PC by the same pianist.
> >
> > > The piano was absolutely the worst i have ever heard
> >
> > Rest assured the piano in the next quiz Tony or I will
> > post will be even worse.... ;-)
>

> glad to see that you guys cater to your customers' needs,
> your kindness is much appreciated:-))

We're looking for a cylinder! ;-)

dk

[dk]

IMHO Henry Orient's greatest performance is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiB5oiH8ADI

dk

[HT]

> IMHO Henry Orient's greatest performance is:
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiB5oiH8ADI

A real surprise. Levant was a far better pianist than I imagined. Even after revisiting his Tchaikovsky reminds me of Horowitz/Toscanini. In particular the opening of the last movement.

Thanks!

Henk

[Frank Berger]

As John's guess was not public, I demand co-credit for
solving the "problem."

Levant was quite a character. I have many memories of him
with Johnny Carson and other talk shows. Always entertaining.

I never saw the film "The World of Henry Orient." Is it
worthwhile?

[dk]

How much credit? Would you accept treasury bonds? ;-)

> Levant was quite a character.

Levant was more than one character! ;-)

> I have many memories of him with Johnny Carson
> and other talk shows. Always entertaining.
>
> I never saw the film "The World of Henry Orient."
> Is it worthwhile?

Reviews on Amazon and various film boards are
quite favorable.

dk

[dk]

Levant was often compared with Horowitz and with
Rubinstein. He had a composer's understanding of
the music he played, which is quite rare in an
industry dominated by performers who are just
actors. Have you listened to the Chopin Etude
also posted? He brings out all the lines in a
way one does not hear often, even though he is
not quite as secure technically as Richter or
Cziffra. Another definitive performance is
Khachaturian's piano concerto:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Byhpz6w7Ww
Hope you like it!

dk

[dk]

On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 1:17:58 PM UTC-7, HT wrote:

> > IMHO Henry Orient's greatest performance is:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiB5oiH8ADI
>
> A real surprise. Levant was a far better pianist
> than I imagined.

Take a look at this transcription:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmxOG2uO1hQ

dk

[Frank Berger]

Federal Reserve notes will do.

[Frank Berger]

Lack of practice could account for technical deficiencies,
couldn't it? Obviously he has plenty of musicality. Would
his mental state allow much practice? Just speculating.

[dk]

On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 2:02:04 PM UTC-7, Frank Berger wrote:
> On 10/23/2016 4:47 PM, dk wrote:
> > On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 1:17:58 PM UTC-7, HT
> > wrote:
> >>> IMHO Henry Orient's greatest performance is:
> >>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aiB5oiH8ADI
> >>
> >> A real surprise. Levant was a far better pianist than I
> >> imagined. Even after revisiting his Tchaikovsky reminds
> >> me of Horowitz/Toscanini. In particular the opening of
> >> the last movement.
> >
> > Levant was often compared with Horowitz and with
> > Rubinstein. He had a composer's understanding of the
> > music he played, which is quite rare in an industry
> > dominated by performers who are just actors. Have you
> > listened to the Chopin Etude also posted? He brings out
> > all the lines in a way one does not hear often, even
> > though he is not quite as secure technically as Richter
> > or Cziffra. Another definitive performance is
> > Khachaturian's piano concerto:
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Byhpz6w7Ww
>

> Lack of practice could account for technical deficiencies,
> couldn't it? Obviously he has plenty of musicality. Would
> his mental state allow much practice? Just speculating.

No need to speculate about his mental state. Orient had
multiple careers: composer, show host, actor, etc.. and
he did not have as much time to practice as a full time
concert pianist. Otherwise his technique was spectacular,
if not quite as polished as Rubinstein's or Horowitz. A
similar lack of ultimate polish is noticeable in the
recordings of famous piano teachers like Goldenweiser,
Neuhaus, Igumnov, Boulanger, etc...

dk

[dk]

Hhmmm.... Even from the treasury of a
nation that has almost $20T debt ?!?

dk

[Frank Berger]

I love it when I talk about something I know nothing about
and am right!

[Frank Berger]

I'm an optimist. And I will take any position that
contradicts those of the conspiracy nuts.

[AB]

you must be in love 24/7.

AB

[AB]

> No need to speculate about his mental state. Orient had
> multiple careers: composer, show host, actor, etc.. and
> he did not have as much time to practice as a full time
> concert pianist. Otherwise his technique was spectacular,
> if not quite as polished as Rubinstein's or Horowitz. A
> similar lack of ultimate polish is noticeable in the
> recordings of famous piano teachers like Goldenweiser,
> Neuhaus, Igumnov, Boulanger, etc...
>
> dk

to say Rubintein had a 'polished technique' ia a bit of an exaggeration... he never was a meticulous technician like Liipatti, Pollini, or the other typists....

[Tony]

On Monday, 24 October 2016 00:11:49 UTC+3, dk wrote:
>
> Hhmmm.... Even from the treasury of a
> nation that has almost $20T debt ?!?
>
> dk

We're going to find a way to get Frank some SDRs and top them up with a few bitcoins ;)

Oscar Levant is new to me. Thanks for an interesting introduction.

[dk]

On Monday, October 24, 2016 at 12:08:09 AM UTC-7, Tony wrote:
> On Monday, 24 October 2016 00:11:49 UTC+3, dk wrote:
> >
> > Hhmmm.... Even from the treasury of a
> > nation that has almost $20T debt ?!?
>

> We're going to find a way to get Frank some
> SDRs and top them up with a few bitcoins ;)

Or rubles? ;-)

> Oscar Levant is new to me.

?!? He was VERY famous.

> Thanks for an interesting introduction.

My pleasure. Great pianists can be as easily
forgotten without being sent to labor camps.

dk

[dk]

On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 2:50:00 PM UTC-7, Frank Berger wrote:
>
> I love it when I talk about something I
> know nothing about and am right!

Trumpism? ;-)

dk

[O]

In article <ea9b2f5a-4858-457b...@googlegroups.com>, dk
<dan....@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 2:06:01 AM UTC-7, Kerrison wrote:
> > On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 9:51:06 AM UTC+1, dk wrote:
> > > On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 1:31:36 AM UTC-7, Kerrison wrote:
> > > > On Sunday, October 23, 2016 at 2:59:23 AM UTC+1, dk wrote:
> > > > > On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 6:29:37 PM UTC-7, AB wrote:
> > > > > > On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 8:05:41 PM UTC-4, dk wrote:
> > > > > > > On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 5:02:06 PM UTC-7, dk wrote:
> > > > > > > > On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 3:57:36 PM UTC-7, dk wrote:
> > > > > > > > > On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 3:22:44 PM UTC-7, dk wrote:

> > > > > > > > > > On Saturday, October 22, 2016 at 3:14:00 PM UTC-7, HT wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > > > This MP is not Russian! ;-)
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Interesting. It reminded me of Horowitz/Toscanini. <g>
> > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > Thanks for listening. It does
> > > > > > > > > > remind one of Horror/Tosca.
> > > > > > > > > > However this is not Horowitz.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > BTW this quiz should be rather easy to
> > > > > > > > > solve. Not many pianists can play this
> > > > > > > > > fast and not skip over the smallest of
> > > > > > > > > details. This MP is a towering genius!
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Should I upload another piano concerto
> > > > > > > > > by the same MP?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I have just uploaded a Grieg concerto by
> > > > > > > > the same pianist, IMHO the finest ever
> > > > > > > > recorded. It leaves Lipatti and everyone
> > > > > > > > else in the dust! It almost makes one
> > > > > > > > smell the codfish and the breeze in
> > > > > > > > the fjords! If this doesn't cure one
> > > > > > > > of chronic Lipattitis, nothing will ;-)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Oops! I got so carried away that I forgot
> > > > > > > to post the link:
> > > > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exjk5NmrOBA
> > > > > >
> > > > > > more tolerable. the 1st movt. cadenza was very
> > > > > > well crafted. he adds lots of little extra
> > > > > > turns which I enjoy.... also a lot of 'free
> > > > > > expression' which one can accept or reject
> > > > > > depending on the mood...
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks for listening. If you think this is
> > > > > merely "tolerable", please provide a link
> > > > > to a better performance.
> > > >
> > > > Hmmm ... There's something very fishy about the
> > > > sound, both of the piano and the orchestra.
> > >
> > > It is an old recording.
> > >
> > > > I will only say that wonders can be done these
> > > > days with electronic jiggery-pokery, just as it
> > > > can in the case of photographs with photo-shop ...
> > >
> > > Sorry, I don't play such games.
> > >
> > > > In fact, I'll go out on a limb and will be very
> > > > happy to be proved wrong but I don't think a
> > > > pianist and orchestra are involved in this at
> > > > all!
> > >
> > > Are you planning to vote for Trump? Suspecting
> > > the pianist and the orchestra are undocumented
> > > musicians? ;-)
> > >
> > > dk
> >
> > Well, click this link and see what you think! ...
> >
> > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR8CsIcdnHE
> >
> > If I'm wrong about this "computerised concerto"
> > then kindly come up with the name of the pianist,
> > the orchestra, the conductor, the record label
> > and date of the recording and I'll duly accept
> > your findings with great pleasure!

>
> This is a quiz. Sooner or later someone will
> figure out who is/was the mystery pianist
> and all the details will be revealed. The
> recording is from the 1940s and was made
> in the US with a major orchestra under a
> well known conductor.
>

> dk
>

The pianist was Alan Turing, and it was played on a Turing Machine. The
orchestra was composed of members of MI-5, and it was recorded at
Bletchley Park.

-Owen

P.S. The record label was "NP-Complete Records" whose only retail
outlet were traveling salesmen.

-O, OK, I'll stop the computer science insider jokes.

[christian....@gmail.com]

Den måndag 24 oktober 2016 kl. 17:16:36 UTC+2 skrev O:
> P.S. The record label was "NP-Complete Records" whose only retail
> outlet were traveling salesmen.

:D

[Tony]

On Monday, 24 October 2016 10:58:09 UTC+3, dk wrote:
>
> ?!? He was VERY famous.
>

okay but even his fame cannot persuade me to listen to what I don't want to hear :)

....I didn't know he played Chopin.....

[dk]

Orient had a vast repertoire. Including the
Khachaturian concerto some think definitive.

dk