Comment on this TIG welder, please

[Tim Wescott]

This is probably going to stay on my wish list for a good long time, but
I've been lusting after TIG welding capabilities for a while now.

Nearly all the projects that I have in mind at the momet involve
welding .03" to .06" aluminum sheet to itself and to 1/8" or 3/16"
bosses, so it looks like this thing is heavy-duty enough.

So, is it a good buy?

http://www.eastwood.com/tig-welders-eastwood-tig-ac-dc-welder.html

--
www.wescottdesign.com

[jon_banquer]

No it's not a good buy. Nothing Eastwood offers is a good buy.

[dca...@krl.org]

On Saturday, November 21, 2015 at 6:50:14 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote:

> Nearly all the projects that I have in mind at the momet involve
> welding .03" to .06" aluminum sheet to itself and to 1/8" or 3/16"
> bosses, so it looks like this thing is heavy-duty enough.
>

> www.wescottdesign.com

Be sure to check the minimum current of any TIG welder you buy. The original Miller Econotig had a minimum current of something like 30 amps. So it would not adjust down to a low enough heat to weld .03 aluminum.

And of course remember that you will need a cylinder of argon , flow regulator, and 220 volt power outlet.

Dan

[Steve W.]

I think it's a "custom" Longevity unit.

A comparison video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oISSe0Itq7U

--
Steve W.

[jon_banquer]

Longevity and Everlast are just marketing firms for the Chinese.

[Tim Wescott]

Thanks for the video link -- it's very helpful.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

[rangerssuck]

And in that video, he really seems to like the AHP more. I plan on buying one of those very soon (hopefully before the end of this year). for an extra $50, I think you get a lot more. AND, you can buy it from Amazon, which gives you another layer of protection.

[Tim Wescott]

Yes, he really sold me on the AHP.

I've got to decide if I can really justify the $800 to myself, because I
don't need a welder very often -- but when I do I really need it, and
there's some stuff that I just can't make at the moment because I don't
have one.

--
www.wescottdesign.com

[Jim Wilkins]

"Tim Wescott" <t...@seemywebsite.com> wrote in message
news:fJydnfcYI9DXGs7L...@giganews.com...

Have you ever tried TIG welding thin aluminum with a high-end machine,
at night school for instance?

It isn't as easy as mild steel or stainless. I stopped trying to learn
when I retired and no longer wanted it on my resume.

-jsw

[Cydrome Leader]

Just for fun I tried a to tig the top of a pop can with a large machine
from Lincoln. The starting arc exploded nickel size holes in the metal,
even with the current turned way down.

[Tim Wescott]

No. I've been thinking of taking a welding class at the local Community
College, but I've been held back by the time commitment.

I can certainly believe that it's more difficult -- I know I could do
this job in a heartbeat with steel, with my gas torch. I've been tempted
to get some aluminum rod and gas welding flux and giving it a whirl, but
I have a sense that it'll take as long or longer to learn as doing it
with TIG, and that the result would never be as good.

[Tim Wescott]

A pop can is a lot thinner than 30 mils -- but yes, that's a concern.

[Terry Coombs]

I have an Everlast 250EX , much cheaper than that Lincoln or a Miller ... I
can light an arc on the bottom of a pop or beer can and run a bead , but
welding 2 of them together is still beyond my skill level . IIRC mine will
light up as low as 5 amps . It has all the same features as the Big Names ,
and would be a good starting point - if Tim had about double the budget .

--
Snag

[Jim Wilkins]

"Tim Wescott" <seemyw...@myfooter.really> wrote in message
news:7bidncPsYPbPBM7L...@giganews.com...

I've tried to learn how to do everything myself but in cases like this
I really learned what I could realistically expect when I contracted
it out. And why aluminum is still riveted.
-jsw

[dca...@krl.org]

On Monday, November 23, 2015 at 3:20:29 PM UTC-5, rangerssuck wrote:

> > >> Nearly all the projects that I have in mind at the momet involve
> > >> welding .03" to .06" aluminum sheet to itself and to 1/8" or 3/16"
> > >> bosses, so it looks like this thing is heavy-duty enough.
> > >>

> > > A comparison video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oISSe0Itq7U
> >
> > Thanks for the video link -- it's very helpful.
> >
> > --
> >
> > Tim Wescott
> > Wescott Design Services
> > http://www.wescottdesign.com
>
> And in that video, he really seems to like the AHP more. I plan on buying one of those very soon (hopefully before the end of this year). for an extra $50, I think you get a lot more. AND, you can buy it from Amazon, which gives you another layer of protection.

Looking at the specs for the AHP , it shows the minimum current as 10 amps. The rule of thumb is one amp per .001 inch of thickness. But I think that is where you set the max current. And then you use the foot pedal to get the current right. So when welding say .063 aluminum you would set the amps to about 90 amps ( 50 % more for aluminum ) , but when you are welding you may only be using 45 amps. And as you approach the end of the material , you would feather off to maybe 20 amps. So the AHP ought to be okay for 1/16 aluminum. But on .030 aluminum , you might want to feather down to ten amps. And that is as low as you can go. Anyway I would want to try the AHP on .030 aluminum before buying the machine.

If you keep looking on Ebay and Craigslist, you may find a older Tig welder for about 3 or 4 hundred. The disadvantage is they are heavy and need more power than an inverter TIG.

Dan

[Jon Elson]

Cydrome Leader wrote:

> Jim Wilkins <murat...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Just for fun I tried a to tig the top of a pop can with a large machine
> from Lincoln. The starting arc exploded nickel size holes in the metal,
> even with the current turned way down.

I have a Lincoln SquareWave TIG 300. Truly an awesome machine, even though
pretty primitive by today's inverter welder technology. I've never tried to
do anything quite so thin, but my machine has a VERY smooth, soft start. It
is so smooth, you can't be exactly sure when the transition from HF to AC
TIG happens! The machine clicks when the preflow timer ends, but the main
welding current takes about a second extra to develop. Once you pour on the
current, the hum of the AC arc makes it clear welding current is flowing.

I know you can set the current down below 5 A, I've done it while watching
the meters. Of course, you can't watch the meters and actually weld
anything, or at least I can't.

I have done some aluminum extrusions and also copper, which might actually
be harder to control the heat than aluminum. You've got the whole piece
within a few degrees of completely melting all the time.

Jon

[Gunner Asch]

The old Lincoln Idealarc 250 and 300, would on low range..start at "3"
amps. When in bad shape..they would start at 5-8 amps

My Squarewave 300 will start at 3-4 amps on low, and with process
controls on...I can get pulsed (selectable) 3 amp ac/dc. Welding beer
cans is easy. It will also go up to 425 amps..but to get over
250ish..it needs a 100 amp breaker...


Gunner

[Gunner Asch]

On Mon, 23 Nov 2015 20:53:12 -0600, Jon Elson <el...@pico-systems.com>
wrote:

That machine..is one of the FINEST welders ever made. Primitive or
not...it will do just about any damned thing you can want of it. Heavy
as hell...and draws a fair amount of power..but its better than a
Syncrowave 300 and as good as my welder.

[Gunner Asch]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Miller-Econo-Tig/321929237146

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Miller-Econotig-Ac-Dc-welding-machine-tig-and-stick-/161892205413

[Gunner Asch]

On Mon, 23 Nov 2015 18:49:10 -0800 (PST), "dca...@krl.org"
<dca...@krl.org> wrote:

http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html

http://sandiego.craigslist.org/nsd/tls/5329685003.html

http://stockton.craigslist.org/tls/5316556006.html

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/tls/5329061276.html

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/tls/5328123006.html

http://sacramento.craigslist.org/tls/5327334212.html

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/wvl/tls/5328111745.html

etc etc etc.

Best Craigslist search engine:

www.searchtempest.com

[gghe...@gmail.com]

On Saturday, November 21, 2015 at 6:50:14 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote:

> This is probably going to stay on my wish list for a good long time, but
> I've been lusting after TIG welding capabilities for a while now.
>
> Nearly all the projects that I have in mind at the momet involve
> welding .03" to .06" aluminum sheet to itself and to 1/8" or 3/16"
> bosses, so it looks like this thing is heavy-duty enough.

Knowing next to nothing about welding, Can you solder the
aluminum pieces together? Or do you need more strength?

George H.

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 00:39:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
wrote:

>http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html

Tim's wondering if he wants to invest as much as $7/800 in a welder
and you offer up a bunch of $1,200-2k listings? Interesting. ;)

Well, screw welders. I want one of these babies, + several dozen
crates of ammo, please. Christmas looms!
http://www.gizmag.com/dtv-shredder-jackal-military-ugv/18990/
Would't those be a blast to ride, guys?

--
The most powerful factors in the world are clear
ideas in the minds of energetic men of good will.
-- J. Arthur Thomson

[Tim Wescott]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 09:22:18 -0800, Larry Jaques wrote:

> On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 00:39:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html
>
> Tim's wondering if he wants to invest as much as $7/800 in a welder and
> you offer up a bunch of $1,200-2k listings? Interesting. ;)
>
> Well, screw welders. I want one of these babies, + several dozen crates
> of ammo, please. Christmas looms!
> http://www.gizmag.com/dtv-shredder-jackal-military-ugv/18990/
> Would't those be a blast to ride, guys?

I would love a $7/800 welder. Less than a penny sounds great, as long as
the thing works.

My suspicion is that for what I want, a new el-cheapo welder will be
better than a nice older machine -- I suspect that if I were doing normal
stuff in a normal shop (i.e., not really thin stuff) that I'd feel
differently.

[Tim Wescott]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 07:08:58 -0800, ggherold wrote:

> On Saturday, November 21, 2015 at 6:50:14 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote:
>> This is probably going to stay on my wish list for a good long time,
>> but I've been lusting after TIG welding capabilities for a while now.
>>
>> Nearly all the projects that I have in mind at the momet involve
>> welding .03" to .06" aluminum sheet to itself and to 1/8" or 3/16"
>> bosses, so it looks like this thing is heavy-duty enough.
>
> Knowing next to nothing about welding, Can you solder the aluminum
> pieces together? Or do you need more strength?

I've tried soldering without a lot of success. I've also tried aluminum
brazing, which rapidly turned into half-assed aluminum welding, and then
a puddle on my bench.

I suppose I should try epoxy, but it's for a model airplane muffler and I
have visions of the thing just falling apart in the air.

[Jon Elson]

Gunner Asch wrote:


> That machine..is one of the FINEST welders ever made. Primitive or
> not...it will do just about any damned thing you can want of it. Heavy
> as hell...and draws a fair amount of power..but its better than a
> Syncrowave 300 and as good as my welder.

Yes, Ernie Leimkuehler said the same thing, which is why I snagged it when
it came up on eBay quite some time ago.

Jon

[Leon Fisk]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 12:27:56 -0600
Tim Wescott <seemyw...@myfooter.really> wrote:

<snip>

>My suspicion is that for what I want, a new el-cheapo welder will be
>better than a nice older machine -- I suspect that if I were doing normal
>stuff in a normal shop (i.e., not really thin stuff) that I'd feel
>differently.

I was looking and drooling awhile back too. I really liked the looks of
the Thermal Arc 186 AC/DC:

http://store.cyberweld.com/tharc186tigw.html

I figured around $2000 to be safe, get it ready to go with argon, some
consumables and such...

Sure are a bunch of almost affordable choices nowadays ;-)

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 09:22:18 -0800, Larry Jaques

<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 00:39:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html
>
>Tim's wondering if he wants to invest as much as $7/800 in a welder
>and you offer up a bunch of $1,200-2k listings? Interesting. ;)
>
>Well, screw welders. I want one of these babies, + several dozen
>crates of ammo, please. Christmas looms!
>http://www.gizmag.com/dtv-shredder-jackal-military-ugv/18990/
>Would't those be a blast to ride, guys?

I also offered up the URL of the best Craigslist search engine Ive
ever found. The list of machines I posted was done in less than 5
minutes. It also showed that cheap machines are hard to find, even on
Craigslist. There was (1) (old) $500 Miller on Ebay..but it will
need the torch, cooler, pedal etc etc...bringing the price up
considerably.

If the suitcase welders are what he can afford/need, Id suggest he
find one with the best reviews and buy it.

However..I would...would further suggest he do a Craigslist search
engine search in his area for a few weeks and see what turns up. And
do NOT be afraid to call the seller and haggle, particularly for
machines that have been up for 6 or more days. As the economy slows
down yet again....Im seeing more "hobby stuff" appearing on Craigslist
and very reasonable prices.

Set a deadline of say..1 month..and hit the ads regularly and
hard...if you dont fine a lincoln or miller at his price range..then
jump on one of the Chicom Inverter suitcase machines. By all
reports..they are decent enough for the price. Just remember...if
they break..there is ZERO repair sources for them ,generally that dont
involve big shipping costs both ways.

[gghe...@gmail.com]

Did you have the right flux? (La-co Aluminum flux paste)
I haven't done a lot but I soldered Al pieces to circuit board and
pieces of copper wire to aluminum foil. (like right off the roll in the kitchen)
I've never tried it for joining Al bits together, but I bet I could do it.

I don't know about mufflers, how hot do those things get?
There are epoxies that claim 500 F. That seem cheaper than a
new welder.. unless you mostly are looking for an excuse to buy one.

George H.

[Gunner Asch]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 09:22:18 -0800, Larry Jaques
<lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:

>On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 00:39:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html
>
>Tim's wondering if he wants to invest as much as $7/800 in a welder
>and you offer up a bunch of $1,200-2k listings? Interesting. ;)
>
>Well, screw welders. I want one of these babies, + several dozen
>crates of ammo, please. Christmas looms!
>http://www.gizmag.com/dtv-shredder-jackal-military-ugv/18990/
>Would't those be a blast to ride, guys?

From the same site....

http://www.gizmag.com/nissan-zeod-rc-engine/30611/?li_source=LI&li_medium=default-widget

http://www.gizmag.com/duke-engines-axial/33631/?li_source=LI&li_medium=default-widget

both of which are absolutely fascinating!!

Gunner

[dca...@krl.org]

On Tuesday, November 24, 2015 at 1:28:02 PM UTC-5, Tim Wescott wrote:
>
>
> I would love a $7/800 welder. Less than a penny sounds great, as long as
> the thing works.
>
> My suspicion is that for what I want, a new el-cheapo welder will be
> better than a nice older machine -- I suspect that if I were doing normal
> stuff in a normal shop (i.e., not really thin stuff) that I'd feel
> differently.
>
> --
>
> Tim Wescott
> Wescott Design Services
> http://www.wescottdesign.com

Ernie is the man as far as welding goes. He reads SJEW , but it might take a while to get an answer. You might consider getting a small DC Tig welder. They are pretty cheap especially if it is used. Here is some info an welding aluminum using DC tig.

Ernie for tig welding all the steels I do I use DC (EN), My welder also has the option for DC (EP), Can I use this for tig welding? If so what materials or use for?
Thanks

Answer
DC Electrode Positive will work for aluminum and Magnesium.
AC works better, but DCEP does work.
The problem with DCEP is that the majority of the heat is coming back at the tungsten, so the tungsten gets very hot.
This limits the capacity of DCEP as to thickness of aluminum.
The simple rule is the tungsten has to be at least as thick as the aluminum.

Even if you have AC on your TIG you can use DCEP to ball the tungsten before welding with AC.
You will get a better ball.

Dan

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 12:48:15 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 09:22:18 -0800, Larry Jaques
><lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 00:39:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html
>>
>>Tim's wondering if he wants to invest as much as $7/800 in a welder
>>and you offer up a bunch of $1,200-2k listings? Interesting. ;)
>>
>>Well, screw welders. I want one of these babies, + several dozen
>>crates of ammo, please. Christmas looms!
>>http://www.gizmag.com/dtv-shredder-jackal-military-ugv/18990/
>>Would't those be a blast to ride, guys?
>
>
>I also offered up the URL of the best Craigslist search engine Ive
>ever found. The list of machines I posted was done in less than 5
>minutes. It also showed that cheap machines are hard to find, even on
>Craigslist. There was (1) (old) $500 Miller on Ebay..but it will
>need the torch, cooler, pedal etc etc...bringing the price up
>considerably.

Yes, kudos for SearchTempest referral. It's a honey of an app.

[Larry Jaques]

On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 12:57:31 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>

wrote:

>On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 09:22:18 -0800, Larry Jaques
><lja...@invalid.diversifycomm.com> wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 24 Nov 2015 00:39:14 -0800, Gunner Asch <gunne...@gmail.com>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>http://inlandempire.craigslist.org/tls/5328865747.html
>>
>>Tim's wondering if he wants to invest as much as $7/800 in a welder
>>and you offer up a bunch of $1,200-2k listings? Interesting. ;)
>>
>>Well, screw welders. I want one of these babies, + several dozen
>>crates of ammo, please. Christmas looms!
>>http://www.gizmag.com/dtv-shredder-jackal-military-ugv/18990/
>>Would't those be a blast to ride, guys?
>
>
>From the same site....
>
>http://www.gizmag.com/nissan-zeod-rc-engine/30611/?li_source=LI&li_medium=default-widget

I INSTANTLY wanted one for my riding mower. ;)

>http://www.gizmag.com/duke-engines-axial/33631/?li_source=LI&li_medium=default-widget
>
>both of which are absolutely fascinating!!

I wonder if the Duke Axial will ever make it out of the research lab.

[Larry Jaques]

<vbg> Um, pretty warm.
http://eng.fsu.edu/me/senior_design/2006/team15/exhaust_temp.JPG
http://assets.bankspower.com/prod_inline_images/322/tailpipe-chart.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads12/glowing+bmw+m+v8+headers1197176043.jpg

I recommend against epoxy.

[Tim Wescott]

Those are for gasoline or diesel four-strokes, and you're mostly quoting
temperatures that would melt an aluminum muffler off of the engine -- and
in model airplane service, if a muffler isn't aluminum, there's a good
chance that it's carbon fiber.

[Larry Jaques]

That'll teach me to read only the last part of the message...