ANNOUNCE: CENTAUR REPRODUCTION PLAYFIELDS - 2010 Re-Run
Kevin CPR
A heads-up.....
The major details are at the web site, but in a nutshell we were able
to manage a VERY small re-run of Centaur playfields due to some
opportunistic circumstances in timing here at CPR. These were not
planned, thus there was no preorder structure to these in advance. We
have now served the intended recipients of why these were made
(including ourselves - who didn't have any Centaur playfields of our
own left). Now is the time to take the remaining playfields public.
I don't know how long these will last. There could be a rush on
these, there might be gentle apathy. All I know is the remaining
number can be counted using two hands, and if you ever thought about
restoring a Centaur, here is the chance for anybody who missed out in
2005 & 2006 to grab one.
THREE DIFFERENT VERSIONS ARE AVAILABLE, a couple or few of each (see
the site for details and photos)
First come, first served at this point. We'll have them up in our
Store section until they are gone. Special bundle-pricing will be in
effect for Centaur plastics sets, if taken with a playfield.
Thanks.
KEVIN
Classic Playfield Reproductions
http://www.classicplayfields.com
brokenvette
Those are awesome. You guys reproduce a mean PF. Im glad I dont have a
Centaur because I would be on the white ones like a duck on a junebug.
James
Hugh
I'm waiting for the same announcement for Fathom playfields :)
Hugh
seymour.shabow
That whitetop version looks funky (in a good way). I never really
noticed the hands cupping the girl on the shoot again insert ;)
Pinster68
Ok, I'm in. Now someone want to sell me a Centaur? I've been wanting
one and my impulses got the best of me here.
BC_Gambit
I have hopefully purchased one of the white ones; I do not own a
Centaur either. We'll see what response I get!
Pinster68
Yeah ... I put my order in, but the reality is there's no
confirmation. So I'll just sit tight and hope.
Came close to going for a white one, then opted for standard at the
last second, along with the plastics set deal.
Again ... now all I have to do is actually buy the pin... Doh.
I'm in Northern New Jersey if there's anyone with a Centaur for sale
in the area.
Brian
Kevin CPR
>
> > I have hopefully purchased one of the white ones; I do not own a
> > Centaur either. We'll see what response I get!
>
> Yeah ... I put my order in, but the reality is there's no
> confirmation. So I'll just sit tight and hope.
My silence is a good thing :) It means there's no problem.
There's a few orders coming in since the announcement. So far,
everybody is getting what they asked for. No conflicts yet. :)
Besides, I'm marking the versions "SOLD OUT" immediately when my count
goes to zero on any particular version.
You got your white version my friend :)
KEVIN
Pinster68
Woohoo! Now I can proceed with actually finding a Centaur to put it
in.
Thanks for the update Kevin.
Brian
BC_Gambit
Thank you for the update as well! This is a welcome early Christmas
surprise.
It will be a lot harder to justify my previously planned Fathum repro
backglass purchase (as I do not own a Fathum either), but we'll see
how things shake out.
Carl
Those playfields look awesome.
Kind of a tangent, but I already have the Phoenixarcade run of the
Fathom backglass, from years ago. My original bg was sampled for it.
Is there any reason I'd want to shell out for the CPR run of the
backglass? Anyone know? I think it looks great.
Joey
beatmaster
hope the same thing goes as well for the standard version, i placed an
order and i hope i'll get it, no marking yet!
keep up the good work guys!
--
beatmaster
This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com
Kevin CPR
> Fathom backglass, from years ago. My original bg was sampled for it.
> Is there any reason I'd want to shell out for the CPR run of the
> backglass? Anyone know? I think it looks great.
If you already have a Phoenix glass, I don't know if buying ours will
offer anything more. We are using Darin's films (he made the CPR run
possible) so the artwork quality will be identical to what you already
have. I have never seen the Phoenix version in person, so the only
difference I would wonder about is the mirroring. I'm not absolutely
sure if silvery-ink was used for the mirroring back then, or real
mirror. We're going to be using true see-your-face-in-it mirroring.
How the upcoming run will compare to the Phoenix glass, I don't know.
But it's the only potential difference I can think of, if at all.
I'd say just wait for the photo gallery to be posted at our site.
Then you can make a judgement call of ours versus the glass you have
already.
KEVIN
Kevin CPR
> Then you can make a judgement call of ours versus the glass you have
> already.
I had to come back and reply to myself :)
I just did some hunting on old RGP articles, and it seems that the
Phoenix glass was indeed printed with true mirror, according to
reviews and Darin's own posts. So the difference between that and
ours will probably be minimal. Check our future photo gallery of our
version, but I'm sure what you've got already will be a keeper. Save
your money.
KEVIN
yancy
over 700 bucks on a game I don't even own. Damn it all.
Thanks for the heads up, Kevin.
Yancy
JBuffington
Yep, me too!
I never realized how stunning and detailed Centaur artwork was until I
seen those photo's. Wow!
Now on to find a machine.
twilightzonepinball
Silverball Mania BGs being done?
-Tom
http://home.myfairpoint.net/vze8f4tt/tomstwilightzonepinballmachineaccessories/index.html
Carl
Thanks for the info!
Joey
Pinster68
Holy crap, it shipped! Just got the tracking confirmation. Very
psyched.
I am such a child.
Jazman
Sigh - Now I have 2 playfields for games I don't even own yet...
YES - more shopping to do!!!
Jaz
Don H.
pocket. :-)
- Don
TMD2
time I immediately jumped on the chance!
Now I've got to figure out how to afford Christmas presents... :-)
TMFP
>
> - Show quoted text -
Bah, you are not trying
I think I have now 4 repro playfields for games I do not own
Pinster68
> Holy crap, it shipped! Just got the tracking confirmation. Very
> psyched.
A heads-up to anyone that ordered a pf in the US, it may be stuck in
customs like mine. I checked my tracking info today as it seemed a
real long time since getting a confirmation. The package was marked as
delivered last Friday, but not to my address. After a couple of
nervous calls UPS customer service told me that my package, and other
packages from the shipper were "recalled" by US Customs and being held
at another UPS location for investigation. The UPS address is what
they told me I was seeing in the delivery status.
So, I'm patient, but man I cringe to think what they're going to do
with the package to "investigate". Crap.
Brian
#1BallyFan
from my house in Virginia when it was recalled by Customs and Border
Protection (CBP) and sent back up to New York. I worked for the U.S.
Customs Service for 12 years (U.S. Customs is now known as Customs and
Border Protection) and I am a little worried. There is no duty on
pinball parts, so no worry there. What I am worried about is the fact
that ALL items imported into the United States MUST have a country of
origin marking. I'm not sure if Kevin at CPR is marking the
playfields "Made in Canada". If he marks them "Made in the USA",
they could be seized for false markings! It happens ALL THE
TIME....I have personally seized items for this. If they are not
marked with any country of origin, they can also be seized. I am
suspecting that one of Kevin's shipments were opened, Customs found a
problem and now they have recalled all the shipments. I am going to
give this a few more days and then I am going to get on the phone with
some former associates who still work for CBP and see if they can find
out what is going on.
MarchAFB
I am curious as to what is going on too as I ordered a BK playfield
and it was recalled to NY too after being in my hometown ready to be
delivered the next day. Keep us posted if you are able to get in touch
with your former associates.
Corey
Pinster68
Thanks for the info. I emailed CPR with my concerns.
#1BallyFan
re-routed and he said he has never had a shipment held up in Customs
before. At that time, I didn't think of asking him if the playfields
are being marked with country of origin. Customs has a database that
will flag everyone of his shipments if one is found to be in violation
of some regulation. I am suspecting this right now. One of this
shipment was probably inspected and there is a problem with it and now
Customs has decided to recall every shipment they can.
planetbiz
It looks like I'm in the same boat. I was just about to check into
why the delivery was taking so long today and then I found this note.
My shipment is marked as delivered to Plattsburgh, NY. You would
think that we'd get some sort of notice from UPS that the delivery had
been re-routed by Customs.
I'm fearing that we'll never see these playfields, not to mention the
money.
Bill
Troz
"THE UPS INITIATED DELIVERY INTERCEPT REQUEST FOR THIS PACKAGE WAS
SUCCESSFULLY COMPLETED / THE ADDRESS HAS BEEN CORRECTED. THE DELIVERY
HAS BEEN RESCHEDULED "
On the phone, UPS claims the package will be delivered today despite
the intercept request, showing that the final address was my address.
Odd, considering my tracking information now shows PLATTSBURGH, NY as
the new delivery address on their website. Hopefully it'll change to
"Out for delivery" soon...
Troz
packages from this shipper have been recalled by customs, so back to
Plattsburgh my playfield goes after reaching California. Great.
MRG
here is the info I got from UPS. A package from CPR was spot checked
by customs, UPS/customs looked up the value of the playfields on
line. they saw that the playfields were worth $500 - $600. CPR was
saying they were worth only $15. This was to avoid paying 20% import
duty/tax on the playfields comining into the US. All 20 packages were
recalled back to new york customs until the matter can be resolved.
The matter is now in CPR's hands with customs/UPS.
You can call UPS at 803-502-6700 and talk with Justin.
kbliznick
Wow, so after CPR gets fined and has to pay back import taxes of 20%
($100-$120) for every single playfield that they have shipped through
UPS (are they going to go look 5 years back through their records?) Is
CPR still going to be in business and are PF's now going to cost US
customers an extra 20%??
This is very upsetting and I imagine it's going to cost CPR alot to
resolve this.
ecurtz
It would be really bad if CPR had to pay some sort of back duties.
I've never looked into this prior to the last 5 minutes, but doesn't
this publication indicate that there are no tariffs on imported
pinball machines (it seems to apply to parts for items covered as
well.) Are import duties and tariffs separate things?
http://www.usitc.gov/publications/docs/tata/hts/bychapter/1002C95.pdf
#1BallyFan
a previous post, I worked for Customs for 12 years and I can tell you
with 100% accuracy that there are no import taxes on pinball machine
parts. HOWEVER, the sender of the package (CPR) MUST declare the true
and accurate value of the playfield on the invoice. Otherwise, it can
be seized under Title 19, United States Code, section 1592. The
government will access a penalty for the failure to adequately invoice
the value (the penalty can up to the value of the merchandise
seized). The government won't care who pays it (CPR or us), so the
next thing we need to do is but the pressure on Kevin to open up his
checkbook. I'm sure that we will all receive a letter from Customs
and Border Protection in the next few weeks.
JBuffington
Did everyone that ordered one get a tracking number? I haven't heard
anything after sending in my payment.
kbliznick
> I've never looked into this prior to the last 5 minutes, but doesn't
> this publication indicate that there are no tariffs on imported
> pinball machines (it seems to apply to parts for items covered as
> well.) Are import duties and tariffs separate things?
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
What does the 35% in the second column mean?
#1BallyFan
don't like (Cuba, North Korea, etc).
ecurtz
> > It would be really bad if CPR had to pay some sort of back duties.
> > I've never looked into this prior to the last 5 minutes, but doesn't
> > this publication indicate that there are no tariffs on imported
> > pinball machines (it seems to apply to parts for items covered as
> > well.) Are import duties and tariffs separate things?
>
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> What does the 35% in the second column mean?
The 35% column is for a special list of weird counties of origin or
something defined in another document I only glanced at. #1BallyFan
certainly knows the rules and agrees that there is no tariff but there
is a separate issue about the declaration.
Pinster68
================
It's happening on ALL the Centaurs or playfields shipped out that
week. It's is indeed US Customs. They have requested inspection of
them in upstate NY. Wherever the parcels were in the country, they
have turned around and are heading back to customs for opening and
contents inspection. The shipment was "flagged" according to UPS
Brokerage manager I had on the phone. She couldn't tell me why.
Could be random UPS-parcel-imports they are checking for terror
threats, a they flagged my entire pickup from that week. It was every
parcel from that day, without exception.
They tell me they will continue onward after Customs is done. But
there is nothing you or we can do about it, I tried. If Customs
decides to check them, that is their call that nobody (even UPS) can
deny. They are in charge of everything coming into your country.
This is the first time customs has turned anything around we have sent
into the USA. We're all going to have to keep watching and waiting.
Kevin
=================
brokenvette
dude. Give him a chance to make it right or return your money before
you assume he is going to screw you and go through paypal to take your
money back from him.
Pinster68
I'm patient ... just sharing info. For the others I would agree with
you ... before we claim foul let's wait for the outcome. CPR to my
knowledge is a reputable bunch.
Brian
Kevin CPR
> On Nov 23, 1:34 pm, brokenvette <zr11...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
> > Forgive me for not minding my own business but Kevin is a ritious
> > dude. Give him a chance to make it right or return your money before
> > you assume he is going to screw you and go through paypal to take your
> > money back from him.
OK guys, just coming in on this thread for the first time as of a half
hour ago.
As for the customs issue itself, I've been aware of its early
beginnings late last week when several customers noticed their parcels
were being redirected. Then eventually ALL the playfield boxes from
that week were being turned around to go back to Plattsburg NY.
Finally, as of monday and today, they are beginning to land as
delivered at customs. So with all my calls to UPS, who seem to be
pussyfooting on what this involves, this thread actually contained way
more information with end users being given more information and
deeper detail than I get as the UPS account holder.
What I'm being told by UPS is the exact opposite theme to what seems
to be (I suspect) the case. I'm being told "no worries, they will
simply get inspected and continue on... it was a random search as far
as we know..blah blah" What some people have posted here is far more
involved - where customs are "seizing" the parcels for a greater
reason and process. I'm beginning to believe the latter, although
they still haven't all been delivered to Plattsburg yet.
I'm being told that Customs will call me to finally reveal their
issues and gather information from me. I'm dying to know what they
are having trouble with.
So even since the above email somebody posted from me, I've learned
even more in the last half hour than the last 4 days...I've had a
lenghtly call with #1BallyFan to get a point of view of a Customs &
Border Patrol former employee. His opinion is much deeper in scope
relating to why they possibly wanted to flag these - and it could be
anywhere from country of origin markings, to declared value issues.
But it's not likely a fast pass-through, and could take 2-3 weeks of
their life at customs before communications and resolution processes
take place. #1BallyFan told me that eventual communcations will take
place - possibly even to the end customers, to reveal what the problem
is with the held parcels (via letter for example). I'm waiting for my
phone to ring, but #1Fan says it's unlikely. We just have to let it
play out and see what happens. Nothing is going to be destroyed, and
we don't even know what their problem is with the parcels yet.
In case customs does send anything out via lettermail to announce
their holding, everyone watch their mailbox and let me know (directly,
not RGP) what you got and what it says. I want to be instantly on top
of what is going on, and #1Fan says I may not be the one contacted
with initial information because I am Canadian.
Bottom line, no need for panic, nobody is getting screwed, the
playfields aren't going to an incenerator, and we'll deal with
whatever problem customs has. I'm waiting for their contact and will
see what they say. This is going to be a time-delay and
inconvenience, but nobody is going to end up at a loss.
KEVIN
Classic Playfield Reproductions
http://www.classicplayfields.com
Jazman
I have no doubt that Kevin will get this sorted out and all will be
fine. He'll make right on whatever happens. I suspect something
changed that he didn't expect and caused a hiccup. It happens.
Jaz
Jazman
> I have no doubt that Kevin will get this sorted out and all will be
> fine. He'll make right on whatever happens. I suspect something
> changed that he didn't expect and caused a hiccup. It happens.
>
> Jaz
Oh, and I guess I didn't make it clear... I do have an affected
shipment.
Jaz
Kevin CPR
I was phoned (unsolicited) by a significantly higher-up UPS Import/
Export liason with Customs. The issue IS the value on the invisible
customs documents (defaulted to $15 in my UPS Worldship software, deep
in some screen I never visit). We had switched to a new UPS
"Paperless" setup back in the spring, where I was convinced by my
local UPS sales rep to go to the new "Paperless" process, and never
have to fill out Customs documents by hand ever again. If some of you
think back, we used to have customs invoices in plastic pouches on our
parcels. Well, those documents stopped when we went paperless...
Come to find out, when my rep set up my WorldShip software, she got it
to the point where I enter names & addresses and print out labels.
That simple. She said I was now paperless and I simply select one of
three templates (plastics box, backglass box, or playfield box) and I
loved it. All the default measurements, weights, and descriptions
would automatically populate.
Buuuuut...deep in a tab and a button and a menu into the depths of
WorldShip was the customs details section - the part that uploads the
invoice to Customs. It was sending the same invoice over and over and
over for every parcel...with the default value she stuck in there of
$15 !
The UPS liason was surprised this didn't set off flags earlier, as
we've been shipping for MONTHS with the same invoice being invisibly
shot to Customs for every single parcel - thus hundreds of times.
Anyway, we are working on closure for this stupidity. Finally they
have explanation, I have submitted a formal letter explaining my label-
making stupidity, and I've been shown "paperless" doesn't mean customs
documents "take care of themselves"... I've been taught how to fill
out the details that get uploaded. So the templates have been
edited. It's now a matter of dealing with these parcels that have
been flagged for inspection. The liason is confident we'll get this
cleared up (no guarantee, but 80% sure) before thanksgiving. He's on
the case bigtime, has some serious clout, and understands the simple
clerical nature of this problem.
Oh, and its confirmed, pinball parts ARE 100% duty-free, so there are
no government revenue/monetary wranglings for duties or taxes that
were caused by this - including all previous shipments. So $15 or
$1500 declared, it would make no difference.
I'll update again with any news.
Pinster68
Good news Kevin. Thanks for keeping us updated.
Sam
This is unrelated to CPR but the statement "pinball parts ARE 100%
duty-free" interests me. Is it true also if the parts are going from
US to Canada? Just curious.
Sam
#1BallyFan
States. Oh, and to be 100% technically correct, pinball parts shipped
to the United States from countries that the US does not like (Cuba,
North Korea, etc) are assessed an import duty of 35%. So, pinball
parts from Canada = good! Pinball parts from North Korea = bad :(
MarchAFB
Stuff happens.
No worries on the time frame for me as I have plenty of other projects
to get done.
Corey
Kevin CPR
> Yes, Thanks Kevin for keeping us updated and staying on top of this!
> Stuff happens.
** FINAL UPDATE **
Finally, after another week of wrangling (the thanksgiving 4-day
weekend at customs was stuck in there), I am happy to report that
customs has graciously backed off and will be releasing the Centaur
parcels to continue along on their way to their final destinations.
Within the next 24 to 48 hours, movement will begin again on the
parcels, either on their original tracking numbers (most likely), or
new tracking numbers (least likely) - but UPS cannot tell me for
sure. Either way, the good news is that end users will finally be
getting their playfields delivered, albeit 2 weeks past their delivery
date.
This also opens up my release of the sitting parcels that have been
sitting here at my front door not picked up yet. They were picked up
3 hours ago and begin their journey starting now.
If anything good has come out of this, it would be that I have formed
direct first-name relationships with THREE customs officers at the
Plattsburg (Port of Champlain) customs house - one of whom was in
charge (a higher rank). I have direct phone numbers to two of their
desks, one of whom is the higher rank. They are the actual people
that in the past and in the future check in on CPR parcels coming
through there (amongst thousands of other Canadian shippers). So,
they know me, they know our products, they know my parcels... we can
communicate at any time, and I am no longer a faceless shipper to
them. Our last call today actually ended in their warmest holiday
wishes to me (kinda blew me away after all the initial talks when we
first met). Great people just doing their job, but it became much
better in the end. So the Port of Champlain is all cool with me now
and what CPR is and does.
We're also opening up a NAFTA certificate to smoothen the border
crossings even more of our parcels.
So...back shipping confidently again, and sorry to the delays some
have experienced when ordering off the site the last week or so.
Pinster68
Thanks for the thorough follow-through and updates Kevin. Can't wait
for my Centaur PF.
Brian
#1BallyFan
has made it to the UPS facility in Laurel, MD. That means it should
be in my hands tomorrow.
planetbiz
> I just checked the UPS tracking number on myCentaurplayfield and it
> has made it to the UPS facility in Laurel, MD. That means it should
> be in my hands tomorrow.
My Centaur playfield finally arrived today. Although the box has been
dinged up in its travels and there was a hole poked in the middle of
the box, I'm happy to say that it has arrived safe and sound. I'm not
sure whether it was ever opened but it did have a piece of paper
saying that it had been assigned to a particular exam team and then a
smaill "RELEASED" sticker.
THANK GOODNESS.
Bill
#1BallyFan
yet. The box looks like it has been to New York and back a couple of
times (oh wait, it has). Mine was not opened by Customs. They are
required to use special tape marked "Inspected by Customs and Border
Protection" whenever they open an international package for official
purposes.
Pinster68
yancy
> Mine arrived 45 minutes ago. Here's the pics:
>
> http://gallery.me.com/carscadden1#100512
Ouch, nasty ding. My UPS status is still "Billing Information
Received," fingers crossed.
Yancy
yancy
the customs issue was resolved, my UPS status is still "Billing
Information Received." I don't need the playfield anytime soon, but
I'd much rather have it in hand than floating around in cardboard
limbo. The longer it's in the pipeline, the more likely it is to get
lost, dinged, warped in the freezing cold, etc.
Yancy
PinMan
just to accept the box? To the tune of $37????
On Dec 10, 1:34 pm, yancy <ya...@ameritech.net> wrote:
> Is anyone else still waiting for aCentaurplayfield? Nine days after
MarchAFB
Customs recall shipments. My UPS tracking info never changed to let me
know it was being delivered, still showed as sitting in NY. No extra
fee here.
Corey
balls2thewall
fee" as well. I emailed CPR about it, but haven't received a response
yet.
Gabe
Don H.
Thanks for the great playfield! (no, I haven't found a game to put it
in as yet... )
:-)
- Don
yancy
> Got mine finally this week. Did anyone else have to pay an extra fee
> just to accept the box? To the tune of $37????
My white-top finally arrived today! Unharmed, but with a $32.75 fee.
Has anyone heard back from CPR yet about the fees?
Yancy
Brian Munn
I had a $32.75 fee with mine today. CPR should have informed us about
this earlier. CPR's reputation took a big hit with me today. They
should have informed all of us of this. I may not buy from them
again.... Especially with Kevin not responding to this forum...
Brian
Detroit Pinball
brokenvette
Are you sure it was CPR charging the fee or UPS charginy out to get it
out of customs?
Brian Munn
>
> - Show quoted text -
They did not say and neither is Kevin. Why should I be charged? If a
proper process was not followed it was not on my end....
IF CPR reached a settlement with customs and that resulted in a charge
then CPR should inform us and give us the option to not proceed....
Per a previous poster replacement parts do not get a customs fee...
Brian
Detroit Pinball
Troz
I received my Centaur playfield last week (I'm in California) and had
no fee with it, so I wouldn't be so quick to blame CPR.
-Karl
brokenvette
>
> - Show quoted text -
I would guess that you were charged because ut was UPS's job to get it
from CPR to you and when customs called it back UPS had to do some
fenageling like they have to do to get other stuff out of customs. I
would be glad I got my PF.
Brian Munn
>
> - Show quoted text -
Mine never went to customs. It was shipped after the settlement. I
can only assume the Kevin aggreed to something and shipped without
informing us the price change. Paperwork for mine was scanned 12/10
and it was not picked up for shipment for several days after that.
Brian
Detroit Pinball
Robert Winter
Same here. Got mine last week (California) with no fees or amount due.
It had been redirected back to customs a couple weeks prior and was
tied up with everyone else's.
Robert
-----
http://robertwinter.com
shock_me
Sounds like you paid some kind of Brokerage fee. Happens to me about
60% of the time I get something shipped from the US to Canada. It's a
crap shoot, some times you get dinged sometimes you don't.
seymour.shabow
> Mine never went to customs. It was shipped after the settlement. I
> can only assume the Kevin aggreed to something and shipped without
> informing us the price change. Paperwork for mine was scanned 12/10
> and it was not picked up for shipment for several days after that.
>
> Brian
> Detroit Pinball
So, what did Kevin say when you contacted him directly about it? Don't
assume "the Kevin" (haha, like "the Donald") even knows about it - did
it come COD or something?
I happen to know that neither of the CPR principals sit around looking
at RGP all day, so might not even be aware of this issue if you didn't
email them directly.
This does sound like some kind of UPS fee though - usually what happens
with those type of fees, where the ups program calculates the shipping,
and they spot check it and it ends up being more for some reason, they
just bill the shipper's account.
-scott CARGPB#29
seymour.shabow
>
> Sounds like you paid some kind of Brokerage fee. Happens to me about
> 60% of the time I get something shipped from the US to Canada. It's a
> crap shoot, some times you get dinged sometimes you don't.
If Brian's in Canada though he shouldn't have to pay any duty etc. since
it's Canada to Canada. I'd assume he's in the US, and again, no duty on
pinball parts. (CPR is in Canada if you didn't know that already)
It would be nice to know what the charge actually is.
-scott CARGPB#29
Kevin CPR
> should have informed all of us of this. I may not buy from them
> again.... Especially with Kevin not responding to this forum...
Whoa whoa whoa Everybody please hold your horses.
I was just directed to visit here like 60 seconds ago by one of our
Centaur customers who called me (the phone number on your parcel) who
took this up with me directly to get answers. He said essentially
"better get on RGP, there is a shitstorm brewing".
I haven't been on here since the day I announced the Solar Fire
backglasses.
I have been aware through the odd email the last week or so that UPS
is asking for brokerage fees at the door. I never put much thought
into it as a concern because I've been used to those charges for
decades at my door from UPS & FedEx - and assumed all our customers
were too. Anything imported from another country must go through a
licensed broker. In UPS' case, they are also a worldwide broker
themselves, so they perform the brokering for you themselves.
Now I am beginning to understand the shock & confusion, because I'm
realizing the problem is that *y'all haven't seen these before* with
parcels from us. Now I get it.
Due to us now shipping correctly and by US Importation law (the
paperwork being done right), after getting heavily spanked by US
Border Patrol...the parcels you are receiving are getting proper entry
into the country. Not to get too complicated, but here is the easiest
breakdown I can give:
Anything declared "Made in USA" is considered "coming home" and thus
doesn't have to be brokered, as it's not considered an imported
product. Well, the hobby has enjoyed EVERY SINGLE PARCEL since we
started in 2005 being declared as "Made in USA" on the paperwork -
whether on paper or paperless via UPS - up until 3 weeks ago. I truly
considered the playfields to be Made in USA, always did. So it wasn't
a fraud I was trying to pull over on customs. The wood was from
Wisconsin, the inserts were from Chicago, the inks are american
origin, the clearcoat is american origin, etc... nothing except
assembly was Canadian. But US Customs say I was dead wrong - and
always was since we started. We must now declare every product we
create as "Made in Canada" for it's origin declaration. Even a "Made
in Canada" sticker must be manditorially attached to every parcel, or
the merchandise itself. They say if they catch us again, we're in
deep trouble.
Secondly, anything over $200 USD must be brokered into the country as
a booked import. Since 2005, all our paperwork was declared value
$500 or $600 on playfield parcels, or whatever... but the Made in USA
origin declaration trumped the value barrier...so nothing was ever
brokered. Once we went paperless in June, all our "virtual paperwork"
that was being uploaded by the UPS software was defaulted to $15 per
parcel, for every parcel regardless of contents. This was Customs'
second major problem with us... that everything since June was coming
as declared $15 AND declared origin USA. Two major boo-boos.
So in conclusion, the expectation for playfields (to the USA) will be
that there will be a brokerage fee charged to you by UPS. FedEx would
be the same way. It's not the shipper doing it for fun, it's not CPR
charging it either - it's by law they do it, for brokering it for
you. You can choose to have a third-party broker (like Livingston
USA) do it for you, but I don't know who would want their parcel
diverting to a third party to come into the country.
If some of you lucked out and didn't get one - it was because when
Customs let the parcels go, not all of them got corrected paperwork.
Some continued onward with their $15 value and "Made in USA" origin...
both wrong declarations... but they let them go as forgiven, thus the
final mistakes they let through there. There can not and will not be
any more.
We nearly had Customs take us through a 5-year audit for all our
parcels - with a risk of $20 fine per parcel that was incorrectly
declared...there was a moment where I saw us being banned forever. It
got dicey. But thankfully they backed down due to our obvious
software settings error, and my obvious belief our products were
origin USA in materials...our playfields cannot be considered "coming
home". They are a Canadian product in US Customs' eyes.
So with probably very few exceptions, brokering will become the norm
on all parcels over $200... as they should have always been since
2005... but this is "new" for most people who enjoyed incorrectly
declared parcels for years from us. It was a good 5 years, but I
guess all errors get caught eventually. We ended up very lucky in
being forgiven (without a penny of fines) by US Customs. If we make
a misstep in the future, we will be in very deep trouble - even risk
being banned as an importer. This was clearly explained to me.
There will be NO fudging of paperwork, so please don't ask. They see
the stuff on our website, and can open any box at anytime to compare
the contents priced on our site to the declared value.
Lastly, for any future peculiarities that you don't understand -
contact me in email or phone and ask (several did the last week or
so)... the fellow Gabe above that said he wrote, I didn't receive
anything, FYI Gabe... Running to RGP and carrying on a thread with
other just-as-wondering folks won't get any answers to your
satisfaction.
I am in RGP to post announcements, about once every 8-10 days. That's
it. I don't have time otherwise.
I'm going to add something about US shipping/importation to our site
someday soon. Probably in the FAQ section. This is all as new to me
as it was to you.
Thanks for your patience on waiting for me to appear in here.
miracleman
who were charged?
Kevin CPR
> so you're not going to cover the previously unknown fee for the buyers
> who were charged?
Never thought of it that way. Kind of a stretch, and I'm sure the
logic of it will be explained to me in response shortly. But sure, I'm
game.
If they read the explanation above and feel CPR is responsible for
UPS' brokerage service for them importing an item into the USA, then
sure. I encourage them to email me. Of course, this will be for
existing Centaur shipments. I have to draw some kind of a reasonable
timeline for cutoff, of course.
With advance knowledge, would it have mattered in the purchase
decision to grab a Centaur playfield? I don't know. That's the
individual's call I guess.
I just want to make clear, it is a UPS brokerage charge, sprung on
them without advance notice (to me or them), by UPS. Owed to UPS
Brokerage. Not a CPR charge, owed to us. Some people thought it was
a COD charge for something we were billing them for, or we mistakely
shipped the items Freight Forward. Nope and nope.
Nothing was done wrong with their shipping, this is actually correct
shipping. In fact, the absence of the brokering fees for the last 5
years for hundreds and hundreds of people actually saved the hobby
thousands and thousands of dollars in peoples' pockets. Our American
buyers were all pretty lucky the last 5 years, in that respect. If
there was a do-over via a time machine, the reality wouldn't be
refunding a dozen people of current brokerage fees, but rather seeing
5 years worth of parcels billed to the consignees for
brokerage. :)
Curious, hasn't anybody bought stuff outside of the USA that was over
$200? Only asking, because I've been used to hundreds of parcels over
the last decade from Europe and USA with brokerage bills attached. A
favorable precedent was set, but it was never ever correct.
WarpZoneArcade.com
Same here though I get charged brokerage fees for virtually every
package that comes from the US to Canada via UPS.
Kevin CPR
> package that comes from the US to Canada via UPS
It's terrible here for that. At least in the USA their gate is at the
$200 mark. In Canada it's anything over value $20 !
So a birthday card won't have to be brokered, but a single BluRay disc
would. Been there, done that. Hundreds of times. I've paid $30 in
brokerage on a $25 GPE parts order :) More than doubling the paid
cost for the parts. Yikes. But it's pay or they put the parcel back
on the truck, return-to-sender. Not really much choice.
Kevin
Chris in Hopkins
My advice to anyone pissed that they are getting a $30 charge which
they didn't expect is this: Let It Go. It's not that big a deal. It's
how it is SUPPOSED to work when you order shit that has to cross the
border.
Maybe you weren't informed, maybe Kevin didn't know to inform you,
maybe you have a point and "should" be a little pissed about it.
I say take one for the team and don't worry about it. Kevin is lucky
to have come through that situation without getting backcharged for 5
years of incorrect importing, which would have put them out of
business. I'm sure he wasted many many hours straightening this out.
Let's be glad the company still exists to make more playfields to buy.
Kevin has expressed willingness to pay your import charge for you--- I
say don't make him do it. If you had been told in advance you would
have paid it without question, I am certain. So just let it go.
Respectfully and not wishing to offend anyone,
Chris
WarpZoneArcade.com
I called UPS several years ago to get an explanation of how they
arrive at the brokerage fee and hung up even more confused than before
I called. Needless to say I'm not fan of UPS.
On a brighter note I received my Centaur playfield sans brokerage fees
and was overjoyed. It's nice to actually order something within Canada
for a change. It looks awesome! Can't wait to get the Solar Fire
glass. Mine is trashed. Thanks, Kevin. Keep up the great work, guys!
kbliznick
> they didn't expect is this: Let It Go. It's not that big a deal. It's
> how it is SUPPOSED to work when you order shit that has to cross the
> border.
>
> Maybe you weren't informed, maybe Kevin didn't know to inform you,
> maybe you have a point and "should" be a little pissed about it.
>
> I say take one for the team and don't worry about it. Kevin is lucky
> to have come through that situation without getting backcharged for 5
> years of incorrect importing, which would have put them out of
> business. I'm sure he wasted many many hours straightening this out.
> Let's be glad the company still exists to make more playfields to buy.
>
> Kevin has expressed willingness to pay your import charge for you--- I
> say don't make him do it. If you had been told in advance you would
> have paid it without question, I am certain. So just let it go.
>
> Respectfully and not wishing to offend anyone,
>
>
> - Show quoted text -
Very Well Said!
yancy
> My advice to anyone pissed that they are getting a $30 charge which
> they didn't expect is this: Let It Go.
I completely agree with Chris. Anyone who can afford a $600 pinball
part isn't hurting for thirty bucks.
Would I like to have been informed of the UPS fee before I ordered?
Sure. Would knowing that my order was going to cost $32.75 (about 5%)
more have changed my decision? No. Do I feel that Kevin owes me $32.75
due to an honest oversight or lack of communication? Nah. He's
cranking out products that are, for many of us, priceless. I'm willing
to tolerate some bumps in the road, especially considering the CPR
folks all have other jobs.
That said, I think it's fair to criticize CPR for erring on the side
of minimal communication. There's no order confirmation. There was no
notification of the customs delay, unless you made a point to keep up
with this thread. And it would've been good to directly notify
customers affected by the fees as soon as Kevin learned of them. But
again, none of these are deal-breakers for me. They're honest people
doing amazing work.
Yancy
Robert Winter
I just received an invoice today from UPS for the brokerage fees of
$32.75. Must have gotten lost at the post office or something because
the invoice was dated 12/9 and it said it was to be paid by 12/17.
Robert
-----
http://robertwinter.com
Troz
And I was just about to post the same thing...
-Karl
Stu
http://www.classicplayfields.com/usashipping.html
There is a link on the Store page to access this page
mike in p-hill
I suspect it's not going to get there on time.
Mike
MrBally
>
> - Show quoted text -
If we were talking about Time Warp playfields, one could still arrive
on time o<;o)
planetbiz
> On Dec 23, 8:43 am, mike in p-hill <miller...@msn.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Yeah, I got one yesterday also, except mine said it was due on 12/21.
>
> > I suspect it's not going to get there on time.
>
> > Mike
>
> > > I just received an invoice today from UPS for the brokerage fees of
> > > $32.75. Must have gotten lost at the post office or something because
> > > the invoice was dated 12/9 and it said it was to be paid by 12/17.
>
> > > Robert
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> If we were talking about Time Warp playfields, one could still arrive
>
> - Show quoted text -
They finally caught up with me, I received an invoice for $32.75 today
dated 12/6 and due by 12/17..
lovely...
late fees won't be incurred until 12/31., that's nice of them..
Bill