9mm vs. .45: speed of bullet
Jason Bodak
how fast the average .45 bullet goes. I hear that the 9mm is
considerably faster, which can potentially lead to less stopping
power?
Does the speed of a 9mm bullet vary greatly depending on the
manufacturer of the gun, or there is an average speed for all
guns?
Thanks.
--Jason Bodak
--
. . . . . . . . . .
Info on moderated group rec.guns is at http://doubletap.cs.umd.edu/rec.guns
Paul Rubin
Jason Bodak <11036...@CompuServe.COM> wrote in message
<6s6pn0$h...@xring.cs.umd.edu>...
> ...
Jim Herman
There are lots of places on the net to get this kind of info, including the
FAQ here at rec.guns. Try clicking either on the URL at the bottom of this
message, or go directly there by clicking on this URL:
http://www.digiweb.com/dputzolu/VIIE8.html. Take a cruise through the FAQ,
and you will find all kinds of interesting info.
Jim
Jason Bodak <11036...@CompuServe.COM> wrote in article
<6s6pn0$h...@xring.cs.umd.edu>...
# Hi, I was wondering how fast the average 9mm bullet goes, and
# how fast the average .45 bullet goes. I hear that the 9mm is
# considerably faster, which can potentially lead to less stopping
# power?
# Does the speed of a 9mm bullet vary greatly depending on the
# manufacturer of the gun, or there is an average speed for all
# guns?
# Thanks.
# --Jason Bodak
Mark Yaworski
<11036...@CompuServe.COM> wrote:
# Hi, I was wondering how fast the average 9mm bullet goes, and
#how fast the average .45 bullet goes. I hear that the 9mm is
#considerably faster, which can potentially lead to less stopping
#power?
# Does the speed of a 9mm bullet vary greatly depending on the
#manufacturer of the gun, or there is an average speed for all
#guns?
For guns with a similar barrel length, the bullet velocity for a given
cartridge will be fairly close.
Most usual 9mm loads, with bullets in the 115 to 125 grain range, are
supersonic when fired from most handguns and have a velocity in the
range of 1100 to 1300 feet per second.
The .45 auto fires the .45 ACP cartridge and the most common bullet
weight is 230 grains which is propelled at between 800 and 900 feet
per second.
Stopping power is dependent on many more things than just bullet
weight and speed although those are very important because they
combine to give the bullet kinetic energy and momentum which are
critical to stopping ability. Also important is the way the bullet
expands if hollow point bullets are used.
If we don't use hollow points, energy and momentum become very
important but the size of the bullet also becomes important.
According to the tables from ProLoad Ammunition at
http://www.proload.dmi.net/specs.htm, the average 9mm and .45 have
very similar energy ratings. The .45 makes a bigger than the 9mm and
arguably is a better stopper but others will argue about hydrostatic
shock damage by a supersonic bullet.
When it comes right down to it, I don't want to be shot by either. :-)
Mark Yaworski, CNA <I speak for myself and nobody else>
NRA Life Member
NRA Certified Instructor
NRA Recruiter http://www.erols.com/yaworski/joinnra.htm
Part time gun dealer
Some time baseball umpire
Other time basketball referee
and a lot of other stuff that no one cares about
If you are in the DC area, check out http://www.erols.com/yaworski/mpc.htm for match info
Andrew Leung, D.C.
#
# considerably faster, which can potentially lead to less stopping
# power?
# Does the speed of a 9mm bullet vary greatly depending on the
# guns?
# Thanks.
# --Jason Bodak
I'm assuming that you are talking the 9mm and the .45ACP. Well, the 9mm
is faster than the .45, however they are of different bullet weights.
.45 is obviously heavier thus despite the decrease in velocity,
generates more energy.
Rough estimate speed without really testing it on a Chronograph to test
the true load:
9mm in 115fmj is about 1250-1300 fps
.45 in 230fmj is about 860-900 fps
assuming both out of similar length barrels like around 5 inches.
Speed does depend on barrel length...ideally the maximum velocity is
reached when all the powder is burned inside the alotted barrel length
and builds enough pressure before the bullet creates "drag" due to
excessive barrel length.
Most probably it didn't answer all your questions, but hope this helps.
Andrew
g. maiers
.45ACP rounds can vary in velocity from approximately 700feet per second
(fps) to as high as 1100fps. These speeds are dependent on several factors.
The major factor is bullet weight. A lighter bullet will go faster. Makes
sense, yes? Another major consideration is barrel length. Up to a certain
length a bullet's velocity will not be optimized and anything longer will
also be detrimental to velocity. Powder used in the round will also affect
velocity. Yes, certain guns will shoot identical rounds faster than others,
even identical guns from the same manufacturer.
As for the 9MM, it can be loaded from 850fps to almost 1500fps. All the
same factors from above also apply to the 9. The 9's stopping power can be
quite on par with the .45 depending on which loading of each cartridge is
being used. Hope this is helpful.
Glenn
Jason Bodak <11036...@CompuServe.COM> wrote in message
<6s6pn0$h...@xring.cs.umd.edu>...
# Hi, I was wondering how fast the average 9mm bullet goes, and
#considerably faster, which can potentially lead to less stopping
#power?
Dean Speir
Jason Bodak wrote:
# I was wondering how fast the average 9mm bullet goes,
# and how fast the average .45 bullet goes.
A 115-grain 9 X 19mm round's nominal velocity is 1250 fps.
A 230-grain .45 ACP round's nominal velocity is 850 fps.
# I hear that the 9mm is considerably faster, which can
# potentially lead to less stopping power?
Get a book on external ballistics... avoid like the plague any
texts on this subject by Marshall, Sanow, Fackler, Jason or
Roberts.
# Does the speed of a 9mm bullet vary greatly depending
# on the manufacturer of the gun, or there is an average
# speed for all guns?
Is this flame bait?
--
- Dean Speir
Industry Intelligencer, FIREARMS FOURTH ESTATE
oal...@my-dejanews.com
Jason Bodak <11036...@CompuServe.COM> wrote:
# Hi, I was wondering how fast the average 9mm bullet goes, and
# how fast the average .45 bullet goes. I hear that the 9mm is
# power?
<snip>
"Stopping power" is a myth in the realm of handguns. Proper placement of the
round in the attacker is the ONLY reliable way to stop an attacker with a
handgun round, be it a 9mm or .45. If you don't hit a vital area, your chances
of stopping the attack are spotty at best, regardless of the handgun you use.
Read up on this topic, about actual shootings, and you'll believe.
If you want to split hairs, the .45 does make a bigger hole, and that's
better. But that hole isn't EVER big enough to make up for poor shot
placement. If you hit vitals with a good 9mm hollowpoint, you'll be well on
your way to winning the gunfight.
Take your pick from any gun in anything from 9mm on up - your handgun should
be the one that #1 is reliable #2 you can shoot most accurately under stress
(out to 15 yards or so) #3 you can control under recoil to quickly follow up
shots
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Bill D.
#
snip - - - - - - - -
#
# Get a book on external ballistics... avoid like the plague any
# texts on this subject by Marshall, Sanow, Fackler, Jason or
# Roberts.
# -- - - - - - - - - - -
# Is this flame bait?
#
I will guess your "recommendation" will be flame bait.
Got some factual data to back up your unrecommendation of Fackler ?
Seeing as you obviously don't believe anything anybody writes, is there
anyone who has any credibility in your opinion ?
You say to get a book on ballistics but by whom ?
I laughed like hell when you grouped all those folks together - I don't
there is any other way you could have insulted all of them
simultaneously.
Bill
Monte Harrison
#If you want to split hairs, the .45 does make a bigger hole, and that's
#better. But that hole isn't EVER big enough to make up for poor shot
#placement. If you hit vitals with a good 9mm hollowpoint, you'll be well on
#your way to winning the gunfight.
#
#Take your pick from any gun in anything from 9mm on up - your handgun should
#be the one that #1 is reliable #2 you can shoot most accurately under stress
#(out to 15 yards or so) #3 you can control under recoil to quickly follow up
#shots
#
A wholehearted second to the above statement. All of the .45 v. 9mm
argument is just Chevy v. Ford arguments. Either one gets the job
done, if you hold up your end of the bargain.
Monte Harrison
harr...@direclynx.net
*******************************************
"Those who give up essential liberty,
to preserve a little temporary safety,
deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Dudley LeRoux
If both were using the exact same charge and had the same shape, the
9mm would be faster.
A 45 is known to have greater stopping power, although you'd still
need to take into account the charge propelling the slug.
On 28 Aug 1998 13:34:24 -0400, Jason Bodak
<11036...@CompuServe.COM> wrote:
> ...
Please reply to newsgroup, not via e-mail
if possible.
(dudleyl at murrob dot com)
Dudley LeRoux
dud...@murrob.com
scott clark
Monte Harrison wrote in message <6sc3qi$4...@xring.cs.umd.edu>...#
##If you want to split hairs, the .45 does make a bigger hole, and that's
##better. But that hole isn't EVER big enough to make up for poor shot
##placement. If you hit vitals with a good 9mm hollowpoint, you'll be well
on
##your way to winning the gunfight.
##
##Take your pick from any gun in anything from 9mm on up - your handgun
should
##be the one that #1 is reliable #2 you can shoot most accurately under
stress
##(out to 15 yards or so) #3 you can control under recoil to quickly follow
up
##shots
##
#
#A wholehearted second to the above statement. All of the .45 v. 9mm
#argument is just Chevy v. Ford arguments. Either one gets the job
#done, if you hold up your end of the bargain.
try telling that story to any soldier in the army during the Philippine
police action when they were buying out of their own money, colt single
action army pistols in 45cal because their 38specials (which hit harder than
9mm) wouldn't stop the Morays.
Hillbrath
# try telling that story to any soldier in the army during the Philippine
# police action when they were buying out of their own money, colt single
# action army pistols in 45cal because their 38specials
# (which hit harder than 9mm)
Actually, the Army issue at the time was .38 Long Colt, which was loaded with a
150 grain bullet at 770 fps and a muzzle energy of 195 foot pounds. Not as good
as most 9mm loads.
The .38 Special was developed because of the problems with the Long Colt
cartridge.
# wouldn't stop the Morays.
Why were they shooting eels, anyway?
Henry Hillbrath
TSBench
<scottc...@worldnet.att.net> writes:
##A wholehearted second to the above statement. All of the .45 v. 9mm
##argument is just Chevy v. Ford arguments. Either one gets the job
##done, if you hold up your end of the bargain.
#
#
#try telling that story to any soldier in the army during the Philippine
#police action when they were buying out of their own money, colt single
#action army pistols in 45cal because their 38specials (which hit harder than
#9mm) wouldn't stop the Morays.>>>>
I would, if I could find one who is still alive. But, if I did, he'd probably
tell me that the issue revolvers fired the .38 Colt Long, not the .38 S&W
Special.
The .38 Long Colt developed considerably less energy than the 38 S&W, which, in
its military loading, develops quite considerably less energy than the military
loading in the 9mm Para..
The Army re-issued SAAs, so the troops didn't have to buy their own. As it
turns out, the hopped up Moros weren't reliably stopped by the .30 Army out of
a Krag, so the .45 Colt probably wasn't that much of a problem solver.
Regards,
TSB
Bill Walker...Producer and Cohost of The Shooting Bench radio program...Curator
of Small Arms, US Naval & Shipbuilding Museum in Quincy, MA....General Manager,
WDIS-Radio, Norfolk, Massachusetts.
Mark Terka
:>#A wholehearted second to the above statement. All of the .45 v. 9mm
:>#argument is just Chevy v. Ford arguments. Either one gets the job
:>#done, if you hold up your end of the bargain.
:>
:>
:>try telling that story to any soldier in the army during the Philippine
:>police action when they were buying out of their own money, colt single
:>action army pistols in 45cal because their 38specials (which hit harder than
:>9mm) wouldn't stop the Morays.
Actually, from what I've read, even the .45 wasn't an absolute guarantee to
shooting those doped up, hard charging tribesmen. But, the size of the bullet
did boost morale.
It seems like the ONLY weapon that was pretty well a certainty during the
insurrection was a shotgun armed with 00 buck. Just like white hunters used
to use on tigers or lions for "close-in" work.
------------------------------------------------
Mark Terka - Galveston, Texas - mte...@ibm.net
PGP PUBLIC KEY on: public-k...@pgp.ai.mit.edu,
COMMAND: GET mte...@ibm.net in message body
PGP FINGERPRINT:
02 54 67 39 AE 86 2E 63 C4 83 EF 3F F1 6D 96 BB
------------------------------------------------
MMB
Albo
There is no doubt that the heavier bullet and lower velocity ~700-800fps .45
served to STOP/Push back a charging adversary better than a lighter/ higher
velocity .38. Both were FMJ projectiles with little or no expansion.
Douglas
#
# scott clark wrote:
#
# # try telling that story to any soldier in the army during the Philippine
# # police action when they were buying out of their own money, colt single
# # action army pistols in 45cal because their 38specials
# # (which hit harder than 9mm)
#
# Actually, the Army issue at the time was .38 Long Colt, which was loaded with a
# 150 grain bullet at 770 fps and a muzzle energy of 195 foot pounds. Not as good
# as most 9mm loads.
#
# The .38 Special was developed because of the problems with the Long Colt
# cartridge.
#
# # wouldn't stop the Morays.
#
# Why were they shooting eels, anyway?
#
Hay you ever see a Moray attack scares the crap out of you.
aaron
wrote:
# Hillbrath wrote:
# #
# # scott clark wrote:
# #
# # # try telling that story to any soldier in the army during the Philippine
# # # police action when they were buying out of their own money, colt single
# # # action army pistols in 45cal because their 38specials
# # # (which hit harder than 9mm)
# #
# # Actually, the Army issue at the time was .38 Long Colt, which was
loaded with a
# # 150 grain bullet at 770 fps and a muzzle energy of 195 foot pounds.
Not as good
# # as most 9mm loads.
# #
# # The .38 Special was developed because of the problems with the Long Colt
# # cartridge.
# #
# # # wouldn't stop the Morays.
# #
# # Why were they shooting eels, anyway?
# #
# Hay you ever see a Moray attack scares the crap out of you.
Well, no. But I thought they were called the Moros...