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Re: A title vs. B title
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Rob T
May 5, 2012, 12:05:49 AM5/5/12
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tompellowe;1935507 Wrote:
> What's the next "B" title to be considered an "A" title?
Give me your entire list of "B" titles and I will tell you.
--
Rob T
This USENET post sent from http://rgparchive.com
Dr_Gonzo
May 5, 2012, 12:22:51 AM5/5/12
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On May 4, 9:54 pm, DenPINBALL <tpell...@dividendcapital.com> wrote:
> What's the next "B" title to be considered an "A" title?
Whichever one the collectors start hyping.
> What's the next "B" title to be considered an "A" title?
Mike Gervasi
May 5, 2012, 7:46:58 AM5/5/12
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Mr. 68
May 5, 2012, 7:53:18 AM5/5/12
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I'll be listing my hype and games for sale soon.
Kim
Kim
cody chunn
May 5, 2012, 8:05:05 AM5/5/12
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This is an impossibility. A "B" game can't change into an "A" game unless it
is modified somehow to be better than it used to be. Maybe a "PROC'd" game
could make the transition.
It's all subjective anyway. AFMars isn't an A game to me, but it is for
many.
Hey, what's the next "A" game to get bumped down to "B"? None? Ever? Then
that should tell you that a game changing tiers has nothing to do with that
game and everything to do with marketing. Just because a game's price
inflates does not mean it suddenly plays better.
-cody
"DenPINBALL" wrote in message
news:33274300.27.1336190052144.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbcg6...
is modified somehow to be better than it used to be. Maybe a "PROC'd" game
could make the transition.
It's all subjective anyway. AFMars isn't an A game to me, but it is for
many.
Hey, what's the next "A" game to get bumped down to "B"? None? Ever? Then
that should tell you that a game changing tiers has nothing to do with that
game and everything to do with marketing. Just because a game's price
inflates does not mean it suddenly plays better.
-cody
"DenPINBALL" wrote in message
news:33274300.27.1336190052144.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@vbcg6...
Max Badazz
May 5, 2012, 8:14:45 AM5/5/12
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> What's the next "B" title to be considered an "A" title?
WH2O, CFTBL, and POTC all seem to be in high demand, higher than
average price increase, and the new "A" listers.
The "A" of the month has to be RBION... not sure why those went up in
price by a grand and in high demand all of a sudden. Its a good game,
but not this much hype.
Chris (in NH)
http://usergallery.myhomegameroom.com/gallery/maxbadazz
Steve Williams
May 5, 2012, 9:34:02 AM5/5/12
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Everybodys "A" list is different.
--
Steve Williams
Pinballed
May 5, 2012, 11:13:33 AM5/5/12
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Exactly...good point. WH2O is a B game that somehow, thru enough noob
buyers and sheep jacking the price over the last year or two makes it
seem as if its acheived A list status. It has but in price only. Its
still a B game, whatever the cost. And theres a pile like that these
days.
buyers and sheep jacking the price over the last year or two makes it
seem as if its acheived A list status. It has but in price only. Its
still a B game, whatever the cost. And theres a pile like that these
days.
Rare Hero
May 5, 2012, 12:29:36 PM5/5/12
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On May 5, 8:13 am, Pinballed <probass...@live.ca> wrote:
> Exactly...good point. WH2O is a B game that somehow, thru enough noob
> buyers and sheep jacking the price over the last year or two makes it
> seem as if its acheived A list status. It has but in price only. Its
> still a B game, whatever the cost.
Why do you say that? I'd rather play WH2O than any supposed "A"
> Exactly...good point. WH2O is a B game that somehow, thru enough noob
> buyers and sheep jacking the price over the last year or two makes it
> seem as if its acheived A list status. It has but in price only. Its
> still a B game, whatever the cost.
game. It's gorgeous, unique, fun...if it were in the same room as MM,
I'd ignore it and play WH2O all day long. Since it's gone up in
price, it's safe to say people feel the same way about the
game....therefore- why can't it be considered "A" due to its content?
Greg
Ken VanCott
May 5, 2012, 12:45:52 PM5/5/12
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On May 5, 8:13 am, Pinballed <probass...@live.ca> wrote:
more play over most my A titles and I've had it 3 years.
Pinballed
May 5, 2012, 1:00:15 PM5/5/12
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I think Stargate has alot to offer...more than WH2O, I think WoF has
more to offer, same with games like JM, DH etc... but lets use SG as
the example...better than WH2O but wont be an A list machine until all
the sheep 'discover' it. Thats my point. WH2O is an A list game as
much as SG is...and SG isnt.
more to offer, same with games like JM, DH etc... but lets use SG as
the example...better than WH2O but wont be an A list machine until all
the sheep 'discover' it. Thats my point. WH2O is an A list game as
much as SG is...and SG isnt.
Rumpel Tilt-skin
May 5, 2012, 1:14:41 PM5/5/12
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high demand, not necessarily how "good" it is. Opinion of what is
"good" will vary.
I think a "B" game can be elevated to "A" list status. When the
prices of the existing "A list" games soar, buyers start looking for
the next best "bang for the buck" game. When demand for such a game
(ie WH2O, STTNG...) increases, so does price. And eventually the
game's status increases too.
There are many "A" games that are expensive and in high demand, but I
don't think are very fun. It seems like the demand and price make
them "A list," not my opinion of them.
Pinballed
May 5, 2012, 1:29:50 PM5/5/12
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I think we need a new bar for A games then. Like anything over 5
grand...and theres NO shortage of those.
grand...and theres NO shortage of those.
cody chunn
May 5, 2012, 4:21:55 PM5/5/12
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This further proves the uselessness of "A" lists. Some define an "A" game by
value, I define an "A" game as one that excels above most others in pinball
entertainment. I will never rank a games appeal on price or scarcity. Only
FUN FACTOR.
So IMO, that's why Whitewater will never be an "A" game. I just don't find
it all that much fun to play.
Also, you must take the game in context. Older games that supply has
shortened on due to collectors holding onto them or attrition, may seem to
be in higher demand, but it's just because they aren't coming up for sale as
often. It doesn't mean the game has magically become more fun (or as fun as
better games), it's just the market with more buyers after fewer units.
Eventually, if enough collectors join the ranks and keep buying and holding
machines, they will ALL become A-listers, further proving the ephemeral
nature of "A lists" and why they are basically pointless.
-cody
"Rumpel Tilt-skin" wrote in message
news:6e83cfd3-22f2-40ab...@o5g2000pbj.googlegroups.com...
value, I define an "A" game as one that excels above most others in pinball
entertainment. I will never rank a games appeal on price or scarcity. Only
FUN FACTOR.
So IMO, that's why Whitewater will never be an "A" game. I just don't find
it all that much fun to play.
Also, you must take the game in context. Older games that supply has
shortened on due to collectors holding onto them or attrition, may seem to
be in higher demand, but it's just because they aren't coming up for sale as
often. It doesn't mean the game has magically become more fun (or as fun as
better games), it's just the market with more buyers after fewer units.
Eventually, if enough collectors join the ranks and keep buying and holding
machines, they will ALL become A-listers, further proving the ephemeral
nature of "A lists" and why they are basically pointless.
-cody
"Rumpel Tilt-skin" wrote in message
news:6e83cfd3-22f2-40ab...@o5g2000pbj.googlegroups.com...
Rumpel Tilt-skin
May 5, 2012, 5:30:40 PM5/5/12
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On May 5, 1:21 pm, "cody chunn" <cchu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> This further proves the uselessness of "A" lists. Some define an "A" game by
> value, I define an "A" game as one that excels above most others in pinball
> entertainment. I will never rank a games appeal on price or scarcity. Only
> FUN FACTOR.
>
> So IMO, that's why Whitewater will never be an "A" game. I just don't find
> it all that much fun to play.
>
> Also, you must take the game in context. Older games that supply has
> shortened on due to collectors holding onto them or attrition, may seem to
> be in higher demand, but it's just because they aren't coming up for sale as
> often. It doesn't mean the game has magically become more fun (or as fun as
> better games), it's just the market with more buyers after fewer units.
>
> Eventually, if enough collectors join the ranks and keep buying and holding
> machines, they will ALL become A-listers, further proving the ephemeral
> nature of "A lists" and why they are basically pointless.
>
I respect your opinion.
> This further proves the uselessness of "A" lists. Some define an "A" game by
> value, I define an "A" game as one that excels above most others in pinball
> entertainment. I will never rank a games appeal on price or scarcity. Only
> FUN FACTOR.
>
> So IMO, that's why Whitewater will never be an "A" game. I just don't find
> it all that much fun to play.
>
> Also, you must take the game in context. Older games that supply has
> shortened on due to collectors holding onto them or attrition, may seem to
> be in higher demand, but it's just because they aren't coming up for sale as
> often. It doesn't mean the game has magically become more fun (or as fun as
> better games), it's just the market with more buyers after fewer units.
>
> Eventually, if enough collectors join the ranks and keep buying and holding
> machines, they will ALL become A-listers, further proving the ephemeral
> nature of "A lists" and why they are basically pointless.
>
Defining "A list" as a game that excels above most others in pinball
entertainment is just saying "A list games are the games I like
best." Everyone's opinion varies. With such a definition, I agree "A
list" is completely pointless term.
I also agree that games do not become "magically more fun." Fun isn't
mandatory for an "A list" game. I believe "A list" is high demand,
high value. Easy to sell for a high price.
If many people are clamoring to buy a game for above average money, it
would seem to qualify as an "A- list" game. Even if I think it
sucks. "A list" appears to be massively sought, not massively loved.
Lastly, I agree that the term is fairly pointless. To me, "A list" as
just a tag for a popular, expensive game.
Marksf1
May 5, 2012, 5:41:39 PM5/5/12
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On Friday, May 4, 2012 8:54:12 PM UTC-7, DenPINBALL wrote:
> What's the next "B" title to be considered an "A" title?
How many A list games are there? can some provide a list?
> What's the next "B" title to be considered an "A" title?
TunaSled
May 5, 2012, 6:14:00 PM5/5/12
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> How many A list games are there? can some provide a list?
PapaJohn
May 5, 2012, 6:53:49 PM5/5/12
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On May 5, 3:14 pm, TunaSled <tunas...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > How many A list games are there? can some provide a list?
>
> You should really read the thread.
I have all 'A' titles. All four of them are early to late '70's
> > How many A list games are there? can some provide a list?
>
> You should really read the thread.
games. They are great fun to look at and play to me, so, in my
opinion they are 'A' titles. I'm not interested in the other so
called 'A' titles with their return ramps to the flippers and DMD
videos. Its interesting to read how many people sell their A&B titles
so often. Makes me wonder if they get bored with the games or if
there just in the hobby to flip and make a buck? Guess Herb's latest
e-bay sale would qualify as an A title, after all its worth more than
double a Medieval Madness.
Message has been deleted
Joe S
May 6, 2012, 10:00:36 AM5/6/12
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Rating games based on "fun factor" is subjective. Rating them based
on value is objective. The market determines A vs. B titles. Games
like MM, AFM, MB will always be in high demand. The combination of
toys, humor, theme will always attract a certain number of players.
Once you play pinball virtually everyday for years, your tastes will
likely change. But, for the casual player or family that plays just a
few games from time to time, they'll generally prefer the A titles in
my experience. And, if you're only buying one or two games, the extra
cash isn't a big deal.
on value is objective. The market determines A vs. B titles. Games
like MM, AFM, MB will always be in high demand. The combination of
toys, humor, theme will always attract a certain number of players.
Once you play pinball virtually everyday for years, your tastes will
likely change. But, for the casual player or family that plays just a
few games from time to time, they'll generally prefer the A titles in
my experience. And, if you're only buying one or two games, the extra
cash isn't a big deal.
skippy church
May 6, 2012, 10:37:47 AM5/6/12
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Here's my thought:
When I first got into this hobby a few years back, I thought that "A"
title meant quality, or highly rated. Highly favored, and generally well
received. Like, Godfather, Shawshank Redemption and Casa Blanca would be
"A list" movies. ;)
But, as time went on, it seems that A list games are simply expensive...
usually expensive because they are sought after, but not always because
they're great games. Well, that's just bullshit, if you ask me.
Whatever idiot started this grading system x amount of years ago really
screwed things up. Who cares what letter you say a game is, as long as
it's good. I look to buy games that are generally well received and
loved, and then make sure I also like them too. Why? If a game is rated
poorly, that usually means that something about it isn't so hot. And,
since I simply have no way to play pins, I have to sort of rely on
people's opinions for the most part. I've bought pins without ever
playing them. Many times, it works out, but there are times I buy a game
simply because it's supposed to be good, and that doesn't work well.
What my jabbering about means is, there are many "B" titles that are
amazingly awesome. Shadow, WCS, BSD, Whitewater.... these games are
supposedly B titles, and yet they are better than just about all the
games out there. Why can a game rate in the top 20, and yet it's a "B"
title, while some games rated near 100 are A? Because of price? lol,
wtf.
I stopped giving a shit about A, B, C, and more focus on reviews from
multiple sites to help me. I'm very fond of pinballreviews.com, as they
don't seem to pull punches, and really go into depth on machines as to
why they're good or bad. I have no other options except the occasional
pin emu, which helps me decide (this is how I know I love RS and DW, two
games that you folks don't like, even though they are rated well
everywhere else on earth).
TL,DR: Fuck this alphabet list.
--
skippy church
alveolus
May 6, 2012, 3:14:06 PM5/6/12
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nearly as subjective as pinball's, yet there seems much more consensus
regarding "A-list" movies. Perhaps this is because of the weight of
the "expert" opinion of the professional critics, which has no
counterpart in pinball. We are the critics with our limited exposure
and bias to the machines we have played and owned. The effect of
price, rarity, collectibility greatly impacts objectivity as well.
Maybe a group of well respected and experienced pinball experts should
be nominated to settle this argument and create "official" pinball
rankings.
Before the flamefest erupts, know that it is only a half serious idea,
though I do like it it theory.
Greg Davis
May 6, 2012, 4:03:19 PM5/6/12
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cody chunn
May 6, 2012, 6:23:01 PM5/6/12
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There ain't no good pins,
there ain't no bad pins...
There's only you and me and we just disagree.
-cody
"Greg Davis" wrote in message
news:8523265.157.1336334599263.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynss9...
there ain't no bad pins...
There's only you and me and we just disagree.
-cody
"Greg Davis" wrote in message
news:8523265.157.1336334599263.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynss9...
Pinballed
May 6, 2012, 7:17:34 PM5/6/12
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On May 6, 6:23 pm, "cody chunn" <cchu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> There ain't no good pins,
> there ain't no bad pins...
>
> There's only you and me and we just disagree.
>
^^Nice!
> There ain't no good pins,
> there ain't no bad pins...
>
> There's only you and me and we just disagree.
>
phishrace
May 6, 2012, 6:41:04 PM5/6/12
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pinballreviews dot com. Oh wait.
http://www.pinballreviews.com/
While the reviewers aren't identified, they are experts. Art, sounds
and video are way, way more subjective, but gameplay-wise, these guys
nail it. I challenge anyone to find a review where they were all off
base.
-phish
jimjim66
May 6, 2012, 7:46:28 PM5/6/12
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Jurassic Park.
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