How to cut this copper coil

[Ignoramus9502]

I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
a tube.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg

The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
make #1 copper.

Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
blade?

Thanks

[Larry Jaques]

On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
<ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:

>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>a tube.
>
> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>
>The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>make #1 copper.

That's probably worth a fortune as #1 copper. Oh, it's down from $3
(when I last looked) to $2.28/lb, but still valuable.

>Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>blade?

How about a recip saw for a deeper cut? If it's soft, a 12"
woodcutting blade might work, though it might leave rough edges.
Cut it in half and clean from there.

What takes that white gunk off? What is that?

--
Newman's First Law:
It is useless to put on your brakes when you're upside down.
--Paul Newman

[DoN. Nichols]

On 2017-04-09, Ignoramus9502 <ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:
> I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
> coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
> a tube.
>
> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg

Ugly!

> The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
> cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
> make #1 copper.
>
> Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
> blade?

How long is the coil?

And what about the radial thickness?

Do you have a portable bandsaw? That might bridge the radial
thickness. Are you cutting it in place, or can you bring it to your
place first?

Maybe a low speed circular saw with a zero rake blade. Anything
with a rake will probably dig in. A pity the coil is not open enough to
use tubing cutters on it.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: <BPdnic...@d-and-d.com> | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

[Carl Ijames]

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
news:4jajeclbejpq7m8gv...@4ax.com...

On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
<ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:

>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>a tube.
>
> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>
>The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>make #1 copper.

That's probably worth a fortune as #1 copper. Oh, it's down from $3
(when I last looked) to $2.28/lb, but still valuable.


>Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>blade?

How about a recip saw for a deeper cut? If it's soft, a 12"
woodcutting blade might work, though it might leave rough edges.
Cut it in half and clean from there.

What takes that white gunk off? What is that?

=============================================================

I'm guessing the white stuff is your basic hard water deposits, calcium and
magnesium carbonates and/or sulfates and/or other salts. It always tempting
to start throwing acids at the problem to dissolve them, but then you are
going to have a big volume of hazardous waste to get rid of. How about
cutting the tubing with bolt cutters, and trying something like a small air
hammer with a wide flat tip to vibrate off as much of the white stuff as you
can. Maybe hit the coil before you cut it up to knock off big chunks, then
each length after you cut it up. Finish with a wire brush. As much as I
love chemistry, mechanical methods are almost always faster :-). Save any
acid for a final polishing step only if really needed.

-----
Regards,
Carl Ijames

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
<ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:

Sawz-All

[Ignoramus14657]

On 2017-04-09, Larry Jaques <lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
><ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:
>
>>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>>a tube.
>>
>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>>
>>The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>>cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>>make #1 copper.
>
> That's probably worth a fortune as #1 copper. Oh, it's down from $3
> (when I last looked) to $2.28/lb, but still valuable.

Still pretty good. Copper has been pretty flat for the last 1.5 years
or so.

>
>>Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>>blade?
>
> How about a recip saw for a deeper cut? If it's soft, a 12"
> woodcutting blade might work, though it might leave rough edges.
> Cut it in half and clean from there.

I want to cut it to remove steel ends, and secondly to clean off the
urethane foam.

> What takes that white gunk off? What is that?

White gunk is expanding urethane foam, it does not seem to stick to
copper very well and should easily come off once the coil is cut.

i

[Ignoramus14657]

On 2017-04-09, Carl Ijames <Xcarl....@Zverizon.net> wrote:
> I'm guessing the white stuff is your basic hard water deposits, calcium and
> magnesium carbonates and/or sulfates and/or other salts. It always tempting

No, it is expanding urethane foam.

> to start throwing acids at the problem to dissolve them, but then you are
> going to have a big volume of hazardous waste to get rid of. How about
> cutting the tubing with bolt cutters,

Way too thick for bolt cutters, over an inch thick, and inside the
tubing there is one more tubing (it is a heat exchanger). So it is
like a double tube.

> and trying something like a small air hammer with a wide flat tip to
> vibrate off as much of the white stuff as you can. Maybe hit the
> coil before you cut it up to knock off big chunks, then each length
> after you cut it up. Finish with a wire brush. As much as I love
> chemistry, mechanical methods are almost always faster :-). Save
> any acid for a final polishing step only if really needed.

I was really hoping that there is a blade for a circular saw that
would work.

i

[Ignoramus14657]

On 2017-04-09, DoN. Nichols <BPdnic...@d-and-d.com> wrote:
> On 2017-04-09, Ignoramus9502 <ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:
>> I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>> coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>> a tube.
>>
>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>
> Ugly!
>
>> The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>> cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>> make #1 copper.
>>
>> Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>> blade?
>
> How long is the coil?

Not sure how long, it is very hard to unroll. I tried, as you see,
with big forklifts, but it was very difficult.

> And what about the radial thickness?

Each tubing is over an inch thick, heavy, and inside this tube there
is a smaller tube, as this is a heat exchanger.

> Do you have a portable bandsaw? That might bridge the radial
> thickness. Are you cutting it in place, or can you bring it to your
> place first?

It is at my place.

> Maybe a low speed circular saw with a zero rake blade. Anything
> with a rake will probably dig in. A pity the coil is not open enough to
> use tubing cutters on it.

I bought a 60 tooth circular saw blade for "non-ferrous". I will give
it a try.

i

[Gunner Asch]

On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
<ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:

A good screw drive Milwaukee would be my first tool to try.

The white stuff is foam or ceramic?

Gunner

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[Leon Fisk]

On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500

As you already know copper is sticky, doesn't saw well. For the stuff
you have unrolled try an axe, maybe splitting maul with a block of wood
underneath. Wire rope, cable cutters might work on it too but they are
kind of pricey. The miners would use air chisels to cut large chunks
into smaller ones...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

[James Waldby]

On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 01:21:48 -0400, clare wrote:

> On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502 wrote:
>>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>>a tube.
>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>>
>>The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>>cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>>make #1 copper.
>>
>>Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>>blade?

> Sawz-All

A Sawzall would work, but a chainsaw might be good for an
initial cut across the side of the whole coil.

--
jiw

[Ignoramus14657]

On 2017-04-09, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
><ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:
>
>>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>>a tube.
>>
>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>>
>>The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>>cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>>make #1 copper.
>>
>>Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>>blade?
>>
>>Thanks
>
> A good screw drive Milwaukee would be my first tool to try.

I will try, I thought I had a screw drive circular saw

> The white stuff is foam or ceramic?

urethane foam

[Howard Beel]

"Ignoramus14657" <ignoram...@NOSPAM.14657.invalid> wrote in message
news:Q8-dnXqESZYBHnfF...@giganews.com...

> On 2017-04-09, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
>><ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>>>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>>>a tube.

This might work:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/181933936141?rmvSB=true

Maybe you can rent one from ahern.

Best Regards
Tom.


---
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[mog...@hotmail.com]

Powered saws with diamond-edged blades do the best on almost anything.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

Copper is "sticky" so a circular saw isn't ideal. A portable band saw
would be ideal, but a recip would do the job. Either way, there WILL
be some "fun" involved. I also have a "shear" that would "likely" do
the job, but you would need to uncoil everything first.

[Larry Jaques]

On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 08:51:14 -0500, Ignoramus14657
<ignoram...@NOSPAM.14657.invalid> wrote:

>On 2017-04-09, Larry Jaques <lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>> On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 22:07:22 -0500, Ignoramus9502
>><ignora...@NOSPAM.9502.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>I got a bit lucky and bought a broken air dryer that had a big copper
>>>coil inside. This is a heat exchanging coil with a copper tube inside
>>>a tube.
>>>
>>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/coil.jpg
>>>
>>>The problem is that it is extremely heavily made and would not easily
>>>cut with a cable cutter. I want to cut it up into pieces and clean to
>>>make #1 copper.
>>
>> That's probably worth a fortune as #1 copper. Oh, it's down from $3
>> (when I last looked) to $2.28/lb, but still valuable.
>
>Still pretty good. Copper has been pretty flat for the last 1.5 years
>or so.

It has been awhile since I looked.

>>>Any idea what can cut it, maybe a circular saw with a small tooth
>>>blade?
>>
>> How about a recip saw for a deeper cut? If it's soft, a 12"
>> woodcutting blade might work, though it might leave rough edges.
>> Cut it in half and clean from there.
>
>I want to cut it to remove steel ends, and secondly to clean off the
>urethane foam.

Recip saws are nice for demo work. I bought a nice, heavy duty Porter
Cable Tiger Saw years ago. It's a heavy beast, too. You can also set
one up in a vise and use it to hack off the thicker urethane, not
having to worry about scraping the surface. They're a bit safer than
circular and band saws.
I bought a

The little 18v Ryobi is much lighter.

>> What takes that white gunk off? What is that?
>
>White gunk is expanding urethane foam, it does not seem to stick to
>copper very well and should easily come off once the coil is cut.

Oh, God. That shit is nearly invulnerable to solvents. Acetone works
when it's fresh, but nothing cuts it when it's dry/cured. And it
doesn't burn off cleanly, producing toxic gases if you try.

I suggest you build a multiple brush unit to run it through to clean
off that foam. And ask your scrap guys what they consider "clean", so
you're not surprised when you take it in to redeem it.

[Larry Jaques]

Just remember to replace the chain and bar afterward.

[Ignoramus14657]

OK, I had some free time today and I had some success. I have jaws for
cutting heavy cables and a hydraulic power supply for it. The jaws are
new/Chinese by SDT and the power supply is Burndy from a heavy old
crimper.

As you can see from the pictures below, it does cut the tubes. You can
see how one tube is inside of another.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-1.jpg
http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-2.jpg

I will have my guy cut up the rest tomorrow.

i

[Ignoramus14657]

OK, I have a hydraulic cable cutter that worked today. The cutter head
and power supply were initially unrelated.

http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-1.jpg
http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-2.jpg

I realized that if I cut some tubes first, I can unroll the coil tube
by tube.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

Looks like you've got it.

[Ignoramus14657]

Thanks. It is not a continuous duty pump and it does overheat after a
while., But since he will also have to clean off the foam, it may get
enough time to cool down.

i

[Leon Fisk]

On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 20:47:09 -0500
Ignoramus14657 <ignoram...@NOSPAM.14657.invalid> wrote:

<snip>

>OK, I have a hydraulic cable cutter that worked today. The cutter head
>and power supply were initially unrelated.
>
> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-1.jpg
> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-2.jpg
>
>I realized that if I cut some tubes first, I can unroll the coil tube
>by tube.

That looks really nice. Should do a good job on this.

Thought you might have something like that around. You are quite the
scrounger :)

[Neon John]

On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 09:01:32 -0500, Ignoramus14657
<ignoram...@NOSPAM.14657.invalid> wrote:


>> Maybe a low speed circular saw with a zero rake blade. Anything
>> with a rake will probably dig in. A pity the coil is not open enough to
>> use tubing cutters on it.
>
>I bought a 60 tooth circular saw blade for "non-ferrous". I will give
>it a try.

I'd go with the slow speed metal cutting circle saw. I have the HF
knockoff of the Milwaukee unit and it works great. The blade is
completely shielded so the large hot chips don't go flying.

I bought the HF unit for a particular job cutting rectangular tubing,
considering it disposable. It's actually been a pretty good saw and
is several years old. It should slice that copper with no effort at
all.


John
John DeArmond
http://www.neon-john.com
http://www.tnduction.com
Tellico Plains, Occupied TN
See website for email address

[bruce2...@gmail.com]

On 2017-04-10, cl...@snyder.on.ca <cl...@snyder.on.ca> wrote:

And if you don't have a band or reciprocating saw, then dragging tie-wire over the copper tubing can cut the tubing itself via/friction after awhile.

[Ignoramus24752]

On 2017-04-10, Leon Fisk <lf...@no.spam.iserv.net> wrote:
> On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 20:47:09 -0500
> Ignoramus14657 <ignoram...@NOSPAM.14657.invalid> wrote:
>
><snip>
>>OK, I have a hydraulic cable cutter that worked today. The cutter head
>>and power supply were initially unrelated.
>>
>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-1.jpg
>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-2.jpg
>>
>>I realized that if I cut some tubes first, I can unroll the coil tube
>>by tube.
>
> That looks really nice. Should do a good job on this.
>
> Thought you might have something like that around. You are quite the
> scrounger :)
>

I bought the pump on craigslist and the cutting head I bought new from
a retailer.

i

[Jim Wilkins]

"Ignoramus24752" <ignoram...@NOSPAM.24752.invalid> wrote in
message news:MaqdnYJCKcbvxHDF...@giganews.com...

The quick disconnects used on Porta Powers are handy for other things.
http://shop.hoseandfittings.com/catalog/Porta-Power/Hydraulic_Accessories.html

-jsw

[Larry Jaques]

Wasn't the recip saw a lot quicker? That thing must take a minute or
more to cycle, huh? Nice, though! Was it expensive?

[Larry Jaques]

Just be sure to put the plastic plugs/covers back on every fitting
every time. (I got chewed out at the body shop for forgetting once.)

Amazon is slightly cheaper and has free 2-day Prime shipping if you're
a Prime member. It's $99/yr and they just told me I had saved $289
last year in shipping fees.

[Ignoramus24752]

Jim, thanks. I have another high pressure hydraulic set up for 10,000
psi. With a pneumatic/hydraulic pump and a number of cylinders. All
bought piecemeal on auctions and some taken out of a custom machine
that never saw use. I just finished it last week and it does use such
couplers. I will post some pictures later. This week we will be
lifting some heavy machinery to move it (80,000 lbs) and these
cylinders will hopefully be helpful.

i

[Ignoramus24752]

The pump was $100 on craigslist, the head about $130. Sawzall alone
would not do it. My guy also used a circular saw with 60 tooth blade.

i

[Larry Jaques]

On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 02:28:16 -0500, Ignoramus24752

<ignoram...@NOSPAM.24752.invalid> wrote:

>On 2017-04-12, Larry Jaques <lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 17:32:18 -0500, Ignoramus24752
>><ignoram...@NOSPAM.24752.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>On 2017-04-10, Leon Fisk <lf...@no.spam.iserv.net> wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 20:47:09 -0500
>>>> Ignoramus14657 <ignoram...@NOSPAM.14657.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>><snip>
>>>>>OK, I have a hydraulic cable cutter that worked today. The cutter head
>>>>>and power supply were initially unrelated.
>>>>>
>>>>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-1.jpg
>>>>> http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/Coil-2.jpg
>>>>>
>>>>>I realized that if I cut some tubes first, I can unroll the coil tube
>>>>>by tube.
>>>>
>>>> That looks really nice. Should do a good job on this.
>>>>
>>>> Thought you might have something like that around. You are quite the
>>>> scrounger :)
>>>>
>>>
>>>I bought the pump on craigslist and the cutting head I bought new from
>>>a retailer.
>>
>> Wasn't the recip saw a lot quicker? That thing must take a minute or
>> more to cycle, huh? Nice, though! Was it expensive?
>>
>
>The pump was $100 on craigslist, the head about $130.

Not bad at all. Is the head for copper only, or will it do wire rope?

>Sawzall alone would not do it. My guy also used a circular saw with 60 tooth blade.

One row at a time, I'm guessing?

[Ignoramus25440]

Copper wire only, no steel.

>
>>Sawzall alone would not do it. My guy also used a circular saw with 60 tooth blade.
>
> One row at a time, I'm guessing?
>

Right!