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Boring Head Method - Taper Turning Method
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Bob La Londe
Dec 11, 2017, 1:02:07 PM12/11/17
to
In my playing around I often watch videos on YouTube in the morning
while I have my coffee, or at night when I can't sleep. A lot of them
have some good information in them even if some of it is a little odd or
even sometimes wrong. I try to take what is good and move on.
I watched one the other day that was a sort of interesting trick for
turning tapers "between centers." You put a boring head in the tail
stock. For low angle tapers you can just put a center in the boring
head, and for sharper angles you can use a cup with a ball bearing in
the chuck and the boring head. I get all of that and it makes sense.
What got me and the guy makign the video didn't show (or I missed it) is:
How do you make sure the center or ball bearing cup in the boring head
is on center vertically?
Since I don't have to turn a lot of tapers I thought this might be a
nice stop gap technique instead of making a taper attachment for my lathe.
while I have my coffee, or at night when I can't sleep. A lot of them
have some good information in them even if some of it is a little odd or
even sometimes wrong. I try to take what is good and move on.
I watched one the other day that was a sort of interesting trick for
turning tapers "between centers." You put a boring head in the tail
stock. For low angle tapers you can just put a center in the boring
head, and for sharper angles you can use a cup with a ball bearing in
the chuck and the boring head. I get all of that and it makes sense.
What got me and the guy makign the video didn't show (or I missed it) is:
How do you make sure the center or ball bearing cup in the boring head
is on center vertically?
Since I don't have to turn a lot of tapers I thought this might be a
nice stop gap technique instead of making a taper attachment for my lathe.
Bob La Londe
Dec 11, 2017, 2:23:20 PM12/11/17
to
the two pines to each and to the lathe bed. My machinist level will
probably get me close enough.
David Billington
Dec 11, 2017, 3:03:50 PM12/11/17
to
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Engineers-Taper-Turning-Attachment-3MT-No-Offset-Of-Lathes-Tailstock-Required/152801807404
.
whit3rd
Dec 11, 2017, 4:56:27 PM12/11/17
to
On Monday, December 11, 2017 at 10:02:07 AM UTC-8, Bob La Londe wrote:
> turning tapers "between centers." You put a boring head in the tail
> stock....
> turning tapers "between centers." You put a boring head in the tail
> How do you make sure the center or ball bearing cup in the boring head
> is on center vertically?
Stack of 1-2-3 blocks and an adjustable parallel on the lathe bed?
> is on center vertically?
... to adjust a boring head orientation, that is.
If it's just a ball center, the offset adjust of the tailstock ought to be accurate enough.
John B.
Dec 11, 2017, 7:17:26 PM12/11/17
to
On Mon, 11 Dec 2017 13:56:21 -0800 (PST), whit3rd <whi...@gmail.com>
wrote:
Back in the day people turned tapers between centers (and also aligned
the head and tail stocks the same way).
I used to turn rifle barrels that way and it goes without saying that
the 0.D. and the bore would be concentric.
--
Cheers,
John B.
wrote:
the head and tail stocks the same way).
I used to turn rifle barrels that way and it goes without saying that
the 0.D. and the bore would be concentric.
--
Cheers,
John B.
DoN. Nichols
Dec 12, 2017, 4:35:10 PM12/12/17
to
On 2017-12-11, Bob La Londe <no...@none.com99> wrote:
> I watched one the other day that was a sort of interesting trick for
> turning tapers "between centers." You put a boring head in the tail
> stock. For low angle tapers you can just put a center in the boring
> head, and for sharper angles you can use a cup with a ball bearing in
> the chuck and the boring head. I get all of that and it makes sense.
> What got me and the guy makign the video didn't show (or I missed it) is:
>
> How do you make sure the center or ball bearing cup in the boring head
> is on center vertically?
Perhaps put a level on the dovetail with it extended a bit?
> I watched one the other day that was a sort of interesting trick for
> turning tapers "between centers." You put a boring head in the tail
> stock. For low angle tapers you can just put a center in the boring
> head, and for sharper angles you can use a cup with a ball bearing in
> the chuck and the boring head. I get all of that and it makes sense.
> What got me and the guy makign the video didn't show (or I missed it) is:
>
> How do you make sure the center or ball bearing cup in the boring head
> is on center vertically?
> Since I don't have to turn a lot of tapers I thought this might be a
> nice stop gap technique instead of making a taper attachment for my lathe.
tailstock to do taper turning between centers. You loosen the tailstock
clamp to the bed, loosen a screw in the middle of the back side of the
tailstock, and tighten the one in the front side to move the tailstock
ram back. (Or the other way around, to move it towards you, depending
on whether you want the big end of the taper towards the tailstock or
the headstock.) With this, there is no question as to whether the
height of the center is correct.
However, you need to come up with a way to set the tailstock
back on horizontal center when you are done. There are various tricks
for this.
The two lathes which I have had which do not have this feature
are the Unimat SL-1000 (on that, you rotate the headstock to shift the
tip back or forward), and the Emco-Maier Compact-5/CNC, which being a CNC
lathe, can do tapers without the trick. However, the same tailstock is
used on the manual Compact-5, so there such a trick would be useful.
Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: <BPdnic...@d-and-d.com> | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
Bob La Londe
Dec 12, 2017, 4:57:58 PM12/12/17
to
I donwanna. LOL.
On the same work piece I need to have the tail stock in line, and
separately I need to be able to turn the longish taper. I might have
mentioned I might need to do a few of them down the road. I had already
resigned myself to building a guide rod style taper attachment when I
ran across the other offset adapter ideas like the boring head idea.
Then somebody pointed out the purpose built adapter that's dead cheap.
I reckon I can level that faster than I can put a guide rod taper
attachment on the lathe.
I tend to spend way to much time thinking about these things looking for
the easiest way to get a satisfactory result.
Ed Huntress
Dec 12, 2017, 5:23:30 PM12/12/17
to
On Tue, 12 Dec 2017 14:57:53 -0700, Bob La Londe <no...@none.com99>
That is not a bad thing. It will save you from doing a lot of
time-consuming or expensive things that you'll want to kick yourself
for when you finally *do* realize what the easy or cheap way was. <g>
These days, I just sit and think about little jobs before tackling
them, if it's something I haven't done before. Fortunately, nobody is
watching me or paying me to do it.
--
Ed Huntress
time-consuming or expensive things that you'll want to kick yourself
for when you finally *do* realize what the easy or cheap way was. <g>
These days, I just sit and think about little jobs before tackling
them, if it's something I haven't done before. Fortunately, nobody is
watching me or paying me to do it.
--
Ed Huntress
John B.
Dec 12, 2017, 7:40:45 PM12/12/17
to
On 12 Dec 2017 21:31:53 GMT, "DoN. Nichols" <BPdnic...@d-and-d.com>
wrote:
To align head and tail centers you simply mount a piece of stock
between centers and turn a length at the head stock end and then at
the tail stock end - using the same cross feed setting of course.
Adjust the tail stock, if necessary and repeat.
They used to sell "test bars" to do this. Hardened steel bars to be
mounted between centers and then you could mount a dial indicator on
the carriage and run the carriage back and forth. The test bars were,
of course, exactly the same diameter for their entire length.
Back in the day, they weren't considered "tricks". Just common
knowledge in the trade :-)
--
Cheers,
John B.
wrote:
between centers and turn a length at the head stock end and then at
the tail stock end - using the same cross feed setting of course.
Adjust the tail stock, if necessary and repeat.
They used to sell "test bars" to do this. Hardened steel bars to be
mounted between centers and then you could mount a dial indicator on
the carriage and run the carriage back and forth. The test bars were,
of course, exactly the same diameter for their entire length.
Back in the day, they weren't considered "tricks". Just common
knowledge in the trade :-)
--
Cheers,
John B.
John B.
Dec 12, 2017, 7:52:10 PM12/12/17
to
happened. The inspector comes in the shop and one guy is just sitting
there staring off into space and a second guy is frantically turning
pages in the Machinery's Handbook and scribbling numbers on a piece of
paper.
The Inspector marks the guy staring off into space as "Not Working"
and the guy with the book as "Working" when in actual fact the guy
staring off into space was calculating the number and sequence of "set
ups" he would use to machine the part and the guy with the book was
trying to figure out how to cut threads :-)
--
Cheers,
John B.
Gunner Asch
Dec 13, 2017, 5:07:02 AM12/13/17
to
back into alignment.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Jim Wilkins
Dec 13, 2017, 7:15:04 AM12/13/17
to
"John B." <sloc...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:nqt03dtht8p5guase...@4ax.com...
A former Air Force repairman told me that when he had nothing to fix
he wandered around carrying a clipboard as though he was an inspector,
so no one would dare bother him.
-jsw
news:nqt03dtht8p5guase...@4ax.com...
he wandered around carrying a clipboard as though he was an inspector,
so no one would dare bother him.
-jsw
rangerssuck
Dec 13, 2017, 8:51:21 AM12/13/17
to
John B.
Dec 13, 2017, 8:29:28 PM12/13/17
to
and a clipboard is viewed with a certain amount of reserve - what is
HE checking on - and usually left alone.
Of course, if he happens to meet his boss...
--
Cheers,
John B.
goodsoldi...@google.com
Dec 13, 2017, 8:33:50 PM12/13/17
to
feet between centers then you can align them to (depending on your
micrometer) perhaps a 1/10 or less. With a center gauge?
--
Cheers,
Schweik
dca...@krl.org
Dec 13, 2017, 9:16:07 PM12/13/17
to
On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 4:57:58 PM UTC-5, Bob La Londe wrote:
> I donwanna. LOL.
>
> On the same work piece I need to have the tail stock in line, and
> separately I need to be able to turn the longish taper. I might have
> mentioned I might need to do a few of them down the road. I had already
> resigned myself to building a guide rod style taper attachment when I
> ran across the other offset adapter ideas like the boring head idea.
> Then somebody pointed out the purpose built adapter that's dead cheap.
> I reckon I can le> I tend to spend way to much time thinking about these things looking for
> I donwanna. LOL.
>
> On the same work piece I need to have the tail stock in line, and
> separately I need to be able to turn the longish taper. I might have
> mentioned I might need to do a few of them down the road. I had already
> resigned myself to building a guide rod style taper attachment when I
> ran across the other offset adapter ideas like the boring head idea.
> Then somebody pointed out the purpose built adapter that's dead cheap.
> the easiest way to get a satisfactory result.
vel that faster than I can put a guide rod taper
> attachment on the lathe.
>
If you are concerned about the boring head not being installed exactly horizontal, try setting it by eyeball and then turning a taper. If the boring head is not installed exactly horizontal , it will not make much of an error in the taper.
vel that faster than I can put a guide rod taper
> attachment on the lathe.
>
Dan
Gerry
Dec 13, 2017, 11:52:40 PM12/13/17
to
ten sheets of blank copy paper in a new file folder and visited every
office in the provincial gov't department headquarters complex where
they worked - took a full week to complete their "inspection"!
Jim Wilkins
Dec 14, 2017, 7:23:28 AM12/14/17
to
"rangerssuck" <range...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:f95bf071-7f84-4d9b...@googlegroups.com...
I use scrap aluminum from the tray under the shear for that to avoid
damaging the points. Depending on their condition - mine are either
second-hand or Enco - you should be able to align the centers closely
enough to center-drill both ends of some rod stock.
With the rod held between centers, clean up the eccentricity for about
1/2" at both ends, then take a finish pass on both ends without
changing the cutting radius, flipping the rod to make both cuts at the
tailstock end.
You now have a test bar that should be (check it) the same diameter at
both ends, which you can use with a dial indicator to center the
tailstock more accurately.
This is a commercial product that can serve as a lathe test bar:
http://www.shars.com/3-precision-cylinder-square
A shop-made one is more convenient if you turn it down in the middle
to clear the dial indicator.
-jsw
news:f95bf071-7f84-4d9b...@googlegroups.com...
damaging the points. Depending on their condition - mine are either
second-hand or Enco - you should be able to align the centers closely
enough to center-drill both ends of some rod stock.
With the rod held between centers, clean up the eccentricity for about
1/2" at both ends, then take a finish pass on both ends without
changing the cutting radius, flipping the rod to make both cuts at the
tailstock end.
You now have a test bar that should be (check it) the same diameter at
both ends, which you can use with a dial indicator to center the
tailstock more accurately.
This is a commercial product that can serve as a lathe test bar:
http://www.shars.com/3-precision-cylinder-square
A shop-made one is more convenient if you turn it down in the middle
to clear the dial indicator.
-jsw
DoN. Nichols
Dec 14, 2017, 9:45:09 PM12/14/17
to
On 2017-12-14, Jim Wilkins <murat...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "rangerssuck" <range...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:f95bf071-7f84-4d9b...@googlegroups.com...
>> On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 7:40:45 PM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
>>> To align head and tail centers you simply mount a piece of stock
>>> between centers and turn a length at the head stock end and then at
>>> the tail stock end - using the same cross feed setting of course.
>>> Adjust the tail stock, if necessary and repeat.
>>>
>>> They used to sell "test bars" to do this. Hardened steel bars to be
>>> mounted between centers and then you could mount a dial indicator
>>> on
>>> the carriage and run the carriage back and forth. The test bars
>>> were,
>>> of course, exactly the same diameter for their entire length.
>>>
>>> Back in the day, they weren't considered "tricks". Just common
>>> knowledge in the trade :-)
[ ... ]
> "rangerssuck" <range...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:f95bf071-7f84-4d9b...@googlegroups.com...
>> On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 7:40:45 PM UTC-5, John B. wrote:
>>> To align head and tail centers you simply mount a piece of stock
>>> between centers and turn a length at the head stock end and then at
>>> the tail stock end - using the same cross feed setting of course.
>>> Adjust the tail stock, if necessary and repeat.
>>>
>>> They used to sell "test bars" to do this. Hardened steel bars to be
>>> mounted between centers and then you could mount a dial indicator
>>> on
>>> the carriage and run the carriage back and forth. The test bars
>>> were,
>>> of course, exactly the same diameter for their entire length.
>>>
>>> Back in the day, they weren't considered "tricks". Just common
>>> knowledge in the trade :-)
> I use scrap aluminum from the tray under the shear for that to avoid
> damaging the points. Depending on their condition - mine are either
> second-hand or Enco - you should be able to align the centers closely
> enough to center-drill both ends of some rod stock.
>
> With the rod held between centers, clean up the eccentricity for about
> 1/2" at both ends, then take a finish pass on both ends without
> changing the cutting radius, flipping the rod to make both cuts at the
> tailstock end.
> You now have a test bar that should be (check it) the same diameter at
> both ends, which you can use with a dial indicator to center the
> tailstock more accurately.
>
> This is a commercial product that can serve as a lathe test bar:
> http://www.shars.com/3-precision-cylinder-square
have.
1) The center holes at the ends are as cast, and the square
is not machined from those. It is ground so the cylindrical
surface is truly square to the rim (also ground), and is for
sitting on a surface plate to provide a true vertical from a
true horizontal of the surface plate.
Note that B&S made one which was ground intentionally a tiny bit
off square -- and there were etched lines on the surface
representing 0.0001" offset points as you rotated the square.
(Or, if you set it the other end down, it would be truly square.
2) The handle mounted on one end has no center hole at all, so
mounting it between centers would not work at all, even if the
hole at the other end were a true center.
> A shop-made one is more convenient if you turn it down in the middle
> to clear the dial indicator.
be careful to not apply enough force to bend the bar.
Larry Jaques
Dec 14, 2017, 10:34:46 PM12/14/17
to
On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 23:52:32 -0500, Gerry <gerald...@yahoo.ca>
wrote:
TFF, and so ironic & sad.
P.S: Um, what did their bosses say when they didn't shop up on the job
for a week?
--
A sound mind in a sound body is a short but full
description of a happy state in this world.
--John Locke
wrote:
P.S: Um, what did their bosses say when they didn't shop up on the job
for a week?
--
A sound mind in a sound body is a short but full
description of a happy state in this world.
--John Locke
whit3rd
Dec 14, 2017, 11:02:01 PM12/14/17
to
On Tuesday, December 12, 2017 at 4:40:45 PM UTC-8, John B. wrote:
> To align head and tail centers you simply mount a piece of stock
> between centers and turn a length at the head stock end and then at
> the tail stock end - using the same cross feed setting of course.
> Adjust the tail stock, if necessary and repeat.
Why bother? Can't you just base an indicator on the chuck or faceplate,
> To align head and tail centers you simply mount a piece of stock
> between centers and turn a length at the head stock end and then at
> the tail stock end - using the same cross feed setting of course.
> Adjust the tail stock, if necessary and repeat.
extend to the taper (internal socket) of the tailstock, and rotate the spindle
by hand, looking at the reading?
It's easy if the tailstock is near the spindle.
Howard Beel
Dec 14, 2017, 11:25:15 PM12/14/17
to
"whit3rd" <whi...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:99dff8ee-2e46-4e13...@googlegroups.com...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJrPLOq1T6A
Best Regards
Tom.
---
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Larry Jaques
Dec 14, 2017, 11:26:57 PM12/14/17
to
Jim Wilkins
Dec 15, 2017, 7:11:29 AM12/15/17
to
students from 1965 to 1991 and every alignment test gives a different
result. I have to take and measure several light finish cuts to sneak
up on the proper diameter.
-jsw
DoN. Nichols
Dec 15, 2017, 10:46:34 PM12/15/17
to
you can lay the anti-rotation lever against the bed, and start the
spindle rotating in back-gear and slowest RPM available. Then you
watch the needle wiggle (with the face facing you all the time) as you
adjust the tailstock offset screws to a minimum wiggle. (A brand new
high quality lathe will have the tailstock center slightly above the
headstock center to allow from wear. For a long time, it will wear
towards even better before it starts getting worse. (And a very slight
vertical offset won't make much difference in the workpiece diameter,
especially if the workpiece diameter is 0.250" or greater.
> It's easy if the tailstock is near the spindle.
headstock collet or chuck and tailstock ram socket.
Gerry
Dec 16, 2017, 11:11:32 PM12/16/17
to
On Thu, 14 Dec 2017 19:34:54 -0800, Larry Jaques
time for "inspection".
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