New Problem on Multi-Use Paths--Masses of People Staring at their Phones

[sms]

My wife uses the San Tomas Aquino Creek Trail
<http://www.rhorii.com/STACT/SanTomasTrl.html> which runs right by her
office.

It's usually very lightly used. During the past few days it has been
packed with scooters, pedestrians, skateboarders, cyclists walking their
bike, and hoverboarders. They are all intently staring at their phones
and madly swiping. She also has notices hordes of people walking around
the office park where she works, including them congregating outside her
window.

Not sure what the heck is going on here. Must be some new-fangled app on
these people's phone that makes them go outside, but not pay attention
to their surroundings.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

nice ditch....scenic.....any aegypti ?

yeah well I gave in to squandering a few minutes over in wiki after the same wonder was expressed in Yak County. 'Jeeez lookit all the creeps'

yo asshole doahn step on that rattlesnake.....

so you can see this happening ? amazing.

does it bring any good looking young pussy out of the ac ?

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

https://www.google.com/#q=pokemon+go+for+dummies

eeyehhahhha 54k/66

Mongolian ?

[Peter Gordon]

sms <scharf...@geemail.com> wrote in news:nmdk86$e4i$1...@dont-email.me:

It's an app called Pocomon GO.
http://www.pokemon.com/us/pokemon-video-games/pokemon-go/

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/jul/16/pokemon-go-server-crash-
niantic-europe-us

Here in Australia it has become a problem with people
walking onto roads without looking.

[jbeattie]

Population control. If you're dopey enough to be wasting your time on an "augmented reality" game based on a cartoon show/card game for ten year-olds, then you don't deserve to be in the gene pool. What is the world coming to? Dopes and terrorists. It's like Jihad meets Idiocracy.

-- Jay Beattie.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

talk about augmented reality ........

gnaw this is healthy. to play one is....to play is tube more...

we do this with topo maps n garmin handheld gps ....on the hole not appreciably more dangerous than a city street.

say what's with the sponge ?

[somebody]

On Sat, 16 Jul 2016 08:35:27 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

Get a cheap bell. Or a horn. Those pump-up horns are loud enough.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[John B.]

On 16 Jul 2016 19:33:15 GMT, Peter Gordon <petergoATnetspace.net.au>
wrote:

Think of it as Darwin's theory in action, "a branching pattern of
evolution resulted from a process that he called natural selection, in
which the struggle for existence has a similar effect to the
artificial selection involved in selective breeding."

The intelligent and alert of the species get to breed while the "Num
Nuts" don't. :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sat, 16 Jul 2016 08:35:27 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

The idlers are seeking enlightenment from their phones. They have
made the pilgrimage to the various shrines in the park, where the
prophets and radio waves are known to congregate. They are now
performing the ritual of finding a hot spot, syncing their phones, and
engaging in responsive dialog with the spirits, in the hope that
Usenet, Siri, Cortana, or TheAnswerDude will provide them with the
answers they seek.

The congregations are not so that they may be closer to their
prophets, but rather that they seem to have found an open Wi-Fi
hotspot. I suggest you have your wife ask IT if their Wi-Fi is still
secure and if some moron has punched the router reset button, which
default the router to wide open. It's quite common.


--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 18:09:03 +0700, John B. <slocom...@gmail.xyz>
wrote:

>Think of it as Darwin's theory in action, "a branching pattern of
>evolution resulted from a process that he called natural selection, in
>which the struggle for existence has a similar effect to the
>artificial selection involved in selective breeding."

Natural selection doesn't work when the govenment supports mostly the
failures at the expense of the successful. Your purpose in life is to
consume, pollute, and over-populate. Failure to do any of these is
punished by society but aided by government.

>The intelligent and alert of the species get to breed while the "Num
>Nuts" don't. :-)

There are apps for the unintelligent and distracted:
<https://play.google.com/store/search?q=dating%20apps>

The meek shall inherit the earth. I think they already have.

[russell...@yahoo.com]

Its that PokeMon Go thing I have heard about. NPR Nightly Business Report had stories about it this week. Stories were about how to make money from it. The great American dream. Making/taking money from idiots. Wonderful.

Trails where I live do not have too many walkers. Trails are sort of away from the populated areas and it would take a lot of effort for walkers to get on them. Few trails near downtown where you do have to watch for pedestrians. But even those trails are not right next to the buildings. 1/2 mile away across the river.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

AE6KS

ahh liebo you spout elitist garbage...

the idea, beyond seling ad space next week....is engaging people to look see think feel....reason....discover.

I meet educated isolationists ...woefully behind on education.

the words of the prophets are...

[John B.]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 09:02:34 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
wrote:

>On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 18:09:03 +0700, John B. <slocom...@gmail.xyz>
>wrote:
>
>>Think of it as Darwin's theory in action, "a branching pattern of
>>evolution resulted from a process that he called natural selection, in
>>which the struggle for existence has a similar effect to the
>>artificial selection involved in selective breeding."
>
>Natural selection doesn't work when the govenment supports mostly the
>failures at the expense of the successful. Your purpose in life is to
>consume, pollute, and over-populate. Failure to do any of these is
>punished by society but aided by government.
>
>>The intelligent and alert of the species get to breed while the "Num
>>Nuts" don't. :-)
>
>There are apps for the unintelligent and distracted:
><https://play.google.com/store/search?q=dating%20apps>
>
>The meek shall inherit the earth. I think they already have.

I don't think it is the meek. Herbert Spencer wrote:

"The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly, is to
fill the world with fools."

Reading the Internet it seems Old Herbie may well have gotten it right

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 18:21:47 -0700 (PDT), DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH
<avag...@gmail.com> wrote:

> AE6KS
>
>ahh liebo you spout elitist garbage...

True. For you, I will (mostly) use words of fewer syllables so that I
will not tax your reading ability.

>the idea, beyond seling ad space next week....is engaging
>people to look see think feel....reason....discover.

Hardly. It's a secret plot by those conspiring to entice the GUM
(great unwashed masses) into getting some exercise, possibly for the
first time in their lives:
<http://gizmodo.com/sore-legs-become-pandemic-as-pokemon-go-players-acciden-1783402931>
<http://health.usnews.com/wellness/articles/2016-07-11/pokemon-go-has-everyone-exercising>

>I meet educated isolationists ...woefully behind on education.

That's odd. I usually meet isolated educators, who are woefully
lacking any connection with reality.

>the words of the prophets are...

mine.

Bicycle sales are booming:
<http://www.telegraphindia.com/1080325/jsp/frontpage/story_9054706.jsp>

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

We are parked across from SpaceX's launch pad clear sky bright moon on the water fresh cool breeze.

People walking looking at grey hand held rectangles.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 18 Jul 2016 08:39:43 +0700, John B. <slocom...@gmail.xyz>

wrote:

>On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 09:02:34 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>
>wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 18:09:03 +0700, John B. <slocom...@gmail.xyz>
>>wrote:
>>
>>>Think of it as Darwin's theory in action, "a branching pattern of
>>>evolution resulted from a process that he called natural selection, in
>>>which the struggle for existence has a similar effect to the
>>>artificial selection involved in selective breeding."
>>
>>Natural selection doesn't work when the govenment supports mostly the
>>failures at the expense of the successful. Your purpose in life is to
>>consume, pollute, and over-populate. Failure to do any of these is
>>punished by society but aided by government.
>>
>>>The intelligent and alert of the species get to breed while the "Num
>>>Nuts" don't. :-)
>>
>>There are apps for the unintelligent and distracted:
>><https://play.google.com/store/search?q=dating%20apps>
>>
>>The meek shall inherit the earth. I think they already have.

>I don't think it is the meek.

<https://www.vocabulary.com/dictionary/meek>
Something about a nation of sheep.

>Herbert Spencer wrote:
>"The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly, is to
>fill the world with fools."

Fools are another class of people that may not benefit from
protection. The same can be said for medicine, financial aid,
unemployment, killing bugs, etc. All we've done is created a
civilization full of medical liabilities, permanently impoverished,
perpetually unemployed/unemployable, super bugs, etc. However,
civilizations are judged somewhat on how they treat their
unfortunates. I don't think anyone wants to resurrect the Spartan
methods of improving the general health and welfare of the population.
So, we live with a subclass of fools etc, and only deal with the
problem when it becomes too expensive.

>Reading the Internet it seems Old Herbie may well have gotten it right
>:-)

"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people
all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time."
(Abraham Lincoln).
He was wrong. You can fool all the people all the time by simple
repetition. The internet and the advertising business have done a
wonderful job of proving that. All one needs to do is repeat the same
lies over and over and eventually they become facts. Eventually, the
sources become obscured by evolutionary repetition (where things
change slightly as they are repeated).

Shielding everyone from the effects of their own mistakes also has the
effect of causing people to become careless and reckless. I have
insurance so I can drive my car like a maniac. If I get hurt, someone
else will pay the bills. My credit card is insured so I don't need to
worry about security. All this creates more fools out of otherwise
normal people.

Much of this is based on the observation that people tend to trust
things they do NOT understand. If they know how something works or
operates, they tend to know its limitations and only trust it so far.
However, if the mechanisms and operations are completely unfathomable,
they will prefer to trust it, even though they are suspicious. Well,
that's a fair description of government, banks, stock market,
insurance, modern medicine, and most financial instruments. Trusting
something that one does not understand is my definition of a fool.

[Jeff Liebermann]

That's typical. Go to any ball game and look at the crowds. Many are
watching the game on smartphones and tablets. Allegedly, they get a
better "view" of what's happening on the field. I suspect they would
have been better off staying home.

However, this is just the beginning. Those people are maintaining
contact with their friends and associates wherever they may be. The
smartphone is the current way of doing that, but is terribly
inconvenient and somewhat dangerous. A better way would be to have a
brain implant which provides the necessary visual and aural
connections to the friends and associates. Just take the smartphone
out of the path and replace it with some transducers and
communications devices. Effectively, brain to brain communications.
Then, you can complain about zombies wandering the beach, staring off
into the distance, eyes fixated on nothing, and blithely walking into
one of Florida's famous sink holes.

[sms]

On 7/17/2016 3:48 PM, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Its that PokeMon Go thing I have heard about. NPR Nightly Business Report had stories about it this week. Stories were about how to make money from it. The great American dream. Making/taking money from idiots. Wonderful.
>
> Trails where I live do not have too many walkers. Trails are sort of away from the populated areas and it would take a lot of effort for walkers to get on them. Few trails near downtown where you do have to watch for pedestrians. But even those trails are not right next to the buildings. 1/2 mile away across the river.

Outside my office is a trail, but there's a little creek separating the
trail from our parking lot. There are a bunch of Pokemon's on the trail.
The CEO jokingly suggested that we drop everything and construct a
little bridge over the creek so employees can reach the Pokemons. It's
only about 12 feet across so a few 2" x 4" x 16' boards would do it,
plus a some supports that won't sink into the mud.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

we know you as the saying goes better than that...

watching multiple goldenfoiled releases from the Xcam ....

on my handheld TV ..


finding immediate specs n diagrams while working ...

so goes okiemon ..

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

? The Electrons defend the Castle ? .

Are you going to Cleveland ?

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

Contagion. .... we"re attacked by SpaceX and locals ... get out the mace...

[Tosspot]

On 17/07/16 12:25, somebody wrote:
> On Sat, 16 Jul 2016 08:35:27 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> My wife uses the San Tomas Aquino Creek Trail
>> <http://www.rhorii.com/STACT/SanTomasTrl.html> which runs right by her
>> office.
>>
>> It's usually very lightly used. During the past few days it has been
>> packed with scooters, pedestrians, skateboarders, cyclists walking their
>> bike, and hoverboarders. They are all intently staring at their phones
>> and madly swiping. She also has notices hordes of people walking around
>> the office park where she works, including them congregating outside her
>> window.
>>
>> Not sure what the heck is going on here. Must be some new-fangled app on
>> these people's phone that makes them go outside, but not pay attention
>> to their surroundings.
>
> Get a cheap bell. Or a horn. Those pump-up horns are loud enough.

My AirZound has claimed three phones :-)

[Tosspot]

Then you'd only get someone like me that would saw halfway through the
timber :-)

[John B.]

On Sun, 17 Jul 2016 19:42:03 -0700, Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com>

While I am fairly sure that Spencer was referring to the mentally
"slow" when he said that but I am equally sure that if he'd been shown
a person with the level of debt that the "average" Usian has today
he'd have, straight away, added that to his "fool" category.

>>Reading the Internet it seems Old Herbie may well have gotten it right
>>:-)
>
>"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people
>all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time."
>(Abraham Lincoln).
>He was wrong. You can fool all the people all the time by simple
>repetition. The internet and the advertising business have done a
>wonderful job of proving that. All one needs to do is repeat the same
>lies over and over and eventually they become facts. Eventually, the
>sources become obscured by evolutionary repetition (where things
>change slightly as they are repeated).

Certainly. Dr. Joseph Gobbels proved that.

>Shielding everyone from the effects of their own mistakes also has the
>effect of causing people to become careless and reckless. I have
>insurance so I can drive my car like a maniac. If I get hurt, someone
>else will pay the bills. My credit card is insured so I don't need to
>worry about security. All this creates more fools out of otherwise
>normal people.
>
>Much of this is based on the observation that people tend to trust
>things they do NOT understand. If they know how something works or
>operates, they tend to know its limitations and only trust it so far.
>However, if the mechanisms and operations are completely unfathomable,
>they will prefer to trust it, even though they are suspicious. Well,
>that's a fair description of government, banks, stock market,
>insurance, modern medicine, and most financial instruments. Trusting
>something that one does not understand is my definition of a fool.

But, I would have to ask, why don't they understand? After all the
financial institutes you describe are, essentially, rather simple
operations. After all, "1% interest, monthly, on the unpaid balance"
is pretty simple, as is "five today for seven on payday".

I think I would alter your definition just a bit. If one has something
that is of vital importance and they make no attempt to understand
even the underlying facts, terms, operation, what have you, then they
are pretty foolish but the fact that you, for example, may very well
not understand the detailed intricacies of, say the fuel injection on
you car, does not make you foolish.

--
cheers,

John B.

[jbeattie]

That would happen here in fantasy land -- except there would be a $1B bond issuance for bridge building that would include a bike, pedestrian and unicorn facility. Property tax payers would see a new line item for the Pokebridge -- right next to the zebra tanning beds and mustache help line.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Joerg]

On 2016-07-17 15:48, russell...@yahoo.com wrote:
> Its that PokeMon Go thing I have heard about. NPR Nightly Business
> Report had stories about it this week. Stories were about how to
> make money from it. The great American dream. Making/taking money
> from idiots. Wonderful.
>
> Trails where I live do not have too many walkers. Trails are sort of
> away from the populated areas and it would take a lot of effort for
> walkers to get on them. Few trails near downtown where you do have
> to watch for pedestrians. But even those trails are not right next
> to the buildings. 1/2 mile away across the river.
>

I am thankful for singletrack without cell coverage. That's where I will
ride this week. Other than a few other MTB riders, longhaul hikers,
horses and dogs I won't meet anyone there. Certainly none of this
Pokemon crowd.

On Monday I had a kid on a BMX bike barreling down a hill on a bike path
at high speed, both hands off the handlebar and on his cell phone,
staring at its screen.

What some people do is really stupid.

[...]

--
Regards, Joerg

http://www.analogconsultants.com/

[Mike A Schwab]

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-pokemon-go-players-stabbed-fall-off-cliff-20160714-snap-story.html

[Mike A Schwab]

Only? Must be a slow week.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYkBHGurj-I

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

if you carefuly consider your geo-reality all Portland Bond Issues are fantasy

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

WE WILL SOLDIER ONWARD .....

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

On Monday, July 18, 2016 at 3:43:50 PM UTC-4, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
> WE WILL SOLDIER ONWARD .....

'Is this real life? This particular "why" is just ridiculous. A #Floridaman in Palm Coast shot at two teenagers in a car outside his house around 1:30 a.m. Saturday. The teens were playing Pokemon.

Here's what happened. The homeowner awoke to noise outside his house. He sees the car. He goes outside with a gun. The teens speed off, and he shoots at the car. The next day, one of the kids' moms finds bullet holes in the tire and calls the police.

The investigation is ongoing. However, something tells me a rare Pikachu was involved.

No one was hurt. Phew.'

FLA TODAY mulling earthquakes vs violence.

[Mike A Schwab]

And a new generation of bike thief.

http://www.newyorkupstate.com/news/2016/07/pokemon_go_upstate_ny_woman_accused_of_stealing_boys_bike_to_catch_pokemon.html

Pokemon Go: Upstate NY woman accused of stealing boy's bike to catch Pokémon

By Geoff Herbert
on July 15, 2016 at 11:27 PM, updated July 15, 2016 at 11:28 PM

Gotta catch 'em all? An Upstate New York woman has been caught trying to do just that.

The Democrat & Chronicle reports Brandi-Lyn Heidenreich, 26, is accused of stealing a 13-year-old boy's bicycle while playing Pokémon Go. The Genesee County Sheriff's Office said the she took the bike from behind a North Main Street business in Oakfield, N.Y., and rode it to her nearby home on Thursday.

Heidenreich was later found walking around the area. Deputies said she "took the bicycle so she could get around faster playing Pokémon Go."

<continued>

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

BUT SHE DIDN'T KNIFE THE KID RIGHT ?

so whats the big deal ?

[SMS]

I could build a bridge for about $200 in lumber and it would be nice to
be able to get over the creek to the trail easily, especially when I
bike to work since it would be a nicer route. But I suspect that it
would not take long for the city or county to notice it and remove it.

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[John B.]

Which exemplifies why we need Truth in Government. What is needed is
some form of regulation that until the government notifies the tax
payers, perhaps by way of some sort of public notice, of all the
ramifications of building, lets say housing home for homeless bunny
rabbets, that no money could be expended.

A foot note with some sort of penalty for running over budget would
also be useful :-)

--
cheers,

John B.

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 07-17-2016 21:42, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> He was wrong. You can fool all the people all the time by simple
> repetition. The internet and the advertising business have done a
> wonderful job of proving that. All one needs to do is repeat the same
> lies over and over and eventually they become facts. Eventually, the
> sources become obscured by evolutionary repetition (where things

I think not. How many decades has the "don't eat fat" myth been
spouted? And yet there are still large numbers of us who have read the
actual medical research that proved otherwise long ago.

--
Wes Groleau

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 07-18-2016 10:01, Joerg wrote:
> On Monday I had a kid on a BMX bike barreling down a hill on a bike path
> at high speed, both hands off the handlebar and on his cell phone,
> staring at its screen.

Laws in Toronto explicitly prohibit riding a bicycle while using any
device that prevents you from having both hands on the handlebar.

Yet I was tempted to violate that rule in order to take a video of a
policeman pedaling down a busy street, thumbing away on a phone that he
was staring at. With another policeman alongside choosing not to write
him a ticket.

--
Wes Groleau

[John B.]

I'm no sure of "still large numbers". You will have to explain large
in comparison to ?"

But you are perfectly correct in intimating that fat is a useful
ingredient in a mammal's food. After all it contains about twice as
many calories of energy as either protein or carbohydrates.
--
cheers,

John B.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

WHOA. Ninny takes lead...

markets/worldmarkets/worldmarkets.asp

the up line is....

ON FAT ....More anatomy ....Search: physiology digesting fats

or maybe ura pullin' our Lego ?

[Joerg]

On 2016-07-18 19:12, W. Wesley Groleau wrote:
> On 07-18-2016 10:01, Joerg wrote:
>> On Monday I had a kid on a BMX bike barreling down a hill on a bike path
>> at high speed, both hands off the handlebar and on his cell phone,
>> staring at its screen.
>
> Laws in Toronto explicitly prohibit riding a bicycle while using any
> device that prevents you from having both hands on the handlebar.
>

Would they give you a ticket if you take a sip out of the water bottle
while riding?

> Yet I was tempted to violate that rule in order to take a video of a
> policeman pedaling down a busy street, thumbing away on a phone that he
> was staring at. With another policeman alongside choosing not to write
> him a ticket.
>

Sometimes they think they are above the law. I mostly see that with
motorcycle cops doing unsafe lane changes.

IME cyclists have great respect for not riding while yapping. I see it
all the time on the long bike path in the valley. Deedle-deedle-dee ..
tantantaraa .. they roll onto the shoulder of the bike path, stop and
take the call. Shoulders are one of the many advantages of segragated
bike paths. Then came this Pokemon craze, whetever the heck that is.

What is funny are tandem riders where the stoker takes a call which I
guess is legal. I've had situations where the bike path was so full that
I couldn't pass for a while or the tandem riders were fast enough and I
could hear stuff that I would not discuss in public. Maybe they
subconsciously think they are in a car.

My cell number is only known to very few clients, the ones who could
have a real emergency where they need help right away. This way I am
rarely disturbed by the cell phone ringing and I can keep it in one of
the panniers.

One ride this week will require 20mi of singletrack. Not much cell
coverage so it'll be a nice "Pokemon-free" event. I'll probably meet
5-10 horses, maybe they know where Pokemon went.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

http://venturebeat.com/2016/07/18/why-pokemon-go-could-be-a-groundbreaking-model-for-chatbots/?google_editors_picks=true

[Joerg]

On 2016-07-19 12:22, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
>
>
> http://venturebeat.com/2016/07/18/why-pokemon-go-could-be-a-groundbreaking-model-for-chatbots/?google_editors_picks=true
>

I am so glad that about four miles worth of pedaling on the MTB gets me
into a pristine non-augmented reality. I don't even own a smart phone,
don't need one.

On a trail: "But it can show you where the good restaurants are" ...
"Pubs, too?" ... "Yeah" ... "Show me" ... trundle, trundle, no signal
... my map comes out, printed on dead trees ... "Here is the next
brewpub" ... "Oh!"

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

a bar fly with no smart phone ?

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 07-19-2016 01:02, John B. wrote:
> On Mon, 18 Jul 2016 21:07:42 -0500, "W. Wesley Groleau"
> <Grolea...@FreeShell.org> wrote:
>
>> On 07-17-2016 21:42, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>>> He was wrong. You can fool all the people all the time by simple
>>> repetition. The internet and the advertising business have done a
>>> wonderful job of proving that. All one needs to do is repeat the same
>>> lies over and over and eventually they become facts. Eventually, the
>>> sources become obscured by evolutionary repetition (where things
>>
>> I think not. How many decades has the "don't eat fat" myth been
>> spouted? And yet there are still large numbers of us who have read the
>> actual medical research that proved otherwise long ago.
>
> I'm no sure of "still large numbers". You will have to explain large
> in comparison to ?"

If even one person isn't fooled, then "You can fool all the people all
the time" is suspect. I'm not fooled, the people who did the research
aren't fooled, and I'm not the only person who read and understood the
research.

--
Wes Groleau

[John B.]

On Tue, 19 Jul 2016 20:37:54 -0500, "W. Wesley Groleau"

True but from casual conversations I would say that you are in a
minority :-)

I try to tell people that being fat is simply a matter of energy in
and energy out. But no one believes it.

Re Diets, I recently read an article about how diet could cure, or
greatly reduce diabetes.... simply eat 600 calories a day for two
weeks :-)
--
cheers,

John B.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

yup

http://www.bing.com/news/search?q=pokemon+baltimore+police+car&qs=n&form=QBNT&pq=pokemon+baltimore+police+car&sc=0-20&sp=-1&sk=

[Joerg]

I usually make sure to circle by a brewpub on the way back home, mainly
to have a growler filled. That way my wife (does not ride) also has
something from my rides.

In a couple of weeks carbonation should be finished and then we also
have our very own house brewsky.

[Mike A Schwab]

Ancel Keys came up with they Hypothesis that eating fat gives you heart attacks. Going through the data, he found that if he limited his data to seven countries, the data from those countries supported his hypothesis. Never mind that reviewing the data for the entire world supported the eating carbs gives you heart attacks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Countries_Study

[SMS]

On 7/19/2016 12:41 PM, Joerg wrote:

<snip>

> I don't even own a smart phone, don't need one.

Communist.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

hydrate ?

[Joerg]

Yup, it's part of my hydration scheme :-)

Yesterday after consuming about a gallon of water and electrolyte mix
and sweating it back out on a MTB trail I treated myself to a Sierra
Nevada Summerfest beer here:

http://s3-media4.fl.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/yo2jMjgq0nQmKoOR11fW2Q/o.jpg

If they'd build at least bike lanes on the more dangerous part of White
Rock Road they'd see a lot more MTB riders there. OTOH then it might be
so full that happy hour pricing goes away.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

www.analogconsultants.com/


http://goo.gl/k6phmr

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 07-20-2016 10:20, Mike A Schwab wrote:
> Ancel Keys came up with they Hypothesis that eating fat gives you heart attacks. Going through the data, he found that if he limited his data to seven countries, the data from those countries supported his hypothesis. Never mind that reviewing the data for the entire world supported the eating carbs gives you heart attacks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seven_Countries_Study

Keys himself has been quoted as saying "we knew it all along" that
eating fat doesn't cause CVD.

The seven countries study was 1943. I have a copy of another study the
same year that showed a high correlation between fat consumption and
death. But it showed a slightly higher correlation between carbohydrate
consumption and death.

Sort of sounds to me like it translates to a high correlation between
consumption and death.

--
Wes Groleau

[John B.]

Actually, there is a high correlation between birth and death :-)

I suspect that on a world wide basis the main source of calories is
not animal based but carbohydrates. Thus, perhaps the 7 countries was
all available for the study :-)

But I did read a study that purported to show that all else being
equal that an individual who eats the most fat will likely have the
highest cholesterol levels.

On the other hand, both my grand mother's main cooking utensil was a
cast iron "skillet" (fry pan) and they both cooked with bacon grease
as shortening. My grand fathers lived to 92 and 89 years of age. But,
both were active farmers and physically active well into their 70's.
--
cheers,

John B.

[AMuzi]

When I finally ride my bike under the bus, any latent
arterial occlusions will be moot.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[sms]

On 07-20-2016 10:20, Mike A Schwab wrote:
> Ancel Keys came up with they Hypothesis that eating fat
> gives you heart attacks. Going through the data, he found
> that if he limited his data to seven countries, the data
> from those countries supported his hypothesis.

Sounds like he went to the F.K. School of Statistical Analysis. Or Trump
University. Carefully select your sample by time and place so you get
the result you want, then try to extrapolate that result to convince
those with no critical thinking skills that what you are saying is
accurate. If that doesn't work, just lie.

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 07-23-2016 04:00, John B. wrote:
> I suspect that on a world wide basis the main source of calories is
> not animal based but carbohydrates. Thus, perhaps the 7 countries was
> all available for the study :-)

No, there were MANY more available in 1943, and if you graph them all
using Keys' methods, the correlation completely vanishes.

There are various sources for this. The best two I've seen,
unfortunately, I cannot show you. One was the medical journal article I
already mentioned from the same year as the infamous Seven Countries
Study. The other was a scatter-plot using Keys' method of numerous
countries in the first few pages of this book:

https://books.google.com/books?id=J0CzHjr_3_YC

Two other interesting mentions of the issue are:

Pages 33-35 of
https://books.google.com/books?id=r_PmOunrDk0C&pg=PA33

and pages 48-49 of
https://books.google.com/books?id=rFF30fhh7SoC&pg=PA49

--
Wes Groleau

[John B.]

On Sat, 23 Jul 2016 10:07:02 -0700, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

Ah, the Smurf philosophy. "If it doesn't work, just lie"

Is "he shows his true colors" an appropriate comment here?
--
cheers,

John B.

[John B.]

I have no idea, "in 1943" but I do know that Japanese born post WW II
are taller than their parent and life expectancy increased by ~13
years in a ten year period from 1945, attributed, in part, to better
diets. Heart problems in Japan are also relatively low, again
attributed, in some part, to diet. The Japanese diet is largely fish,
vegetables and rice. Relatively little "red meat" is eaten.

And, I have mentioned that my grand parents, who, as far as I know,
ate a typical diet for their times, substantially fried foods and
lived into their late 80's and 90's. Another thing my paternal grand
father ate at least 5 meals a day for most of his life and was a very
slender person. Of course he also raised several thousand chickens by
himself and worked from before sun-up in the mornings until dark in
the evenings.

My own supposition is that diet is significant only when discussed as
part of the whole life style. "Up and 'at 'em" before daylight and
hard at it until dark doing strenuous physical labor may well permit a
much different diet from the "office chair to recliner in front of the
TV" effort :-)

But I also have this suspicion that diet studies like many other
studies may well come with pre-supposed values or conditions or end
results expected.

I think I mentioned a site I happened on that argued that diabetes
could be controlled by diet alone. Their cure was a diet of 600
calories a day for two weeks... I'm sure that did reduce blood sugar
significantly :-)

--
cheers,

John B.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

There are sims....Use ages promote more of any variety...

TTE AFAIK ( - 0 ) Zthe autopilot group fid not pub scatter diagrams on AP cycle recog scenario....

........

truth is fat is No 1 cause heart disease
, small particulate airborne pollution No 1 caws lung disease

alcohol is a toxic poison.. dehydrating n drink g CHOH inhaling dust/smoke n eating sausages is fatal

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

Like Radio Brazzaville ?

[Mike A Schwab]

On Monday, July 25, 2016 at 6:32:28 AM UTC-5, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
>
> truth is fat is No 1 cause heart disease
> , small particulate airborne pollution No 1 caws lung disease
>

Body Fat is No. 1 so-indicator of heart disease.
Excess carbs causes the release of insulin which stores excess carbs as body fat.