11 Ball Record (video)
Alex Barron
about year since i first flashed it
and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
Alex
--
----== posted via www.jugglingdb.com ==----
Jack Denger
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
Dude, go for the qualify! One catch away from the world record! that made
my day,
sick.
ChrisHagadol
qualify it!!!
KooKie
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
What a coincidence! I was looking through the records today, and I wonder
why I've never heard of you. Your records are right there with Peter,
Jason, etc...
Beastly!
Massacre
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
Would be cool to see a new name beetween old world record holders. ;)
Peter Bone
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
Very nice pattern. I hope this becomes official. This is just what I need
to start working on the qualify again. Have you tried 12 or 13?
Pete
AndyB
Congratulations - now for the qualify?!? Oh, and a better background would
be nice!
Alex Barron
>
> Alex Barron wrote:
> >
> > I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> > about year since i first flashed it
> > and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
> >
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
> >
> > Alex
>
> Very nice pattern. I hope this becomes official. This is just what I need
> to start working on the qualify again. Have you tried 12 or 13?
> Pete
>
Thanks and good luck with qualify. I've tried 12 a number of times and
have come close to a flash with
the async pattern so hopefully i can get that by the end of the summer.
I'm yet to have a proper go at
13 but with some help from your article i've managed to work out a decent
grip to use and so i should
make some progress. How much harder was flashing 13 compared to your 18
catches of 11?
Michał
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
I don't know what is more amazing. Your current record or the extremly
fast progress.
And requests if I could: Background+slow-mo:)
Michal
Colin E.
It strikes me as a little funny that even at your level you are still
asking the question "how much harder is N+1, or N+2".
Seriously though, fantastic video, great pattern and good luck to you :-)
Colin E.
Peter Bone
>
> Alex Barron wrote:
> >
> > Peter Bone wrote:
> > >
> > > Alex Barron wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this
> for
> > > > about year since i first flashed it
> > > > and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
> > > >
> > > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
> > > >
> > > > Alex
> > >
> > > Very nice pattern. I hope this becomes official. This is just what I need
> > > to start working on the qualify again. Have you tried 12 or 13?
> > > Pete
> > >
> >
> > Thanks and good luck with qualify. I've tried 12 a number of times and
> > have come close to a flash with
> > the async pattern so hopefully i can get that by the end of the summer.
> > I'm yet to have a proper go at
> > 13 but with some help from your article i've managed to work out a decent
> > grip to use and so i should
> > make some progress. How much harder was flashing 13 compared to your 18
> > catches of 11?
>
> It strikes me as a little funny that even at your level you are still
> asking the question "how much harder is N+1, or N+2".
It's difficult for him to get an idea unless he's made serious attempts at
13. Knowing how much harder 11 is than 9 doesn't really give an idea
either.
It's difficult to compare 18 catches with 11 and the 13 flash because
they're so different and it's dependant on the individuals physiology.
Also, one is more dependant on luck than the other. For me I would say
that 13 took a bit less effort but with a bit more luck.
Pete
Mats1
>
> Alex Barron wrote:
> >
> > I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> > about year since i first flashed it
> > and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
> >
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
> >
> > Alex
> >
17 on camera? Is this your best run? Great stuff in the video and I will
very much look forward to seeing your continued improvement!
Boppo
So, how many people will I piss off by posting this link?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WIdWu5LXb4
Wow! (Even though there's no music, it's just one trick with no
connections, not even qualifying ... sheesh! He doesn't even qualify
8 in this run (meaning, 8 balls thrown and caught twice).)
But still, wow! I go for this sort of stuff even if others don't.
Good background, too!
-boppo
Little Paul
>
> So, how many people will I piss off by posting this link?
>
I didn't expect such behaviour from you.
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
Boppo
> On 2010-08-20, Boppo <btiem...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > So, how many people will I piss off by posting this link?
>
> >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOU8GIRUd_g
>
> I didn't expect such behaviour from you.
>
> -Paul
> --http://paulseward.com
Yeah, I know.
It's almost like I'm becoming ... The Spanish Inquisition!!
-boppo
Peter Bone
> Good background, too!
I'm so happy to have found this place for filming (N50.870249,E0.017166).
It's a few minutes walk from my house, big white wall for a background,
quiet (apart from trains), nice green area for juggling on and for
positioning the camera. I think that finding the right location is very
important for this kind of thing.
Pete
Mats1
>
> But still, wow! I go for this sort of stuff even if others don't.
>
> Good background, too!
>
> -boppo
Amazing! Looks like one of you is going to qualify this soon!
Michał
The battle has begun...
Boppo
wrote:
>
> - Show quoted text -
I think you both misunderstood me. By saying "I go for this, even if
others don't" I meant, I go for watching videos with short clips of
single tricks, with no connections, no music, no long runs, etc. ...
even if others don't.
But ... am I secretly training to qualify 11 balls ? Bwahahahaha ....
-boppo
Phil Vermehren
>
> Boppo wrote:
> > Good background, too!
>
> I'm so happy to have found this place for filming (N50.870249,E0.017166).
> It's a few minutes walk from my house, big white wall for a background,
> quiet (apart from trains), nice green area for juggling on and for
> positioning the camera. I think that finding the right location is very
> important for this kind of thing.
> Pete
>
It just looks so amazing, seeing a pattern like that up in the air! I
give you a few weeks to get the qualify...sound fair?
Thanar
to qualify 11 balls, trading off record-breaking runs every 3 days or so:
Aug 16 - Alex Barron - 17 catches -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
Aug 19 - Peter Bone - 18 catches -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WIdWu5LXb4
Aug 23 - Alex Barron - 19 catches -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b9405uteA8
I never thought I'd see a Juggling world record "steel cage match" like
this!
Jason Quinn
AHHHHH... and I can't see them because China blocks youtube... :-(
Jason
VincentCarter
a
week!
Keep it up Alex!
Same for you peter!
Boppo
wrote:
Then I feel obliged to plug JugglingTV: Peter and Alex, please also
upload your videos to JTV, out of consideration for our Chinese
pals.
-boppo (who doesn't even know whether JTV is also blocked in China)
Jason Quinn
> -boppo (who doesn't even know whether JTV is also blocked in China)
It's not. The filter system also seems to trigger on random pages
depending on keyword combinations, so as long as the titles don't contain
any such combination, the videos will be viewable.
JugglingdotTV
> > > In case anyone isn't aware, Alex Barron and Peter Bone are now in a race
> > > to qualify 11 balls, trading off record-breaking runs every 3 days or so:
> >
> > > Aug 16 - Alex Barron - 17 catches -
> > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
> > > Aug 19 - Peter Bone - 18 catches -
> > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WIdWu5LXb4
> > > Aug 23 - Alex Barron - 19 catches -
> > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b9405uteA8
> >
> > > I never thought I'd see a Juggling world record "steel cage match" like
> > > this!
> >
> > AHHHHH... and I can't see them because China blocks youtube... :-(
> >
> > Jason
>
> upload your videos to JTV, out of consideration for our Chinese
> pals.
Hear hear!
JTV
_don't watch _be seen _ http://juggling.tv
Vince
about the idea of 8 and 9...
Makes you feel kind of small...
Hahah.
Good luck guys!
Little Paul
> I felt I was impressive now that I've just started getting more serious
> about the idea of 8 and 9...
>
> Makes you feel kind of small...
Go and watch some "expertvillage" videos on youtube, you'll feel a lot
better about yourself.
-Paul
--
http://paulseward.com
Michał
Ehh, and all those wikipedias and other record databases need to be
updated...
This guy is outstanding!!!
TK
--
TK ~ aka Terry Kimpling
http://wejuggle2.com/circusskills.php learn/make juggle/balance equipment
Adam Rowney
Ahaha, I came across one of those again recently,
and had to laugh :P
Brook Roberts
The Void
> > In case anyone isn't aware, Alex Barron and Peter Bone are now in a race
> > to qualify 11 balls, trading off record-breaking runs every 3 days or so:
> >
> > Aug 16 - Alex Barron - 17 catches -
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
> > Aug 19 - Peter Bone - 18 catches -
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WIdWu5LXb4
> > Aug 23 - Alex Barron - 19 catches -
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b9405uteA8
>
Rejoice... Alex has seen the light:
http://juggling.tv/video/4516/11-balls-21-catches
..oh, and got 21 catches.
The Void
...........
A bit partial
--
TLMB tees & hoodies: www.tlmb.net/tees : 18 designs
Tobias
>
>>> Aug 16 - Alex Barron - 17 catches -
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>>> Aug 19 - Peter Bone - 18 catches -
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WIdWu5LXb4
>>> Aug 23 - Alex Barron - 19 catches -
>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b9405uteA8
>
> http://juggling.tv/video/4516/11-balls-21-catches
I'll admit widescreen has its applications, but why don't any of these
high pattern people turn their camera to use more pixels for the pattern
and less for the (usually boring) background?
--
Tobias
jimhatfield
The Void
> > > http://juggling.tv/video/4516/11-balls-21-catches
> > I'll admit widescreen has its
> applications, but why don't any of
> these
> > high pattern people turn their
> camera to use more pixels for the
> pattern
> > and less for the (usually boring)
> background?
Probably because all online video players are landscape oriented,
therefore if they did film sideways, the pattern would end up looking much
smaller in the player anyway. Plus it's a bit of a hassle to rotate it in
the editing program.
> slo-mo wud b gud 2 !
The JTV player has a slo-mo button.
The Void
...........
Disemvoweling heretics
--
TLMB tees & hoodies: www.tlmb.net/tees : 18 designs
--
wikipedo
since alex always seems to chase after the last catch he would run out of
the
screen if he did that.
Could you imagine qualifying it and then seeing you didn't got it on tape.
Wikipedo.
biztheclown
This whole thread is just awesome. What an exciting thing to be
witnessing. Keep at it Alex and Peter!
Brook Roberts
Well, given his apparent preference for odd numbers of catches, he'd get
the 22
on video. 23 would be greedy!
Jay Linn
<devil...@hotmail.com.nospam.com> wrote:
<snip>
> Aug 25 - Alex Barron - 21 catches -
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPmAWY1dAaE
I just watched that a few times, and I counted seventeen catches every
time. I even tried to count throws (there are no drops so throws should
equal catches) which is a bit harder, and that looked like seventeen too.
I have no interest in questioning Alex's achievement (hey, it's only
numbers, not something important ;-), and I'm completely prepared to
believe that my counting is badly at fault, is anyone else actually
counting the catches in these things, or just taking the video title at
face value?
--
Jay Linn
Semper Eadem.
Brook Roberts
I just watched twice, including on juggling.tv in slo-mo, and definitely
counted 11 left hand catches (=21 catches).
But I admit to not at all checking until you said... would have been an
amusing
joke (albeit one requiring rather good juggling)
Jay Linn
<devil...@hotmail.com.nospam.com> wrote:
Thank you, thank you, thank you. It simply hadn't dawned on me to count
either left or right hands alone. I've just watched it twice more, looking
once at the left hand and once at the right, and Hey Presto! Eleven LH
catches and ten RH. Now I'm left wondering why my miscounting was so
reliably wrong. Interesting stuff.
Well done Alex! Come on Peter!
--
Jay Linn
Pah! Loser. He didn't even qualify them!
Iain Murray
>
> On Wed, 25 Aug 2010 20:44:36 +0100, Brook Roberts
> <devil...@hotmail.com.nospam.com> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> > Aug 25 - Alex Barron - 21 catches -
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPmAWY1dAaE
>
> I just watched that a few times, and I counted seventeen catches every
> time.
Interesting. I watched it on youtube and counted seventeen first time. I
then opened the video in vlc and watched it in super-slow motion and it
was *definitely* 21 catches. I then watched it again at full speed and it
looked like seventeen(ish) again... it is incredibly hard to count without
slowing it right down.
Iain.
Ewano
>
> I just watched that a few times, and I counted seventeen catches every
> time. I even tried to count throws (there are no drops so throws should
> equal catches) which is a bit harder, and that looked like seventeen too.
> I have no interest in questioning Alex's achievement (hey, it's only
> numbers, not something important ;-), and I'm completely prepared to
> believe that my counting is badly at fault, is anyone else actually
> counting the catches in these things, or just taking the video title at
> face value?
I played it in *really* slow mo in VLC, and by my count it's 21 catches
with the 20th catch taking about 4 attempts.
Ewano - who wonders if Jay has been down the boozer tonight..
Jay Linn
Alas no. Are you offering to get a round in?
I watched on YT. Despite its high resolution JTV's frame rate is too slow
and jerky, whether at full speed or in slow motion. I need to try looking
at the .flv in VLC, as someone else suggested.
Jason Quinn
> Rejoice... Alex has seen the light:
> http://juggling.tv/video/4516/11-balls-21-catches
>
> ..oh, and got 21 catches.
The force is strong in this one.
Jason
Jason Quinn
>
> I played it in *really* slow mo in VLC, and by my count it's 21 catches
> with the 20th catch taking about 4 attempts.
>
> Ewano
Those weren't attempts. They were 11 ball multiplex throws.
Jason
Miika
> Brook Roberts wrote:
> <snip>
>
> > Aug 25 - Alex Barron - 21 catches -
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CPmAWY1dAaE
>
> I just watched that a few times, and I counted seventeen catches every
> time. I even tried to count throws (there are no drops so throws should
> equal catches) which is a bit harder, and that looked like seventeen too.
> I have no interest in questioning Alex's achievement (hey, it's only
> numbers, not something important ;-), and I'm completely prepared to
> believe that my counting is badly at fault, is anyone else actually
> counting the catches in these things, or just taking the video title at
> face value?
>
I'm sure many of us count these things every time. I recall counting
Thomas' five ball millsmess run to have been particularly stupid to count
and then not writing down the result anywhere.
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgQlXGYGfm4 )
-Miika
--
Siteswaps of the day: (4x,2)* , (4,2x)* , (4x,2x)
Franco187
Hey some of those did help me! Don't make fun of "special needs" jugglers
such as myself...
Norbi
>
> In case anyone isn't aware, Alex Barron and Peter Bone are now in a race
> to qualify 11 balls, trading off record-breaking runs every 3 days or so:
And then what? I don't want to be boring, I am seriously impressed, love
watching numbers, and very happy to be a 'witness' of this event, BUT...
So lets say one of them (I'll have to put my money on Alex) qualifies 11
balls, then what?
Is he really going to put all his effort into becoming a 'solid' 11 ball
juggler, go get super long runs and start doing tricks. I personally doubt
it. Is Pete going to come along and break it by a throw and start
everything up again (possibly, but again I doubt it..and still leaves the
question 'so what?')
I asked Pete once what it was like when he flashed 12 ball the first time,
was he super excited. He said no, he was relieved.
Sure it's going to be a cool event and people will talk about it...for a
week or 2 maybe.
I don't know, maybe I'm weird. Maybe I've become too 'solid on stage only'
performance based. Or maybe I'm just a boring juggling grouch*. But I feel
like this whole 'event' is going to be anti-climactic.
Norbi
-------------------------
* I do spend a lot of time just watching other people, and going to bed
before midnight, at festivals these days..
Michael Falkov
We are at a point in history when one of the most fundamental juggling
techniques (arguably the most
(cascade)) is about the be pushed to a level that it has never before
reached (as far as we know) but
which many people have been anticipating. It is a especially novel time
that we are in the midst of.
That may or may not be interesting to a given person, but it is a fact
that if it does happen (and it
certainly seems like it could - any hour now) it will never happen again,
and we will all be able to say
that we were there participating in the anticipatory activities leading up
to the climax...for whatever
that's worth.
I think it's interesting. I also see how most of the meaning making that
people engage in is more or
less arbitrary. Sure, it might make sense in a given context, which may
include or be limited to a
person's physiological state (especially neurophysiological), but change a
few associations here and
there and all of a sudden important things don't even register on
perceptual radar, or vice versa.
For what it's worth, here are some of the reason's that this event
interests me and seems significant:
-I like to see records broken. My intuition tells me that the limits of
human potential are not close to
being reached in any field and that we have a great deal more optimization
to get through if we
(humanity as represented by exemplary individuals) are to arrive at a
level that could be reasonably
called a limit. When fundamental advancements in a field are achieved, it
can stir things up and lead to
progress and innovation. In this case, I think a side effect of an 11 ball
qualify video out there will be
the facilitation of progress in high numbered juggling for many jugglers
both in term of acquisition
speed and reach, I think this will be especially true for newer jugglers.
- Seeing something done by another person makes me feel much closer to
being able to do it myself. I
intend to qualify 11 balls someday, and having these videos for mental and
physical referencing will
help me achieve that goal.
- Peter released a new video and seemed stimulated by these events. I like
watching his juggling and
keep an eye out for new videos which show it - he has already released
one. Point for me. ;)
I know what it's like to regularly pump time, energy and attention into
achieving something tedious,
highly technically demanding, and personally desirable - upon completion,
you could call my
emotional state relieved, as opposed to excited [1]. My meta-emotional
state is something like
acceptance and understanding of the frustration often encountered in
striving for difficult goals,
tinged with the satisfaction of knowing that I have advanced myself and
will likely benefit for it
(otherwise I probably wouldn't have spent so many resources on the
process). I don't think that my
immediate, primary emotional response negates the significance of such an
achievement.
As for whether or not Alex will continue working on 11 balls to solidify
it - who knows? Alex? Are you
reading this? What do you think? Are you going to go for longer runs? Will
you try other patterns? Do
you intend to push onward to 12, 13, 14, or 15? More, perhaps?
I hope you don't lose your juggling zeal Norbi, I like what you come up
with too - even though I'm not
a ring juggler. :)
Michael
[1] This might be different if the culmination happened at some event with
people around who were
eagerly anticipating it and happy to see it manifest - I would probably
feel more joyful emotions.
Norbi
> a lot of stuff I am going to cut.
You make very good points and I do agree with you pretty much 100%
I also love to see this happen and find numbers very impressive (as stated
in my post).
Also thank you for your kind words. I do still enjoy juggling, and
searching/finding (even if someone else may or may not have done it
before/after/at the same time as me).
I think the main thing which "bugged" me, was the word qualify.
Look at his video of 21 catches. That is a magnificent image, a thing of
art or beauty even. Truly stunning to see that many objects so well
controlled for so long. I am 'textless' as I try to find words to describe
an actual feeling of happiness. Seems wierd but I don't think I am alone.
So, if we take that image and add 1 catch. Then what? ONE SINGLE CATCH.
Then it becomes this elusive qualify. Then we all rejoice more than ever
before because he made one extra catch.
I wonder if the idea of a qualify didn't exist, would it be easier to get
there because there is no legendary goal...or quite the opposite and more
difficult because there is nothing to aim for.
Anyway, it's just funny to me than even though we have just seen the long
standing world record beaten numerous times in a single week, no-one will
truly be happy until he makes one more catch.
But he's an odd catch guy. So he will make 23*..then what? We can't stop
on 23, that's like a qualify plus a little bit but not enough to be worth
anything. Will we need to go to 25?
Alright that'll do pig, that'll do.
-----------------------
*what a coincidence
Boppo
wrote:
It was a big deal when the first runner broke the 4-minute mile.
Notwithstanding the fact that a mile is an arbitrary distance, and 4
minutes is a rather arbitrary time, making the four-minute mile a
doubly-arbitrary sustained velocity, but it was a big deal. I think
it even made the national news.
The juggling community has agreed upon what qualifying means* and here
we are at the brink of eleven balls being qualified for the first time
probably ever in history. It's really the same as the four-minute
mile, except that it probably won't make national news. It deserves
to, though.
-boppo
* for patterns of period 1 and ground-state patterns of period 2,
anyway
Adam Rowney
I'm in a bit of a rush now and have not read the other posts, so maybe
Falcov mentioned this.
I think seeing 11 qualified will hope push more people to try 11, and
indeed lower numbers. If they know it is possible, then they will attempt
it more. In fact, I think the number of poeple attempting 11 (or a higher
number they have never tried before) this week has probably gone up, but I
have no real way of saying that this is true. Would be interesting to know
:)
TK
> It was a big deal when the first runner broke the 4-minute mile.
> Notwithstanding the fact that a mile is an arbitrary distance, and 4
> minutes is a rather arbitrary time, making the four-minute mile a
> doubly-arbitrary sustained velocity, but it was a big deal. I think
> it even made the national news.
>
> The juggling community has agreed upon what qualifying means* and here
> we are at the brink of eleven balls being qualified for the first time
> probably ever in history. It's really the same as the four-minute
> mile, except that it probably won't make national news. It deserves
> to, though.
The 4 minute mile (accurately timed) had been a barrier for the prior
100 years but once broken hundreds have broken it. John Walker (135)
and Steve Scot (136) almost took turns winning races.
One can hope that breaking the 11 ball barrier will have a similar result.
My dad was fond of saying "It is amazing what you can do if you are not
smart enough to know you can't do it." Most of us "know" that no one
can juggle 11 balls and therefore are relieved of the need to even try.
--
TK ~ aka Terry Kimpling
http://wejuggle2.com/circusskills.php learn/make juggle/balance equipment
A woman drove me to drink and I didn't even have the decency to thank
her. W. C. Fields
Michael Falkov
formatting unexpectedly and unaesthetically altered [1] for some reason.
I'm posting this for people who might have wanted to read what I wrote,
but were turned off by the 2x post length and half length lines every
other line of text. I hope the formatting stays intact this time.
Oh, and I guess I'll be the first to mention that Alex posted a new record
of 23 catches today - no video yet, but... it seems that it's been done! :)
http://www.jugglingdb.com/records/record.php?prop=b&number=11
CONGRATULATIONS ALEX! Of course we all want to see the video, maybe you'll
even get 23+ catches for it - that would be a nice touch.
Another question for Mr. Barron: How consistent is your 11 ball flash?
About how many times will you get it out of 10, for example. Obviously we
are all watching video of your successful runs, so we are generally seeing
your best results, but your pattern looks so clean, and your record is
rising so quickly (and is the highest level of achievement in this
category) - I wonder what the average attempt is like and perhaps what
tends to go wrong when something does.
Reformatted for readability: (Alex>Thanar>Norbi>Michael)
We are at a point in history when one of the most fundamental juggling
techniques (arguably the most (cascade)) is about the be pushed to a level
that it has never before reached (as far as we know) but which many people
have been anticipating. It is an especially novel time that we are in the
midst of.
That novelty may or may not be interesting to a given person, but it is a
as opposed to excited [2]. My meta-emotional state is something like
acceptance and understanding of the frustration often encountered in
striving for difficult goals, tinged with the satisfaction of knowing that
I have advanced myself and will likely benefit for it (otherwise I
probably wouldn't have spent so many resources on the process). I don't
think that my immediate, primary emotional response negates the
significance of such an achievement.
As for whether or not Alex will continue working on 11 balls to solidify
it - who knows? Alex? Are you reading this? What do you think? Are you
going to go for longer runs? Will you try other patterns? Do you intend to
push onward to 12, 13, 14, or 15? More, perhaps?
I hope you don't lose your juggling zeal Norbi, I like what you come up
with too - even though I'm not a ring juggler. :)
Michael
[1] I posted the first message using Chrome 5.0.375.127 on Mac OS 10.6.4
through JugglingDB. I'll try another Chrome post under this one to see if
the problem lies with the Googley one.
[2] This might be different if the culmination happened at some event with
Michael Falkov
It looks like I missed a line when I fixed the formatting of the parent to
this post... oh well. This post is
just a test to see if the original formatting error was a result of
posting from this version of Chrome
(5.0.375.127) on Mac OS 10.6.4
I'll use a Wikipedian synopsis of Plato's Allegory of the Cave as filler
text.
Synopsis
Inside the cave
Socrates begins by describing a scenario in which what people take to be
real would in fact be an
illusion. He asks Glaucon to imagine a cave inhabited by prisoners who
have been chained and held
immobile since childhood: not only are their arms and legs held in place,
but their heads are also fixed,
compelled to gaze at a wall in front of them. Behind the prisoners is an
enormous fire, and between
the fire and the prisoners is a raised walkway, along which people walk
carrying things on their heads
"including figures of men and animals made of wood, stone and other
materials". The prisoners watch
the shadows cast by the men, not knowing they are shadows. There are also
echoes off the wall from
the noise produced from the walkway.
Socrates asks if it is not reasonable that the prisoners would take the
shadows to be real things and
the echoes to be real sounds, not just reflections of reality, since they
are all they had ever seen or
heard. Wouldn't they praise as clever whoever could best guess which
shadow would come next, as
someone who understood the nature of the world? And wouldn't the whole of
their society depend on
the shadows on the wall?
Release from the cave
Socrates next introduces something new to this scenario. Suppose that a
prisoner is freed and
permitted to stand up. If someone were to show him the things that had
cast the shadows, he would
not recognize them for what they were and could not name them; he would
believe the shadows on
the wall to be more real than what he sees.
"Suppose further," Socrates says, "that the man was compelled to look at
the fire: wouldn't he be
struck blind and try to turn his gaze back toward the shadows, as toward
what he can see clearly and
hold to be real? What if someone forcibly dragged such a man upward, out
of the cave: wouldn't the
man be angry at the one doing this to him? And if dragged all the way out
into the sunlight, wouldn't
he be distressed and unable to see "even one of the things now said to be
true," viz. the shadows on
the wall (516a)?
After some time on the surface, however, Socrates suggests that the freed
prisoner would acclimate.
He would see more and more things around him, until he could look upon the
Sun. He would
understand that the Sun is the "source of the seasons and the years, and
is the steward of all things in
the visible place, and is in a certain way the cause of all those things
he and his companions had been
seeing" (516b–c). (See also Plato's metaphor of the Sun, which occurs near
the end of The Republic,
Book VI)[3]
Return to the cave
Socrates next asks Glaucon to consider the condition of this man.
"Wouldn't he remember his first
home, what passed for wisdom there, and his fellow prisoners, and consider
himself happy and them
pitiable? And wouldn't he disdain whatever honors, praises, and prizes
were awarded there to the ones
who guessed best which shadows followed which? Moreover, were he to return
there, wouldn't he be
rather bad at their game, no longer being accustomed to the darkness?
"Wouldn't it be said of him that
he went up and came back with his eyes corrupted, and that it's not even
worth trying to go up? And if
they were somehow able to get their hands on and kill the man who attempts
to release and lead up,
wouldn't they kill him?" (517a)
Remarks on the allegory
Socrates remarks that this allegory can be taken with what was said
before, viz. the metaphor of the
Sun, and the divided line. In particular, he likens
"the region revealed through sight" – the ordinary objects we see around
us – "to the prison home, and
the light of the fire in it to the power of the Sun. And in applying the
going up and the seeing of what's
above to the soul's journey to the intelligible place, you not mistake my
expectation, since you desire
to hear it. A god doubtless knows if it happens to be true. At all events,
this is the way the phenomena
look to me: in the region of the knowable the last thing to be seen, and
that with considerable effort,
is the idea of good; but once seen, it must be concluded that this is
indeed the cause for all things of
all that is right and beautiful – in the visible realm it gives birth to
light and its sovereign; in the
intelligible realm, itself sovereign, it provided truth and intelligence –
and that the man who is going
to act prudently in private or in public must see it" (517b-c).
After "returning from divine contemplations to human evils", a man "is
graceless and looks quite
ridiculous when – with his sight still dim and before he has gotten
sufficiently accustomed to the
surrounding darkness – he is compelled in courtrooms or elsewhere to
contend about the shadows of
justice or the representations of which they are the shadows, and to
dispute about the way these
things are understood by men who have never seen justice itself?" (517d-e)
Alex Barron
>
> My first response to Norbi, which this post is a response to, had it's
> formatting unexpectedly and unaesthetically altered [1] for some reason.
> I'm posting this for people who might have wanted to read what I wrote,
> but were turned off by the 2x post length and half length lines every
> other line of text. I hope the formatting stays intact this time.
>
> Oh, and I guess I'll be the first to mention that Alex posted a new record
> of 23 catches today - no video yet, but... it seems that it's been done! :)
>
> http://www.jugglingdb.com/records/record.php?prop=b&number=11
>
> CONGRATULATIONS ALEX! Of course we all want to see the video, maybe you'll
> even get 23+ catches for it - that would be a nice touch.
>
> Another question for Mr. Barron: How consistent is your 11 ball flash?
> About how many times will you get it out of 10, for example. Obviously we
> are all watching video of your successful runs, so we are generally seeing
> your best results, but your pattern looks so clean, and your record is
> rising so quickly (and is the highest level of achievement in this
> category) - I wonder what the average attempt is like and perhaps what
> tends to go wrong when something does.
>
Hi and thanks, it was great feeling getting it for the first time today!
I'll answer your questions about the pattern first:
In terms of the flashes, if i'm running the pattern fairly well and theres
no pressure i can get it fairly
consistently (one in every two or three tries.) It becomes a lot more
inconsistent if theres someone
watching or if i havn't properly warmed up.
My average attempt is probably suprisingly bad and definitely less than a
flash. I know i've progressed
significantly in the past few weeks but i've had my fair share of failed
attempts - I'd say each extra
catch from 15 has taken about an hour of trying 11 or maybe more. This may
not seem like much but
11 is pretty tough on the arms so doing any more than this in one session
would probably make them
ache for the next day.
The failed attempts can be anything, but i often have trouble when i scoop
the left hand throws
backwards after the release if i havn't got the rhythm of the pattern
quite right. Another recurring
mistake is to drop the second last catch in my left hand.
Anyway, i'm sorry there isn't a video of the qualify. I actually met up
with peter bone today to do some
11 ball stuff and we filmed some of it on his camera.
Unfortunately i managed the qualify quite early on so his camera wasn't
running yet and although
mine was filming, it was pushed over by the wind just beforehand so all i
got was a shot of sky and
the sound of me yelling in celebration. Despite this irritation it was a
good afternoon and we got some
good runs including a 19 catch one from peter which broke his record.
I hope this helps and ill try for the qualify on video tomorrow,
Alex
Adam Rowney
Ah congrats so much !! That is so awesome, I look forward to it on video
if you managed it again :) Im sure you will. Maybe some attempts at 21 and
22 ball passing with Peter would go down well? So many records have been
broken lately, so it could be a good time for more records to be made :)))
VincentCarter
Jason Quinn
> Anyway, i'm sorry there isn't a video of the qualify. I actually met up
> with peter bone today to do some
> 11 ball stuff and we filmed some of it on his camera.
> Unfortunately i managed the qualify quite early on so his camera wasn't
> running yet and although
> mine was filming, it was pushed over by the wind just beforehand so all i
> got was a shot of sky and
> the sound of me yelling in celebration. Despite this irritation it was a
> good afternoon and we got some
> good runs including a 19 catch one from peter which broke his record.
>
> I hope this helps and ill try for the qualify on video tomorrow,
>
> Alex
This is great. Good job! You should post the video anyway. Hearing your
celebration might be fun too. Did Peter see the qualify?
Jason
Norbi
>
> I actually met up with peter bone today to do some 11 ball stuff...
That is quite an epic thought.
Peter Bone
Here's the video. I feel so sorry for Alex for not getting it on video. I
saw the whole qualify. Very clean. It actually looked like he could run it
for longer. He said afterwards that it felt like he was doing 9.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFUAbbrfxxs
Pete
Boppo
wrote:
How far do you live from one another?
-boppo
gantenbein
Congrats (to both of you),
that's awesome! I can't watch the video, youtube says it's not available.
Are you planning to upload to jtv also?
Are you also trying to get a 13 ball flash on video (might be in this
thread somewhere, haven't plowed through all of it).
Steffen
VincentCarter
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
What beanbags do you use?
Peter Bone
It works on youtube for me. Maybe try again later. I'll upload this one to
JTV maybe. I only upload my best videos to JTV.
I'm not putting any effort into filming the 13 ball flash yet as I'm
concentrating on 11 balls. Maybe after (if) I get 11. Alex and I just had
a few attempts at 13 and Alex happened to get a good attempt.
Pete
Peter Bone
It was a 1.5 hour drive. Not something I'm likely to repeat soon but it
was fun for a one off trip.
Boppo
wrote:
> Here's the video. I feel so sorry for Alex for not getting it on video. I
> saw the whole qualify. Very clean. It actually looked like he could run it
> for longer. He said afterwards that it felt like he was doing 9.
I can say that sometimes I've done 7 and it "felt like 5" and once in
a while 9 seems to contain glimpses of 7 - which, however, were never
long enough to just cruise it, though.
I can't help but think, when later he manages the flash or more with
13, that he will helpfully inform us that it "almost feels just like
11" - which, however, will offer little insight to those rest of us
who can't do 11, rather the majority of us I'm afraid.
-boppo
gantenbein
Thanks for uploading to JTV! What an incredible video!
Steffen
Chris Dunlop
Seeing video evidence of such extraordinary progress with 11 has been
remarkable, and has encouraged me to structure my practice a bit more this
week, regardless that Alex is a more advanced juggler by orders of
magnitude.
I've increased personal bests on several tricks I've been working on this
week,
including a plain 5 ball cascade. But I still can't say that "5 feels
like 3"
- can anyone? I'm only just starting to get runs of 70/80*, so it's far
from
solid. But how many jugglers with a solid pattern can just pick up 5
balls and
juggle away on peripheral vision whilst watching TV or something, as even
I can
with 3.
I hope Alex gets his video soon - it was really bad luck to have the
camera
fall at just that moment. On the evidence of the past month it can't be
long
coming.
Chris Dunlop
*I did reach 100 catches with 5b, twice, in around 1998, but after a 10
year
gap started over again, 15 months ago.
Brer Licky
I practice pretty irregularly, sometimes missing whole weeks, so I can't
do it for very long, but I can certainly watch something else briefly
while juggling 5. Watching, I can usually get couple hundred catches,
looking away, probably only 20-30. I imagine those people who can get
more than a thousand catches can probably juggle 5 with their peripheral
vision nearly indefinitely.
It's one of those things you get better at with practice. For a few days
in a row I practiced looking away while doing 5, and made very noticeable
improvement. I think the reason it's so uncommon with 5 is simply
because with three, you can keep your head level and still see the peak in
your peripheral vision, but most people juggle 5 so high that it's not so
easy to see.
Bartolo
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
Nice to see some progress on 11 balls juggling !
In the 90' when I went from 1 to 9 balls in 18 months, I felt quite
alone...then I stopped juggling. 20 years later I still didn't find time
to go back to numbers...
..but seeing you guys progressing with 11 could bring me back the
motivation to throw balls in the air !! (despite I may be a bit old now
but who knows)
Btw, how can you handle 6 balls in one hand and send each of them
precisely ? Maybe a question of balls size ? Bean bags I presume.
Good 9+ and especially 11 throws !!
Cyril.
Peter Bone
The right balls have a lot to do with it. Have a look here
http://www.jugglingdb.com/compendium/skills/training/numbers/flashing.html
I doubt that your age will hold you back significantly as long as you
stick at it and don't try too much too soon.
Pete
Alex Barron
>
> In case anyone isn't aware, Alex Barron and Peter Bone are now in a race
> to qualify 11 balls, trading off record-breaking runs every 3 days or so:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
> Aug 19 - Peter Bone - 18 catches -
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WIdWu5LXb4
> Aug 23 - Alex Barron - 19 catches -
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9b9405uteA8
>
> I never thought I'd see a Juggling world record "steel cage match" like
> this!
>
>
April 3 2012 - Alex Barron - 23 catches -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWX4QSmnw6g
perhaps a little bit later than expected, but hopefully worth the wait :)
capricornwhite
>
> I just made 17 catches of 11 balls to camera. I'd been working at this for
> about year since i first flashed it
> and, with a bit luck, i made it fairly cleanly :)
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aqbtugSVYp8
>
> Alex
>
few years and be ridiculously difficult and probably pointless with the
exception of knowing that it can be done. But that's never stopped
anybody from trying before :)