The Art of No Deal

[Clave]

The Great Closer. What a clown.

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Clave <cla...@themonastery.com> wrote:
>The Great Closer. What a clown.

|

| GOP cave on Obamacare repeal is the biggest broken promise
| in political history
| ...
| Republicans ran on repealing and replacing Obamacare for
| seven years, over the course of four election cycles. They
| won the House majority in 2010 in large part because of the
| backlash against the passage of Obamacare -- and the vow to
| "repeal and replace" Obamacare was part of their "Pledge to
| America" campaign document that year. The botched rollout
| of Obamacare helped them win the Senate in 2014. House
| candidates, Senate candidates, gubernatorial candidates,
| and even state legislative candidates ran against Obamacare
| -- and won.
| ...
<http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/gop-cave-on-obamacare-repeal-is-the-biggest-broken-promise-in-political-history/article/2618413>

--bks

[popinjay]

Yet every scumbag democrat is against it.

[risky biz]

On Friday, March 24, 2017 at 12:52:04 PM UTC-7, Clave wrote:
> The Great Closer. What a clown.

The Republican replacement would have reduced healthcare tax credits to poorer Americans and increased healthcare tax credits to wealthier Americans. Even some Republicans commented on the unfairness and illogic of that.

This fake replacement failed because there were enough smarter Republicans who realized that it would spotlight what uncontrollably greedy fucks they are.

[Clave]

"risky biz" <swing...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:722e3dd4-02bb-4795...@googlegroups.com...

Actually, they couldn't get the Teabaggers on board because it wasn't mean
ENOUGH.

Dunno if you'd heard this, but in the wee hours this morning, in an effort
to win votes from the Teabaggers, the bill was amended to do away with
minimum coverage for ER visits, preventive care, maternity and neo-natal
costs (after a meeting of 35 men), and a bunch of other stuff one would
usually take for granted in a "health insurance" policy, but it STILL wasn't
cruel enough for the Teabaggers.

I'll scrape around and see if I can find all the stuff they snuck in there
overnight.

[Dutch]

I'm just going to throw this out there, I don't expect you to respond.

During the campaign the (now) president promised that under this new
plan everyone would be covered with great health care and premiums would
be much lower. Do you think the rubes who believed that patently
ridiculous promise are still lined up to suck Trump's cock?

[Bill Vanek]

I don't get it. Is there some hurry with this? Should the Republicans
do just like the Dems, cobble something together, and then ram it
through? You know, pass it so they can find out what's in it?

[Clave]

"Dutch" <n...@email.com> wrote in message
news:TtlBA.75136$7b3....@fx18.iad...

> popinjay wrote:
>> On Friday, March 24, 2017 at 6:03:50 PM UTC-7, Bradley K. Sherman wrote:
>>> Clave <cla...@themonastery.com> wrote:
>>>> The Great Closer. What a clown.
>>>
>>> |
>>> | GOP cave on Obamacare repeal is the biggest broken promise
>>> | in political history
>>> | ...
>>> | Republicans ran on repealing and replacing Obamacare for
>>> | seven years, over the course of four election cycles. They
>>> | won the House majority in 2010 in large part because of the
>>> | backlash against the passage of Obamacare -- and the vow to
>>> | "repeal and replace" Obamacare was part of their "Pledge to
>>> | America" campaign document that year. The botched rollout
>>> | of Obamacare helped them win the Senate in 2014. House
>>> | candidates, Senate candidates, gubernatorial candidates,
>>> | and even state legislative candidates ran against Obamacare
>>> | -- and won.
>>> | ...
>>> <http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/gop-cave-on-obamacare-repeal-is-the-biggest-broken-promise-in-political-history/article/2618413>
>>>
>>> --bks
>>
>> Yet every scumbag democrat is against it.

"Scumbags" who don't want 20,000,000 people thrown off their health care.

> I'm just going to throw this out there, I don't expect you to respond.
>
> During the campaign the (now) president promised that under this new plan
> everyone would be covered with great health care and premiums would be
> much lower. Do you think the rubes who believed that patently ridiculous
> promise are still lined up to suck Trump's cock?

After 7 years of the GOP obstructing EVERY SINGLE OBAMA INITIATIVE, suddenly
trumpswabs like Pop-Tard think the Democrats should wake up to the
enlightened wonderfulness of bipartisanship.

Christ, what an asshole.

(BTW, yes -- they're still lined up.)

[Clave]

"Bill Vanek" <bilv...@invalid.com> wrote in message
news:f1rbdcps4d8m615b7...@4ax.com...

<...>

> I don't get it. Is there some hurry with this? Should the Republicans
> do just like the Dems, cobble something together, and then ram it
> through?

My god, this horseshit again? The ACA was publicly debated and reworked for
18 months after it was introduced -- real public hearings happened -- before
any votes were cast. This GOP pile of puke was only introduced three weeks
ago, FFS.

Could you possibly be a bigger stooge?

[Clave]

"Clave" <cla...@themonastery.com> wrote in message
news:ob4qp7$tk7$1...@dont-email.me...

>
> "Bill Vanek" <bilv...@invalid.com> wrote in message
> news:f1rbdcps4d8m615b7...@4ax.com...
>
> <...>
>
>> I don't get it. Is there some hurry with this? Should the Republicans
>> do just like the Dems, cobble something together, and then ram it
>> through?
>
> My god, this horseshit again? The ACA was publicly debated and reworked
> for 18 months

BEG pardon, 6 months after introduction, but it was built on previous health
care bills and debates (the Heritage Foundation introduced the idea of the
individual mandate in 1989).

In any case, it was in no fucking way "cobbled together" or "rammed
through".

[popinjay]

On Friday, March 24, 2017 at 9:12:53 PM UTC-7, Clave wrote:



>
> "Scumbags" who don't want 20,000,000 people thrown off their health care.
>

I already addressed this rationally. Tough titty. Let them eat cake. What do you give a fuck for? Does it effect you or Dutch? Dutch ain't even in this country. Quit cryin. All you people do is whine and cry. Some people are going to die. That's life.

[Dutch]

This happened because they made a huge ridiculous promise that they
attempted to appear to fulfill. It was always going to end badly.

[Dutch]

All this talk about healthcare prompted me to do a little digging.

Last year the U.S. government spent $592 billion on Medicare, Medicaid
$309 billion, Subsidies $51 billion, Children's health $15 billion,
divided into 242 million taxpayers that's $4000 each. Then you pay for
your own health insurance, that's what, about $6000 a year?

In 2016 Canada spent $6300 per person on healthcare. That's full no
deductible top notch coverage for every citizen.

One of these days you'll wise up.

[Clave]

"Dutch" <n...@email.com> wrote in message

news:%JpBA.45272$Fv2....@fx02.iad...

Pop-Tard cares more (I told you he'd bite) about money than people, and he
isn't even right about the money.

Christ, what an asshole.

[VegasJerry]

On Friday, March 24, 2017 at 9:05:14 PM UTC-7, Bill Vanek wrote:
> On Sat, 25 Mar 2017 01:03:47 +0000 (UTC), b...@panix.com (Bradley K.
> Sherman) wrote:
>
> >Clave <cla...@themonastery.com> wrote:
> >>The Great Closer. What a clown.
> >
> > |
> > | GOP cave on Obamacare repeal is the biggest broken promise
> > | in political history
> > | ...
> > | Republicans ran on repealing and replacing Obamacare for
> > | seven years, over the course of four election cycles. They
> > | won the House majority in 2010 in large part because of the
> > | backlash against the passage of Obamacare -- and the vow to
> > | "repeal and replace" Obamacare was part of their "Pledge to
> > | America" campaign document that year. The botched rollout
> > | of Obamacare helped them win the Senate in 2014. House
> > | candidates, Senate candidates, gubernatorial candidates,
> > | and even state legislative candidates ran against Obamacare
> > | -- and won.
> > | ...
> ><http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/gop-cave-on-obamacare-repeal-is-the-biggest-broken-promise-in-political-history/article/2618413>
> >
> > --bks

> I don't get it.

Did you ever?

> Is there some hurry with this?

Pass it before we find out how bad it was.

> Should the Republicans do just like the Dems, cobble something together,
> and then ram it through?

Speaking of you not getting it. That was NOT how it happened. It was how FOX (GOP) told you it happened. You’re still stuck on Fake Fox News. Did you ever make the effort to get the truth; or did you fear it?

> You know, pass it so they can find out what's in it?

And again. Fox/GOP told you this, but no Democrat ever said that.

NOW do you get it?

Jerry (being rhetorical) ‘n Vegas

[VegasJerry]

On Friday, March 24, 2017 at 11:33:39 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:

> Some people are going to die. That's life.

These are the gems I wait for...

Jerry (being trolled and loving it) 'n Vegas

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Dutch <n...@email.com> wrote:
>Bill Vanek wrote:
>> On Sat, 25 Mar 2017 01:03:47 +0000 (UTC), b...@panix.com (Bradley K.

>>> Clave <cla...@themonastery.com> wrote:
>>>> The Great Closer. What a clown.
>>> |
>>> | GOP cave on Obamacare repeal is the biggest broken promise
>>> | in political history
>>> | ...
>>

>> I don't get it. Is there some hurry with this? Should the Republicans
>> do just like the Dems, cobble something together, and then ram it
>> through? You know, pass it so they can find out what's in it?
>
>This happened because they made a huge ridiculous promise that they
>attempted to appear to fulfill. It was always going to end badly.

The remarkable thing is how little stamina Trump has.
He put in a few days twisting arms and now wants to
wash his hands of the issue and go back to Mirage-a-Lego
for more golf and taco bowls. Worse (for him), he issued
an ultimatum calling for the vote and *then wimped out*.
Whatever political capital he had is spent, he's in
the hole, and he's headed for political bankruptcy.

--bks

RussiaGate looms around the next corner.

[da pickle]

On 3/25/2017 3:14 AM, Dutch wrote:

> All this talk about healthcare prompted me to do a little digging.
>
> Last year the U.S. government spent $592 billion on Medicare, Medicaid
> $309 billion, Subsidies $51 billion, Children's health $15 billion,
> divided into 242 million taxpayers that's $4000 each. Then you pay for
> your own health insurance, that's what, about $6000 a year?
>
> In 2016 Canada spent $6300 per person on healthcare. That's full no
> deductible top notch coverage for every citizen.

I tried a little digging too ... I cannot find how the "fees" of
individual doctors are "set" under the Canadian system. Are doctors
free to charge any amount that they want for a particular "service"?
Are all doctors somehow "required" to charge a specific amount for a
specific service? If so, who sets the amount and does it apply to each
and every doctor?

From what I read, it appears that the Canadian system is a FFS system
(fee for service) and that encourages doctors to perform additional
unnecessary services so they get paid more and the "folks in charge" (I
am not sure exactly who is in charge) want to try and get more in
control of exactly what should be done and what to charge for it. There
does not appear to be any "difference" between similarly situated
doctors ... a doctor is a doctor ... a "specialist" is a "specialist ...
everyone gets paid under the same rules for the same service. How about
in the city verses the country? Is there any difference due to cost of
living? Are different "specialists" paid at a different rate than other
doctors in the same "specialty"? Does the same person or committee
determine the pay for each and every specialty?

It appears that this is very complicated and who determines how much the
person or committee members make that determines how much the doctors
and specialists make?

There appear to be rules in each Provence about how many days a year you
must actually live in that Provence to be "covered"? How does that work
for people that live in more than one Provence from time to time? It
appears that the people above making the determination of how much each
sort of doctor makes for each sort of procedure or service varies from
Provence to Provence ... and those people making those decisions have
their pay determined likely from the central government perhaps?

Can you visit a doctor in another Provence? Does your Provence pay that
doctor or does the doctor's Provence pay him or her?

Can any doctor choose any Provence to practice?

I would also ask about hospitals with the same sorts of questions, but
that might be an entirely different system. Just one ... must all
hospitals allow all doctors to practice in there hospital or can they
certify some doctors and not others?

[da pickle]

And there is no way ... no way possible for Hillary to lose the
election. Obamacare has got to go. Some day a replacement will come
forward. You guys want "single payer" as the mantra of the day.

I have asked about the Canadian system ... perhaps a new thread is
necessary. Let us call it:
Explain the Canadian heath care system.

I'll do it.

[Bradley K. Sherman]

da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
> ...

>Explain the Canadian heath care system.

> ...

It's a system which results in better outcomes at
less expense than does the U.S. system.

--bks

[pkarl]

Does it have a huge insurance industry lobbying legislators in Ottawa?

[da pickle]

There is a thread for you to explain your conclusion.

Give it a try if you actually know anything about it.

I say that because when you talk about that which you know something
about, you are quite correct. When you conclude something about Canada
as applied to the USA is as easy and facile as your comment above, not
so much.

The idea that the *same* *system* is comparable to the same populations
and conditions is totally incorrect.

[Bradley K. Sherman]

da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>On 3/25/2017 10:24 AM, Bradley K. Sherman wrote:
>> da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> ...
>>> Explain the Canadian heath care system.
>>> ...
>>
>> It's a system which results in better outcomes at
>> less expense than does the U.S. system.
>

>There is a thread for you to explain your conclusion.
>
>Give it a try if you actually know anything about it.

Done and done.

--bks

[da pickle]

On 3/25/2017 10:50 AM, Bradley K. Sherman wrote:
> da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On 3/25/2017 10:24 AM, Bradley K. Sherman wrote:
>>> da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> ...
>>>> Explain the Canadian heath care system.
>>>> ...
>>>
>>> It's a system which results in better outcomes at
>>> less expense than does the U.S. system.
>>
>> There is a thread for you to explain your conclusion.
>>
>> Give it a try if you actually know anything about it.
>
> Done and done.
>
> --bks

Dodge and run

[Bradley K. Sherman]

da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>On 3/25/2017 10:50 AM, Bradley K. Sherman wrote:
>> da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> On 3/25/2017 10:24 AM, Bradley K. Sherman wrote:
>>>> da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> ...
>>>>> Explain the Canadian heath care system.
>>>>> ...
>>>>
>>>> It's a system which results in better outcomes at
>>>> less expense than does the U.S. system.
>>>
>>> There is a thread for you to explain your conclusion.
>>>
>>> Give it a try if you actually know anything about it.
>>
>> Done and done.
>

>Dodge and run

I'm still here. I understand that facts make you uncomfortable.

--bks

[Dutch]

When this bill was pulled Trump went immediately into full sour grapes
mode. "You heard me say in every speech, the best thing we could do
politically is to just let Obamacare fail."

Funny, what I heard in every speech was, "On day one we are going to
repeal and replace Obamacare. Nobody will lose their coverage and it
will be way cheaper and better."

When the truth no longer matters you have taken the first giant step
away from Democracy. The lessons of the 20th century are fading, I guess
we're destined to repeat the same mistakes.

[Dutch]

da pickle wrote:
> On 3/25/2017 3:14 AM, Dutch wrote:
>
>> All this talk about healthcare prompted me to do a little digging.
>>
>> Last year the U.S. government spent $592 billion on Medicare, Medicaid
>> $309 billion, Subsidies $51 billion, Children's health $15 billion,
>> divided into 242 million taxpayers that's $4000 each. Then you pay for
>> your own health insurance, that's what, about $6000 a year?
>>
>> In 2016 Canada spent $6300 per person on healthcare. That's full no
>> deductible top notch coverage for every citizen.
>
>
> I tried a little digging too ... I cannot find how the "fees" of
> individual doctors are "set" under the Canadian system. Are doctors
> free to charge any amount that they want for a particular "service"?

No, the fees are set by healthcare administrators.

Are
> all doctors somehow "required" to charge a specific amount for a
> specific service? If so, who sets the amount and does it apply to each
> and every doctor?

Yes, afaik. There are a few specialized clinics set up outside the
system that are basically illegal, but they operate anyway with an
apparent nudge and wink from the government.

>
> From what I read, it appears that the Canadian system is a FFS system
> (fee for service) and that encourages doctors to perform additional
> unnecessary services so they get paid more

I don't see why that tendency would depend on through what mechanism the
doctor is getting paid. I'm sure padding happens everywhere.

and the "folks in charge" (I
> am not sure exactly who is in charge) want to try and get more in
> control of exactly what should be done and what to charge for it.

I would imagine that any insurance provider is concerned about milking
of fees.

There
> does not appear to be any "difference" between similarly situated
> doctors ... a doctor is a doctor ... a "specialist" is a "specialist

The amount varies based on doctors’ specialties; family physicians make
about $271,000 while medical specialists make about $338,000 and
surgical specialists earn $446,000.

...
> everyone gets paid under the same rules for the same service. How about
> in the city verses the country? Is there any difference due to cost of
> living?

There are incentives provided for doctors willing to work in certain
less desirable areas.

> Are different "specialists" paid at a different rate than other
> doctors in the same "specialty"? Does the same person or committee
> determine the pay for each and every specialty?
>
> It appears that this is very complicated and who determines how much the
> person or committee members make that determines how much the doctors
> and specialists make?

It doesn't seem that complicated to me, and I do not think you've shown
it is. What is complicated is millions of patients with thousands of
completely different insurance policies.

> There appear to be rules in each Provence about how many days a year you
> must actually live in that Provence to be "covered"? How does that work
> for people that live in more than one Provence from time to time?

Coverage is portable across the country. My provincial plan covers me
everywhere in Canada. If I move to another province I switch to their plan.

It
> appears that the people above making the determination of how much each
> sort of doctor makes for each sort of procedure or service varies from
> Provence to Provence ... and those people making those decisions have
> their pay determined likely from the central government perhaps?

It varies somewhat, yes, but not a whole lot.

>
> Can you visit a doctor in another Provence? Does your Provence pay that
> doctor or does the doctor's Provence pay him or her?

See above.

>
> Can any doctor choose any Provence to practice?

Yes.

>
> I would also ask about hospitals with the same sorts of questions, but
> that might be an entirely different system. Just one ... must all
> hospitals allow all doctors to practice in there hospital or can they
> certify some doctors and not others?

The hospital decides how many doctors they need, which type, and which
applicants to hire.

Your curiosity seems fishy. What are you getting at?

[Dutch]

Never underestimate the power of a good con man.

Obamacare has got to go. Some day a replacement will come
> forward.

Bills do not "come forward", people have to write them. This government
shows no signs that they have the ability or the will to do it right.

> You guys want "single payer" as the mantra of the day.

It is the answer you're searching for. It doesn't have to government
administered, contract it out, but it has to be mandatory to work.

>
> I have asked about the Canadian system ... perhaps a new thread is
> necessary. Let us call it:
> Explain the Canadian heath care system.
>
> I'll do it.

No need, I explained it in the other post. It's really simple.

[Dutch]

When you say something is incorrect, the normal thing to do is to follow
with a reason *why* it is incorrect. You always just leave these hanging
announcements like we're supposed to know what you're babbling about.

[Clave]

"Clave" <cla...@themonastery.com> wrote in message news:...

<...>

> Dunno if you'd heard this, but in the wee hours this morning, in an effort
> to win votes from the Teabaggers, the bill was amended to do away with
> minimum coverage for ER visits, preventive care, maternity and neo-natal
> costs (after a meeting of 35 men), and a bunch of other stuff one would
> usually take for granted in a "health insurance" policy, but it STILL
> wasn't cruel enough for the Teabaggers.
>
> I'll scrape around and see if I can find all the stuff they snuck in there
> overnight.

Found it. Among the things Ryan removed from required coverage were:

- Ambulatory patient services

- Emergency services (like ER visits)

- Hospitalization (!!!)

- Maternity and newborn care

- Mental health and substance abuse disorder services

- Prescription drugs (!!!)

- Rehabilitative and habilitative services and devices

- Laboratory services

- Preventive and wellness services and chronic disease management

- Pediatric services, including oral and vision care


Just what the fuck was left to cover?

[Mossingen]

"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message
news:ob5n58$m1d$1...@reader1.panix.com...

_______________



Since when is there a time limit on repealing Obamacare? Trump saw that he
couldn’t win this round, so he cut bait and moved on. It's really odd to me
that this is seen as some sort of catastrophic defeat. The man has not been
in office even 100 days. He's probably learning where the power lies, how
to manipulate it, and will likely get most of his agenda through in four
years.

You are like those athletes who celebrate too early and lose races. People
who think like you do are the ones who sat in stunned silence on election
night wondering what happened. You underestimate Trump at every turn. Just
wait and see what happens.

[Mossingen]

"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message

news:ob622h$n06$1...@reader1.panix.com...

__________________


Would that be true if Canadian medicine was forbidden from using American
breakthroughs in medical science for the last 100 years? Imagine the state
of medicine without American R&D during the last 100 years or so.

[Clave]

"Mossingen" <jhan...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:ob9eup$4nm$1...@dont-email.me...

<...>

> Since when is there a time limit on repealing Obamacare? Trump saw that
> he couldn’t win this round, so he cut bait and moved on. It's really odd
> to me that this is seen as some sort of catastrophic defeat.

Because it's never happened before, dumbass. Never has an incoming
President been handed such a humiliating defeat on his first major
leglislative initiative by HIS OWN FUCKING PARTY.

That vote rendered T-Rump irrelevant as far as future legislation goes.
Congress basically gave him the middle finger, saying "we don't care what
you want, we'll do as we please." One of T-Rump's primary campaign
promises, as well as 7 years of GOP promises, goes down in spectacular
flames.

I'd be very surprised if the issue came up again in this Congress.

I have to wonder how far up their own ass someone's head would have to be to
not be able to see any of that.

[Clave]

"Mossingen" <jhan...@cox.net> wrote in message

news:ob9f3p$52p$1...@dont-email.me...

> "Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message
> news:ob622h$n06$1...@reader1.panix.com...
>
> da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>> ...
>>Explain the Canadian heath care system.
>> ...
>
> It's a system which results in better outcomes at
> less expense than does the U.S. system.
>
> --bks
>
> __________________
>
>
> Would that be true if Canadian medicine was forbidden from using American
> breakthroughs in medical science for the last 100 years?

What possible relevance does that have? Canada has made their share of
contributions, and would probably do more if they subsidized private
pharmaceutical research with taxpayer dollars to the degree we do in the
USA.

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Mossingen <jhan...@cox.net> wrote:
>"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message
>news:ob622h$n06$1...@reader1.panix.com...
>
>da pickle <jcpi...@nospam.hotmail.com> wrote:
>> ...
>>Explain the Canadian heath care system.
>> ...
>
>It's a system which results in better outcomes at
>less expense than does the U.S. system.

> ...

>Would that be true if Canadian medicine was forbidden from using American
>breakthroughs in medical science for the last 100 years? Imagine the state
>of medicine without American R&D during the last 100 years or so.

I think you overestimate those breakthroughs. The most important
health breakthrough since penicillin (from the UK) has been the
effort to curb cigarette smoking (basic research from Germany).

BTW, the treatment of diabetes using insulin is a Canadian
contribution.

--bks

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Mossingen <jhan...@cox.net> wrote:
> ...

>You are like those athletes who celebrate too early and lose races. People
>who think like you do are the ones who sat in stunned silence on election
>night wondering what happened. You underestimate Trump at every turn. Just
>wait and see what happens.

That's what one should say when throwing a frisbee, "Watch This!"
No chance of embarrassment.

Let's try a simple prediction: Do you think General Flynn
has made a deal with the FBI to give evidence against others
in the Trump administration?

Background for the question:
<https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/from-russia-with-oil-4d027411bcc5#.mwc5dwm52>

Flynn's wikipedia page:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_T._Flynn>

--bks

[Mossingen]

"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message

news:ob9h3i$5s7$1...@reader1.panix.com...

>Let's try a simple prediction: Do you think General Flynn
>has made a deal with the FBI to give evidence against others
>in the Trump administration?

Why is that important? You're just predicting that there will be minor
scandals in a presidential administration. Now who's throwing frisbees?

What you really believe is that Trump will be impeached and/or removed from
office. Care to wager on that?

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Mossingen <jhan...@cox.net> wrote:
>"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message
>news:ob9h3i$5s7$1...@reader1.panix.com...
>
>>Let's try a simple prediction: Do you think General Flynn
>>has made a deal with the FBI to give evidence against others
>>in the Trump administration?
>
>Why is that important? You're just predicting that there will be minor
>scandals in a presidential administration.

> ...

Flynn was Trump's *National Security Adviser*. He ran Military
Intelligence when he was in the military. You think this is
a "minor" scandal? Yow!

--bks

[Mossingen]

"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message

news:ob9l6r$meu$1...@reader1.panix.com...

Flynn was Trump's *National Security Adviser*. He ran Military
Intelligence when he was in the military. You think this is
a "minor" scandal? Yow!

--bks

_____________________



Right now, based upon the information we have, yes, it appears to be a minor
scandal. Do you know something that we don't?

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Mossingen <jhan...@cox.net> wrote:
>"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message
>

>Flynn was Trump's *National Security Adviser*. He ran Military
>Intelligence when he was in the military. You think this is
>a "minor" scandal? Yow!

> ...

>Right now, based upon the information we have, yes, it appears to be a minor
>scandal. Do you know something that we don't?

Did you read the backgrounder I provided?
<https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/from-russia-with-oil-4d027411bcc5#.mwc5dwm52>
If that's minor, I'd like to know what you think is major!

--bks

[Clave]

"Mossingen" <jhan...@cox.net> wrote in message

news:ob9vdu$4g0$1...@dont-email.me...

Looks like a whole lot of people know a whole lot of things you don't.

History and civics come readily to mind.

[Dutch]

Why would Canadian medicine be forbidden from *buying* American medical
devices, drugs, etc..? What does that have to do with anything?

The answer to your question is yes. National healthcare providers are
big customers of medical technology from all over the world. I took a
Hep-C cure two years ago, three pills a day for 24 weeks, one of the
morning pills was $1000 a pop, the others were over $100, each. The U.S.
company that developed and marketed the drugs made out like a bandit,
they still are.

And disabuse yourself of the myth that American companies are the only
ones doing breakthrough medical research. And besides, that has only
peripheral relevance to the health insurance issue. As above, our system
pays for the latest treatments, we support YOUR research industry, just
as you support ours.

[Dutch]

Mossingen wrote:
> Since when is there a time limit on repealing Obamacare?

Since The Donald led off every rally with "On day ONE, I will REPEAL AND
REPLACE the disaster known as "Obamacare" and replace it with something
fantastic that will be way cheaper."

Since "DAY ONE", that's when since.

[Clave]

"Dutch" <n...@email.com> wrote in message
news:3d1CA.167718$kx.6...@fx33.iad...

“I’m going to work immediately to knock out Obamacare, and we are
going to start taking care of our vets and the military.”

"We will immediately repeal and replace ObamaCare – and nobody can
do that like me. We will save $'s and have much better healthcare!"

“On day one of the Trump Administration, we will ask Congress to
immediately deliver a full repeal of Obamacare.”

“One of my first acts as President will be to repeal and replace
disastrous Obamacare, saving another 2 million American jobs.”

“On my first day I’m going to ask Congress to immediately send me
a bill to repeal and replace Obamacare.”

“Together we’re going to deliver real change that once again puts
Americans first. That begins with immediately repealing and
replacing the disaster known as Obamacare. My first day in office,
I am going to ask Congress to put a bill on my desk getting rid of
this disastrous law and replacing it with reforms that expand
choice, freedom, affordability....It’s going to be so easy.”

“When we win on November 8th and elect a Republican Congress, we
will be able to immediately repeal and replace Obamacare. I will
ask Congress to convene a special session.”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/politics/wp/2017/03/24/its-true-trump-didnt-pledge-obamacare-repeal-in-64-days-he-pledged-it-in-one

[Dutch]

You're funny.. it's potentially the biggest political scandal in US
history. Based on what is probably true now it already is.

[Mossingen]

"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message news:oba00p$g7$1...@reader1.panix.com...

________________


I'd like to know when you put your brain to sleep and stopped being able to
detect finely spun slanted political-opinion bullshit masquerading as news.
There is some possibility that Flynn was involve in some shady shit, but I
don't see any actual evidence of it. All of these guys interact with each
other over a myriad of issues. Whether actual corruption occurred is
another question.

[Mossingen]

"Dutch" wrote in message news:4y1CA.83328$Jh.6...@fx17.iad...

>You're funny.. it's potentially the biggest political scandal in US
>history. Based on what is probably true now it already is.

What the hell is wrong with you people? Most of you, hell all of you, are
way older than I am. You guys remember Watergate, Vietnam, Reagan
testifying on the Iran-Contra affair, Clinton actually being impeached and
tried by the U.S. Senate, and all of the other political shit that has
happened over the last 40-50 years. And you think that Flynn meeting with
the Russian ambassador is larger than all of those?

Make that case based upon actual facts that are known at this time. Or, are
you guys banking on some conspiracy between Trump and the Russians to "rig"
the election? Is that it? A good ol' commie hunt?

[Bradley K. Sherman]

Mossingen <jhan...@cox.net> wrote:
>"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message news:oba00p$g7$1...@reader1.panix.com...
> ...

>Did you read the backgrounder I provided?
><https://medium.com/@yonatanzunger/from-russia-with-oil-4d027411bcc5#.mwc5dwm52>
>If that's minor, I'd like to know what you think is major!

> ...

>I'd like to know when you put your brain to sleep and stopped being able to
>detect finely spun slanted political-opinion bullshit masquerading as news.
>There is some possibility that Flynn was involve in some shady shit, but I
>don't see any actual evidence of it. All of these guys interact with each
>other over a myriad of issues. Whether actual corruption occurred is
>another question.

So you're dodging the question? It's pretty simple: Do you
think Flynn made a deal with the FBI to squeal on other
Trumpettes, or not?

--bks

[VegasJerry]

Besides TREASON, who’s the “we,” you keep referencing?

Jerry

[da pickle]

It will be OK ... it is impossible for Trump to be elected president.

Based on all the reliable information.

[Mossingen]

"Bradley K. Sherman" wrote in message

news:obb041$ohb$1...@reader1.panix.com...

>So you're dodging the question? It's pretty simple: Do you
>think Flynn made a deal with the FBI to squeal on other
>Trumpettes, or not?

> --bks

If I say "yes," do I get a prize?

If he becomes a snitch, then his testimony becomes even more suspect to me.
I deal with this crap all the time. The Government has the power to dangle
freedom in front of someone if they help the Government. Guess what? They
all make up shit and slant their testimony to help the Government. It's a
sleazy thing that happens all the time in the criminal justice system.

But, to answer your question. How the hell would I know? How would you
know? Maybe Flynn has a defense and will fight it. Maybe DOJ will offer
him a deal to snitch and he'll take it. Who the hell knows until it
happens. I remain fascinated by the fact that you seem so focused on this.

[Mossingen]

"da pickle" wrote in message
news:w42dnRrFsMSwuETF...@giganews.com...

>It will be OK ... it is impossible for Trump to be elected president.

>Based on all the reliable information.

Trump has affected the Liberal psyche in profound ways. Did you see Ted
Koppel lecturing Sean Hannity about the "damage" that his partisanship is
doing to the country? I love Koppel, used to watch Nightline regularly back
in the day.

It was curious to me that he singled out Hannity and not Rachel Maddow to
make that point. Hannity never claims to be anything other than a biased
opinion commentator. He does not sit at a news desk or go live to report on
breaking stories. Maddow, however, who lectured us for months about how
Trump's candidacy was a joke, and that he could not win, was part of the
MSNBC news team on election night, sitting there with Brian Williams and
Chris Matthews. She was placed in a position to be a straight reporter and
you could see how uncomfortable she was when it became apparent that Hillary
was going to lose. Matthews at least tried to offer a reason, noting how
Hillary never went to the barren industrial waste of Michigan to connect
with white middle-class workers, never really talked about trade in a
meaningful sense, and didn't really take a stand on immigration. Maddow
argued with him about that.

Maddow's show is fine as a platform for her opinions, just like Hannity's.
But, she weaves her way into straight-news much more than Hannity does.

[popinjay]

On Sunday, March 26, 2017 at 8:15:42 PM UTC-7, Clave wrote:


>
> Looks like a whole lot of people know a whole lot of things you don't.
>
> History and civics come readily to mind.

I guarantee you he is WAY better educated than you are, Clave. I promise you that.

[popinjay]

On Monday, March 27, 2017 at 10:58:47 AM UTC-7, Mossingen wrote:


> I love Koppel, used to watch Nightline regularly back
> in the day.
>

This is a short clip of Koppel interviewing a guy who was one of my best friends when we were in our late teens and early 20s. His name is Clarence but we called him Mike, or Nub. Nub was because he was missing half a finger. This guy was really good with a tattoo needle back then, apparently still is. I have two that he did for me on my right arm. When I knew him he had black hair and was clean shaven. We were best friends for a few years.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iShYwlVMHMY&feature=related

[Mossingen]

"popinjay" wrote in message
news:85ddf922-b98f-4db3...@googlegroups.com...

___________________


I am glad that you have apparently made better life choices than Mr. Nub.
It does not look like life has treated him well.

[popinjay]

On Monday, March 27, 2017 at 7:02:13 PM UTC-7, Mossingen wrote:


>
> I am glad that you have apparently made better life choices than Mr. Nub.
> It does not look like life has treated him well.

I got out on my 25th birthday. He was a couple years younger but got out about the same time. I think I called his family about a month later, he had already gone BACK on a robbery charge. What an idiot. But that was 35 years ago and I look much younger now than he does in that video. I have a baby face, and my skin is smooth. And I've never been in trouble since then. But what's most important is that I changed inside. I have a conscience, and want to be a good person.

[Mossingen]

"popinjay" wrote in message
news:7d5cef6b-3a23-41f6...@googlegroups.com...

_________________


Good for you, paul.

[BillB]

"popinjay" <paulpo...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:85ddf922-b98f-4db3...@googlegroups.com...

**********

He seems like an alright guy. He wasn't a racist, was he? If he was
agreeable to doing racist tattoos then I've lost all respect!

[popinjay]

On Monday, March 27, 2017 at 11:52:30 PM UTC-7, BillB wrote:



>
> He seems like an alright guy. He wasn't a racist, was he? If he was
> agreeable to doing racist tattoos then I've lost all respect!

I promise you he never did a tattoo for a black guy. Seriously, are you crazy? Do you have any idea who the underdog race is in United States prisons? Grow up.

[BillB]

They need someone like me in there to bring the blacks and whites together.

[Bea Foroni]

Yeah, that's what they need. Races all getting along, what a novel idea! I'm sure it will work.

[Dutch]

A supremely articulate half white half black president couldn't do it,
should be a cakewalk for BillB.

[BillB]

Pfftt..Obama is 25% black, tops. He's as white a black man as you'll
ever see. And as far as I can see, Obama did nothing for blacks, other
than passing out a few free cell phones. At least Trump is going to
rebuild the inner cities and make them tremendously tremendous again.

[Bea Foroni]

Imagine BillB waddling up to that Nub guy and explaining how he is doing it all wrong.

Or some black con, arrested by a white cop, prosecuted by a white DA, defended by a whie public defender with a sleep problem, judged by a white jury, sentenced by a white judge. I'm sure with just the right attitude, BiilB will have him lapping up his pearls of wisdom.

[Bea Foroni]

On Tuesday, March 28, 2017 at 12:39:54 AM UTC-7, BillB wrote:

>
> Pfftt..Obama is 25% black, tops. He's as white a black man as you'll
> ever see. And as far as I can see, Obama did nothing for blacks, other
> than passing out a few free cell phones. At least Trump is going to
> rebuild the inner cities and make them tremendously tremendous again.

Obama could never introduce a bill that would be specifically designed to help black people. It would never pass, and it would have further weakened his powers.

Obama did a lot for black people with the ACA, He increased the amount of college grants for poor and middle income students.

When America was going through the great recession, black people were losing their homes at a much higher rate. He helped stem those loses.

Earned income credit was expanded, helping more people to afford to work, and keep more of what they earned.

Unemployment improved more for blacks than any other racial group.

America is a very race conscious country, if any law was directed specifically to help black Americans it would have been overturned the day Trump took office. Much of the improvements are of the stealth variety.

From Fact Check Dot Org:

Q: Has the Obama administration started a program to use "taxpayer money" to give free cell phones to welfare recipients?

A: No. Low-income households have been eligible for discounted telephone service for more than a decade. But the program is funded by telecom companies, not by taxes, and the president has nothing to do with it.

[Dutch]

BillB wrote:

> Pfftt..Obama is 25% black, tops. He's as white a black man as you'll
> ever see. And as far as I can see, Obama did nothing for blacks, other
> than passing out a few free cell phones. At least Trump is going to
> rebuild the inner cities and make them tremendously tremendous again.

I saw the guy with the "I made a big mistake" sign but I wonder when the
real buyer's remorse is going to set in? Watched Fox News for a while
tonight; even Hannity is getting fed up with this clown car administration.

[VegasJerry]

Uh, that was a Bush 2 program...

J..

[da pickle]

Interesting video ... interesting "Paul" as usual ... maybe amazing Paul.

[BillB]

On 28/03/2017 4:54 AM, VegasJerry wrote:

>> Pfftt..Obama is 25% black, tops. He's as white a black man as you'll
>> ever see. And as far as I can see, Obama did nothing for blacks, other
>> than passing out a few free cell phones.
>
> Uh, that was a Bush 2 program...

Okay, so Bush passed out a few cell phones too. So what? I was talking
about Obama.

It was called the Obamaphone, so I am assuming Obama gave away more than
Bush? Or maybe Obama gave away smartphones and Bush gave away crappy
7-11 flip phones.

[popinjay]

My one remaining black friend got one of those, as soon as he got out of prison. He was calling me and told me it's his Obama Phone. I said what the heck is that? He told me, and then later he got another one. He had two Obama Phones. lol

[VegasJerry]

On Tuesday, March 28, 2017 at 2:05:43 PM UTC-7, BillB wrote:

> On 28/03/2017 4:54 AM, VegasJerry wrote:
>
> >> Pfftt..Obama is 25% black, tops. He's as white a black man as you'll
> >> ever see. And as far as I can see, Obama did nothing for blacks, other
> >> than passing out a few free cell phones.
> >
> > Uh, that was a Bush 2 program...
>
> Okay, so Bush passed out a few cell phones too. So what? I was talking
> about Obama.
>
> It was called the Obamaphone,

By the Fox wing-nuts that refused to admit it was a Bush program.

> so I am assuming Obama gave away more than Bush?

Continuing the program? So? It was still 'something for blacks.'

Jerry

[popinjay]

On Tuesday, March 28, 2017 at 3:32:46 PM UTC-7, VegasJerry wrote:



> >
> > It was called the Obamaphone,
>
> By the Fox wing-nuts that refused to admit it was a Bush program.
>

What did I just say, numbnuts? My black friend has TWO Obama Phones, and that's where I first heard about them. Do you think he is a Fox wing nut?

[VegasJerry]

Is he? Were they 'helped by Obama?'

[Bea Foroni]

On Tuesday, March 28, 2017 at 3:55:22 PM UTC-7, popinjay wrote:

I have a phone I bought on Amazon. It cost $7.95. The case cost ten. I get more minutes than I need for $7.00 a month. I use it in case I have an emergency. One would be pretty small minded to deprive someone a tool that could get him a job or help with his medical care, for such a paltry price. This country is becoming a bunch of pea brains worrying someone might get a little more than for nothing. Meanwhile the wealthy just laugh and laugh as the rest of us supply them with the tranquility to grow their fortunes.