Cast iron grate repair

[Terry Coombs]

I just got a call from the guy I buy my compressed gasses from wanting me
to weld up some cracks in a stove grate . I'm thinking plain phosphor bronxe
filler might not take the heat , and am looking for opinions on what to use
. Looks like my choices are Ni-99 , Ni-55 , silicon bronze . or cast iron
filler . Will CI or SB require peening , like the nickel does ? Or is
peening necessary with the part preheated to around 500°-600° ? I'll have
the grate in/on firebricks to retain the heat while I work on it or possibly
bury it in dry sand .
Which would you use ? I do know that whatever I use it's going to need
preheat and a slow cooldown . I'm thinking a nice wood fire could handle
both since I don't have anything else to preheat a piece about 11 x 13 .
He won't be bringing it for a couple of weeks , so I have time to order
some filler as soon as I decide which to use .


--
Snag

[et...@whidbey.com]

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 10:42:58 -0600, "Terry Coombs" <snag...@msn.com>
wrote:

Greetings Terry,
I'm not sure which of the rods mentioned above is best for your job
but I do know that there is a rod available for stick welding cast
iron alone or welding it to steel. I used the stuff years ago and it
worked very well and I think I bought it at the hardware store.I think
it was the Ni-55. In fact, I'm almost positive that's what it was.
Your idea about pre-heating is a good one. When I weld cast iron I use
ceramic blanket material that I buy from Seattle pottery supply. I
like the stuff because it is real easy to make a form fitting oven.
When I use it I lay it on the welding table, lay the part on the
stuff, and I pack it around the part as close as possible. If the part
is heavy I will lay fire brick on top of the blanketand lay the part
on the fire brick. I then use a weed burner to heat the cast iron so
that it is very hot. Then welding commences and as soon as I am
finished welding I cover the part with the blanket to cool slowly.
Since I started using this method I have not had any parts with cracks
once cooled. A couple jobs I have done had such thin cross sections
being welded I worried about strength after welding. So I welded some
mild steel reinforcements to the cast iron.
Eric

[dca...@krl.org]

I do not have much experience welding cast iron. But read

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us/support/welding-how-to/Pages/welding-cast-iron-detail.aspx From Lincoln Electric.

It only mentions peening when you do not preheat. When you do not preheat , the weld shrinks on cooling and the cast iron does not. So you peen the weld to make it expand. I think the NI-55 shrinks less than NI-99. and may have about the same thermal expansion as cast iron. I am just guessing here. ( invar36 is 36 % nickel. Invar -41 is 41 % Ni. INvar 36 has less thermal exponsion acound room temperatures , but invar 41 has less thermal expansion at higher tempertures. ) But Ni-99 is softer and will yield .

I would probably go with NI-55 as it is a lot cheaper than NI-99. But if you preheat you could probably use CI rod.

Dan

[dca...@krl.org]

On Friday, November 20, 2015 at 8:34:51 PM UTC-5, dca...@krl.org wrote:
>
>
> I do not have much experience welding cast iron.
>

Dan

I wandered around the internet and found a site ( welding tricks ...jody ) that mentioned using 312 stainless rod on cast iron.

I am pretty sure that I have some invar 36 and invar 41 tig rod and could cut some to fit in a flat rate box. But as I remember it is all 1/16 dia. Let me know if you want some.

Dan

[Tom Gardner]

I know what a pain these kind of jobs can be and I wish you luck! I
would truly like to see a before and after and explain your process.

[Neon John]

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 10:42:58 -0600, "Terry Coombs" <snag...@msn.com>
wrote:

> I just got a call from the guy I buy my compressed gasses from wanting me
>to weld up some cracks in a stove grate . I'm thinking plain phosphor bronxe
>filler might not take the heat , and am looking for opinions on what to use
>. Looks like my choices are Ni-99 , Ni-55 , silicon bronze . or cast iron
>filler . Will CI or SB require peening , like the nickel does ? Or is
>peening necessary with the part preheated to around 500°-600° ? I'll have
>the grate in/on firebricks to retain the heat while I work on it or possibly
>bury it in dry sand .

Ni-55 is my go-to filler for cast iron and just about anything else.

Couple of weeks ago I had to weld some 18-8 stainless weld nuts to a
cast iron pot for a custom induction heated lead melter. This was
the bastard of all jobs.

I recently had my TIG setup stolen and the Ni-55 rods the shop had
were too large for my little solid state rig so I stripped some
carbon-zinc D cells and carbon arc welded the fittings!

I heated the pot to 600 degrees with one of our induction heaters,
blanketed the rest of the pot and welded away, arc-to-work from the
carbon rod. It worked amazingly well.

I heated the weld nut and the cast iron nearby red hot with the
induction heater and then I blanketed the welded assembly and let it
cool for a couple of hours.

I sacrificed one pot trying to break the weld in shear (actual use is
in compression). The pot broke in the press before the weld did.

I did NOT make any attempt to peen the weld. The stress-relieving was
the heating to red heat and slow cool.

> Which would you use ? I do know that whatever I use it's going to need
>preheat and a slow cooldown . I'm thinking a nice wood fire could handle
>both since I don't have anything else to preheat a piece about 11 x 13 .
> He won't be bringing it for a couple of weeks , so I have time to order
>some filler as soon as I decide which to use .

Well, I could fix you up with a nice, inexpensive induction heater.
See fluxeon.com. :-)

Seriously now, if I didn't have an induction heater, I'd probably tack
together several lengths of 3/8" black steel pipe, manifold them
together, drill a bunch of holes and feed it with gas. Optionally
with a reducer fitting acting as a venturi. That should easily get a
large area to red heat.

John
John DeArmond
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.fluxeon.com
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
See website for email address

[dca...@krl.org]

On Wednesday, November 25, 2015 at 1:58:03 PM UTC-5, Neon John wrote:

>
> Ni-55 is my go-to filler for cast iron and just about anything else.
>

> John
> John DeArmond
> http://www.neon-john.com
> http://www.fluxeon.com
> Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
> See website for email address

This is a general question, not necessarily to you , John. But can anyone tell me why the nickel percentage in a 55% rod is 55%. I mean there is 55% and 99% but nothing in between and nothing recommended for cast iron below 55%. I have rummaged around on the internet, but have not found the answer.

Dan

[Gunner Asch]

On Wed, 25 Nov 2015 13:57:53 -0500, Neon John <n...@never.com> wrote:

>
>John
>John DeArmond
>http://www.neon-john.com
>http://www.fluxeon.com
>Tellico Plains, Occupied TN

How much are the case neck annealers?

[Larry Jaques]

On Wed, 25 Nov 2015 20:56:33 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

$499 Annie (OOS, but the parts are in)
$741 Roy

See 'web store' button on fluxeon page.

Gonna buy two? They're small.

--
Courage and perseverance have a magical talisman, before
which difficulties disappear and obstacles vanish into air.
-- John Quincy Adams

[Gunner Asch]

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 08:08:45 -0800, Larry Jaques
<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 25 Nov 2015 20:56:33 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Wed, 25 Nov 2015 13:57:53 -0500, Neon John <n...@never.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>John
>>>John DeArmond
>>>http://www.neon-john.com
>>>http://www.fluxeon.com
>>>Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
>>
>>How much are the case neck annealers?
>
>$499 Annie (OOS, but the parts are in)
>$741 Roy
>
>See 'web store' button on fluxeon page.
>
>Gonna buy two? They're small.

It was taking forever to load for some reason, so I bailed out and
never did get a price. Thanks
Bit rich for my blood. Ill stick with the 2 methods that have worked
for me for 30 yrs and doesnt cost 1/10 the price

[Terry Coombs]

Propane torch and a pan of water ?

--
Snag

[Larry Jaques]

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 11:40:55 -0600, "Terry Coombs" <snag...@msn.com>
wrote:

Don't forget the lazy susan base.

[Gunner Asch]

On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 20:25:19 -0800, Larry Jaques

<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 11:40:55 -0600, "Terry Coombs" <snag...@msn.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Gunner Asch wrote:
>>> On Thu, 26 Nov 2015 08:08:45 -0800, Larry Jaques
>>> <lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Wed, 25 Nov 2015 20:56:33 -0800, Gunner Asch
>>>> <gunne...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 25 Nov 2015 13:57:53 -0500, Neon John <n...@never.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John
>>>>>> John DeArmond
>>>>>> http://www.neon-john.com
>>>>>> http://www.fluxeon.com
>>>>>> Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
>>>>>
>>>>> How much are the case neck annealers?
>>>>
>>>> $499 Annie (OOS, but the parts are in)
>>>> $741 Roy
>>>>
>>>> See 'web store' button on fluxeon page.
>>>>
>>>> Gonna buy two? They're small.
>>>
>>> It was taking forever to load for some reason, so I bailed out and
>>> never did get a price. Thanks
>>> Bit rich for my blood. Ill stick with the 2 methods that have worked
>>> for me for 30 yrs and doesnt cost 1/10 the price
>>
>>Propane torch and a pan of water ?

Actually an acet torch and a bowl of water. One of those small
plumbing torches. Its actually cheaper than using propane in the long
run.

>
>Don't forget the lazy susan base.

I use an old record player that has been repullyed. Works fine and
will turn a 14" ss bowl nicely.