When poor white Americans know the price of making America strong

[Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher]

It would be something so traumatic to them that they may change their mind about Trump and may start riots on the streets. It would take BOYCOTTING CHINESE PRODUCTS, and that means NO DOLLAR STORE (it'll be the $5 store), meaning nothing to do for most Americans.

I have the suggestion to ride a bicycle and pack popcorn and peanut/raisins (forget the bananas) to go exploring the community. Yep, THE COMMUNITY --every single community-- needs to be recycled, becoming CLEAN & GREEN and safe for cyclists and pedestrians. Is your community happy or crappy? Are you fat and crappy?

I hate to say it but America is fat --not strong-- and that needs to be addressed. Will Trump go to the roots of the problem?


----------------------------------------------------------------------

"Are you ready for the jungle?"

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1nffbCR_uCZ6znjf3gLiFRXSAoLzhWtoZ6U4S7Y37aKc/edit?usp=sharing

[Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher]

Is this a picture a happiness?

http://www.alternet.org/files/screen_shot_2013-08-01_at_5.11.36_pm.png

Will a job make her happy or she needs banana power?

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

Trump is gonna do away with the EPA, the NHTSA, n build a coal fired power plant on your lawn .... from your increased tax money.

duh

[Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher]

On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 9:59:46 AM UTC-6, Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher wrote:
> On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 5:36:16 AM UTC-6, ltlee1 wrote:
> > If the world is not a jungle, he will make it into one. A Darwinian jungle. Of course, the jungle does not need philosophy and will have none. Unfortunately, most of his supporters would be deeply disappointed. Creative destruction is the only way to go forward.
> >
> > The issue is how far can he go.
>
> The world is indeed a jungle, but he promises to avoid the confrontation with the Russian bear. That's wise indeed.
>
> On the other hand, his ego will likely betray him sooner or later and he'll become caught in another confrontation. A person with big ego can either make it or break it. I have sharpen my machete just in case.
>
> How wise is he? Perhaps he's only business wise. Actually he was not, but you get the point. ;)

Very interesting article (best/worst case scenario):

http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-is-the-most-powerful-man-in-the-world-2016-11

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

..... …… ‘It is impossible to react to this moment with anything less than revulsion and profound anxiety’

http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/an-american-tragedy-donald-trump

Trump and friends are 19th century people.

their policies are 19th. With Raygun, Bush, and Brownback leading to failure in the Global 21C economy.

Demo policy in the 21C recovered from Bush 2 with more jobs less deficient and a healthier environment n people.

The people electing Trump have no pace in the 21C economy. The money earned by Trump et al will go to the rich leaving yo with nothing.

as it was before

[Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher]

He's likely to cause some sort of chaos, such as the markets crashing... and that's where we cyclists can have a chance.

Hillary would have been business as usual.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

There is no money for 'the Kock Bros' in alternate transportation except for Maglev bond issues.

[Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher]

On Friday, November 11, 2016 at 12:26:04 AM UTC-5, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
> There is no money for 'the Kock Bros' in alternate transportation except for Maglev bond issues.

He could cause a backlash in Latin America, where they break permanently with the American way of life, where the car is king.

[cycl...@gmail.com]

I find it interesting that the same people screaming that Trump is a KKK are the same people acting just like the post war KKK. Is this ignorance or the intent of liberal leaders? We had a local principle hold a school meeting to berate Trump to his students. We've had thousands of grade school children cutting schools to march in protests while telling each other complete fabrications about what Trump said. We have the media interviewing high school age Muslim girls who are afraid they're going to be evicted from this country totally aside from the fact that they are secound generation Americans. I don't see the media correcting these false beliefs. If anything they are prompting more of it with lies, distortions and misrepresentations.

Consider this - on these groups we have a fairly good representation of the population of this country and additions from other English speakers even when it isn't their native language. We cannot even agree on the best color of a red bike.

So how is it that the entire media are ALL leftists including FOX if you actually pay attention to what they don't say instead of what they do?

The freedom of the press was given as a protection to the people of this country from a government grown too big for it's britches. And yet what we have is almost the entire media that has become nothing more than propagandists for the left.

The founders NEVER for one second thought that 90% of the entire control of the media in this country would fall to six companies.

And there is where the fix begins. We can allow NO company to control or own or lend money to more than 5% of the media. If we're to be given opinions rather than news let us get a variety of opinions and not one single line of thought taught to 20 year old reporters from leftist teachers in colleges because they could not get a job doing anything practical.

"Shall we expect some transatlantic military giant to step the ocean and crush us at a blow? Never! All the armies of Europe, Asia, and Africa combined, with all the treasure of the earth (our own excepted) in their military chest, with a Bonaparte for a commander, could not by force take a drink from the Ohio or make a track on the Blue Ridge in a trial of a thousand years. At what point then is the approach of danger to be expected? I answer. If it ever reach us it must spring up amongst us; it cannot come from abroad. If destruction be our lot we must ourselves be its author and finisher. As a nation of freemen we must live through all time or die by suicide." Abraham Lincoln.

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 11-11-2016 12:37, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> The founders NEVER for one second thought that 90% of the entire control of the media in this country would fall to six companies.

Jefferson: "The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the
man who reads nothing but newspapers."

--
Wes Groleau

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

No, the difference tween providing more money for robber barons vs formulating n implementing policy for the country's health are vastly divergent.

Rumpites represent the first as the latter ...time and again each try ending in failure for the country, riches for barons such ass the gimp McConnel.

[John B Slocomb]

I would modernize that by saying the man that reads nothing is better
educated than the man that reads only the social media :-)

[Frank Krygowski]

And the latter is the natural prey of a politician whose proposed
policies can be thoroughly explained in 140 characters.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[AMuzi]

Tolstoy: "I didn't read the newspapers for ten years. When I
did, the news was the same."

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971

[jbeattie]

We'll see how things work out, but one thing is abundantly clear to me, the pool of worthy presidential candidates has dried up -- or perhaps more accurately, a qualified candidate probably couldn't get elected these days. Reagan couldn't get elected. My gawd, the guy passed sweeping environmental protection legislation when he was governor of California. Nixon passed the Clean Air and Clean Water acts -- job killers! TR was just Bernie Sanders on a horse. Jefferson was a rationalist who would cringe at the religious right -- putting aside his dalliances with the servants. Makes Bill Clinton look pretty tame. I can't think of a single great conservative president who could get elected in the Twitter age.

And, my friends, that is why I am throwing my hat into the ring for 2020. I am a highly successful thousandaire who has built incredible buildings -- or parts of them. I personally remodeled my downstairs bathroom -- did all the electrical, plumbing, mechanical, and it was under-budget and on time! I run a large organization along with my wife and son (who are the organization). I have successfully rid my yard of moles, and anyone who has had moles knows that is not easy. I can do the same with ISIS. I'll soak the Middle East with castor oil, and I'll make them pay for it!

-- Jay Beattie.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 11/13/2016 11:50 AM, AMuzi wrote:
> On 11/12/2016 8:15 PM, W. Wesley Groleau wrote:
>> On 11-11-2016 12:37, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> The founders NEVER for one second thought that 90% of the
>>> entire control of the media in this country would fall to
>>> six companies.
>>
>> Jefferson: "The man who reads nothing at all is better
>> educated than the man who reads nothing but newspapers."
>>
>
> Tolstoy: "I didn't read the newspapers for ten years. When I did, the
> news was the same."

Sounds like he needed to read better newspapers.

To give him far too much benefit of the doubt: One might, I suppose, be
able to identify some 10 year period in recent history in some country
or other where ignorance of current events didn't really matter.
Perhaps if one lived in a real totalitarian environment, that might be
true more often.

But Tolstoy actually was concerned and involved in issues, so that quote
makes little sense to me.

Certainly, in a democracy a person _should_ feel an obligation to be
reasonably well informed. Information from someone tweeting or blogging
seldom counts. We need full time reporters who know how to make
contacts, do research and ferret out truth. We need them putting out
articles more than one screen long, and following up on important
issues. Sadly, that seems to be going away.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B Slocomb]

Sorry but a "thousandaire" (Hmmmm, Thousandaire seems to be a
misspelled word. Apparently American English doesn't include such
insignificant figures :-) isn't rich enough to buy 1 minute of T.V.
coverage so you will need to make many and very loud inflammatory
statements in order to make the evening news - "Women are superior to
Males!" will get the human female vote (but probably won't attract
many moles :-) and less emphasis on the heterosexuality aspects of
your relationships would attract another section of the voting public.

[John B Slocomb]

Well, I suspect that you are a reasonably informed individual.... but
you still ended up with a president who is viewed with considerable
trepidation by much of the world :-)

[AMuzi]

The outgoing or incoming or both?

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 11-13-2016 14:34, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> On 11/13/2016 11:50 AM, AMuzi wrote:
>> Tolstoy: "I didn't read the newspapers for ten years. When I did, the
>> news was the same."
>
> Sounds like he needed to read better newspapers.

Sounds like he lived in the USSR.

--
Wes Groleau

[Frank Krygowski]

... including the part of the world where I live. :-/


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 13 Nov 2016 12:25:18 -0800 (PST), jbeattie
<jbeat...@msn.com> wrote:

>And, my friends, that is why I am throwing my hat into the ring
>for 2020. I am a highly successful thousandaire who has built
>incredible buildings -- or parts of them. I personally remodeled
>my downstairs bathroom -- did all the electrical, plumbing,
>mechanical, and it was under-budget and on time!

Did you obtain the required building permits and donate to the
building inspectors favorite charity? Doing the work yourself labels
you as anti-union because you are taking away the livelihood of union
carpenters, electricians, and carpenters who will no doubt all be
unemployed should the nation follow your example. In this era of job
creation, you are expected to do things in the most inefficient and
uneconomical manner, thus creating employment for other.

>I run a large organization along with my wife and son (who are
>the organization).

Did you obtain the necessary business license(s) for your
organization? You should declare your organization to be a company,
corporation, political action committee, cartel, or whatever seems
appropriate to meeting your state purpose. Presumably, your large
organization is dedicated to getting you elected, which will require
additional declarations, registrations, fees, and bribes err...
donations.

>I have successfully rid my yard of moles, and anyone who has
>had moles knows that is not easy.

Did you bother to check with the EPA if the mole species is on the
endangered species list? Are you even sure it's really a mole? Such
wanton and reckless devastation of a particular species of animal can
only lead to an unbalance ecology and the wrath of PETA.

>I can do the same with ISIS. I'll soak the Middle East with
>castor oil, and I'll make them pay for it!

I believe that lard (pig fat) would be more effective. The mere
mention of bombing the middle east with castor oil will send commodity
prices soaring. Whatever method you've used effectively on moles is
unlikely to work on ISIS. Instead, you might try getting jobs for
ISIS:
<https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/originals/cd/f0/b1/cdf0b1fa9cef2064382046b88052586e.jpg>
Making ISIS pay for the castor oil doesn't seem very useful. The
money would best be spent towards your campaign.

Basically, as a potential political candidate, you're doing badly. I
suggest you obtain professional coaching from an experienced political
campaign manager, who will instruct you on the management of the
proper lies and distortions, which varies by the audience. For
example, this is bicycling tech group, which presumably wants to hear
how you're going to ban automobiles, build national bike paths, and
subsidize cycling as an energy conservation measure. If you're going
to make any headway at gaining support from bicyclists, such inflated
promises are vital.


--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[John B Slocomb]

Well.... if we are talking only about trepidation probably the new
guy. :-) The old guy is generally viewed with a sort "Gee, I'm glad
he's yours, not ours" sort of attitude... Unless of course he comes
carrying cash :-)

[John B Slocomb]

On Sun, 13 Nov 2016 22:54:24 -0500, Frank Krygowski

Cheer up Frank. there may be an opening for a consulting engineer on
that big wall they are going to build :-)

[AMuzi]

Russian Empire under the Czars, maybe a slight difference if any

[sms]

On 11/13/2016 12:25 PM, jbeattie wrote:

> And, my friends, that is why I am throwing my hat into the ring for 2020. I am a highly successful thousandaire who has built incredible buildings -- or parts of them. I personally remodeled my downstairs bathroom -- did all the electrical, plumbing, mechanical, and it was under-budget and on time! I run a large organization along with my wife and son (who are the organization). I have successfully rid my yard of moles, and anyone who has had moles knows that is not easy. I can do the same with ISIS. I'll soak the Middle East with castor oil, and I'll make them pay for it!

As an apparently successful politician (the votes are still being
counted), with one election under my belt, I can be your advisor, once I
finish making Cupertino great again.



---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

[jbeattie]

On Monday, November 14, 2016 at 10:35:59 AM UTC-8, sms wrote:
> On 11/13/2016 12:25 PM, jbeattie wrote:
>
> > And, my friends, that is why I am throwing my hat into the ring for 2020. I am a highly successful thousandaire who has built incredible buildings -- or parts of them. I personally remodeled my downstairs bathroom -- did all the electrical, plumbing, mechanical, and it was under-budget and on time! I run a large organization along with my wife and son (who are the organization). I have successfully rid my yard of moles, and anyone who has had moles knows that is not easy. I can do the same with ISIS. I'll soak the Middle East with castor oil, and I'll make them pay for it!
>
> As an apparently successful politician (the votes are still being
> counted), with one election under my belt, I can be your advisor, once I
> finish making Cupertino great again.

Good work! Send us a link to your acceptance speech. You should build a wall between Cupertino and Sunnyvale. I don't like those Sunnyvalians. They steal your jobs.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Duane]

Don't let him fool you. SMS built his last shed with low balled steel
from Sunnyvale. Where are the fact checkers?

[sms]

Already in the works. But it has to be between Cupertino and Los Altos,
Los Altos Hills, Sunnyvale, Santa Clara, San Jose, and Saratoga.

It's going to be a beautiful wall! With a bike path on top. Similar to
this:
<https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/09/50/f4/c8/xi-an-city-wall-chengqiang.jpg>
but without the pollution.

Don't worry, I will remember all the little people on r.b.t..

[sms]

On 11/14/2016 1:25 PM, Duane wrote:

<snip>

> Don't let him fool you. SMS built his last shed with low balled steel
> from Sunnyvale. Where are the fact checkers?

I SPIT on steel from Sunnyvale.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Mon, 14 Nov 2016 10:34:41 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

>As an apparently successful politician (the votes are still being
>counted), with one election under my belt, I can be your advisor, once I
>finish making Cupertino great again.

Preliminary congratulations. However, while you're waiting for final
count, could you please fix whatever has calculated that it's 2462
days since election day?
<https://sites.google.com/site/scharf4cupertino/home>
and the fix the "news updates" and the misdirected "discussion forum"
on your web pile? Also the "Donate Now" button that does nothing. I
expect politicians and their web piles to be perfect.

[sms]

On 11/14/2016 8:40 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Nov 2016 10:34:41 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> As an apparently successful politician (the votes are still being
>> counted), with one election under my belt, I can be your advisor, once I
>> finish making Cupertino great again.
>
> Preliminary congratulations. However, while you're waiting for final
> count, could you please fix whatever has calculated that it's 2462
> days since election day?

That was a temporary site which I need to remove.

The real site was at <scharf4cupertino.com>. Not great, but enough. I
was told that people really liked the detailed policy papers even though
no one read any of them.

The ROV is now at 85% counted and there is really no way the 3rd place
person can catch up unless there is some serious voter fraud, and my
lead is widening every day.

I got a lot of last minute voters because we did a big door to door push
the last two weekends, and also the developer sent out two attack pieces
against me, which helped undecided voters vote for me. Talk about a
stupid f$%king thing to do in a city where developers are viewed
extremely negatively. What were they thinking? Also the San Jose Murky
News attacked me, which probably helped.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 10:17:51 -0800, sms <scharf...@geemail.com>
wrote:

>That was a temporary site which I need to remove.

One of the skills required of an aspiring politician is the ability to
effectively bury one's mistakes. Leaving malfunctional web sites in
plain sight, where someone might suggest that they might be an
indication of your work habits, is not a great idea. You may have
abandoned the site, but Google still finds it first.

>The real site was at <scharf4cupertino.com>. Not great, but enough. I
>was told that people really liked the detailed policy papers even though
>no one read any of them.

<http://nordicgroup.us/scharf4council/policypapers.pdf>
35 pages much of which are links to other papers and sites. Ummm...
maybe I'll read it when I find some spare time.

>The ROV is now at 85% counted and there is really no way the 3rd place
>person can catch up unless there is some serious voter fraud, and my
>lead is widening every day.

Voter fraud? You came to the right place. Santa Cruz somehow managed
to add 11,000 newly eligible voters in the 5 months between the 2016
primary and general election.
<https://www.facebook.com/jeff.liebermann>
If you need some additional votes conjured out of thin air, we can
deliver.

>I got a lot of last minute voters because we did a big door to door push
>the last two weekends, and also the developer sent out two attack pieces
>against me, which helped undecided voters vote for me. Talk about a
>stupid f$%king thing to do in a city where developers are viewed
>extremely negatively. What were they thinking?

I wouldn't worry about it too much. The developers will soon be
banging on your door offering gratuities. You can then make up, shake
hands, negotiate a fair an equitable payoff, and become mutually
beneficial friends.

>Also the San Jose Murky
>News attacked me, which probably helped.

Not a problem. Nobody reads newspapers any more.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decline_of_newspapers>

>This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Open Avast -> Settings -> General
and uncheck the box "Enable Avast email signature".

[jbeattie]

Why was the Mercury News attacking you? The coverage I read was pretty newsy and just parroted what the candidates were saying.

What killed Vallco? I would think that with the price of dirt down there, you would not be living with a dead mall. IMO, the dreary big box mall is becoming a thing of the past. Even in rain-ville, people prefer the open air malls or, in downtown PDX, mall-ish areas like the Pearl District. http://crushbrew.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/pearl-district-real-estate.jpg Don't expect to find a parking spot, though.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 21:45:19 -0800 (PST), jbeattie
<jbeat...@msn.com> wrote:

>What killed Vallco? I would think that with the price
>of dirt down there, you would not be living with a
>dead mall.

"A Third of American Malls Will Close Soon"
<http://time.com/money/4327632/shopping-malls-closing/>

The cost per square foot of renting space in a mall is part of the
problem. I think $50/sq foot is the national average with variations
from $25 to $100/sq foot. Even renting kiosk space costs about
$800/month. The money of keeping malls open has always been provided
by the big chain stores (Sears, Macys, etc). Few small retailers can
afford the prices these pay for renting space. As the small retailers
drop off, they were initially replaced by chain stores, and slash and
burn quick buck artists that would appear during the holiday season,
and disappear soon after. Meanwhile, buying on the internet has taken
a big chunk out of the mall's customer base. I'm not sure in what
direction consumerism is heading, but I don't think the shopping mall
is the likely direction.

[sms]

On 11/16/2016 9:52 AM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Nov 2016 21:45:19 -0800 (PST), jbeattie
> <jbeat...@msn.com> wrote:
>
>> What killed Vallco? I would think that with the price
>> of dirt down there, you would not be living with a
>> dead mall.
>
> "A Third of American Malls Will Close Soon"
> <http://time.com/money/4327632/shopping-malls-closing/>
>
> The cost per square foot of renting space in a mall is part of the
> problem. I think $50/sq foot is the national average with variations
> from $25 to $100/sq foot. Even renting kiosk space costs about
> $800/month. The money of keeping malls open has always been provided
> by the big chain stores (Sears, Macys, etc). Few small retailers can
> afford the prices these pay for renting space. As the small retailers
> drop off, they were initially replaced by chain stores, and slash and
> burn quick buck artists that would appear during the holiday season,
> and disappear soon after. Meanwhile, buying on the internet has taken
> a big chunk out of the mall's customer base. I'm not sure in what
> direction consumerism is heading, but I don't think the shopping mall
> is the likely direction.

Vallco is kind of unique. The department stores wanted to stay, but the
mall's purchaser pushed them out, even soliciting help from the city to
force them to sell. One council person dubbed it "Decline by Design."

Vallco was doing well enough with its shift to restaurants and
entertainment (AMC, Bowlmor, Ice Capades), along with the three
department stores and a handful of successful smaller stores, and an
upscale health club (Bay Club). They were even going to add
out-buildings with more restaurants. They were working on leasing space
to more restaurants when the new owner came in and decided to kick
everyone out and try to get approval for office towers and luxury rental
apartments, with just a small amount of retail.

The developer's plan was to kill everything in the mall and then come to
the city and plead to be allowed to build commercial office space
because the mall was empty. It's like the kid who is convicted of
murdering his parents who begs the judge for mercy because he's an orphan.

The developer decided to try to bypass the planning department, the
planning commission, the city council, and the California Environmental
Quality Act's requirement of an EIR, by putting an initiative on the
ballot. They spent a fortune on a misleading campaign, which included
hundreds of thousands of direct mail pieces (we were getting six per day
at the peak), and public outreach with free movies, free bowling, free
food, free wine, and free beer. They hired an army of non-residents to
go door to door soliciting support, but of course these people could not
engage in an intelligent discussion with any residents. They hired
people to hold signs at street corners. They tried to co-opt Tournament
of Bands (my passion).

One reason they rushed to the initiative process was because a) they
were terrified of what an EIR would show, and b) they wanted the project
approved prior to the completion of Apple's new campus which will cause
significant traffic congestion.

They probably spent $10 million between their campaign and other related
expenses.

While many malls throughout the country have failed, many have been
revitalized. In the Bay Area we saw the revitalization of Valley Fair,
Great Mall, Tanforan, Serramonte, Stonestown, New Park, El Paseo,
Oakridge, and Westgate, with Eastridge being revitalized now. Even with
all the online shopping, there is still a demand for malls that keep up,
with a combination of retail, entertainment, and dining.

One reason that Sears and Penny's were so keen to stay open at Vallco is
because it was their last Silicon Valley outpost, after having closed
lower-performing stores nearby. It's a really long way to a Penny's now!

The developer that owns Vallco has somewhat of a tarnished reputation in
the Bay Area, and that helped contribute to the loss of their ballot
initiative.
<http://www.mercurynews.com/2016/11/10/palo-alto-increases-fines-for-edgewood-plaza-violation/>

[cycl...@gmail.com]

On Saturday, November 12, 2016 at 11:31:43 PM UTC-8, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
> No, the difference tween providing more money for robber barons vs formulating n implementing policy for the country's health are vastly divergent.
>
> Rumpites represent the first as the latter ...time and again each try ending in failure for the country, riches for barons such ass the gimp McConnel.

Yeah, and the Clinton Foundation has shown nothing but clear and present charitable intent. Perhaps you should actually know something before commenting?

[cycl...@gmail.com]

Jay - are you aware that the media said EXACTLY the same things about Reagan as they did about Trump? Trump hasn't served one day in office and you have an opinion of his fitness for office. Perhaps you ought to think before commenting. Or is your opinion shaped by the lies of the media which hasn't changed since Eisenhower was in office?

[cycl...@gmail.com]

The stupid Republicans revoked the FCC regulations of 1975 that limited the ownership of media outlets. This has allowed the media to become little more tha a monster held by 6 corporations.

[cycl...@gmail.com]

You STILL can't understand how much the media is lying to you. Why didn't the media - the major TV news - report yesterday that there were huge protests and riots in Greece about the presence of Obama in that country? Why didn't they report that Obama was trapped in the American Embassy while protesters were throwing Molotov Cocktails and chanting "Obama go home"?

Why weren't we informed that Obama was told to get his white XXX out of Ghana and never come back by the President of that country?

Exactly how long are you going to go before you understand that you are being manipulated by the media for purely political reasons?

[cycl...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, November 9, 2016 at 7:45:13 AM UTC-8, Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher wrote:
> It would be something so traumatic to them that they may change their mind about Trump and may start riots on the streets. It would take BOYCOTTING CHINESE PRODUCTS, and that means NO DOLLAR STORE (it'll be the $5 store), meaning nothing to do for most Americans.
>
> I have the suggestion to ride a bicycle and pack popcorn and peanut/raisins (forget the bananas) to go exploring the community. Yep, THE COMMUNITY --every single community-- needs to be recycled, becoming CLEAN & GREEN and safe for cyclists and pedestrians. Is your community happy or crappy? Are you fat and crappy?
>
> I hate to say it but America is fat --not strong-- and that needs to be addressed. Will Trump go to the roots of the problem?
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Are you ready for the jungle?"
>
> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1nffbCR_uCZ6znjf3gLiFRXSAoLzhWtoZ6U4S7Y37aKc/edit?usp=sharing

On the news they were showing "racist graffiti" painted on walls etc. in several different places in the San Francisco bay area. I happen to be familiar with these areas and NO conservative whites would go there if an army was protecting them. What's more this "racist graffiti" has EXACTLY the same technique as the gang taggers.

Again and again now we are seeing the media presenting lies on top of lies and they know it. One of those walls tagged is in my old neighborhood and I'm the only white person that would DARE go there at any time of the day and even I would not go there in the dark of night.

The threats to this country are not from politicians WHO IN THE END HAVE NOT ONE OUNCE OF EFFECT ON LOCAL POLITICS (Oakland and Chicago are the most dangerous cities in this country and have been under the control of liberal Democrats for over 70 years) but to a media who will present ANYTHING pro-liberal and anti-conservative.

And to do this these large media corporations hire college age reporters who actually believe in socialism because they have lived off Mommy and Daddy their entire lives and believe that being supported by others is the natural way of things.

[jbeattie]

Pffff. Go fish. Reagan was governor of California -- which currently has the sixth largest economy in the world. Reagan ran in '76 and was fully vetted. Although I disagreed with many of his policies (and his administration had lots of problems, which people seem to forget), he was a skilled politician. He was dignified, presidential and an exceptional speaker. Trump can barely string-together six sentences.

Yes, I actually expect my politicians to have relevant experience running a government or something like it. A business is not like government, sorry to say -- the military is sort of. Eisenhower wasn't perfectly prepared for the presidency, but he was infinitely more prepared than Trump. If you believe Trump has some sort of magic or native intelligence that will make him a great president, all I can say is . . . I hope you are right.

By the way, go to :012, that's my sister's house in Santa Rosa. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU-IBF8nwSY It's always morning in America at her place.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Duane]

On 17/11/2016 3:23 PM, jbeattie wrote:
> On Thursday, November 17, 2016 at 8:34:19 AM UTC-8, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 12:25:21 PM UTC-8, jbeattie wrote:
>>> On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 6:24:03 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>>> On 11/13/2016 6:46 AM, John B Slocomb wrote:
>>>>> On Sat, 12 Nov 2016 20:15:31 -0600, "W. Wesley Groleau"
>>>>> <Grolea...@FreeShell.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 11-11-2016 12:37, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>> The founders NEVER for one second thought that 90% of the entire control
>>>>> of the media in this country would fall to six companies.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jefferson: "The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the
>>>>>> man who reads nothing but newspapers."
>>>>>
>>>>> I would modernize that by saying the man that reads nothing is better
>>>>> educated than the man that reads only the social media :-)
>>>>
>>>> And the latter is the natural prey of a politician whose proposed
>>>> policies can be thoroughly explained in 140 characters.
>>>
>>> We'll see how things work out, but one thing is abundantly clear to me, the pool of worthy presidential candidates has dried up -- or perhaps more accurately, a qualified candidate probably couldn't get elected these days. Reagan couldn't get elected. My gawd, the guy passed sweeping environmental protection legislation when he was governor of California. Nixon passed the Clean Air and Clean Water acts -- job killers! TR was just Bernie Sanders on a horse. Jefferson was a rationalist who would cringe at the religious right -- putting aside his dalliances with the servants. Makes Bill Clinton look pretty tame. I can't think of a single great conservative president who could get elected in the Twitter age.
>>>
>>> And, my friends, that is why I am throwing my hat into the ring for 2020. I am a highly successful thousandaire who has built incredible buildings -- or parts of them. I personally remodeled my downstairs bathroom -- did all the electrical, plumbing, mechanical, and it was under-budget and on time! I run a large organization along with my wife and son (who are the organization). I have successfully rid my yard of moles, and anyone who has had moles knows that is not easy. I can do the same with ISIS. I'll soak the Middle East with castor oil, and I'll make them pay for it!
>>>
>>> -- Jay Beattie.
>>
>> Jay - are you aware that the media said EXACTLY the same things about Reagan as they did about Trump? Trump hasn't served one day in office and you have an opinion of his fitness for office. Perhaps you ought to think before commenting. Or is your opinion shaped by the lies of the media which hasn't changed since Eisenhower was in office?
>
> Pffff. Go fish. Reagan was governor of California -- which currently has the sixth largest economy in the world. Reagan ran in '76 and was fully vetted. Although I disagreed with many of his policies (and his administration had lots of problems, which people seem to forget), he was a skilled politician. He was dignified, presidential and an exceptional speaker. Trump can barely string-together six sentences.

I'm sort of confused here. Which lies were the media spreading about
Trump? Not that I have much use for CNN but it seems to me the most of
the non-biased fact checkers were of the opposite opinion.

As for Reagan, his trickle down economics never did trickle down to
anywhere that I could see it. And if it weren't for North falling on
his sword he would likely have been impeached as well. I'm not sure
when Reagan became such a beacon of leadership.

> Yes, I actually expect my politicians to have relevant experience running a government or something like it. A business is not like government, sorry to say -- the military is sort of. Eisenhower wasn't perfectly prepared for the presidency, but he was infinitely more prepared than Trump. If you believe Trump has some sort of magic or native intelligence that will make him a great president, all I can say is . . . I hope you are right.
>

Well we all hope he is right but it will be a shock if he is.

[AMuzi]

Before your sister's house, there was a kid throwing
newspapers from a bicycle. I used to live in that country a
long long time ago.

[Frank Krygowski]

Ah yes, throwing newspapers from a bicycle. I was once highly skilled
at that!

I strongly suspect that my newsboy career still benefits my bike riding.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[jbeattie]

My brothers and I were paperboys -- for the San Jose Mercury News. http://www.nytimes.com/1987/03/22/business/what-s-new-in-newspaper-delivery-paperboys-go-the-way-of-the-dodo.html Alas, paperboys have gone the way of the dodo. In the '60s, us dodos were willing to work for practically nothing and were managed like so many urchins from Oliver Twist. Maybe Trump will bring back paperboys. I sure hope so. And fire dogs -- whatever happened to Dalmatians on fire trucks? Aprons. Tractors in parades. Three black and white TV stations. Cigarettes. Chrome bumpers. The list is endless. We let it all slip away.

If I were elected, I would bring back Polaroid cameras. I can still smell the pictures. They smelled like fun and family. Maybe Apple can come up with some iSmell application to recreate the olfactory excitement of the '60s.

-- Jay Beattie.

[Frank Krygowski]

On 11/18/2016 10:11 AM, jbeattie wrote:
> On Thursday, November 17, 2016 at 7:56:51 PM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>>
>> I strongly suspect that my newsboy career still benefits my bike riding.
>

> My brothers and I were paperboys -- for the San Jose Mercury News. Alas, paperboys have gone the way of the dodo. In the '60s, us dodos were willing to work for practically nothing and were managed like so many urchins from Oliver Twist. Maybe Trump will bring back paperboys. I sure hope so.

I hope so too, but as with all things Trump, I have little hope.

My brothers and I ran a paper route for about 10 years. If we ever
missed delivering to a house, it was a cause of great embarrassment, and
we'd rush out with that paper as fast as our 26" wheels could carry us.

We now subscribe to a paper delivered at about 4 AM, by a guy driving a
rather large car from door to door. Roughly once a month, he somehow
manages to skip our house. How does that happen? He obviously doesn't
have someone like my father enforcing standards of competence.

I have the paper's customer service number on speed dial.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[sms]

On 11/18/2016 7:11 AM, jbeattie wrote:
> On Thursday, November 17, 2016 at 7:56:51 PM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
>> On 11/17/2016 5:35 PM, AMuzi wrote:
>>> On 11/17/2016 2:23 PM, jbeattie wrote:
>>>>
>>>> By the way, go to :012, that's my sister's house in Santa Rosa.
>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EU-IBF8nwSY It's always morning in
>>>> America at her place.
>>>>
>>>> -- Jay Beattie.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Before your sister's house, there was a kid throwing newspapers from a
>>> bicycle. I used to live in that country a long long time ago.
>>
>> Ah yes, throwing newspapers from a bicycle. I was once highly skilled
>> at that!
>>
>> I strongly suspect that my newsboy career still benefits my bike riding.
>
> My brothers and I were paperboys -- for the San Jose Mercury News.

It's so light today that I don't think you can even throw it.

> If I were elected, I would bring back Polaroid cameras. I can still smell the pictures. They smelled like fun and family. Maybe Apple can come up with some iSmell application to recreate the olfactory excitement of the '60s.

<http://www.costco.com/FUJIFILM-Instax-Mini-70-Camera-Bundle.product.100282050.html>

[jbeattie]

No, no, no! I mean the '60s Polaroid with the peel-off face sheet, and the image that had to be skimmed with that weird pink sponge with fixer in it. It was the fixer that gave it that "It's my birthday" smell (or I'm shooting porn in the bedroom smell -- you pick). A camera with a little heft to it: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a0/Polaroid_Land_Camera_100_IMGP1932_WP.jpg And made in Amercia, damn it!

I want a car that has same-day steering and a metal dash! I want a 91% top marginal rate and a bomb shelter! Kids these days couldn't tell the difference between a fire ball and a disco ball -- it's sad, really sad. Let me tell you, it's sad. Did I mention that we need to bring back hats?

-- Jay Beattie.

[Doug Landau]

On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 9:27:49 AM UTC-8, DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH wrote:
> On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 11:45:39 AM UTC-5, Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher wrote:
> > On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 9:59:46 AM UTC-6, Wise TibetanMonkey, Most Humble Philosopher wrote:
> > > On Thursday, November 10, 2016 at 5:36:16 AM UTC-6, ltlee1 wrote:
> > > > If the world is not a jungle, he will make it into one. A Darwinian jungle. Of course, the jungle does not need philosophy and will have none. Unfortunately, most of his supporters would be deeply disappointed. Creative destruction is the only way to go forward.
> > > >
> > > > The issue is how far can he go.
> > >
> > > The world is indeed a jungle, but he promises to avoid the confrontation with the Russian bear. That's wise indeed.
> > >
> > > On the other hand, his ego will likely betray him sooner or later and he'll become caught in another confrontation. A person with big ego can either make it or break it. I have sharpen my machete just in case.
> > >
> > > How wise is he? Perhaps he's only business wise. Actually he was not, but you get the point. ;)
> >
> > Very interesting article (best/worst case scenario):
> >
> > http://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trump-is-the-most-powerful-man-in-the-world-2016-11
>
> ..... …… ‘It is impossible to react to this moment with anything less than revulsion and profound anxiety’
>
> http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/an-american-tragedy-donald-trump
>
> Trump and friends are 19th century people.
>
> their policies are 19th. With Raygun, Bush, and Brownback leading to failure in the Global 21C economy.
>
> Demo policy in the 21C recovered from Bush 2 with more jobs less deficient and a healthier environment n people.
>
> The people electing Trump have no pace in the 21C economy. The money earned by Trump et al will go to the rich leaving yo with nothing.
>
> as it was before

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKgPY1adc0A

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

you see one cyclist you seen em all...

From 1980 through 1982, The Beach Boys and The Grass Roots separately performed at Independence Day concerts at the National Mall in Washington, D.C., attracting large crowds.[13][14] In April 1983, Watt banned the concerts, on the grounds that the "rock bands" that had performed on the Mall on Independence Day in 1981 and 1982 had encouraged drug use and alcoholism, and had attracted "the wrong element", who would subsequently rob attendees of similar events.[14] Watt then announced that Las Vegas singer Wayne Newton, a friend and an endorser of President Reagan and a contributor to the Republican Party, would perform at the Independence Day celebration at the mall in 1983.[14][15] During the ensuing controversy, Rob Grill, lead singer of The Grass Roots, stated that he felt "highly insulted" by Watt's remarks, which he termed "nothing but un-American."[14]

The Beach Boys stated that the Soviet Union, which had invited them to perform in Leningrad in 1978, "obviously... did not feel that the group attracted the wrong element."[14] Vice President George H. W. Bush said of The Beach Boys, "They're my friends, and I like their music."[14] Watt apologized to The Beach Boys after learning that President Reagan and First Lady Nancy Reagan were fans of the band.[16] Nancy Reagan apologized for Watt.[17] The White House staff gave Watt a plaster foot with a hole for his "having shot himself in the foot."[18]

At the 1983 event, Newton was booed by the audience when he came on stage.[16][19] The Tonight Show host Johnny Carson poked fun at Watt's last name, saying "James What? What?"

In an interview with the Satellite Program Network, Watt said, "If you want an example of the failure of socialism, don't go to Russia, come to America and go to the Indian reservations."[20]

A controversy erupted after a speech to the U.S. Chamber of Commerce in September 1983, when Watt mocked affirmative action by making the following statement about a coal leasing panel: "I have a black, a woman, two Jews and a cripple. And we have talent."[21] Watt resigned within weeks of making this statement.[21][22] In 2008, Time magazine named Watt among the ten worst cabinet members in modern history.[23]

Later life[edit]

In 1995, Watt was indicted on 25 counts of felony perjury and obstruction of justice by a federal grand jury, accused of making false statements before the grand jury investigating influence peddling at the Department of Housing and Urban Development, which he had lobbied in the 1980s.[24] On January 2, 1996, Watt pleaded guilty to one count of misdemeanor of withholding documents from the grand jury. On March 12, 1996, he was sentenced to five years' probation, and ordered to pay a fine of $5,000 and perform 500 hours of community service.[25]

In a 2001 interview, Watt applauded the energy policy of the Bush administration, stating that its preference of oil drilling and coal mining to conservation was just what he recommended in the early 1980s.[26]

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 3:25:21 PM UTC-5, jbeattie wrote:
> On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 6:24:03 AM UTC-8, Frank Krygowski wrote:
> > On 11/13/2016 6:46 AM, John B Slocomb wrote:
> > > On Sat, 12 Nov 2016 20:15:31 -0600, "W. Wesley Groleau"
> > > <Grolea...@FreeShell.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >> On 11-11-2016 12:37, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> > >>> The founders NEVER for one second thought that 90% of the entire control
> > > of the media in this country would fall to six companies.
> > >>
> > >> Jefferson: "The man who reads nothing at all is better educated than the
> > >> man who reads nothing but newspapers."
> > >
> > > I would modernize that by saying the man that reads nothing is better
> > > educated than the man that reads only the social media :-)
> >
> > And the latter is the natural prey of a politician whose proposed
> > policies can be thoroughly explained in 140 characters.
>
> We'll see how things work out, but one thing is abundantly clear to me, the pool of worthy presidential candidates has dried up -- or perhaps more accurately, a qualified candidate probably couldn't get elected these days. Reagan couldn't get elected. My gawd, the guy passed sweeping environmental protection legislation when he was governor of California. Nixon passed the Clean Air and Clean Water acts -- job killers! TR was just Bernie Sanders on a horse. Jefferson was a rationalist who would cringe at the religious right -- putting aside his dalliances with the servants. Makes Bill Clinton look pretty tame. I can't think of a single great conservative president who could get elected in the Twitter age.
>
> And, my friends, that is why I am throwing my hat into the ring for 2020. I am a highly successful thousandaire who has built incredible buildings -- or parts of them. I personally remodeled my downstairs bathroom -- did all the electrical, plumbing, mechanical, and it was under-budget and on time! I run a large organization along with my wife and son (who are the organization). I have successfully rid my yard of moles, and anyone who has had moles knows that is not easy. I can do the same with ISIS. I'll soak the Middle East with castor oil, and I'll make them pay for it!
>
> -- Jay Beattie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dBkAvxPsJ8

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

On Sunday, November 13, 2016 at 11:50:38 AM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:

> On 11/12/2016 8:15 PM, W. Wesley Groleau wrote:
> > On 11-11-2016 12:37, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> The founders NEVER for one second thought that 90% of the
> >> entire control of the media in this country would fall to
> >> six companies.
> >
> > Jefferson: "The man who reads nothing at all is better
> > educated than the man who reads nothing but newspapers."
> >
>

> Tolstoy: "I didn't read the newspapers for ten years. When I
> did, the news was the same."
>

> --
> Andrew Muzi
> <www.yellowjersey.org/>
> Open every day since 1 April, 1971

a cawment on Russia's stability

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

His opponents claimed, naturally, that all of these seemingly noble gestures were politically motivated. Nixon didn’t care about he environment: he knew lots of Americans did care, and he wanted to divert attention from the disaster in Vietnam.

Nixon involved killing black males in Nam preventing further rioting for equality in Michigan. Thru the secret plan to end the war.

Congress passed the legislation. The first water act was in 1948.

http://www.climatecentral.org/blogs/richard-nixon-the-environmentalist-resigned-38-years-ago-today-14776


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robin-madel/nixons-clean-water-act-im_b_1372740.html

[Frank Krygowski]

On 11/18/2016 5:14 PM, jbeattie wrote:
> Did I mention that we need to bring back hats?

http://www.walzcaps.com/



--
- Frank Krygowski

[John B Slocomb]

On Sat, 19 Nov 2016 00:00:25 -0500, Frank Krygowski
<frkr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

>On 11/18/2016 5:14 PM, jbeattie wrote:
>> Did I mention that we need to bring back hats?
>
>
>http://www.walzcaps.com/

:-)

I've often seen people wearing regular old caps, Caterpillar,
Budweiser, whatever, under the bicycle safety helmet.

I don't think it is for added protection :-) but rather to have a brim
to pull down when the sun gets in your eyes.

But having looked at your reference the question arises. How can one
have a fall and winter cap... without ear flaps?

[Bertrand]

>> http://www.walzcaps.com/

> But having looked at your reference the question arises. How can
> one have a fall and winter cap... without ear flaps?

http://www.walzcaps.com/collections/frontpage/products/wool-4-panel-grey-ear-flap-cycling-cap

[AMuzi]

Indeed, my dead-rabbit flaps come down around minus 10F. Toasty.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

> Open every day since 1 April, 1971

is it that AMuzi no longer commutes ?

strongly recommend trying an REI

https://www.google.com/#q=wool+balaclava&tbm=shop

for dry air, poly/nylon for damp.

a bal rolls up into a watch cap then down over face n neck when cold ...upwind down wind

........

I remember reading ...'we have 3 niggers 2 jews, a Ho and 4 Californians ....n snotting into the cereal. Is prob one of the funniest public utterances from a Cab .....people were uptight then.

[AMuzi]

I am not linking to an action photo of me with a snow
shovel, flaps down, titled 'snotsicle'.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>

[Frank Krygowski]

Thank you!


--
- Frank Krygowski

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

THIS MORNING bird research: goo.gl/2L2Igq

Spoke with an first off home sighting of a grackle morph poss my discovery.

MY DRIVEWAY: goo.gl/rasjvv

800’

The area was wilderness when we moved there from Atl in 1976.

The area across the street was a last stand of 4-6’ Hemlocks from Canton to Dushore

First explored in 1817, Sullivan is atopan ancient volcano plug complete with lost planet side walls.

[DATAKOLL MARINE RESEARCH]

appro ..

goo.gl/aSNDPj

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 11-17-2016 10:34, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> Jay - are you aware that the media said EXACTLY the same things about Reagan as they did about Trump? Trump hasn't served one day in office and you have an opinion of his fitness for office. Perhaps you ought to think before commenting. Or is your opinion shaped by the lies of the media which hasn't changed since Eisenhower was in office?

MY opinion was shaped by the lies of Trump. Balanced effectively by the
lies of Clinton. (But not effectively enough, obviously)

--
Wes Groleau

[John B Slocomb]

Goodness! You don't have a snow blower and have to depend on a shovel?

[John B Slocomb]

On Sun, 20 Nov 2016 12:15:06 +0700, John B Slocomb
<sloc...@inop.org> wrote:

>Care to peruse history and find one that didn't lie. Or at least tweak te truth a bit?

>
>I do remember one that said, "If nominated I will not run, and if
>elected I will not serve". I think he was telling the truth.
>

[Frank Krygowski]

NOte: Citing one example of a truthful statement does not prove a person
has not lied.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[AMuzi]

I dislike the noise and stink of them. A shovel is good
honest work, takes about the same time and gives a small bit
of quiet space for one's thoughts to meander.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>

[Frank Krygowski]

Agreed! I _like_ shoveling snow.

During or after a snowfall, our neighborhood is at its quietest. And a
nice deep snowfall always seems to make all the neighbors friendlier.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Andrew Chaplin]

AMuzi <a...@yellowjersey.org> wrote in news:o0se1g$co4$1...@dont-email.me:

+1

Snow blowers generally require too much fuel, oil and maintenance to
justify them, unless you have a driveway long enough that you will have
changed gears before exiting it--and I speak as a resident of Ottawa.
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)

[cycl...@gmail.com]

I suggest that you read two articles in the October issue of Scientific American that seem to be shocked that the media has done nothing but printed what they were told to do by the government without confirming a thing or seeking a second independent opinion.

You tell us about the "lies" of Trump and yet WHERE did you get that information?

As for Hillary's lies we have data from every place from the New York Slimes to the Washington Foist to the FBI to Wikileaks.

If you cannot consider for one second that you haven't been handed honest information concerning Trump perhaps you should actually think about it.

[John B Slocomb]

Ah, but it does... in that specific instance :-)

[John B Slocomb]

Not to mention that a snow shovel is a cheap addition to the garage
compliment of equipment and simply hangs on the wall during less
inclement weather and, it might be mentioned, lasts nearly a lifetime.
Unlike a snow blower :-)

[Phil Lee]

Frank Krygowski <frkr...@sbcglobal.net> considered Sun, 20 Nov 2016

I remember the time when the village I lived in at the time was cut
off by snow for most of a working week.
This was largely due to snow being relatively rare in the area, so
there was almost no suitable equipment to deal with it, coupled with
the fact that all the roads in and out of the village had sunken lane
sections, which filled up with drifted snow which couldn't be simply
ploughed aside - it all had to be excavated with front-end loaders.
One person in the village had a balloon tyred ATV, which was capable
of going cross-country and floating over the drifts, and everyone
contributed to his running costs in keeping the most essential
supplies coming in.
More neighbours got to know each other, helped each other out, and
generally came together into a proper community in that time than the
whole of the rest of the time I lived there (over 2 years) put
together. My contribution was fixing a couple of heating systems and
walking dogs for some elderly and disabled residents who couldn't get
out of their houses - in some cases the dogs were passed out of
windows to me, as the doors were too deeply snowbound. In one notable
case, this was an upstairs window, and the dog a St Bernard!

[AMuzi]

No reasonable snow shovel lasts a lifetime. A steel one
might but gosh that would be much more effort.

I'm generally not much for modernity but nylon snow shovels
are lighter, don't stick with snow and never fold an edge as
aluminum ones do. They last two to 3 seasons, same as
aluminum, but they are dirt cheap. Used to be Made in
Illinois USA but now Fabrique au Canada. BTW it's amazing
that the same product pops up +/- 10% at all area stores
under many brand names every year. One year Union Illinois
is ubiquitous, the next year they are all Canada. Weird.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 11-20-2016 11:03, Andrew Chaplin wrote:
> Snow blowers generally require too much fuel, oil and maintenance to
> justify them, unless you have a driveway long enough that you will have
> changed gears before exiting it--and I speak as a resident of Ottawa.

I shoveled the walks all the way to work (four blocks) a couple of
times, and then bought a snowblower.

--
Wes Groleau

[W. Wesley Groleau]

Not sure what I was trying to say there. Perhaps the lies are why I
didn't vote for them. But then the third sentence doesn't make sense.
Oh, well, neither did much of what they said.


--
Wes Groleau

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 11-20-2016 11:40, cycl...@gmail.com wrote:
> You tell us about the "lies" of Trump and yet WHERE did you get that information?

You have GOT to be kidding me!

That clown could say something in front of TV cameras, in front of
cameras within a day or two claim he didn't say it, and people say he
"tells it like it is."

2012: Hillary Clinton best Sec'y of State ever
2016: Hillary Clinton worst Sec'y of State ever

2016: "Look at that face. ..."
2016: "I did not criticize her looks."

The difference between him and Clinton is that her lies were about more
important things.

--
Wes Groleau

[John B Slocomb]

On Mon, 21 Nov 2016 01:00:27 +0000, Phil Lee <ph...@lee-family.me.uk>
wrote:

When I was stationed in Shreveport, Louisiana, it snowed 2 inches one
night. I was the only one who came in to work that morning. Of course,
at home - up-state New England -only 2 inches of snow was almost
unknown :-) Two feet yes but not two inches :-)

[John B Slocomb]

Which demonstrates my recent familiarity with snow. I was under the
impression that the aluminum snow shovel was the latest innovation :-)

[Duane]

Not many snow plows out in Shreveport. Or snow tires. Or for that
matter front wheel drives depending on when this was. Not surprising
they stayed home from work. Probably cooking up some gumbo or some
other sane thing to do. <g>

[Frank Krygowski]

Um... for example?


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

I had the same experience after moving to the deep south. An inch of
snow brought society to a standstill. (I got my car and went out and
played in an empty parking lot.)

--
- Frank Krygowski

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

150 feet of sidewalk (corner lot) and 4 car driveway in southwestern
Ontario snow belt in a mild winter isn't impossible - but a few good
dumps makes a (GOOD) snowblower pretty much a necessity for an old
fart.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

I have both snow blower and shovels - and I still wore out at least 6
snow shovels in the time I owned my last blower. (it was 15 years old
when I bought it, and I owned it over 20 years - and sold it in
working condition for what I paid for it !!!

>>
>>No reasonable snow shovel lasts a lifetime. A steel one
>>might but gosh that would be much more effort.
>>
>>I'm generally not much for modernity but nylon snow shovels
>>are lighter, don't stick with snow and never fold an edge as
>>aluminum ones do. They last two to 3 seasons, same as
>>aluminum, but they are dirt cheap. Used to be Made in
>>Illinois USA but now Fabrique au Canada. BTW it's amazing
>>that the same product pops up +/- 10% at all area stores
>>under many brand names every year. One year Union Illinois
>>is ubiquitous, the next year they are all Canada. Weird.
>
>Which demonstrates my recent familiarity with snow. I was under the
>impression that the aluminum snow shovel was the latest innovation :-)

Lifting2 feet of heavy wet snow with a shovel, the second or third
time (the snow is over 3 feet deep beside the walk or driveway) gets
old REAL FAST even if the shovel doesn'r weogh anything. A good blower
can throw that same heavy slop over 50 feet, getting it far enough
from the walk that it does not contribute to drifting it back in..

After one good dump we calculated my blower moverd over 10 TONS of
snow in a few hours - my sidewalk and driveway, and 4 neighbours'
sidewalks..

[Duane]

In my neighborhood (Quebec West Island) we have these plough guys that
we hire for a couple hundred bucks a season. Even with a snow blower I
would be spending a lot of time just to get my car out of the driveway
in the morning. Tried it a couple of times with a shovel when we first
bought the house. Non starter. For the couple hundred bucks these guys
plow in the morning before people leave for work and the afternoon
before we come home.

[Frank Krygowski]

My snowblower was given to me by a good friend who moved south. It's
supposedly a very good one, but it needed a little repair when he gave
it to me.

In any case, it sleeps in the garage except for snows deeper than, oh,
6" or so. When I do use it, I usually do the neighbors' drive for them
while it's out.

Shoveling is usually more pleasant, even for this old fart.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[Frank Krygowski]

On 11/21/2016 1:28 PM, Duane wrote:
>
> In my neighborhood (Quebec West Island) we have these plough guys that
> we hire for a couple hundred bucks a season. Even with a snow blower I
> would be spending a lot of time just to get my car out of the driveway
> in the morning. Tried it a couple of times with a shovel when we first
> bought the house. Non starter. For the couple hundred bucks these guys
> plow in the morning before people leave for work and the afternoon
> before we come home.

As a teenager, my friends and I sometimes made money by shoveling drives
after a snowstorm. Not surprisingly, I don't know any kids who do that
these days.

--
- Frank Krygowski

[AMuzi]

I did too when young.

Up through the early 1990s I could usually find a bum to
help shovel our parking lot for a few dollars. They
uniformly laughed and walked on after the later 1990s.

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>

[John B Slocomb]

I like the term ":necessity" :-)

I wonder what people ever did before the advent of the internal
combustion engine?

[W. Wesley Groleau]

On 11-21-2016 12:16, cl...@snyder.on.ca wrote:
> Lifting2 feet of heavy wet snow with a shovel, the second or third
> time (the snow is over 3 feet deep beside the walk or driveway) gets
> old REAL FAST even if the shovel doesn'r weogh anything. A good blower

I don't lift it. I push the shovel in front of me like a plow and if it
piles too high, veer to the side, back up nd continue straight.

--
Wes Groleau

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

They had workers who were used to working and who would work for a
reasonable price. When I was growing up the neighbor kids would shovel
snow for the older folks for pocket money.

[cl...@snyder.on.ca]

Doesn't work too well with a couple feet of wet and sloppy

[John B Slocomb]

Growing up in a little town in New England I had a school mate who was
obsessed with automobiles and by the time he turned 16 and got his
drivers license had saved enough money from mowing lawns in the summer
and shoveling driveways in the winter to buy a second hand Plymouth (I
think it was).

Of course, he wasn't allowed to drive it to school..... but he knew it
was there at home waiting for him to get back :-)

[John B Slocomb]

On Mon, 21 Nov 2016 08:49:52 -0500, Duane <duane....@group-upc.com>
wrote:

You are certainly correct. Which fact dawned on my after I saw the
second or third set of "skid marks" leading off the street. Hey! When
it is slippery drive slow :-)

Of course the snow all disappeared by about 11 o'clock :-)

[John B Slocomb]

You are being very politically incorrect. They are "Unemployed" not
"Bums" and if what I read in the news media is correct they are to be
pitied in modern American society :-)

[Frank Krygowski]

And I think before IC engines, suburban houses with drives to shovel
were much more rare. Typical city dwellers probably had little if any
pavement to maintain. Rural folk probably had horses pulling sleighs,
and no need to clear the snow.

I remember reading (in some book or other by Eric Sloane) that winter
was the best time by far for moving heavy loads in New England. They'd
wait until a good snowfall - which wasn't a long wait - and get the
draft horses and sledges out.


--
- Frank Krygowski

[Radey Shouman]

They just lived with snow everywhere. It used to be required to shovel
snow *into* covered bridges, so that people might drive their sleighs
across.


--

[sms]

We had a local garbage company that provided free snow removal using
their trucks.

They even advertised it on the side of their trucks, see
<https://www.flickr.com/photos/wmmaster626/14177375051>.

It was a very good service for them to provide and it cost them very little.

Jan. 19, 1977, was probably the reason they decided that they could just
not continue providing that free service, given the record snowfall on
that day.
<http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/weather/sfl-remember-snow-in-south-florida-20120118-story.html>


---
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[John B Slocomb]

You said "over 3 feet deep", or approximately waist deep, or a little
more. And you just push that along?