OT: Cash for Clunkers too confusing?
Olemite
If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
hands on our health!
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
Ole
FL Turbo
Ya gotta wonder what a bunch of dumbasses the Obama administration has
working for them when they open the door for someone to buy some old
clunker and turn it in for $4500 in trade for a new car.
susan
"FL Turbo" <noe...@notime.com> wrote in message
news:9je4751bradm3aon8...@4ax.com...
I understood there was a clause that you had to have owned it (title) for at
least a year.
Jason Pawloski
Personally, I blame Bush. When Bush was the king of the US he totally
ruined the economy and then he sent oil up to $4.00 so his billionaire
buddies can make like $10 each or something i dunno my friend arianna
huffington told me all this BUT BUSH IS SO EVIL WE SHOULD ARREST ALL
REBPUCLIANS!
--
Voted RGP's Stupidest Poster on 3/22/09
"BART [Bay Area Rapid Transit] is rather new." - Jerry Sturdivant chiming
in on how little he knows about a train system that's been operational
since 1972
________________________________________________________________________�
looking for a better newsgroup-reader? - www.recgroups.com
Will_gamble
Not just owned it, but had it insured for a year
=============================================
"I love how democrats condemn everybody the second they detect what they
consider to be racism, yet they love to use the term "redneck" to identify
anyone who doesn't agree with them. "
Brew 07/25/2009
--------�
: the next generation of web-newsreaders : http://www.recgroups.com
La Cosa Nostradamus
You are correct, unfortunately you were talking to a blowhard who spouts
off incessantly without bothering to know any facts.
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
______________________________________________________________________�
* kill-files, watch-lists, favorites, and more.. www.recgroups.com
intang...@yahoo.com
of AutoNation Inc., the U.S.'s largest chain of auto dealerships.
"There's a very compelling case the government should put more money
into it. It's a great stimulus to the economy."
Congress had expected the $1 billion set aside for the rebates to last
several months and set up the program to expire Nov. 1.
The speed with which it took off now puts it among the most successful
stimulus packages to come out of Washington since the start of the
recession. The boom in car sales will give a much-needed bump not just
to auto makers and dealers but also local government coffers that
collect taxes on car transactions.
Irish Mike
zot
Well not to worry bucko, let me explain it for you. Cash for Clunkers is
just another Obama entitlement program. You take money away from those
who earned it and you redistribute it to those who didn't earn it. You
tell the people who got the entitlement that they are victims and that if
they vote for Obama and the Democrats, big government will take care of
them - because they are entitled. So you take that old car, that ran well
and you owned or could afford and you trade it in for a big shiny new car
that you can't afford. You sign a deal where you are making payments on
this new status symbol for the next six or eight years. Then the rich
guy, who owns the business you work for, tells you that you are laid off.
He's sorry but the new Obama taxes and government regulations are costing
him so much that he has to cut expenses, which means your job. So you
join the ranks of the 3,000,000 Americans who have lost private sector
jobs since Obama was sworn in to office. Now you can't afford the
payments on your shiny new car because you have no job. What do you do?
No problem, you just stop making the payments on that new car. Obama
steps in, blames the problem on President Bush and announces that he is
going to take more money from those who earned it to bail out those who
didn't. It's just a mini-version of the sub-prime mortgage meltdown.
And you, use your unemployment money to go buy a driveabloe clunker you
can afford.
Irish Mike
"The problem with socialism is that, sooner or later, you run out of other
people's money."
______________________________________________________________________�
RecGroups : the community-oriented newsreader : www.recgroups.com
bub
latest i heard was the dealers had to use their own money to give the
customers for the "rebates"and were told by the feds they
didn't know how long it would take for the guvment to reimburse them.
On Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:12:28 -0700 (PDT), Olemite
<msol...@yahoo.com> wrote:
Irish Mike
> latest i heard was the dealers had to use their own money to give the
> customers for the "rebates"and were told by the feds they
> didn't know how long it would take for the guvment to reimburse them.
Hard to imagine given that that Obama's big new federal government
published a 126 page document of guidelines - all written in
red-tape-bureaucrat -esse of course. You think this is fucked up? Just
wait until the Federal government creates a trillion dollars worth of new
bureaucracies, committees and czars to administer socialized health care.
Not that we'll ever be able to pay the cost any way.
Irish Mike
"We have met the enemy and they is us" Pogo.
Schmedley
"Olemite" <msol...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:8b1d5645-687c-4e85...@f10g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
I read this article. What exactly was confusing? More like "wildly
successful" or "financial boondoggle" but hardly confusing. I was at a
dealer tonight who said that the money is gone and anyone who waited is SOL.
La Cosa Nostradamus
The money MAY be gone. The offer has been suspended for an indeterminate
amount of time.
The program has been so successful so quickly that our gvt does not know
yet how much money has been spent.
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
-----�
gtech1
program is responsible in part for job losses?
----�
Irish Mike
> On Jul 31 2009 1:16 AM, Schmedley wrote:
>
> > "Olemite" <msol...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> > news:8b1d5645-687c-4e85...@f10g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
> > >
>
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2009-07-30-cash-for-clunkers-program-suspended_N.htm
> > >
> > > If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
> > > hands on our health!
> > >
> > > NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
> > >
> > > Ole
> >
> > I read this article. What exactly was confusing? More like "wildly
> > successful" or "financial boondoggle" but hardly confusing. I was at a
> > dealer tonight who said that the money is gone and anyone who waited is
SOL.
>
>
> The money MAY be gone. The offer has been suspended for an indeterminate
> amount of time.
>
> The program has been so successful so quickly that our gvt does not know
> yet how much money has been spent.
So you take that old car, that ran well and you owned or could afford and
you trade it in for a big shiny new car that you can't afford. You sign a
deal where you are making payments on
this new status symbol for the next six or eight years. Then the "rich"
guy, who owns the business you work for, tells you that you are laid off.
He's sorry but the new Obama taxes and government regulations are costing
him so much that he has to cut expenses, which means your job. So you
join the ranks of the 3,000,000 Americans who have lost private sector
jobs since Obama was sworn in to office. Now you can't afford the
payments on your shiny new car because you have no job. What do you do?
No problem, you just stop making the payments. That's Obama economics in
action.
Irish Mike
"We have met the enemy and they is us".
La Cosa Nostradamus
I am not supporting the program. When i said it was sucessful i was
referring to the participation, not the merits of the ponzi programs of
our gvt.
>
> Irish Mike
>
> "We have met the enemy and they is us".
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
---�
Schmedley
"La Cosa Nostradamus" <a6f...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:pldak6x...@recgroups.com...
would be suprised what this controls), bad tires, and 21MPG. So no dough.
As a one timer, this wasn't the most horrible way to jump start sales. But
it is like crack, and they are already talking about v2 of this.
Schmedley
"Irish Mike" <ad7...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message
news:r28ak6x...@recgroups.com...
> On Jul 30 2009 11:31 PM, bub wrote:
>
>> latest i heard was the dealers had to use their own money to give the
>> customers for the "rebates"and were told by the feds they
>> didn't know how long it would take for the guvment to reimburse them.
>
> Hard to imagine given that that Obama's big new federal government
> published a 126 page document of guidelines - all written in
> red-tape-bureaucrat -esse of course.
Because the used car market is populated by trustworthy individuals who can
be relied on to follow the rules without any oversight.
mo_charles
> "It was an absolute success," said Michael J. Jackson, chief executive
> of AutoNation Inc., the U.S.'s largest chain of auto dealerships.
> "There's a very compelling case the government should put more money
> into it. It's a great stimulus to the economy."
ROFL
ROFLMAO
the ceo of autonation liked it????
LOL
mo_charles
________________________________________________________________________�
garycarson
Well, no, I dont want a bunch of car dealers running our health care.
I just bought a car via the cash for clunkers program. And car dealers
are idiots. the rules are failrly stupid and straightforward. I read
them.
But car dealers can't figure them out. The feds are talking about
suspending them becuase they went live with it without weeks of training
for the dealers. And the dealers aren't getting the paperwork done
properly. Tjere's a back log in paperwork that means the feds don't have
information on how many deals have been done so they can't maintain
accurate "dollars remaining" numbers on their website (which the law
requires them to do). So they might need to suspend the program to get
dealers time to catch up.
The paperwork isn't really that complicated. On my deal, I provided them
all the paperwork they needed excdept for cerfitication that the tradein
had been disabled and salvaged -- most dealers seem to be having trouble
figuring that out. One thing the rules require from dealers is for them
to provide me a "best guess" estimate of salvage value. All I got from
them when I asked about it was "well we can't know for sure until we
finalize on the salvage company we're going to use". I spent 5 minutes on
the internet and based on the gross weight of the car and scrap metal
prices I estimated slightly more than $200. The actual number turned out
to be $250.
Don't let a car salesman run your local health clinic.
I'm not finished with the post yet, but here's my story about the cash for
clunkers program.
http://americantradition.blogspot.com/2009/07/cash-for-clunkers.html
Mrs Irish Mike
junker program, were no longer for sale. Instead the dealers had a
bunch of $13K cars for sale instead. They looked like the same cars,
but not the same price tag. Just something I noticed.
garycarson
> On Jul 30 2009 9:12 PM, Olemite wrote:
>
> >
>
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2009-07-30-cash-for-clunkers-program-suspended_N.htm
> >
> > If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
> > hands on our health!
> >
> > NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
> >
> > Ole
>
> zot
>
> Well not to worry bucko, let me explain it for you. Cash for Clunkers is
> just another Obama entitlement program. You take money away from those
> who earned it and you redistribute it to those who didn't earn it.
Actually it's a tax on poor people. The supply of $1,000 vehicles is
going to be greatly diminished, and most drivers of clunkers can't afford
a new car even if they get $4,500 tradein. People looking to buy a $1000
car will find themselves having to pay !2 or 15, a tough nut for poor
people. At the same time the value of $10k or so used cars goes down
because you can buy a new car for the same price with the cash for
clunkers program.
So people in the market for $1000 cars lose, people driving $10k used cars
lose, and thw winners are GM executives and owners of local dealerships.
It's an extreme market distortion.
You
> tell the people who got the entitlement that they are victims and that if
> they vote for Obama and the Democrats, big government will take care of
> them - because they are entitled.
I'm thinking you might not realize who's benefiting from this deal.
> So you take that old car, that ran well
> and you owned or could afford and you trade it in for a big shiny new car
> that you can't afford.
Well I paid cash. I was in the market for a 2-3 year old used car but
with the cash for clunkers program was able to get a comparable new car
with a couple thousand less than I had expected to pay for a used car. So
I did benefit, but not nearly as much as the car manufactures benefit.
You sign a deal where you are making payments on
> this new status symbol for the next six or eight years.
You's be suprised how many of the cash for clunikers deals are cash deals.
It's important to do a cash deal because the dealerships want to get
leins on the new car to indemtyfy themselves for the risk of them screwing
up the paperwork and/or the feds being slow players. Letting them do a
loan allows them an opening to get that lein.
You just aren't very bright.
garycarson
> latest i heard was the dealers had to use their own money to give the
> customers for the "rebates"and were told by the feds they
> didn't know how long it would take for the guvment to reimburse them.
>
Ten days. That's pretty clear in the law and in the published rules. The
delay is in the dealers part of the transaction, not the feds. The
dealers are trying to make contingent sales, contingent on collecting from
the feds, which isn't possible because they don't get paid until the
clunker is destoryed. There's some risk there that the dealers just don't
understand. The only way around it for them is to not be part of the
program or commit fraud. To many dealers are doing the fraud thing.
________________________________________________________________________�
garycarson
> On Jul 30 2009 11:31 PM, bub wrote:
>
> > latest i heard was the dealers had to use their own money to give the
> > customers for the "rebates"and were told by the feds they
> > didn't know how long it would take for the guvment to reimburse them.
>
> Hard to imagine given that that Obama's big new federal government
> published a 126 page document of guidelines - all written in
> red-tape-bureaucrat -esse of course.
I think it's 135 pages, and it's clearly written. I read it. It didn't
take long.
-------�
garycarson
LOL. Always trust your car dealers.
I had one tell me the the money would probably all be gone within 24 hours
-- this was 2 days before the feds even accepted applications from dealers
to join the program.
--------�
garycarson
You have to provide documentation of 12 months registration and insurance
in the name of the new car buyer. You can do what you suggest, but it
involves a half dozen or so frauds and forgeries -- including forging
titles. If you're going to do all that why do it on a clunker, why not do
it on a $50k car?
Irish Mike
up with this bull shit plan to put a bandaid on the dying American car
manufacturers. Remember, Obama fired the last GM president and took over
the company. Some bureaucrat's in the new and expanded Obama Federal
government issue 126 pages of red tape and guidelines for the clunker
program. Then, when the program gets fucked up, you have the Obama kool
aid drinkers like Gary Carson who jump in and say it's all the car
dealer's fault. What a sad, predictable fucking joke.
Irish Mike
Irish Mike
"The problem with socialism is that, sooner or later, you run out of other
people's money."
----�
Schmedley
"garycarson" <garyc...@alumni.northwestern.edu> wrote in message
news:b5jbk6x...@recgroups.com...
bullshitting. Your point about the liens was interesting, I was wondering
what would happen if the fund rejected a claim.
It seems the Congress is scrambling to reallocate some money to keep the
party going.
garycarson
> "FL Turbo" <noem...@notime.com> wrote in message
>
> news:9je4751bradm3aon8...@4ax.com...
>
> > On Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:12:28 -0700 (PDT), Olemite
>
> >>http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2009-07-30-cash-for-clunkers-prog...
>
> >>If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
> >>hands on our health!
>
> >>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
>
> >>Ole
>
> > Ya gotta wonder what a bunch of dumbasses the Obama administration has
> > working for them when they open the door for someone to buy some old
> > clunker and turn it in for $4500 in trade for a new car.
>
> I understood there was a clause that you had to have owned it (title) for at
> least a year.
Not just ownership, it has to have been road legal, with continous
registration and liability insurance for the last year. I can't take
a broke down car out of the back yard if you've let the insurance
lapse for even one day at any time during the past 12 months.
You have to provide paper work on title, on registration history, on
insurance history, and the dealer has to certify that it's currently
raod worthy and that he's actually driven it on a public road.
Personally I don't see why it's a problem to allow a secondary market
for clunkers to develop, but the law says it's not allowed.
intang...@yahoo.com
>
> ROFL
> ROFLMAO
>
> the ceo of autonation liked it????
>
> LOL
>
> mo_charles
Your dismissive laughter perfectly illustrates why the Right has lost
touch with voters, lost their grip on power, and completely lost the
plot.
No ideas, no policies...only ridicule.
Raider Fan
We had a short discussion at our house about trading in the cheap used car
we bought 2 years ago with some excellent advice from a RGP poster.
Unfortunately, the local Kia dealer wasn't participating.
"This has got to be some sports-related crap, that's all Raiderfan gives a
fuck about." -- Paul Popinjay 2/27/09
FL Turbo
FL Turbo
<garyc...@alumni.northwestern.edu> wrote:
>On Jul 30 2009 8:34 PM, FL Turbo wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:12:28 -0700 (PDT), Olemite
>> <msol...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2009-07-30-cash-for-clunkers-program-suspended_N.htm
>> >
>> >If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
>> >hands on our health!
>> >
>> >NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
>> >
>> >Ole
>>
>> Ya gotta wonder what a bunch of dumbasses the Obama administration has
>> working for them when they open the door for someone to buy some old
>> clunker and turn it in for $4500 in trade for a new car.
>
>
>You have to provide documentation of 12 months registration and insurance
>in the name of the new car buyer. You can do what you suggest, but it
>involves a half dozen or so frauds and forgeries -- including forging
>titles. If you're going to do all that why do it on a clunker, why not do
>it on a $50k car?
>
Damn
You mean I have to keep on driving this old clunker for at least
another 8 months?
Just damn.
It would be my damn luck if the money hasn't run out by then.
mo_charles
> > ROFLMAO
> >
> > the ceo of autonation liked it????
> >
> > LOL
>
> touch with voters, lost their grip on power, and completely lost the
> plot.
i've lost touch with the intellectual denominators?
> No ideas, no policies...only ridicule.
if cash for shit cars qualifies as a sensible economic plan, we're doomed.
mo_charles
________________________________________________________________________�
garycarson
I had two dealers try to get me to approve a lein on the new car so that
they could come back and get the money (or the car) back from me if they
screwed it up. The first one we had a deal in place and they brought it
up at closing but I still had the tradein so I walked away from that one.
The other one tried it after we'd closed, I had possession of the new car
and they had possession of the tradein and I just told them no (actually I
think I laughed and said something like you can kiss my ass, you aren't
getting a lein).
The ones that have been rejected are ones that the dealer screwed up and
there are some dealers who are going to eat the money.
I got a call from my dealer this morning. She wanted to know the engine
size on the tradein. They've delivered it to the scrapyard. They need
that to complete the paper work to turn in to the fed. Part of that
paperwork is a certification (from them) that they personally inspected
the tradein. They didn't. Fuck 'em. I'm not going to guarentee them
from their inability to just follow the damn rules.
> It seems the Congress is scrambling to reallocate some money to keep the
> party going.
Yes, but what they really need to do to save the car industry is to have
the Wizard do what he did for the Scarecrow but for car dealerships.
garycarson
> Typical Gary Carson rationalization of any thing Obama does. Obama comes
> up with this bull shit plan to put a bandaid on the dying American car
> manufacturers. Remember, Obama fired the last GM president and took over
> the company. Some bureaucrat's in the new and expanded Obama Federal
> government issue 126 pages of red tape and guidelines for the clunker
> program. Then, when the program gets fucked up, you have the Obama kool
> aid drinkers like Gary Carson who jump in and say it's all the car
> dealer's fault. What a sad, predictable fucking joke.
Firing the CEO of GM is probably the only smart thing Obama has done since
he took office.
The Cash for Clunkers has some serious flaws, but the flaws don't include
any of the things you're whining about.
The flaws are the way it distorts the used car markets.
It's actually fairly easy to administer and might make a good model for
health care reform.
-------�
bub
wrote:
>Because the used car market is populated by trustworthy individuals who can
>be relied on to follow the rules without any oversight.
please substitute "the used car market" with "congress and the white
house " and "is " with "are"
thanks in advance
Irish Mike
So people in the market for $1000 cars lose, people driving $10k used cars
> lose, and thw winners are GM executives and owners of local dealerships.
>
Well bucko, it's a good thing Obama now owns GM, since he bailed them out
and fired the last CEO.
Irish Mike
----�
Clave
> On Jul 31 2009 1:23 PM, garycarson wrote:
>
> So people in the market for $1000 cars lose, people driving $10k used cars
>> lose, and thw winners are GM executives and owners of local dealerships.
>>
> Well bucko, it's a good thing Obama now owns GM, since he bailed them out
> and fired the last CEO.
And GM fought against that *so* hard...
Jim
Irish Mike
> On Jul 31 2009 1:02 PM, Irish Mike wrote:
>
> > Typical Gary Carson rationalization of any thing Obama does. Obama comes
> > up with this bull shit plan to put a bandaid on the dying American car
> > manufacturers. Remember, Obama fired the last GM president and took over
> > the company. Some bureaucrat's in the new and expanded Obama Federal
> > government issue 126 pages of red tape and guidelines for the clunker
> > program. Then, when the program gets fucked up, you have the Obama kool
> > aid drinkers like Gary Carson who jump in and say it's all the car
> > dealer's fault. What a sad, predictable fucking joke.
>
> Firing the CEO of GM is probably the only smart thing Obama has done since
> he took office.
Careful Carson. Talk like that will result in immediate cancellation of
your membership in the lunatic liberal left Obama worshiper's society.
They will confiscate your Obama kool aid bucket, block your television
access to MSNBC and kick you out of the Chris "a thrill ran up my leg when
I heard Obama speak" Matthews fan club.
Irish Mike
"Proud to be one of the nearly 60,000,000 Americans who did not vote for
Obama".
-----�
Travel A
how all the other industries and unions in the country now want a
"clunker deal".
Obama subsidized: trade your electricity wasting, clunker washing
machine in for a new one, etc. How about air conditioners? Just about
anything.
How about food wasting fat kids? Trade-them-in to the government for
skinny kids.
La Cosa Nostradamus
Let's look at the bottom line.
This program destroys perfectly good PARTS and probably some good cars
As Gary stated somewhere, this messes with the used car market also.
Obama is looking more and more like a crack dealer
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
____________________________________________________________________�
garycarson
wrote:
Some newspaper oped nutcase said that the program is expected to cause
a 3rd quarter increase in GDP. It's going to do so by destruction of
property that causes a net reduction in wealth. It's a really stupid
program, but not for any of the reasons the Sean's and Rush's of the
world are whining about.
If it wasn't for the Sean's and Rush's of the world trying to play
"gotcha" it wouldn't be so important to Obama to come up with a
bullshit program like this that artifically raises GDP by destruction
of wealth.
Pepe Papon
The program might have been a net plus if it had required the new car
to be American made. But then, of course, we'd catch hell from the
WTO.
--
~ Seth Jackson
MySpace URL - http://www.myspace.com/sethjacksonsong
Songwriting and Music Business Info: http://www.sethjackson.net
brewmaster
> On Jul 30, 7:48�pm, "susan" <hotda...@charter.net> wrote:
> > "FL Turbo" <noem...@notime.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:9je4751bradm3aon8...@4ax.com...
> >
> > > On Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:12:28 -0700 (PDT), Olemite
> > > <msolso...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >>http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2009-07-30-cash-for-clunkers-prog....
> >
> > >>If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
> > >>hands on our health!
> >
> > >>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
> >
> > >>Ole
> >
> > > Ya gotta wonder what a bunch of dumbasses the Obama administration has
> > > working for them when they open the door for someone to buy some old
> > > clunker and turn it in for $4500 in trade for a new car.
> >
> > I understood there was a clause that you had to have owned it (title) for
at
> > least a year.
>
>
> Not just ownership, it has to have been road legal, with continous
> registration and liability insurance for the last year. I can't take
> a broke down car out of the back yard if you've let the insurance
> lapse for even one day at any time during the past 12 months.
>
> You have to provide paper work on title, on registration history, on
> insurance history, and the dealer has to certify that it's currently
> raod worthy and that he's actually driven it on a public road.
>
> Personally I don't see why it's a problem to allow a secondary market
> for clunkers to develop, but the law says it's not allowed.
Because they are trying to get the gas-guzzling polluting clunkers off the
road.
Brew
--
Hatred is purity...weakness is disease!
brewmaster
First 1BB is gone, but I heard today that they are trying to approve
another 2BB (if they haven't already). That won't last 8 months either
though.
Brew
--
Hatred is purity...weakness is disease!
--------�
brewmaster
> On Jul 30, 7:48�pm, "susan" <hotda...@charter.net> wrote:
> > "FL Turbo" <noem...@notime.com> wrote in message
> >
> > news:9je4751bradm3aon8...@4ax.com...
> >
> > > On Thu, 30 Jul 2009 17:12:28 -0700 (PDT), Olemite
> > > <msolso...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >>http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2009-07-30-cash-for-clunkers-prog....
> >
> > >>If you think that's confusing, wait till the government gets their
> > >>hands on our health!
> >
> > >>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
> >
> > >>Ole
> >
> > > Ya gotta wonder what a bunch of dumbasses the Obama administration has
> > > working for them when they open the door for someone to buy some old
> > > clunker and turn it in for $4500 in trade for a new car.
> >
> > I understood there was a clause that you had to have owned it (title) for
at
> > least a year.
>
>
> Not just ownership, it has to have been road legal, with continous
> registration and liability insurance for the last year. I can't take
> a broke down car out of the back yard if you've let the insurance
> lapse for even one day at any time during the past 12 months.
>
> You have to provide paper work on title, on registration history, on
> insurance history, and the dealer has to certify that it's currently
> raod worthy and that he's actually driven it on a public road.
>
> Personally I don't see why it's a problem to allow a secondary market
> for clunkers to develop, but the law says it's not allowed.
nm, I misunderstood your post. You are correct, and I agree with you.
Brew
--
Hatred is purity...weakness is disease!
______________________________________________________________________�
brewmaster
> On Sat, 1 Aug 2009 16:01:12 -0700 (PDT), garycarson
> <garyc...@alumni.northwestern.edu> wrote:
>
> >On Aug 1, 3:16�ｿｽpm, "La Cosa Nostradamus" <a6f4...@webnntp.invalid>
> >wrote:
> >> On Aug 1 2009 3:07 PM, Travel A wrote:
> >>
> >> > There was a commentator on the news, somewhere or other, talking about
> >> > how all the other industries and unions in the country now want a
> >> > "clunker deal".
> >>
> >> > Obama subsidized: trade your electricity wasting, clunker washing
> >> > machine in for a new one, etc. How about air conditioners? Just about
> >> > anything.
> >>
> >> > How about food wasting fat kids? Trade-them-in to the government for
> >> > skinny kids.
> >>
> >> Let's look at the bottom line.
> >>
> >> This program destroys perfectly good PARTS and probably some good cars
> >>
> >> As Gary stated somewhere, this messes with the used car market also.
> >>
> >> Obama is looking more and more like a crack dealer
> >>
> >> "FukyRed is my wife. �ｿｽYears ago we had a semi regular group that would
> >> play $5 SNGs together. �ｿｽMost of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
> >> when she had time." XaQ Morphy �ｿｽ �ｿｽ Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
> >>
> >> December 21,2012 playlist
> >>
> >> http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
> >>
> Some newspaper oped nutcase said that the program is expected to cause
> >a 3rd quarter increase in GDP. It's going to do so by destruction of
> >property that causes a net reduction in wealth. It's a really stupid
> >program, but not for any of the reasons the Sean's and Rush's of the
> >world are whining about.
> >
> >If it wasn't for the Sean's and Rush's of the world trying to play
> >"gotcha" it wouldn't be so important to Obama to come up with a
> >bullshit program like this that artifically raises GDP by destruction
> >of wealth.
>
> The program might have been a net plus if it had required the new car
> to be American made. But then, of course, we'd catch hell from the
> WTO.
You'd end up taking classics off the road (well, pre-restored classics)
like Mustangs, GTOs, etc. They should require them to all be Hondas and
Toyotas.
> --
> ~ Seth Jackson
>
> MySpace URL - http://www.myspace.com/sethjacksonsong
> Songwriting and Music Business Info: http://www.sethjackson.net
Brew
--
Hatred is purity...weakness is disease!
----�ｿｽ
La Cosa Nostradamus
> On Aug 1, 3:16�ｿｽpm, "La Cosa Nostradamus" <a6f4...@webnntp.invalid>
> wrote:
> > On Aug 1 2009 3:07 PM, Travel A wrote:
> >
> > > There was a commentator on the news, somewhere or other, talking about
> > > how all the other industries and unions in the country now want a
> > > "clunker deal".
> >
> > > Obama subsidized: trade your electricity wasting, clunker washing
> > > machine in for a new one, etc. How about air conditioners? Just about
> > > anything.
> >
> > > How about food wasting fat kids? Trade-them-in to the government for
> > > skinny kids.
> >
> > Let's look at the bottom line.
> >
> > This program destroys perfectly good PARTS and probably some good cars
> >
> > As Gary stated somewhere, this messes with the used car market also.
> >
> > Obama is looking more and more like a crack dealer
> >
> > "FukyRed is my wife. �ｿｽYears ago we had a semi regular group that would
> > play $5 SNGs together. �ｿｽMost of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
> > when she had time." XaQ Morphy �ｿｽ �ｿｽ Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
> >
> > December 21,2012 playlist
> >
> > http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
> >
> Some newspaper oped nutcase said that the program is expected to cause
> a 3rd quarter increase in GDP. It's going to do so by destruction of
> property that causes a net reduction in wealth.
YUP those guzzling motors could go into trucks and vans. Alternators, etc.
The bottom line is a net reduction in wealth
It's a really stupid
> program, but not for any of the reasons the Sean's and Rush's of the
> world are whining about.
>
> If it wasn't for the Sean's and Rush's of the world trying to play
> "gotcha" it wouldn't be so important to Obama to come up with a
> bullshit program like this that artifically raises GDP by destruction
> of wealth.
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
---�ｿｽ
Pepe Papon
<a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>> The program might have been a net plus if it had required the new car
>> to be American made. But then, of course, we'd catch hell from the
>> WTO.
>
>You'd end up taking classics off the road (well, pre-restored classics)
>like Mustangs, GTOs, etc. They should require them to all be Hondas and
>Toyotas.
Hondas and Toyotas all get good gas mileage.
brewmaster
> On Sat, 01 Aug 2009 16:51:42 -0700, "brewmaster"
> <a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>
> >> The program might have been a net plus if it had required the new car
> >> to be American made. But then, of course, we'd catch hell from the
> >> WTO.
> >
> >You'd end up taking classics off the road (well, pre-restored classics)
> >like Mustangs, GTOs, etc. They should require them to all be Hondas and
> >Toyotas.
>
> Hondas and Toyotas all get good gas mileage.
Worthless ugly pieces of crap I wouldn't be caught dead in.
> --
> ~ Seth Jackson
>
> MySpace URL - http://www.myspace.com/sethjacksonsong
> Songwriting and Music Business Info: http://www.sethjackson.net
Brew
--
Hatred is purity...weakness is disease!
_______________________________________________________________________�
otter
wrote:
> LOL. Always trust your car dealers.
>
> I had one tell me the the money would probably all be gone within 24 hours
> -- this was 2 days before the feds even accepted applications from dealers
> to join the program.
My dealer told me Saturday that the money would be gone in 4 days.
Sure enough, the first $1B ran out Tuesday. Although I've heard that
they have now allocated another $2B. Lucky we got there early
Saturday morning. When we returned later Saturday to finish the deal,
there were people waiting for hours just to talk to a salesman.
otter
wrote:
> On Jul 31 2009 11:20 AM, Mrs Irish Mike wrote:
>
> > I did notice that cars that were going for less than $10K before the
> > junker program, were no longer for sale. Instead the dealers had a
> > bunch of $13K cars for sale instead. They looked like the same cars,
> > but not the same price tag. Just something I noticed.
>
> We had a short discussion at our house about trading in the cheap used car
> we bought 2 years ago with some excellent advice from a RGP poster.
> Unfortunately, the local Kia dealer wasn't participating.
>
dealer in Austin is participating. There is probably one even
closer. Double-check on the internet that your old car qualifies,
though.
otter
> I did notice that cars that were going for less than $10K before the
> junker program, were no longer for sale. Instead the dealers had a
> bunch of $13K cars for sale instead. They looked like the same cars,
> but not the same price tag. Just something I noticed.
I noticed some cars had pretty blatant "packs" added to the sticker.
The car I bought had a list price of $19.5K, but there was another
sticker which added some packs (Vin registration $990, "Market
Adjustment" $1K, etc.). Altogether the asking price was $22K+. We
talked to salesman for a short while, and he dropped all the packs,
and added a rebate. We ended up paying $12.5K. I thought that was
pretty decent for a Kia Optima..
It is important to note that the $4500 doesn't come out of the
dealer's pocket. He still got $17K for the car, so it is still a good
deal for him.
otter
wrote:
> YUP those guzzling motors could go into trucks and vans. Alternators, etc.
The point of the program was to get those "guzzling" motors off the
road. If it drives up the prices in used parts, it may force other
gas guzzlers to be traded in for more efficient cars or trucks as a
positive side-effect (in the view of the program's goal).
Is it a waste of car parts? Sure. But that wasn't the goal of the
program.
FL Turbo
The Demos have a winner here.
They are always on the lookout for more effective ways to hand out
government (aka taxpayer) money.
The last I heard, one Demo Senator was proposing to increase it by
another $1B.
That oughta extend it for at least another few weeks.
Unfortunately for me, it won't last long enough for me to go through
another 8 months to qualify with my clunker.
Damn.
Oh well.
Guess I'll just have to get used to the idea that us poor people will
have to pay higher prices for used cars in the future.
FL Turbo
Someone needs to introduce Liberals to the "Law of Unintended
Consequences"
They might not quite "feeeel" so good if they thought things through.
La Cosa Nostradamus
How much longer would your clunkerwork if it wasnt destroyed ?
I am not faulting you for taking the deal. I am trying to prove the point
to another poster that SOME of the cars to be destroyed aren't at the end
of their lifespan
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
----�
La Cosa Nostradamus
> On Aug 1, 7:13�pm, "La Cosa Nostradamus" <a6f4...@webnntp.invalid>
>
> Is it a waste of car parts? Sure. But that wasn't the goal of the
> program.
EXACTLY
A poorly thought out program that destroys lots of alternators and
universal parts is not the best choice.
My Dad's friend, Lee Iacocca, rebuilt Chrysler with spare parts. The parts
weren't used, they were overstock. Throwing away used stuff that is usable
is not very smart.
"FukyRed is my wife. Years ago we had a semi regular group that would
play $5 SNGs together. Most of them were from RGP, and my wife joined in
when she had time." XaQ Morphy Jul 27 2009 3:22 PM
December 21,2012 playlist
http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=D3A0E9D9365E4D5B
_______________________________________________________________________�
garycarson
> On Jul 31, 11:36�am, "garycarson" <garycar...@alumni.northwestern.edu>
> wrote:
> > LOL. �Always trust your car dealers.
> >
> > I had one tell me the the money would probably all be gone within 24 hours
> > -- this was 2 days before the feds even accepted applications from dealers
> > to join the program.
>
> My dealer told me Saturday that the money would be gone in 4 days.
> Sure enough, the first $1B ran out Tuesday.
LOL.
By Wednesday they'd used less than 10 percent of the money.
They still havn't run out.
> Although I've heard that
> they have now allocated another $2B. Lucky we got there early
> Saturday morning. When we returned later Saturday to finish the deal,
> there were people waiting for hours just to talk to a salesman.
Yes, car dealers got alot of traffic, and they simply lied to you to try
to get you to feel a sense of urgency to buy.
otter
wrote:
> On Aug 2 2009 1:16 PM, otter wrote:
>
> > On Jul 31, 11:36 am, "garycarson" <garycar...@alumni.northwestern.edu>
> > wrote:
> > > LOL. Always trust your car dealers.
>
> > > I had one tell me the the money would probably all be gone within 24 hours
> > > -- this was 2 days before the feds even accepted applications from dealers
> > > to join the program.
>
> > My dealer told me Saturday that the money would be gone in 4 days.
> > Sure enough, the first $1B ran out Tuesday.
>
> LOL.
>
> By Wednesday they'd used less than 10 percent of the money.
>
> They still havn't run out.
Really? That's not what I heard on TV today. In fact, I believe it
was on Fox News, which is probably your prime source. They said they
ran out of the first $1B in 4 days.
Pepe Papon
<a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>On Aug 2 2009 1:47 AM, Pepe Papon wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 01 Aug 2009 16:51:42 -0700, "brewmaster"
>> <a1...@webnntp.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> >> The program might have been a net plus if it had required the new car
>> >> to be American made. But then, of course, we'd catch hell from the
>> >> WTO.
>> >
>> >You'd end up taking classics off the road (well, pre-restored classics)
>> >like Mustangs, GTOs, etc. They should require them to all be Hondas and
>> >Toyotas.
>>
>> Hondas and Toyotas all get good gas mileage.
>
>Worthless ugly pieces of crap I wouldn't be caught dead in.
I used to have a Honda. Loved it. Got 50mpg in real driving
conditions.
Never had a Toyota, but I've had 3 Nissans. Great, reliable cars.
garycarson
LOL
Fox news is probably less reliable than car dealers.
The feds are saying that if they don't get an infusion of more money
they'll probably suspend the program after Tuesday.
Not because they are out of money, but because the car dealers have
finished a lot of deals they havn't sumitted the paper work for and they
might need to suspend the program to allow that paper work to get
submitted so they'll know how much money is left.
They aren't out of money and won't be for a while but they might supend
the program in a few days (not cancel it).
Please just change the channel if you ever want news about health care,
cash for clunkers, Michille's Victory Garden, Sotomayer, or Kenyan
citizenship..
-------�