Bike fit

[Steve Gerdemann]

I'm considering getting a bike fit. The main reason I haven't is the cost $300. I'm wondering if it is really worth it. I race TT & hill climbs and also I ride a lot of miles. The only bike fit was done when I got it 5 years ago.
I'm not having any injury probles but I'm pretty sure everything is far from optimal.

Any thoughts

[jbeattie]

I think they're "worth it" ($300?, yikes) for people who can't get comfortable on their bikes, who have identifiable physical problems, often knee/foot angulation, etc. or who are looking for performance gains -- but not necessarily comfort gains. To get performance gains, you need a serious fitting with real instrumentation.

I've never had one, but I've had friends who did -- and who left with basically the same position with some parameter changed by a mm or two. Early fittings 25 years ago when the fit craze hit often yielded odd positions, IMO. I think it has been dialed-in a bit more -- but I still think you're at the mercy of the particular fitter and his or her competence. I would certainly shop for someone with proven results.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Andre Jute]

I happen to think that a millimetre this way or that can make all the difference to your comfort. But I arrive there mainly in a negative way, in that, after years of sore back and bum rides, I have my bike set up so perfectly that a new component that throws anything out in the least is such a serious disturbance that I look at new components with suspicion.

But in your case, if everything seems optimal, I don't quite see what your three hundred bucks will get you except possibly the upset of your pleasure in your riding by a disturbance even a competent fitter may introduce simply because that is his way of working. Yours seems to be one of those cases where there is a lot of truth in the old adage: "Listen to your body." And your body is telling you everything is copacetic.

Andre Jute
If it ain't broke, don't pay to break it.

[avag...@gmail.com]

awww your experience should support gaining info from controlled adjustments on the current frames.

combined with relevant and trusted online advice.

the fit biz is for new riders without experience ability to acquire knowledge and apply the info. lotta stupid people out there ...wuhwuhwuh....cattle...so there are a large numbers of blood suckers wanting $300 ...

[John B.]

I think that it may depend largely on the individual rider. If, for
example, you understand why a bicycle frame is built the way it is and
what the effects of changing some of the dimensions and angles might
be, and how the human body fits on the bicycle, then I doubt that a
"fitting" is going to do a lot of good, unless the Fitter is an expert
in bicycles that are designed for a very specific use. A track bicycle
for a smallish woman, for example, might well be a very different
machine than a track bicycle built for a tall male.

But, on the other hand, if one has been riding for some time and does
understand what is happening between the man and the machine than it
mat be that a fitter is going to make a whole lot of difference.

My guess is that Eddy Merckx or Greg Lemond, to name a couple of
pretty good riders, ever had a frame fitting :-)

Watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrZBjOloChg
If you learned something new then yes, a fitting may help you, if you
already knew it then perhaps not.
--
cheers,

John B.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 5/22/2016 10:14 PM, John B. wrote:
> On Sun, 22 May 2016 06:06:58 -0700 (PDT), Steve Gerdemann
> <sjger...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm considering getting a bike fit. The main reason I haven't is the cost $300. I'm wondering if it is really worth it. I race TT & hill climbs and also I ride a lot of miles. The only bike fit was done when I got it 5 years ago.
>> I'm not having any injury probles but I'm pretty sure everything is far from optimal.
>>
>> Any thoughts
>
> I think that it may depend largely on the individual rider. If, for
> example, you understand why a bicycle frame is built the way it is and
> what the effects of changing some of the dimensions and angles might
> be, and how the human body fits on the bicycle, then I doubt that a
> "fitting" is going to do a lot of good, unless the Fitter is an expert
> in bicycles that are designed for a very specific use. A track bicycle
> for a smallish woman, for example, might well be a very different
> machine than a track bicycle built for a tall male.
>
> But, on the other hand, if one has been riding for some time and does
> understand what is happening between the man and the machine than it
> mat be that a fitter is going to make a whole lot of difference.
>
> My guess is that Eddy Merckx or Greg Lemond, to name a couple of
> pretty good riders, ever had a frame fitting :-)

I'm not sure which word you left out of that sentence. But as I recall,
a very young Greg Lemond was winning races with a saddle that was far
too low. Some coach or other noticed that problem and realized that
with his saddle at proper height, he'd be damn near unbeatable. So he
did get a frame fitting, so to speak. And he was damn near unbeatable.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B.]

I think I am a victim of "editing" :-) I think I probably originally
wrote " I doubt that" and then improved it to "I'm not sure..."

But one, at least, of the problems with "fittings" is that the people
who make a study, in the laboratory, don't agree.

For example: Greg Lemond's book, " Greg Lemond's Complete Book of
Bicycling" includes charts that recommend for a 30" inseam a seat
height of 26.5". Converting this to centimeters we have 67.3 cm
measured from the seat to the C/L of the bottom bracket. Add the pedal
length (172.5 mm) gets us 84.55 or 110.9% of inseam.

But, if you read Hamley and Thomas
Hamley, E. J., & Thomas, V. (1967). Physiological and postural factors
in the calibration of the bicycle ergometer. The Journal Of
Physiology, 191(2), 55P-56P.

You get different numbers - an 83.6 cm seat to pedal of 83.06, or
109.0 %

(To be brief I'm leaving out something like 14 other studies :-)
they we find:
STATIC VERSUS DYNAMIC EVALUATION IN BIKE FITTING: INFLUENCE OF
SADDLE HEIGHT ON LOWER LIMB KINEMATICS,

Ventura Ferrer-Roca, Andreu Roig, Pedro Galilea and Juan García-López
GIRSANE Research Group, High Performance Sport Center (CAR), Sant
Cugat del Vallès, Spain
Faculty of Physical Activity and Sports Sciences, University of Leon,
León, Spain.

Which tells us that:
"that adjusting saddle height from 106% to 109% of the inseam would
not ensure an optimal knee flexion angle and might not prevent
injuries (30-40o with the crank parallel to the vertical tube).
Therefore, we suggest selecting a saddle height between 109-110.4% of
inseam length could be more appropriate to prevent these types of
injuries."

So essentially we have published recommendations on saddle height
ranging from ~106% inseam to ~111% or for our 30 inch inseam about
31.8" to 33.11".

If you feel that is an insignificant number then wearing the
appropriate garment and foot ware adjust the seat to what feels like
"Just Right" and then raise or lower it 1.3 inches and ride it again.
--
cheers,

John B.