Ping C - NSU

[popinjay]

I was looking through old notes. Did you know that in NSU there is one situation where you would hold AT-suited, (non-progressive), instead of drawing five?

The hand is AT975, where 975 is rainbow, and all different from the suit of the AT. I think you can expect this hand 1 in 100,000 hands, and you will gain 1/10th of a cent, after pushing through $500,000.

Maybe I posted this a few years ago. But it's still interesting.

[risky biz]

Even with a 3-gap I would find it intuitively compelling to hold the AT-suited with 4 wild cards in the deck. But the truth is that I still haven't learned DW even moderately well.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

You may have. I remember you are a student of vp arcana. I, on the other hand, like to keep it nice n easy... to keep from over taxing my tender gray matter. Gambling is not my profession. I make money at it, but I don't average more than a few hours play per week. I leave very little expectation on the table by playing penalty free strategy. I need to find a better play if I'm sweating the penalty cards, though I admit I miss some insight into the game by my lack of study. Of course, now I will be looking for 975 rainbow every time I'm dealt suited A10. Ignorance was bliss.

C

[popinjay]

On Monday, April 10, 2017 at 9:15:03 PM UTC-7, risky biz wrote:



>
> Even with a 3-gap I would find it intuitively compelling to hold the AT-suited with 4 wild cards in the deck. But the truth is that I still haven't learned DW even moderately well.

Deuces Wild is a horse of a different color. You normally don't keep AK, AQ, AJ, or AT suited by themselves. (non-progressive) Notice they are ALL 3-gap.

But the hand I listed is so rare, I'm sure I must have read about it and then written it down. I found the notes while looking at old files a few days ago and thought it still interesting.

[popinjay]

I finally got to re-double on hard 12 last night when it was the correct decision. (Spanish 21) I've been waiting to do that. The dealer yelled out to the Floor, "Player doubling on hard 12!" I jokingly said, "Hey, don't yell to everyone how stupid I am". :-) I hit a 9 and he re-yelled "Player won, not so stupid!" We all laughed.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Any 2 RF containing an ace (no deuce) is a discard. 2RF with ace can't make an sf? Fewer straight possibilities? I haven't analyzed it. Is that weird little deuces progressive still at the GN?

C

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Re double? You get to double twice?

C

[popinjay]

On Tuesday, April 11, 2017 at 12:34:33 PM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:



>
> Any 2 RF containing an ace (no deuce) is a discard.

Not AT975 lol


Not sure about the Golden Nugget. Is that the one that resets at 95% or so, 6-way?

[popinjay]

On Tuesday, April 11, 2017 at 12:37:17 PM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:



>
> Re double? You get to double twice?
>
> C

Dealer shows a 6, my hand is 2,3. I double.

I catch an Ace. A,2,3. I re-double.

I catch a 2. A,2,3,2. I re-re-double. (last one)

I catch a 3. A,2,3,2,3. 21, paid immediately.

Also, splitting up to four hands, I have done it many times, including Aces, and Aces can be hit and re-hit.

Ok, dealer has an 8 showing. I have 5,6. I double, and catch another 5, for 16. I forfeit, or "rescue". (surrender half of my bet)

Fun game!

[popinjay]

On Tuesday, April 11, 2017 at 3:11:01 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:



I'm dealt hard 17 versus an Ace. I surrender.

I'm dealt 3,4 against an Ace. I catch a Jack for 17. I HIT!

Fun game!

[popinjay]

The other night I have 7-clubs and 7-clubs. Dealer has a 7-diamonds.

My play is not to split, but hit. If I catch another 7-clubs I win $5000. And everyone at the table gets an "envy" $50. I have to be betting minimum green chips, or the bonus is smaller.

Alas, I did not catch a 7-clubs.

[popinjay]

On Tuesday, April 11, 2017 at 3:11:01 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:



>

> Ok, dealer has an 8 showing. I have 5,6. I double, and catch another 5, for 16. I forfeit, or "rescue". (surrender half of my bet)
>

If I caught an Ace for hard 12, the correct play is to re-double versus a 7 or 8.

If dealer has 2 thru 6 and I catch an Ace, I stand on 12.

If dealer has 9 thru Ace and I catch an Ace, I "double-down rescue", or surrender half my total bet.

[risky biz]

I should hold a TJ-suited or even a TQ-suited but not an AT-suited in UX DW. The difference is that I can hit a SF in either direction with the first two and either no-gap or 1-gap in the first two. I still find it hard to discard ANY two to a royal in DW.

[popinjay]

On Wednesday, April 12, 2017 at 7:30:01 AM UTC-7, risky biz wrote:


>
> I should hold a TJ-suited or even a TQ-suited but not an AT-suited in UX DW. The difference is that I can hit a SF in either direction with the first two and either no-gap or 1-gap in the first two. I still find it hard to discard ANY two to a royal in DW.

I was addressing NSU (16-10) DW specifically, but generally in DW you do not hold AK, AQ, AJ, or AT suited.

I think JT-suited is more powerful than any other 2-card RF, even QJ. That's off the top of my head without checking.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

I don't remember the pay table. I just remember the meters went down to something like quads. I was pretty amused with a progressive meter that got hit every couple of minutes.

C

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Wow. Action city.

C

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Is that bonus standard? A side bet? My curiosity is piqued. I'll have to look the game up. I don't play much, but I once caught a quad on Let It Ride. One bet removed. Playing with a bunch of friends just for kicks. That was fun.

C

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

10J, 10Q and JQ sooted over an inside straight draw. Inside straight draw over all other 2 RF draws. Intuition doesn't quite hack it when it comes to Double bonus or deuces. The good news is that most of your advantage is coming from multipliers rather than strategy decisions.

C

[popinjay]

The bonus is part of the game, not a side bet. The game is patented by Masque.

Basic Strategy brings the HE to .40%, the bonus brings it down to maybe .39 or .38, I think. That's with re-doubling allowed. If not, and just H17, then the HE is something like .68 or .78, I forget right now. If the game is S17, then the HE is also close to .4. So far I have only seen re-doubling and H17. I've seen it with six decks in four casinos and eight decks in one place.

Also part of the game, no side bet, is extra pay for:

678 rainbow 3:2
678 suited 2:1
678 spades 3:1
777 rainbow 3:2
777 suited 2:1
777 spades 3:1
5-card 21 3:2
6-card 21 2:1
7+ card 21 3:1

These bonuses effect strategy occasionally.

Such as, 13 should be Hit against all dealer upcards, except 6 you would stand. If you have a 4-card 13 you would Hit, and if you catch an 8, you get paid 3:2 immediately for 5-card 21. If your 13 is 67, you should hit and try for an 8.

Now do you see why it's taking me so long to learn this game? Regular blackjack is a snap.

[Bea Foroni]

Perfect V.P. play can get you the smallest of edges in Nevada, so where you'd make less than minimum wage if you had thousand of dollars bankroll and all the time in the world. That's in Vegas, certainly not at an Indian casino.

Minor wins release hormones that make the player feel good. Even 'close misses' will trigger the release of these feel good chemicals. Players who do not keep scrupulous records will FEEL like winners but the truth will be something else.

[popinjay]

On Wednesday, April 12, 2017 at 10:17:37 PM UTC-7, Bea Foroni wrote:
> Perfect V.P. play can get you the smallest of edges in Nevada, so where you'd make less than minimum wage if you had thousand of dollars bankroll and all the time in the world. That's in Vegas, certainly not at an Indian casino.
>

You haven't the foggiest idea what you're talking about. So what else is new?

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Wow. There are a lot more variables. I'll see if they have a rule pamphlet next time I pass a table.

C

[Bea Foroni]

I know exactly what I'm talking about. There is no vp machine that pays out odds that can allow you to make a living. The best you can do is more slowly piss away your government check. Even if you found a machine that returned 101%, you'd still have to dump $1,000 into it to get enough for a profit that'd get you a beer and a hotdog- if you played perfectly.

If someone was posting to this group the best way to hunt unicorns, I'd say bullshit. And bullshit to video poker being worth anyone's time or money.

[popinjay]

On Thursday, April 13, 2017 at 4:07:36 PM UTC-7, Bea Foroni wrote:
> I know exactly what I'm talking about. There is no vp machine that pays out odds that can allow you to make a living. The best you can do is more slowly piss away your government check. Even if you found a machine that returned 101%, you'd still have to dump $1,000 into it to get enough for a profit that'd get you a beer and a hotdog- if you played perfectly.
>
> If someone was posting to this group the best way to hunt unicorns, I'd say bullshit. And bullshit to video poker being worth anyone's time or money.

You're wrong, and you're stupid. Period. You are also a math illiterate. And I have no desire to wise you up.

[popinjay]

I played a DW game tonight where it was correct to hold A-high RF2 with no wild cards.

Here's the paytable, with three progressive jackpots. $3497 Royal $590 Quad Deuces $250 Wild Royal.

1 - 2 - 3 - 3 - 4 - 9 - 20 - JK#3 - JK#2 - JK#1 101.18%

It's rare that I play this because the numbers are usually not high enough so I don't keep myself fine-tuned on it. But somebody must have gave it some action because I knew the Wild Royal was higher than normal and would make it playable, although I didn't know how much until I got home. I played it off, only cracked the Wild Royal and then quit. I had three shots at 222 but didn't connect.

I was looking to play a progressive keno at over $2200 for 7 out of 8 but I found the DW first and decided to work on it first. I lost a couple hundred on the DW, then jumped on the Keno. I got lucky. I was into it only $200 when I hit it, and it was at the same time a drawing was going on so I left the machine to go watch the drawing. When I got back they had my W2 waiting for me. Cashback made the Keno a percent play and I could put through $1200 an hour, not really a good play for the variance and I wanted to wait a few days till it was a better play, but I took my shot and got lucky. I did not get picked in the drawing.

[VegasJerry]

On Thursday, April 13, 2017 at 4:07:36 PM UTC-7, Bea Foroni wrote:
> I know exactly what I'm talking about. There is no vp machine that pays out odds that can allow you to make a living. The best you can do is more slowly piss away your government check. Even if you found a machine that returned 101%, you'd still have to dump $1,000 into it to get enough for a profit that'd get you a beer and a hotdog- if you played perfectly.
>
> If someone was posting to this group the best way to hunt unicorns, I'd say bullshit. And bullshit to video poker being worth anyone's time or money.

I saw a couple of guys that had the right idea. They got machines right near the Sports Book. They played VP real slow, watched the big screen sports in sports book, and got complimentary beers. What a way to spend the day…

[popinjay]

You're no help. But nothing will help her anyway.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

People are so sure of everything here. It's amazing. They know so much.

C

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

I have lousy luck on drawings... so far. I was in a drawing last year at some casino cocktail do. I was near these two women who I recognized. Lots of $ 5 and 10 play action on inferior games. If prizes were not claimed within a certain amount of time another player was drawn. The house seemed to let the clock go an extra few seconds before the prize was claimed and the ladies went ape shit. Shouts of "that's not right! That's bullshit!!!" as they stormed out of the room. Last minute entertainment before the room cleared. It has become my protest declaration every time I miss on a drawing now.

I wish there were more progressive opportunities around me. There aren't many and most are playable only once in a blue moon. I've seen no keno. It sounds like your playing environment is richer than mine. About how many casino options do you have within a couple of hours drive... if that's not giving up too much. I have maybe 10.

C

[popinjay]

On Saturday, April 15, 2017 at 6:05:31 AM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:


>
> I have lousy luck on drawings... so far. I was in a drawing last year at some casino cocktail do. I was near these two women who I recognized. Lots of $ 5 and 10 play action on inferior games. If prizes were not claimed within a certain amount of time another player was drawn. The house seemed to let the clock go an extra few seconds before the prize was claimed and the ladies went ape shit. Shouts of "that's not right! That's bullshit!!!" as they stormed out of the room. Last minute entertainment before the room cleared. It has become my protest declaration every time I miss on a drawing now.
>
> I wish there were more progressive opportunities around me. There aren't many and most are playable only once in a blue moon. I've seen no keno. It sounds like your playing environment is richer than mine. About how many casino options do you have within a couple of hours drive... if that's not giving up too much. I have maybe 10.
>
> C

I don't really have much around me and I'm trying really hard to supplement my living with what I've got. Personal reasons are keeping me from moving to Nevada at this time. I hope to move before I die.

[Bea Foroni]

On Saturday, April 15, 2017 at 12:05:08 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:

>
> I don't really have much around me and I'm trying really hard to supplement my living with what I've got.

You might be trying hard, but you're also trying stupid. In the long run no one wins except the casino. Sure, some get lucky and win the jackpot, but you ain't lucky.

Supplement your income. Like get a job? I'm thinking that is beyond your capabilities.

Why not instead of "supplementing" your income, make your income go farther. One way is to cook more- nothing out of a box, can or jar.

Make friends. Two can live as cheaply as one. It doesn't have to be every aspect of your life, but a little saving here and a little there and pretty soon you'll have something left over at the end of the month.

Volunteer. Do work for Meals on Wheels and you'll get a free meal once in a while. All kinds of rewards come from doing sacrifice, some tangible and others not.

Google, frugal. Plenty of ideas to make your money last. I remember being so poor I couldn't afford the laundromat, I would wash my clothes in the sink and hang them to dry. Even today I will hang clothes to dry to save a buck.

But hare-brained ideas to make money in a casino is a fool's quest.

Good luck.

[popinjay]

On Saturday, April 15, 2017 at 11:48:43 PM UTC-7, Bea Foroni wrote:


>
> You might be trying hard, but you're also trying stupid. In the long run no one wins except the casino. Sure, some get lucky and win the jackpot, but you ain't lucky.
>
> Supplement your income. Like get a job? I'm thinking that is beyond your capabilities.
>
> Why not instead of "supplementing" your income, make your income go farther. One way is to cook more- nothing out of a box, can or jar.
>
> Make friends. Two can live as cheaply as one. It doesn't have to be every aspect of your life, but a little saving here and a little there and pretty soon you'll have something left over at the end of the month.
>
> Volunteer. Do work for Meals on Wheels and you'll get a free meal once in a while. All kinds of rewards come from doing sacrifice, some tangible and others not.
>
> Google, frugal. Plenty of ideas to make your money last. I remember being so poor I couldn't afford the laundromat, I would wash my clothes in the sink and hang them to dry. Even today I will hang clothes to dry to save a buck.
>
> But hare-brained ideas to make money in a casino is a fool's quest.
>
> Good luck.

Shut the fuck up you old hag. Geezus, you don't even have your own washing machine and you are giving ME advice? That's hilarious.

[Clave]

"Bea Foroni" <wilm...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1145da96-9013-4a03...@googlegroups.com...

> On Saturday, April 15, 2017 at 12:05:08 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:
>
>>
>> I don't really have much around me and I'm trying really hard to
>> supplement my living with what I've got.
>
> You might be trying hard, but you're also trying stupid. In the long run
> no one wins except the casino. Sure, some get lucky and win the jackpot,
> but you ain't lucky.
>
> Supplement your income. Like get a job? I'm thinking that is beyond your
> capabilities.

Imagine PopinTwat being a WalMart greeter.

[popinjay]

On Sunday, April 16, 2017 at 12:21:11 AM UTC-7, Clave wrote:


>
> Imagine PopinTwat being a WalMart greeter.

Good one. Save that for Fl Turbo.

[Bea Foroni]

He can't work for Wal-Mart, he'll make too much money and then they'll cut off his government teat check.

I was trying to be nice, but he is so contemptuous of those who pay for his gilded cage existence.

PP is the poster boy for universal income. He'd be free to pursue employment without fear of losing his safety net. Instead, he's forced to work lame-brained pursuits to get some little extras. No wonder he's angry, trapped in a white trash hell.

First it was poker, then it was betting on horses, now it's slot machines. Anything to escape a hopeless future where is only escape is fantasies of being a casino tycoon, and his self-worth comes from seeing his whiteness as making him superior to at least some around him.

[popinjay]

On Sunday, April 16, 2017 at 11:03:31 AM UTC-7, Bea Foroni wrote:



> No wonder he's angry, trapped in a white trash hell.
>

You don't even have your own washer-dryer. I mean, seriously, do you know how long it's been since I've had to use a public coin washer? Decades ago, I can't remember that far back. And you think you are qualified to give ME advice? When you think a significant financial strategy is to save money by hanging up your clothes to dry? I'm curious, I know it rains up there 300 days a year, when do you get a chance to do laundry? You must stink to high heaven.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

The year before last I made enough to live on... I mean, if I moved to a studio apartment and ate tuna casserole every night. I was on my way to a 1 bedroom, but I had a dismal December. Not bad for a few hours per week. I was lucky, but some years you get lucky. Some years you don't. I think in Vegas, it would be very easy to supplement an income. Hope you get out there soon.

C

[popinjay]

On Monday, April 17, 2017 at 4:52:15 AM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:



>
> The year before last I made enough to live on... I mean, if I moved to a studio apartment and ate tuna casserole every night. I was on my way to a 1 bedroom, but I had a dismal December. Not bad for a few hours per week. I was lucky, but some years you get lucky. Some years you don't. I think in Vegas, it would be very easy to supplement an income. Hope you get out there soon.
>
> C

I won another drawing. I can't believe it. In the last few months I have entered three drawings, and scored in two of them. This time I was picked third out of a big barrel of tickets, and won another thousand. I'm lucky.

I've got a new move to make friends with. Recently I mentioned to you that I learned one should HIT a 3-or-more-card hard 17 against an Ace. (Spanish 21) Surrender when dealt 17, but HIT when you have proceeded. So, now that I am playing this way, I have had dealers call the floorman, I have received dirty looks and dirty comments from many players. One old Chinese man who could not speak English just went ballistic on me. I don't know what he was saying, but I'm sure it was awful. I, and the dealer, couldn't help laughing, it was funny. Even funnier when I hit a 3 or 4.

[popinjay]

On Monday, April 17, 2017 at 7:14:21 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:


Had a good hand today. Against a dealer's 6, I split Aces into four hands. Actually kinda surprising how many times I have done that in the few months I've been playing. Anyway, my base bet was $50.

First and second Aces caught a paint for an immediate win. Third Ace caught something like a 2. I double. Catch a 3. Re-double, catch a 4, for 20, and stand on it. That's $200.

Fourth and final Ace catches a 2. I double, catch a 3 like the third hand, re-double and catch a 2, for soft-18. I re-re-double (final time, making it $400) and catch an 8, for hard 16. Damn. Option is to stand, or rescue. I stand and praying for dealer to bust. $600 riding and hoping for a bust. Dealer makes 22 and I rake in a pot like it's hold'em. Plus the $100 on the first two hands that caught paints.

Not a bad split of Aces. Yee haw.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Cool. I actually stopped by the S21 table on Saturday hoping they had some sort of rules card, but had to settle for staring at their table plaque. Too much to digest in a short amount of time. Bad weekend for me. Dropped about 2K on a mix of multi and single play dollars with less than 20K in action, but I've been pretty lucky the last couple of weekends with a royal and a bunch of deuces. I donated about $20 to Elvira while waiting for my salt and pepper shrimp. The boobs bounce when the reels stop. Mesmerizing. Talk about a behavioral reinforcement...

C

[popinjay]

I assume Elvira must be a slot. I have not seen it. I wonder if she is still alive. That was years and years ago.

Somewhere I read that as the true count goes up in SP21, the advantage is greater than regular blackjack. I have been trying to find where I read that so I can quote it accurately.

[risky biz]

On Monday, April 24, 2017 at 4:23:00 AM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:

Do they really bounce or is that just your imagination?

[popinjay]

I looked her up, she's 65, and doesn't look anything like "Elvira". Except the bounce part.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

I don't know if I would call myself an expert, but I have been studying these things since I was an infant. They bounce.

C

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

I looked her up after your question also. She's a remarkable looking woman without all the drag and makeup. Was she on your local station when she was doing her show? The station refused to pay her more than $300 per week, but each year, little by little, she managed to negotiate more and more rights to her character in lieu of a raise... until she had all of the rights. Looks like she's managed to parlay that gig into a decent living.

C

[popinjay]

Yeah, I was in Los Angeles, and it was a local show. Don't remember clearly. She was a hoot.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

Smart cookie, Elvira. Music from a local Creature Feature show, that was ripped off from Experiment In Terror.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UJ0SSHlarc

C

[popinjay]

On Tuesday, April 25, 2017 at 1:02:11 PM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:



>
> Smart cookie, Elvira. Music from a local Creature Feature show, that was ripped off from Experiment In Terror.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6UJ0SSHlarc
>
> C

Cool, but I don't remember it. I did see a comment below about it from someone in Chicago. I played a few of those Mancini clips while I was at this link. Talent, man.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

It was from a nifty little Blake Edwards nod towards noir. Made in 61, but I didn't see it until the 90s. Beautiful opening title sequence. Notice the "Twin Peaks" signage.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ry5ZWlUb8s

C

[popinjay]

On Wednesday, April 26, 2017 at 5:03:31 AM UTC-7, drwhod...@gmail.com wrote:



>
> It was from a nifty little Blake Edwards nod towards noir. Made in 61, but I didn't see it until the 90s. Beautiful opening title sequence. Notice the "Twin Peaks" signage.
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ry5ZWlUb8s
>
> C

Lee Remick, died in 1991. I didn't even know she was dead.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

I looked her up on IMDB also after thinking about the movie. In her 50s. Bad deal. 'Course most of the people in that movie are long gone.

C

[risky biz]

I just ordered "Experiment in Terror and 'Days of Wine and Roses'. Hope I have time to watch both.

[popinjay]

On Thursday, April 27, 2017 at 3:27:22 PM UTC-7, risky biz wrote:



>
> I just ordered "Experiment in Terror and 'Days of Wine and Roses'. Hope I have time to watch both.

The music by Mancini is so cool on those videos. I've played it just to hear the music.

[drwhod...@gmail.com]

I had forgotten Edwards did Days of Wine and Roses. It has been a very long time since I've seen it. I like Lemmon a lot.

C